So your crew went over to their crew, and challenged them? Did it involve a song and dance as well?
If you REALLY want the best of both worlds, there's a gym I saw online that is basically a free weight bar, but it hangs from these cables. You can move it in any range of motion like a regular bar, but it has sensors in the handgrips, so when you cant lift it anymore, let go of the bar and it locks the cables so the bar stays in place. It looks pretty cool, but you have to plug it into an electrical outlet, otherwise it wont work. Also it's pretty expensive, but hey, if you want the best, you gotta pay up.
As for smith mashines vs cages, I usually use cages for squats, but thats because I go to a public gym and they have all the stuff available. Some smith machines have the bar going at a slight angle, not straight up, so the movement is more natural. But not all smith machines are equally good, because in my gym for example we have 2, and when you load up the same weight on both of them, one feels significantly heavier than the other one. Overall, smith machines are OK for squats as long as you keep the same form as you would on a free weight. I see a lot of ppl using a smith who cheat on the form, and they would have a hard time with free weights if they tried.
As for smith mashines vs cages, I usually use cages for squats, but thats because I go to a public gym and they have all the stuff available. Some smith machines have the bar going at a slight angle, not straight up, so the movement is more natural. But not all smith machines are equally good, because in my gym for example we have 2, and when you load up the same weight on both of them, one feels significantly heavier than the other one. Overall, smith machines are OK for squats as long as you keep the same form as you would on a free weight. I see a lot of ppl using a smith who cheat on the form, and they would have a hard time with free weights if they tried.
every powerlifting article on the subject i've read whether
in print (PowerLifting USA magazine) or on the web says it's a myth.
for example, this page.
i know drug-free powerlifters who squat 600-800 lbs. below
parallel regularly who don't have knee problems.
if it's worse for your knees, why doesn't it cause injuries to them?
i don't know where to look for proof.
since you're an expert, maybe you can show me?
As long as your feet are positioned properly and you have no previous knee injuries, I agree that squatting below parallel is better. I certainly can feel it in my hamstrings more
Originally posted by: Landroval
As long as your feet are positioned properly and you have no previous knee injuries, I agree that squatting below parallel is better. I certainly can feel it in my hamstrings more
The powerlifting squat is radically different than the bodybuilding/olympic style squat.It places the load on an entirely and in my opinion stronger set of muscles.
you mean the feets should be at a slight V angle apart, not parallel to each other right??Originally posted by: Landroval
As long as your feet are positioned properly and you have no previous knee injuries, I agree that squatting below parallel is better. I certainly can feel it in my hamstrings more
Originally posted by: m2kewl
you mean the feets should be at a slight V angle apart, not parallel to each other right??Originally posted by: Landroval
As long as your feet are positioned properly and you have no previous knee injuries, I agree that squatting below parallel is better. I certainly can feel it in my hamstrings more
Yes
so if I can find a smith machine for cheaper, it would probably be safer, but not work control muscles as much?
I'm no expert, I just go by what my trainer tells me. He's been a powerlifter for years so he knows better than me. But you've also been a powerlifter for years so who knows? Sometimes you get doctors/powerlifters/experts that disagree on subjects of their expertise.
You could be right, but I'm not going to argue with a guy in his gym. Not only is it his gym, but he also squats 700+ lbs and could literally throw me out.
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I lucked out. I got the $2100 "Ultimate" for $900. It still had most of the stuff still in the box. Some guy bought it, didn't like it, took it to an exercise equipment and pawned it off. My wife and I were shopping around for other stuff and just happened to see it there.
His loss is my gain. The leg attachments were still in the box and the rest of it still had the shipping wrapping on it.
My wife really likes it because she can do a lot of exercises for her legs without having to move lots of plates or use a bunch of machines that take up a small warehouse in size.
I like it because it's a very fluid motion that doesn't take much effort to switch up the exercises you want to do.
Yes, how does the bowflex compare with the cage/smiths in terms of muscle gain?
I'm such a n00b at weight machines, but I want to be able to create a home gym in my next house as well. I just go to the gym now, so I use whatever they have.
I'm such a n00b at weight machines, but I want to be able to create a home gym in my next house as well. I just go to the gym now, so I use whatever they have.
