My nephew denied a job because of Obamacare!

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EagleKeeper

Discussion Club Moderator<br>Elite Member
Staff member
Oct 30, 2000
42,591
5
0
Those that hate Obamacare and all things democratic would have you believe that employees are hired or fired soley based on the employment costs of said employee.
If that where the case it would be easy to run a business, have 0 employees, 0 employment expenses and keep all your profits $$$.

Claiming your laying off or foregoing hiring because of a particular government policy is dishonest and playing politics plain and simple. Anybody that actually runs their business this way is not too bright and deserves what they get.

A business has a certain margin for profit.
5% could kill that margin.

so how do you prevent that 5% loss.

Raise prices.
Cut expenses.

The business has to determine can the raise the prices to cover extra expenses being incurred if the added expense is not going to increase the profits enough to cover the expense.

The business is not intended to run at a loss!
 

buckshot24

Diamond Member
Nov 3, 2009
9,916
85
91
Those that hate Obamacare and all things democratic would have you believe that employees are hired or fired soley based on the employment costs of said employee.
If that where the case it would be easy to run a business, have 0 employees, 0 employment expenses and keep all your profits $$$.

Claiming your laying off or foregoing hiring because of a particular government policy is dishonest and playing politics plain and simple. Anybody that actually runs their business this way is not too bright and deserves what they get.
Its pretty simple, making something cost more means you can afford less of it.
 

berzerker60

Golden Member
Jul 18, 2012
1,233
1
0
So to be clear, poor people are poor because they're lazy, unless they're Republican or family members of Republicans, in which case they're poor because Obamacare.
Responsibility!
 

GuitarDaddy

Lifer
Nov 9, 2004
11,465
1
0
Its pretty simple, making something cost more means you can afford less of it.


You speak of employees as if they are a luxury consumption item, and the more they cost the less you can have. Things aren't that simple and you know it.

Employees produce a quantity of goods or services which the business sells for a profit, and each employee has a finite limit to the amount of product or services he can produce. Therefore to acheive a given amount of sales and profit you must employ a certain number of employees. In certain instances you can effect productivity where you make more product per employee thus requiring less employees but that also brings additional cost in better equipment, overtime, more training etc...

My point is, to say you will employ less people just because the cost per person goes up is pure bullshit, there are many more factors to be considered.
 

Blackjack200

Lifer
May 28, 2007
15,995
1,685
126
Its pretty simple, making something cost more means you can afford less of it.

Yes, so lets get rid of OSHA workplace safety, workers' compensation, federal minimum wages, all restrictions on child labor, all environmental protection law, social security & medicare (because the employers have to make matching contributions) and whatever else you visionaries can dream up to make this a more perfect nation.

Or, you know, MeowKat's nephew could go to one of the dozens of oil boomtowns and land a job just by writing his name down.
 

umbrella39

Lifer
Jun 11, 2004
13,819
1,126
126
My nephew has been applying for a forklift job but has been told that they are only hiring temps right now on occassion as needed because its too expensive to hire with Obamacare looming.(

So you are saying that if it weren't for Obamacare your nephew would have gotten a full-time job with benefits? What prevented companies like this one you mention hiring full-time forklift drivers for the past 10 years? Nobamacare?

Bullshit and you know it.

Why would you even post such an anecdotal nonsense?
 

umbrella39

Lifer
Jun 11, 2004
13,819
1,126
126
This much is clear, when you cause employees to cost businesses more money there will be less employees than there otherwise would have been.

Really?

So if you give businesses more money (in the form of huge tax cuts like they got from Bush) there will be MORE employees than there otherwise would have been?

Interesting logic......
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,894
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
My nephew denied a job because of Obamacare!

My nephew has been applying for a forklift job but has been told that they are only hiring temps right now on occassion as needed because its too expensive to hire with Obamacare looming.

The Black Magic Kenyan is going to run up another trillion in debt and force people to work as temps. :'(

Guess he doesn't want to work here.

Maybe your nephew should move to Kenya.
 

sportage

Lifer
Feb 1, 2008
11,493
3,159
136
PBS... INDEPENDENT LENS:
Park Avenue: Money, Power and The American Dream.

Airs again thursday 11/29 7am est (re-check local listings) on pbs channel 11.3.

This PBS special is not what you'd think.
Its how the top 1% of the top1% looks at the rest of society.
And how they enjoy making people miserable when that 1% don't get their way.
And its not just the republicans in congress on the hook here.
Plenty of democrats in power playing the same game.

Probably the most revealing and depressing documentary I've seen.

