N. Korea vs S. Korea Rnd 2 (update 3-6)

[Possessed Freak]

SEOUL (AP) ? North Korea said Friday it is ditching a nonaggression pact and all other peace agreements with South Korea, in an apparent attempt to use the threat of an armed clash to press Seoul to give up its "confrontational" stance.

The communist nation also said it will no longer respect a disputed sea border with the South, raising the prospect for an armed clash along the Yellow Sea boundary ? the scene of deadly skirmishes between the two navies in 1999 and 2002.

South Korea said it regretted the North's latest move and warned it won't tolerate any attempt to violate the border.

Analysts said Pyongyang's threats could signal it is preparing for an armed confrontation, but only as a way of ratcheting up the pressure on Seoul to get the neighbor to soften its hard-line stance ? and attracting President Barack Obama's attention.

"This signals that North Korea will stage a provocation" ? probably near the maritime border, said Kim Yong-hyun, a North Korea expert at Seoul's Dongguk University.

USAToday Linky

I find that this will be the norm until the UN starts backing its demands. First we had US in Iraq. Then we had Russia in Georgia. Next we have the conflict with Israel/Palestine. Now we have this.

[edit]Stupid Firefox not spell checking the title input box[/edit]

[update 2-19-09]
Who knew, N.Korea shows no sign of weakening its stance!

SEOUL (AP) ? North Korea stepped up its war rhetoric Thursday, saying its troops are "fully ready" for war with South Korea, just hours before a visit to Seoul by U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton.

The North's military accused South Korean President Lee Myung-bak of using "nonexistent" nuclear and missile threats as a pretext for an invasion and warned it was prepared for an "all-out confrontation."

Linky

[update 2-24-09]
We got a satellite too... or is it just another missile test?

Linky

North Korea said Tuesday it is preparing to shoot a satellite into orbit, its clearest reference yet to an impending launch that neighbors and the U.S. suspect will be a provocative test of a long-range missile.

The statement from the North's space technology agency comes amid growing international concern that the communist nation is gearing up to fire a version of its most advanced missile ? capable of reaching the U.S. ? in coming days, in violation of a U.N. Security Council resolution.

North Korea asserted last week it has the right to "space development" ? words the regime has used in the past to disguise a missile test. In 1998, North Korea test-fired a Taepodong-1 ballistic missile over Japan and then claimed to have put a satellite into orbit.

[Update 3-6-09]
Your planes are not welcome here! More posturing from the North.

Linky

SEOUL ? South Korean airlines are rerouting their flights away from North Korean airspace, hours after the North threatened Seoul's passenger planes amid heightened tensions on the divided peninsula.

The move ? which will cost carriers thousands of dollars on each flight ? comes after Pyongyang warned in state-run media that it cannot guarantee security for South Korean civil airplanes flying near its airspace and accused the U.S. and South Korea of attempting to provoke a nuclear war with the upcoming joint military drills.

It did not say what kind of danger South Korean planes would face or whether the threat meant the North would shoot down planes.

South Korea has urged the North to immediately retract the threat.

"The military threat against civil airplanes' normal flights is a violation of international norms and an inhumane act that cannot be justified under any circumstances," Unification Ministry spokesman Kim Ho-nyeon told reporters.

 

[StageLeft]

The US neither has the time nor energy or resources to engage in a drawn out conflict with NK and thus I can only assume that if NK attacks the US will have to flatten it and do it quickly. It would finally put down NK as a cancerous thorn and put out of their misery the millions there who live in varying states of hell and poverty.

I have to wonder if this is in any way related to Kimberly's health issues. Maybe he doesn't want to die while SK remains unfinished.

 

[Elias824]

I think Korea was the only UN sponsored war to date, Perhaps its time for another one. Anyone hear anything about the rumor that Kim Jong-il is dead and his wife was running things.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: Elias824
I think Korea was the only UN sponsored war to date, Perhaps its time for another one. Anyone hear anything about the rumor that Kim Jong-il is dead and his wife was running things.

I have not, but if he's not dead he probably will be soon. I think being that evil shortens one's life. Plus, being so ronery.

 

[K1052]

If he is testing the waters to see if he can get away with a military solution with Obama in the White House I expect he is going to be sorely disappointed.

 

[Genx87]

Smart move as we load troops, tanks, and trucks onto ships headed home from Iraq. Next stop SK.

I dont think the NK has the technology or training to be a serious threat. The days of swarming your enemy are done. Plus I bet if the SK troops offered bread in exchange for surrender it would be a success.

But all joking aside I dont see NK being able to take SK. Especially if we can get troops on the scene in a matter of days. If anything I could see China taking an opportunity to crush a pita and show a little military force in the region at the same time.

 

[Elias824]

There is an article on his supposed death. No one really knows though
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/t...sia/article4692472.ece

Also what is the difference in military power between N, and S Korea. During the war it was mainly china that gave the north an advantage, but I doubt they would help the 2nd time around.

 

[Atreus21]

Isn't SK nuclear-armed?

 

[Oceandevi]

Originally posted by: Elias824
There is an article on his supposed death. No one really knows though
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/t...sia/article4692472.ece

Also what is the difference in military power between N, and S Korea. During the war it was mainly china that gave the north an advantage, but I doubt they would help the 2nd time around.

China's public stance is that they wont help NK in this. They don't have anything to gain from it anyway.. but who knows?

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: Atreus21
Isn't SK nuclear-armed?

No, but they are under our strategic umbrella.

 

[StageLeft]

NK I doubt would get anywhere. There are still thousands of US troops in the immediate area and of course it's watched closely with satellite for any troop movements. I'm positive that if they started to amass many by the border that the US would have ample time to do something about it.

