My 87 year old dad's incredible healthcare

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Modelworks

Lifer
Feb 22, 2007
16,240
7
76
No medicare does not pay it all. My dad is 81 this year and on oxygen with copd. I went yesterday and had his drugs refilled and the actual cost for some of them like inhalers were about $180 , medicare paid all but $62 of that. Now some may think that medicare paid $118, but not so fast. Each month my dad also gets a statement from his medicare provider showing what they were willing to pay the pharmacy for the drug. Their limit was $89 for this one so they paid $27.

I think some think medicare is a government insurance plan where the government pays the pharmacy, not so. Every so many months/years seniors get to choose a medicare provider. The provider is the one paid by the government. In return the senior pays a premium to that provider, my dads is $118 per month. My dads provider paid out about $126 last month, so my dads benefit for having paid into medicare for 60 years is $8 a month. If during the year he happens to reach the preset limit for the provider they will make him pay everything out of pocket, how is this better than other insurance ?
 

Carmen813

Diamond Member
May 18, 2007
3,189
0
76
Modelworks,
That sounds like Medicare Advantage, which if I recall correctly is being phased out. It's basically a windfall for insurance companies.
 

Zedtom

Platinum Member
Nov 23, 2001
2,146
0
0
The medicare system always will pay out more than any individual has put in. It is a huge bureaucratic nightmare that the AMA, HMO's, the insurance industry and hospitals are content to leave as is. The American taxpayer should realize that health care reform is being sabotaged by the powers that benefit most from its waste and inefficiency.

The public should be very concerned about the massive bills being run up by those with no resources that have never paid a dime into the system. (Visit any nursing home in the country and take a look at who's getting free health care courtesy of the taxpayers. It's mostly Europeans, not Mexicans.)
 

SammyJr

Golden Member
Feb 27, 2008
1,708
0
0
I sure wish Canada had those. Right now it's 100% free to see a doctor, and the result is that people will go there just to waste time and be retarded. One of my coworkers (who is fairly young) sees a doctor twice a year just for a check up. What a waste of money. Also, my childhood neighbors wasted so much government money it was unbelievable. Any time one of the kids had a cold, they would see a doctor. If that shit was $20 a pop, they would think twice.

Twice yearly checkups aren't really a bad idea and don't cost much.

In the United States with glorious private health care, we also have people who see the doctor at every sniffle, despite a $20 copay. Copays are a good idea but don't fix hypocondriacs or over anxious mothers.
 
Feb 19, 2001
20,158
20
81
If spidey's dad didn't have to pay into Medicare and was still on private insurance, you don't think that everyone's premium wouldn't go up to cover him and everyone like him?

And if no one had to pay for Medicare, that would be a lot more pocket change that could go into my health care plan. If you look at it as Medicare or Private insurance, one way or the other you're pooling money together for an "insurance" plan for everyone. As it stands now I have to drop some money into Medicare, and drop some money into my private health insurance. Same with Spidey's dad. Why separate it into 2 pools? Especially when we know one is a piece of shit and the other is a for profit industry? For what I get right now my private insurance delivers excellent coverage and excellent treatment. My health conscious (paranoid) parents get checked up for everything and get extra procedures done here and there. No problem for their health insurance.

The idea is that the money is pooled anyway. Whether its insurance or Medicare. What is known is that Medicare money grows at a terrible rate and is used by the government for spending like war spending and then paid back each year afterward. As a result we get shafted in terms of what money is really reserved for our healthcare. If you can show that every $1 I put in Medicare is worth more than that $1 I save today for my private health insurance when I'm 87, then I'm willing to accept that Medicare might be worth it, but for what I see right now, Medicare is just a broken life raft. It's supposed to save you but it doesn't really save you. I mean if you thought those health insurance nightmare stories were bad, Medicare might as well be a death sentence.

Yes, Medicare is wasteful spending if spending hundreds of thousands of dollars to keep your father alive is wasteful spending.

You keep making this point but Medicare is forced spending. It's like making me put $5 a day into a food fund so the government can serve me hot dogs. After a month I'd say its a waste. It's not like food isn't good. I don't want government quality hot dogs for every meal. It doesn't mean I don't value eating food. I'd rather be able to have CHOICE. And this is the same with Medicare. We don't have choice.
 
Nov 29, 2006
15,601
4,051
136
You keep making this point but Medicare is forced spending. It's like making me put $5 a day into a food fund so the government can serve me hot dogs. After a month I'd say its a waste. It's not like food isn't good. I don't want government quality hot dogs for every meal. It doesn't mean I don't value eating food. I'd rather be able to have CHOICE. And this is the same with Medicare. We don't have choice.

You have a choice to get your own supplemental insurance from those for profit places that will drop you in a heart beat if they feel like you are costing them too much money to live.

I mean this is Anandtech where everyone makes a bazillion dollars a year so it shouldnt hurt your wallet any.
 

SammyJr

Golden Member
Feb 27, 2008
1,708
0
0
You keep making this point but Medicare is forced spending. It's like making me put $5 a day into a food fund so the government can serve me hot dogs. After a month I'd say its a waste. It's not like food isn't good. I don't want government quality hot dogs for every meal. It doesn't mean I don't value eating food. I'd rather be able to have CHOICE. And this is the same with Medicare. We don't have choice.

Again, for those who don't read threads. Quit thinking all or nothing. Medicare doesn't inhibit choices - it enables choices. Medicare provides baseline coverage which makes private coverage for the elderly realistic and affordable. Its an example of synergy between the public and private sector that works for everyone involved.