I always wondered with so many brains in government, presidencies, congress, how have we come to down this in todays world?
Now I know.
WATCH IT! PBS.
 

buckshot24

Diamond Member
Nov 3, 2009
9,916
85
91
Employees produce a quantity of goods or services which the business sells for a profit, and each employee has a finite limit to the amount of product or services he can produce. Therefore to acheive a given amount of sales and profit you must employ a certain number of employees.
Sure if demand for your product or service is limitless but it isn't.
In certain instances you can effect productivity where you make more product per employee thus requiring less employees but that also brings additional cost in better equipment, overtime, more training etc...

My point is, to say you will employ less people just because the cost per person goes up is pure bullshit, there are many more factors to be considered.
Its bullshit only in fantasy land where potential sales are limitless.
 

umbrella39

Lifer
Jun 11, 2004
13,819
1,126
126

LOL! Nice to see your parody around post election predictions! Not nearly enough of that around here. Poke this one... he is trickle done!

trickle%2Bdown.gif


Sadly the guy at the end of didn't get the memo that putting more money in corporations pockets translates to more jobs. Sometimes there are even less. Recent history not so easy to revise... Everyone knows this lol...
 

buckshot24

Diamond Member
Nov 3, 2009
9,916
85
91
LOL! Nice to see your parody around post election predictions! Not nearly enough of that around here. Poke this one... he is trickle done!

trickle%2Bdown.gif


Sadly the guy at the end of didn't get the memo that putting more money in corporations pockets translates to more jobs. Sometimes there are even less. Recent history not so easy to revise... Everyone knows this lol...
Your picture isn't an argument.

How many jobs would there have been if there was no Bush tax cuts? Do you have any figures?
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,265
126
It's easier to blame something else than to say you just weren't wanted.

Is that what happened?

I expect that no matter what happens supporters will blame everything but their shortsightedness. America had a moment for healthcare reform like we had with 9/11.

Squandered opportunities.
 

umbrella39

Lifer
Jun 11, 2004
13,819
1,126
126
Your picture isn't an argument.

How many jobs would there have been if there was no Bush tax cuts? Do you have any figures?


Your one word answer wasn't an argument either. How many jobs did the Bush tax cuts save? Do you have any figures? See how this works...

After your October track record I don't think I'll be betting on your swaying anyone about trickle down economics... Much more persuasive and articulate spinmeisters have tried and failed that foolish endeavor here, why waste your time knowing ahead of time how that movie will end. Agree to disagree and move on... I have.
 

SheHateMe

Diamond Member
Jul 21, 2012
7,251
20
81
Is that what happened?

I expect that no matter what happens supporters will blame everything but their shortsightedness. America had a moment for healthcare reform like we had with 9/11.

Squandered opportunities.

Of course, you didn't read the comment I was responding to.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
83,716
47,399
136
Your picture isn't an argument.

How many jobs would there have been if there was no Bush tax cuts? Do you have any figures?

It's not possible to do a counterfactual in that way. What we CAN do however is look at job growth during the period following those tax cuts. Guess what? It was crappy. There's very little evidence that those tax cuts were significant drivers of job growth.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,265
126
It's not possible to do a counterfactual in that way. What we CAN do however is look at job growth during the period following those tax cuts. Guess what? It was crappy. There's very little evidence that those tax cuts were significant drivers of job growth.

Tax cuts do nothing unless targeted. The best option may be to give businesses tax cuts for bringing needed infrastructure back for domestic jobs and smack them when they do not. There also needs to be a distinction between personal and business taxes in peoples minds.
 

buckshot24

Diamond Member
Nov 3, 2009
9,916
85
91
It's not possible to do a counterfactual in that way. What we CAN do however is look at job growth during the period following those tax cuts. Guess what? It was crappy. There's very little evidence that those tax cuts were significant drivers of job growth.
Unemployment got down to as low as 4.4%, how was that crappy?
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,265
126
Of course, you didn't read the comment I was responding to.

I'm not sure what happened. It could be as you say or as described. The only way to know is in the aggregate, not this particular case by examining changes in hiring habits.
 

buckshot24

Diamond Member
Nov 3, 2009
9,916
85
91
Your one word answer wasn't an argument either.
No but it was a direct answer to your question.
How many jobs did the Bush tax cuts save? Do you have any figures? See how this works...
Right, I don't have any figures either but I was just answering your question.
After your October track record I don't think I'll be betting on your swaying anyone about trickle down economics... Much more persuasive and articulate spinmeisters have tried and failed that foolish endeavor here, why waste your time knowing ahead of time how that movie will end. Agree to disagree and move on... I have.
I couldn't care less about how persuaded you or other liberals are who I am directly posting to. I don't think not persuading the unpersuadable is a fault to be ashamed of.