Networking Mess - Advice needed

[Old_newbie]

Hey all - we are having some major connectivity issues at the office. The internet is timing out way too frequently to make coming into work productive. We don't have an IT department (too small) and so the onus of all tech related issues falls on me (no tech background, just general interest). I chatted with our ISP (Rogers), and he offered no help which I kind of understand but at least told me that the network was wrong. Can someone help me with figuring out how to set this up correctly? Our current setup goes like this:

Rogers Cisco DPC3825 modem/router (set to gateway mode). 3 ports being used. First port connected to our Nortel Business Ethernet switch (which goes to every office/room), 2nd port connected to our server computer, 3rd port is connected to a Cisco RW130 wifi router.

There is a Dlink router connected to the switch (in one of the offices), and 3 computers and the Cisco router (I had to connect the cisco router to the switch because otherwise we couldn't connect to the server computer). The Rogers tech could only see that the Dlink router was connected.

There are 2 computers and a few mobile devices connected to the Cisco router.

The computers wired to the switch are having crappy connections (lots of time outs) and someone is thinking that it has to do with the Dlink connection. The wifi connections to both routers seem fine.

Can anyone tell me how to fix this? Any advice is very much appreciated.

 

[JackMDS]

Local Network like yours should have only one active Router connected directly to the Modem.

Make sure that all the Additional Routers (wired or Wireless are configured this way.

Using Wireless Routers (or Modem/Wireless Router) as a Switch with an Access Point - http://www.ezlan.net/router_AP.html

That said, a Major difficulty to help people with Networking problems on line is lack of credible important info.

As an example your Modem feeds to Nortel Business Ethernet switch. There are few Models of this hardware and tens ways of configuration. It might be that you need a real Pro to look locally on the whole Network configuration

 

[Old_newbie]

Thanks Jack for responding. I'll read up on the link that you posted.The Nortel Business Ethernet switch that we are using is the BES50FE-24T. TBH, I find this stuff pretty confusing sometimes. Aside from something like GeekSquad, are there freelance techies who come into office spaces and fix badly put together networks - as one-offs? And how do you find them. Not sure what the google search term for a network specialist would be that isn't a job..ha.

Local Network like yours should have only one active Router connected directly to the Modem.

Make sure that all the Additional Routers (wired or Wireless are configured this way.

Using Wireless Routers (or Modem/Wireless Router) as a Switch with an Access Point - http://www.ezlan.net/router_AP.html

That said, a Major difficulty to help people with Networking problems on line is lack of credible important info.

As an example your Modem feeds to Nortel Business Ethernet switch. There are few Models of this hardware and tens ways of configuration. It might be that you need a real Pro to look locally on the whole Network configuration

 

[Old_newbie]

Also, it's a bit more complicated as one router is being used by one company and the other router by another.

 

[Carson Dyle]

Like Jack said, a clearer idea of the network configuration is necessary to be of much help.

Two companies? Would it be correct to assume that you want to keep their networks totally isolated from one another and that the only thing they're supposed to share is the internet connection? Or don't you care?

Why is your server hanging off a separate router port? Is it supposed to be reachable from the public internet (for, say, email), or is there some other reason?

Is one of the company's networks completely behind the Cisco RW130 wifi router? If not, how is that used?

If 'yes' to the above, are the users on that network having any problems connecting with the internet?

Do you have any idea how your network is subnetted? Company 1, company 2, behind the RW130, behind the D-Link, the IP address of your server?

Still leaves a lot of questions...

 

[sdifox]

You have to at least provide a diagram, even if it is just ascii. Also, what kind of sharing are we talking about?

Where about are you guys?

 

[dave_the_nerd]

You are looking for something called "IT Managed Services" - they're companies to which small organizations like yours can outsource their IT needs. Most companies like that have per-incident fee structures, or they can lease you a network engineer for a few hours. I'd expect costs to be around $150/hour though.

Or you can try to hack your way through it using information from us. (I read the thread, I don't have any ideas yet, and have all the same questions that have already been asked. But my guess is you have some pretty heavy double or triple NAT going on, and that's almost never good.)

Do it cheap or do it right.

