My 87 year old dad's incredible healthcare

[theeedude]

The lockbox makes it a general pool still. I agree with the lockbox concept but I also agreed with privatization, so no I did not vote for Gore.

But honestly a PAYGO system is just setup for fail. You know it. It's just not the best way. If you want a safety net, you build your own damn safety net. Put restrictions on how I build it, and make sure it meets code/standards, but it's MY safety net. AFter all isn't that the idea of SS and Medicare?

Did you vote for Bush who expanded Medicare with prescription drug benefit?

 

[waggy]

Whatever the healthcare answer may be, it isn't what was recently passed.

http://www.house.gov/brady/pdf/Obamacare_Chart.pdf

i agree. i think what was passed was a clusterfuck. I do think in the next 20 years we will have a good working solution (well if we continue to talk and work on it)

 

[theeedude]

Don't know what spidey is smoking, but Medicare does cover pacemakers.
http://www.cms.gov/mcd/viewncd.asp?...=2&basket=ncd%3A20.8:2:Cardiac+Pacemakers

Yeah, my grandpa got one, and he doesn't have supplemental. If you think some puny 200/month paid for a pacemaker, I got some Republicans who can govern for you to vote for.

 

[her209]

Then force that money into government bonds or something. The point of social security and medicare and going into a general pool is retarded. It's time to switch this system to a 401k/IRA based system. If you want it to be a true safety net, you can limit investments to very basic risk-free ones. But it's time to individualize my money and not make this a general pool crap.

Its time to individualize your money by putting into a 401k/IRA. Read that again. Laugh out loud.

 

[BoomerD]

Would supplemental insurance cover all of it without Medicare? Do you really think his premium would be $200/month or even $2000/month without Medicare?
He gets his care paid for by combination of government and private supplemental insurance. That is a good model, basics covered by government, you pay for bells and whistles.

I agree completely. You get BASIC medical care from the government...at no out-of-pocket expense or a small co-pay, and if you want/need "extra" coverage that will cover things like everyday doctor's visits, elective surgery, etc...you pay for it in the form of supplemental insurance.

 

[theeedude]

i agree. i think what was passed was a clusterfuck. I do think in the next 20 years we will have a good working solution (well if we continue to talk and work on it)

That we can agree, you are just not going to get a good bill in current political environment, with one party able to block progress and using it to not improve the bill but score cheap political points for next election. It's like mixing chocolate with feces to reach a "compromise" filibuster-proof candy bar. But at least it proves that the candy making machine works, we can keep reforming health care until we get to what we need.

 

[StageLeft]

There are simply not enough hospitals, doctors, nurses, and machines around to give this high level of care as OP describes to each American. It is absolutely impossible.

 

[Throckmorton]

He's getting up in age and the subject of his health came up as he's had numerous heart surgeries and recently a pace maker. Simple question I asked was "is medicare covering all of this?". Because we're talking a ton of healthcare related costs and expense.

Oh god no, he said. Medicare wouldn't come close but he gets to have pretty much any procedure he wants, from any specialist or doctor he wants. How does he get the greatest care in the world?

Supplemental insurance. 200 bucks a month to supplement medicare and that insurance picks up what medicare won't. Yep, those evil insurance companies are making sure my dad lives a long and happy life without depleting his nest egg he's living off of.

You really don't get it do you? The only reason that supplemental insurance is only $200 a month is because Medicare takes care of most of the risk.

Do me a favor... Look up the price of an equivalent level of health insurance for someone your dad's age without Medicare.

 

[Pens1566]

spidey likes medicare !!!!

 

[her209]

There are simply not enough hospitals, doctors, nurses, and machines around to give this high level of care as OP describes to each American. It is absolutely impossible.

Sure there is. Just let anyone who wants to be a doctor to become one. But that will drive down the quality of care too along with costs!

 

[Vette73]

Sure there is. Just let anyone who wants to be a doctor to become one. But that will drive down the quality of care too along with costs!