 

[MovingTarget]

He's just doing it to try and get more concessions out of the new administration and the international community. Even he knows that a war would be a BAD idea for his country. Obama and other world leaders should stick to their current positions and not change one iota. We shouldn't be putting up with this crap.

 

[Sedition]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
NK I doubt would get anywhere. There are still thousands of US troops in the immediate area and of course it's watched closely with satellite for any troop movements. I'm positive that if they started to amass many by the border that the US would have ample time to do something about it.

I have a marine buddy who was stationed in Japan after he did a tour in Iraq. I just talked to him a few mins ago online about all this.

There is a standing force in the demilitarization zone but not much of one... It is supposed to be enough to get all civilians out and get the marines from Japan over.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: Sedition

Originally posted by: Skoorb
NK I doubt would get anywhere. There are still thousands of US troops in the immediate area and of course it's watched closely with satellite for any troop movements. I'm positive that if they started to amass many by the border that the US would have ample time to do something about it.

I have a marine buddy who was stationed in Japan after he did a tour in Iraq. I just talked to him a few mins ago online about all this.

There is a standing force in the demilitarization zone but not much of one... It is supposed to be enough to get all civilians out and get the marines from Japan over.

A very quick google indicates there may be about 25k left after some left last year. I don't know what their mission is, but if it was to hang around, NK would have a real mess of a time getting through them despite its overwhelming odds. As we've seen, quantity is trumped by quality in modern warfare!

 

[Train]

Corrected Korean to English Translation:

It's time for the rest of the world do another round of "Diplomacy" in which we get a bunch of money for nothing, and they pat themselves on the back admiring how smart and peaceful they are, while we laugh our commie asses off.

 

[maddogchen]

Send Carter in, he'll fix it in "half a day"

Text

 

[0marTheZealot]

NK is a joke, there are some militias in the US that could probably beat the NK.

The only real threat NK has is it's nuclear arsenal. The rest of it's conventional army is outdated and obsolete. You can outnumber the enemy 500:1 in tanks, but none of those tanks will ever get a penetrating shot in, it doesn't matter. The gunner in a modern tank just has to take his time and casually knock out each tank in the column. That's what the Germans did in WW2 with their Panthers/Tigers. The Western Allies had no answer for these tanks other than to drop a 1000 lb bomb on them.

 

[dennilfloss]

Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot
That's what the Germans did in WW2 with their Panthers/Tigers. The Western Allies had no answer for these tanks other than to drop a 1000 lb bomb on them.

*Cough* Firefly & Achilles *Cough*

 

[CitizenKain]

Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot
NK is a joke, there are some militias in the US that could probably beat the NK.

The only real threat NK has is it's nuclear arsenal. The rest of it's conventional army is outdated and obsolete. You can outnumber the enemy 500:1 in tanks, but none of those tanks will ever get a penetrating shot in, it doesn't matter. The gunner in a modern tank just has to take his time and casually knock out each tank in the column. That's what the Germans did in WW2 with their Panthers/Tigers. The Western Allies had no answer for these tanks other than to drop a 1000 lb bomb on them.

Or drive around them and shoot them from the sides.

Quantity is a quality all its own. The big issue with NK isn't its conventional army as much, as Seoul is in range of a good deal of NK artillery.

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: MovingTarget
He's just doing it to try and get more concessions out of the new administration and the international community. Even he knows that a war would be a BAD idea for his country. Obama and other world leaders should stick to their current positions and not change one iota. We shouldn't be putting up with this crap.

yea but he wouldn't dare pull this shit under W. Carry a big stick and take a wack at the bitches.

 

[0marTheZealot]

Originally posted by: dennilfloss

Originally posted by: 0marTheZealot
That's what the Germans did in WW2 with their Panthers/Tigers. The Western Allies had no answer for these tanks other than to drop a 1000 lb bomb on them.

*Cough* Firefly & Achilles *Cough*

Overrated, the FF's one claim to fame was killing Wittmann. Other than that, the FF was still a death toaster that was the #1 priority of Axis armor.

Or drive around them and shoot them from the sides.

Quantity is a quality all its own. The big issue with NK isn't its conventional army as much, as Seoul is in range of a good deal of NK artillery.

Well, it might work for modern tanks, but the tanks from the '60s and '70s literally have no chance of penetrating a modern tank today, even from the side, even from the rear.

I did not realize that Seoul was in artillery range, that could pose a problem if swift action isn't taken.

 

[Train]

Originally posted by: JS80

Originally posted by: MovingTarget
He's just doing it to try and get more concessions out of the new administration and the international community. Even he knows that a war would be a BAD idea for his country. Obama and other world leaders should stick to their current positions and not change one iota. We shouldn't be putting up with this crap.

yea but he wouldn't dare pull this shit under W. Carry a big stick and take a wack at the bitches.

Well, actually they did, not this exact move, but they did wave the big nuke stick around, waited for Condi to show up, write them a check for a few million (or was it billion) and then go about thier merry way.

 

[Dacalo]

Meh, this is just sabre rattling, nothing more. They just want some attention from the U.S. and more concession from SK.

War isn't happening. NK knows that they have no chance whatsoever. SK is more than adequately equipped to win the war without any external intervention.

 

[deathstorm78]

I read this thread and it brought back memories of Ulchi Focus Lens

UFL

USMC is a short hop away stationed in mainland Japan and Okinawa.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

Is this what Biden was talking about when he said "Watch. We're going to have an international crisis, a generated crisis, to test the mettle of this guy."? It'll be interesting to see how Obama and HRC handle this and how effective they'll be. Looks to me that NK is looking for a handout...a really big handout.