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I'm not going to lie and blow smoke up your butt about the bowflex. It's not a replacement for *real* weights. But it is a good alternative if you don't have the space for all the machines/cages that it can take the place of.
It's great in that it forces you to balance yourself like free weights do and you don't have to worry about dropping a couple hundred pounds of iron on you if you don't have a spotter on hand.
But where it lacks is in range of motion. You can't go as low or as high or with different types of foot placements like you can with a true free weight set. But I guess you can say the same thing about most machines vs. a true free weight.
It's got a lot of negative stigma around it. Mainly because of unrealistic results they show on commericals plus it's pretty outrageously priced. I got it for less than half price and I'm a little more modest in what I want out of it.
If you are looking for a good resistance machine that offers a wide range of exercises without taking up a ton of space, it's a great option.
It's great in that it forces you to balance yourself like free weights do and you don't have to worry about dropping a couple hundred pounds of iron on you if you don't have a spotter on hand.
But where it lacks is in range of motion. You can't go as low or as high or with different types of foot placements like you can with a true free weight set. But I guess you can say the same thing about most machines vs. a true free weight.
It's got a lot of negative stigma around it. Mainly because of unrealistic results they show on commericals plus it's pretty outrageously priced. I got it for less than half price and I'm a little more modest in what I want out of it.
If you are looking for a good resistance machine that offers a wide range of exercises without taking up a ton of space, it's a great option.
How long have you been using it, and have you posted any gains/muscle mass increase in that time?
Im not too interested in it for the reasons you mentioned, mostly the price
Koing
Elite Member <br> Super Moderator<br> Health and F
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Originally posted by: 91TTZ
Originally posted by: dxkj
Hrm I heard the other way, you and Koing should duke it out to decide who is right
It's harder on your knees. Think about it. You have a joint that's bending past 90 degrees, so leverage is working against it.
90* angle on your knee is the greatest amount of pressure on your knee. So WHY do you go down to it? You spend FAR longer at 90* if you go down to it then go back up. If you do a full OL squat ATG (ass to grass i.e rock bottom) you spend less time at the weak position.
Going all the way to the bottom is 100% safe as long as you can keep a straight back.
Your personal trainer lifting a lot doesn't mean he knows a lot about lifting. I have seen many strong men lift terribly.
Millions of asians can squat all the way to the bottom. They often sit this way to cook and to eat food.
MOST westerners can not squat deep without their heels coming off the floor. OF COURSE this is NOT A SAFE WAY TO squat with weights. It points at a lack of flexibility.
You WILL NOT get any credible Dr to say that 90* bend of the knee is not the most stressful on your knee joint. If you go all the way to the bottom you spend less time at this point. This in turn is better. Always work a full range of movement = better. Well unless you only want to get as strong in that range of movement or have something very specific in mind.
Koing
I'll have to try that then. Thanks. What advantage will it have in muscle building? I'm sure it has to do something.
Koing
Elite Member <br> Super Moderator<br> Health and F
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A HUGE advantage. You work more of range. Your muscle is made up of little fibres. Within these muscles you have little motors. They 'pulse' as your muscle contracts. In very top level athletes and bigger guys the 'motors' will pulse more IN SYNC meaning they can produce more force (lift more basically). This is the reason why you can see a small guy lift huge amounts.
Causes the body to make more Testerone through using big muscle groups (legs). You will feel SO BEAT UP the first few weeks because your not use to doing squats all the way to the bottom. After you get use to that you will see your body THICKEN OUT much faster. Your other lifts go up also through more testerone in your body.
BB who take steriods have up to 15x the testerone level of normal guys = HUGE muscle production. This is why women don't bulk up. They lack the testerone of guys.
Koing
Thanks for the info, Koing. I'll have to do them (although I'm going to have to go WAY down in weight in order to complete a rep).
It takes a little while to get used to the balance and finding the right spot.... Koing should post the video he has of him doing it, I couldnt find it.
Koing
Elite Member <br> Super Moderator<br> Health and F
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Definately go lower and use less weight. It only stands to reason you can lift more through a smaller range.
Work form and technique as they are more important then 'lifting more' ultimately.
I'll get a video next week as this week is a recovery week = less reps and less weights
Koing
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