Or train more doctors. Problem is the AMA does not want to many out there so there is a limit to the amount of doctors we have. Many qualified people do not get into med schools each year due to limits, not their abilities.

Its also why nurses do a lot of work that Doctors once did, there are more of them and more schools for them.

 

[dmcowen674]

Spidey's on a role though.

He is conservative except when it comes to his wife making big bucks from public coffers as a school administrator and when his dad needs medicare.

Spidey's politics: public spending is not okay unless its going to my family in which case it's totally cool.

Typical Republican hypocrite.

This shows how they don't even realize how much they hate the country.

It's pretty amazing to see and shows how it's possible for them to sleep at night. When you are a horse with blinders on you don't see but what you are allowed to see.

 

[SammyJr]

He's getting up in age and the subject of his health came up as he's had numerous heart surgeries and recently a pace maker. Simple question I asked was "is medicare covering all of this?". Because we're talking a ton of healthcare related costs and expense.

Oh god no, he said. Medicare wouldn't come close but he gets to have pretty much any procedure he wants, from any specialist or doctor he wants. How does he get the greatest care in the world?

Supplemental insurance. 200 bucks a month to supplement medicare and that insurance picks up what medicare won't. Yep, those evil insurance companies are making sure my dad lives a long and happy life without depleting his nest egg he's living off of.

Sounds like the system we should have for all Americans. If you support this kind of hybrid system, then you would find yourself in good company with all sorts of evil types who lean liberal and progressive, including me.

BTW, its easy for private insurance to be cheap when they pick up only 20% of the health costs.

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

So you answer to limited healthcare is no healthcare. So thats how we fix it. Oh wait... :hmm:

So your answer is to leave a broken system in place and let it get worse and worse and be abused by more and more people that come to the conclusion of. I don't have to do anything and I get free health care. While those that work their asses off pay for everyone elses free ride.
If it were up to me, I'd impliment sterilization of people living off of welfare for more than a year. Poverty breeds more poverty. The people that are in true poverty are there because they are not motivated to work. They have found out there is a safety net and they can live off of it and not have to do anything in return.

It's not my, your, or anyone elses civic duty to pay for lazy bastards.
If you want to make sure that the less fortunate have more, then freely give your money away. No one will stop you. But don't force others to pay that don't want to.

 

[her209]

If it were up to me, I'd impliment sterilization of people living off of welfare for more than a year. Poverty breeds more poverty. The people that are in true poverty are there because they are not motivated to work. They have found out there is a safety net and they can live off of it and not have to do anything in return.

It's not my, your, or anyone elses civic duty to pay for lazy bastards.
If you want to make sure that the less fortunate have more, then freely give your money away. No one will stop you. But don't force others to pay that don't want to.

You want to sterilize the entire state of West Virginia? Its bad enough with the wincest.

 

[SammyJr]

The point is medicare doesn't even deliver sufficient coverage. You NEED supplemental insurance to cover the potholes medicare leaves behind. Now you want to give this insufficient coverage to every American? Expect quality to be driven down more. now instead of pot holes you just get unpaved roads. Good luck with that.

This is a fine example of black and white conservative thinking. Anyone who seriously supports Medicare for All also supports supplimental insurance plans.

Edit: Just because Medicare is bad and many people feel that way, doesn't mean you tell them to get off it. The fact is Medicare and SS are just bad deals. We're getting ripped off. But since you already paid for it and can't get your money, you might as well accept whatever shit they throw at you. It's better than walking away right? So you take what you can get and you dump more money to purchase supplemental insurance to get what you REALLY need.

No, the problem is that health care is really really expensive and Medicare would cost even more for 100% coverage. This is why it covers 80%. Private insurance works the same way - it also has coinsurance, copays, and deductibles.