 

[XavierMace]

You are looking for something called "IT Managed Services" - they're companies to which small organizations like yours can outsource their IT needs. Most companies like that have per-incident fee structures, or they can lease you a network engineer for a few hours. I'd expect costs to be around $150/hour though.

Or you can try to hack your way through it using information from us. (I read the thread, I don't have any ideas yet, and have all the same questions that have already been asked. But my guess is you have some pretty heavy double or triple NAT going on, and that's almost never good.)

Do it cheap or do it right.

I was being billed at $150/hr 7 years ago. The senior guys were over $200/hr. I'd have to assume it's gone up since then.

 

[Old_newbie]

Hi Carson,

Apologies in advance if I'm not very clear or leave out info as I am really out of my realm but am trying to see if I can figure it out (doing research on line and this forum!)

Like Jack said, a clearer idea of the network configuration is necessary to be of much help.

Two companies? Would it be correct to assume that you want to keep their networks totally isolated from one another and that the only thing they're supposed to share is the internet connection? Or don't you care?

Yes, you are correct that the two companies want it separate, only sharing the internet.

Why is your server hanging off a separate router port? Is it supposed to be reachable from the public internet (for, say, email), or is there some other reason?

The server is hanging off a separate router port because that is how it's always been (whoever set it up, set it up like that) and my boss would definitely not want it reachable by the public internet.. it may have been set that way with the intention that the printer/fax machine connected to it had access to send straight to email but as far as I know it doesn't work.

Is one of the company's networks completely behind the Cisco RW130 wifi router? If not, how is that used?

I'm not 100% sure what you mean, but Company A uses the Cisco RW130 (2 laptops + mobiles) plus 3 computers also wiring into the Nortel Business Ethernet switch. Company B has 3 laptops connected through the DLink. I feel like I didn't answer you question, ha sorry!

If 'yes' to the above, are the users on that network having any problems connecting with the internet?

Yes, the offices farther from the routers/modem need to be cabled because it is ending up being a poor connection

Do you have any idea how your network is subnetted? Company 1, company 2, behind the RW130, behind the D-Link, the IP address of your server?

How can I check?

Still leaves a lot of questions...

Here is a link to a drawing I made of our network setup: http://s27.postimg.org/m3lrenfrn/network2.jpg

 

[Old_newbie]

Hi sdifox,

Here's a link to a diagram of the network: http://s27.postimg.org/m3lrenfrn/network2.jpg

We are in Toronto.

As for sharing.. do you mean my company and the other? We share an office space and the internet.

You have to at least provide a diagram, even if it is just ascii. Also, what kind of sharing are we talking about?

Where about are you guys?

 

[Old_newbie]

Thanks Dave! Hmmm I'm not sure if we can budget for that. Especially if XavierMace thinks that it has probably gone up! Yikes. I'll google/ contact some and see what the rates are.

I'll also have to google NAT.. for some reason, I have a feeling you may be right.

I think right now, I'll have to try to hack my way through and see if I can figure it out. And thanks a million to you all for responding and trying to help. Super appreciate it!!

You are looking for something called "IT Managed Services" - they're companies to which small organizations like yours can outsource their IT needs. Most companies like that have per-incident fee structures, or they can lease you a network engineer for a few hours. I'd expect costs to be around $150/hour though.

Or you can try to hack your way through it using information from us. (I read the thread, I don't have any ideas yet, and have all the same questions that have already been asked. But my guess is you have some pretty heavy double or triple NAT going on, and that's almost never good.)

Do it cheap or do it right.

 

[Old_newbie]

Thanks XavierMace. I'm going to see if I can get some quotes.

I was being billed at $150/hr 7 years ago. The senior guys were over $200/hr. I'd have to assume it's gone up since then.

 

[master_shake_]

looks like my network.

lol.

does your modem act as a router?

if not you may asking for too many ip's from your isp.

the ethernet switch if replaced with a router can combat that.

does the modem give out ip address's?

what are the routers internal ip address's?

example 192.168.0.???

there is probably a good chance there are ip address conflicts if all the dhcp servers are turned on on each router.

only your central router should have that turned on.

 

[sdifox]

Hi sdifox,

Here's a link to a diagram of the network: http://s27.postimg.org/m3lrenfrn/network2.jpg

We are in Toronto.

As for sharing.. do you mean my company and the other? We share an office space and the internet.

So the server is yours? Is there wifi sharing between the companies?

assumption of mine: 1 external link shared by 2 companies, Rogers provides 2 ips.

solution: oops forgot you have a dlink, so no new router needed.

Rogers
|
Cisco DPC3825 bridge mode, dhcp off
| -----------> Cisco sw130 with NAT on and assigned WAN IP 0--->switch--->company one computers, including server
|
|------------> DLINK Router with NAT turned on and assigned WAN IP 1 ---> Company TWO computers.

 

[Old_newbie]

haha Master shake.. somehow that makes me feel better

looks like my network.

lol.

does your modem act as a router?No, it shouldn't.As far as I know, the Rogers tech said it should be set as only a modem (gateway mode).

if not you may asking for too many ip's from your isp.

the ethernet switch if replaced with a router can combat that.

does the modem give out ip address's? I don't think so, how can I check?

what are the routers internal ip address's? The dlink is 192.168.0.1, Cisco DPC3825.. and ohoh.. it's the same! .. and the cisco rv130w is 192.168.1.1

example 192.168.0.???

there is probably a good chance there are ip address conflicts if all the dhcp servers are turned on on each router.

only your central router should have that turned on. sorry what do you mean by this?

 

[Old_newbie]

Hi sdifox,

So the server is yours? Is there wifi sharing between the companies? Yes, the server is ours, and no wifi sharing between the companies

assumption of mine: 1 external link shared by 2 companies, Rogers provides 2 ips. yes, you are right about the first.. and i guess the second?

solution: oops forgot you have a dlink, so no new router needed.

Rogers
|
Cisco DPC3825 bridge mode, dhcp off can't go to bridge mode because then only port 1 of the cisco dpc3825 is useable
| -----------> Cisco sw130 with NAT on and assigned WAN IP 0--->switch--->company one computers, including server
|
|------------> DLINK Router with NAT turned on and assigned WAN IP 1 ---> Company TWO computers. I don't know how you assign a WAN. Sorry, I'm a total newbie at this stuff so not sure how to do this.. especially if you say I have to go to bridge mode.. how can I connect the server computer and the two routers to the internet?

 

[sdifox]

Hi sdifox,

sorry, the DPC should be in gateway mode. it should then give out 2 ips if you are getting 2 ips from rogers.

From there, you just connect the two routers to the dpc, each is setup as if it is connected directly to the cable modem. consult your router manuals on how to configure it.

 

[Old_newbie]

An updated image of the network: http://s23.postimg.org/wfh32lx57/network2_copy.jpg

 

[Old_newbie]

Actually all ports are active currently as it isn't set to bridge mode. Rogers told me that if I set it to bridge, only port 1 is useable.

err, if only the first port of the dpc is active, why do you have 3 connections to it? that is the first problem

 

[Old_newbie]

So, I have to cable the dlink directly to the modem versus it going through the ethernet switch (which is how it currently is set up)

sorry, the DPC should be in gateway mode. it should then give out 2 ips if you are getting 2 ips from rogers.

From there, you just connect the two routers to the dpc, each is setup as if it is connected directly to the cable modem.

 

[sdifox]

So, I have to cable the dlink directly to the modem versus it going through the ethernet switch (which is how it currently is set up)

do you have a layout of your office as well? makes a difference for wifi.

switch, if needed, should be behind the router.

 

[Old_newbie]

Here is a layout of the office: http://s2.postimg.org/d3kzahm2x/layout2.jpg

Red lines means it's 'connected' to the internet through the walls to the ethernet switch (outlets in the offices)

Green lines means it's using wifi

Blue lines means it's directly cabled to the modem

Office One is Company Two, the rest of the office is Company One

Dark black lines equals walls

do you have a layout of your office as well? makes a difference for wifi.

switch, if needed, should be behind the router.

 

[Old_newbie]

also, just an fyi, i cannot move the location of the ethernet switch and modem

 

[Old_newbie]

and i forgot to put a red line between the cisco rv130w router to the ethernet

 

[JackMDS]

OP, With all due respect looking at the progress of this thread I do not think that it is safe for you to deal with these issues on your own.

It is business you do something wrong and it might cost you dearly in Business and its security.




P.S. happy Thanksgiving everyone.