It's like the government throwing you free housing. Here's a 60 year old shack that's falling apart. When winter comes, you will have a leaky roof. Everyone who bites has to throw money into roofing. When they complain that the house sucks, you tell them "Why don't you move out?" Well it was free house. But it doesn't mean it doesn't suck for a house...

In your example, you're bitching that you have to maintain your free house. I could have sworn that houses you bought/mortgaged also needed maintainance. I'm trying to figure out why you're complaining, but then I realized that most conservatives hold Government to an impossibly high standard so they can bitch about it when it doesn't meet their expectations.

 

[SammyJr]

You really don't get it do you? The only reason that supplemental insurance is only $200 a month is because Medicare takes care of most of the risk.

Do me a favor... Look up the price of an equivalent level of health insurance for someone your dad's age without Medicare.

You're asking the impossible. No one insures an 87 year old. Without Medicare paying 80% of the cost, premiums would be impossibly high.

This is the fault in spidey's logic - he thinks that his Dad could get those rates without Medicare.

 

[ichy]

Or train more doctors. Problem is the AMA does not want to many out there so there is a limit to the amount of doctors we have. Many qualified people do not get into med schools each year due to limits, not their abilities.

Its also why nurses do a lot of work that Doctors once did, there are more of them and more schools for them.

I wish people would learn how medical education works...

American med schools aren't the bottleneck. We can and do import foreign physicians, or Americans who trained in foreign schools. The real bottleneck is residency training slots, because a physician must have done post-med school training in the US in order to practice here. Residency training is largely funded by CMS (Medicare/Medicaid) so it's actually the government that caps the number of physicians.

 

[ichy]

You're asking the impossible. No one insures an 87 year old. Without Medicare paying 80% of the cost, premiums would be impossibly high.

This is the fault in spidey's logic - he thinks that his Dad could get those rates without Medicare.

Actually in Switzerland the elderly can and do buy private health insurance, however that's because the government regulates prices AND there's a universal mandate so everyone has to get coverage. I'm generally a believer in free markets, however without some sort of government intervention the elderly would be uninsurable. The "free-market" solution to medical care for those who're elderly and not wealthy would be to send them to the Soylent Green factory...

 

[zephyrprime]

If an 87 yo had to buy private insurance, it would cost about $500 a month.

https://www.bluecrossmn.com/apps/dt...b.html.TOKEN=7356d27641f0b68f51cf44a7a8b0200d

 

[BoomerD]

If an 87 yo had to buy private insurance, it would cost about $500 a month.

https://www.bluecrossmn.com/apps/dt...b.html.TOKEN=7356d27641f0b68f51cf44a7a8b0200d

I'd be surprised if that were true. For my wife & I, both in our mid-50's, even crappy Blue Cross would cost between $1200 and $1600 as of two years ago. Yes, that's in Kahleeforneeya not MN, but it stopped me from buying Blue Cross.

 

[Mr. Lennon]

Nomination for self ownage of the year thread?

 

[Pens1566]

Nomination for self ownage of the year thread?

I believe forum rules have exempted spidey from that award.

 

[Vette73]

I believe forum rules have exempted spidey from that award.

Yea theres a limit to how many times you can be nominated. :awe:

 

[Thump553]

If an 87 yo had to buy private insurance, it would cost about $500 a month.

https://www.bluecrossmn.com/apps/dt...b.html.TOKEN=7356d27641f0b68f51cf44a7a8b0200d

I agree with what BoomerD said a few posts above. I suspect this Blue Cross is also some kind of supplmental plan. My wife and I pay over $500 per month for no-frills, catestrophic coverage ($10k-$15k annual deductible) for a couple in mid-50's, excellent health. And ours isn't Blue Cross, I left them a decade ago when the cost was over a grand a month.

Back on the thread point, it's astonishing how many "conservatives" now love Medicare even though the GOP tried mightly to scuttle it originally (Governor Reagan made the national scene based on his opposition to it). maybe soon Spidey will be walking around with a "Keep Your Gubermit Hands Off My Medicare" sign soon.