Oh wait, you want the elderly poor to make the "choice" to be without coverage and trumpet as a victory for the Free Market Gods and consumer "choice." Am I close?
 

SammyJr

Golden Member
Feb 27, 2008
1,708
0
0
And if no one had to pay for Medicare, that would be a lot more pocket change that could go into my health care plan. If you look at it as Medicare or Private insurance, one way or the other you're pooling money together for an "insurance" plan for everyone. As it stands now I have to drop some money into Medicare, and drop some money into my private health insurance. Same with Spidey's dad. Why separate it into 2 pools? Especially when we know one is a piece of shit and the other is a for profit industry? For what I get right now my private insurance delivers excellent coverage and excellent treatment. My health conscious (paranoid) parents get checked up for everything and get extra procedures done here and there. No problem for their health insurance.

Bigger pools have lower prices because you have a larger group of healthy people and a larger group of people who die without using services.

Medicare isn't a piece of shit and despite years of Republican tampering and borrowing by both parties, it does quite well for being baseline insurance for the elderly. Your problem is that you hold the Government to this massively high standard then get pissed off when it doesn't meet your lofty standards. Medicare does not and will never cover 100% of treatments. It isn't supposed to and shouldn't. Supplemental insurance will always be around because people have different needs and expectations.

The idea is that the money is pooled anyway. Whether its insurance or Medicare. What is known is that Medicare money grows at a terrible rate and is used by the government for spending like war spending and then paid back each year afterward. As a result we get shafted in terms of what money is really reserved for our healthcare. If you can show that every $1 I put in Medicare is worth more than that $1 I save today for my private health insurance when I'm 87, then I'm willing to accept that Medicare might be worth it, but for what I see right now, Medicare is just a broken life raft. It's supposed to save you but it doesn't really save you. I mean if you thought those health insurance nightmare stories were bad, Medicare might as well be a death sentence.

This isn't a Medicare problem. The problem is that too many people are too eager for yet another war. Too many people turn a blind eye to the China problem and wonder why our social programs are growing at such a rate. Blaming Medicare for the problems of our population and Government is shortsighted at best.
 

ebaycj

Diamond Member
Mar 9, 2002
5,418
0
0
First off, I don't think anybody will find a domestic insurance quote for persons over 65 that *doesn't* take medicare into account. Basically, everybody over 65 receives medicare benefits, so premiums are based on that fact.

Best estimate would be travelers health insurance (designed for foreigners traveling to the USA). You'd have to get a year-long policy though, to compare.
 

Throckmorton

Lifer
Aug 23, 2007
16,830
3
0
And if no one had to pay for Medicare, that would be a lot more pocket change that could go into my health care plan. If you look at it as Medicare or Private insurance, one way or the other you're pooling money together for an "insurance" plan for everyone. As it stands now I have to drop some money into Medicare, and drop some money into my private health insurance. Same with Spidey's dad. Why separate it into 2 pools? Especially when we know one is a piece of shit and the other is a for profit industry? For what I get right now my private insurance delivers excellent coverage and excellent treatment. My health conscious (paranoid) parents get checked up for everything and get extra procedures done here and there. No problem for their health insurance.

The idea is that the money is pooled anyway. Whether its insurance or Medicare. What is known is that Medicare money grows at a terrible rate and is used by the government for spending like war spending and then paid back each year afterward. As a result we get shafted in terms of what money is really reserved for our healthcare. If you can show that every $1 I put in Medicare is worth more than that $1 I save today for my private health insurance when I'm 87, then I'm willing to accept that Medicare might be worth it, but for what I see right now, Medicare is just a broken life raft. It's supposed to save you but it doesn't really save you. I mean if you thought those health insurance nightmare stories were bad, Medicare might as well be a death sentence.



You keep making this point but Medicare is forced spending. It's like making me put $5 a day into a food fund so the government can serve me hot dogs. After a month I'd say its a waste. It's not like food isn't good. I don't want government quality hot dogs for every meal. It doesn't mean I don't value eating food. I'd rather be able to have CHOICE. And this is the same with Medicare. We don't have choice.

Except the alternative to government hot dogs isn't gourmet food for the same price. It's either starving to death or paying exhorbitant prices so the food vendor can still make a profit when you're 87 and it takes millions of dollars to keep you alive one more year.

Good luck with all that money in your pocket for insurance when no one finds it profitable to ensure your old decrepit ass.
 

ebaycj

Diamond Member
Mar 9, 2002
5,418
0
0
You're neglecting what would have happened to that money at a lowball 5% return over time. But thank you for putting some thought into it.

The main point again is that medicare is not sufficient for quality care and must be supplemented by 90% of seniors. He's a WW2 vet, my pops was operating and decoding shit in the south pacific. And yet he STILL CHOOSES TO USE PRIVATE INSURANCE SO THAT HE CAN GET THE BEST HEALTHCARE IN THE WORLD.

Assuming your father made 150,000 per year for 35 years, that is 4500 per year in Medicare tax. This is very likely an unreasonably high assumption, but I am doing this for illustrative purposes.

First year's contribution
4500 x 1.05^35 =$ 24,822.07

Tenth year's contribution
4500 x 1.05^25 =$ 16,000.53

Twentieth year's contribution
4500 x 1.05^15 =$ 9,822.94

Thirtieth year's contribution
4500 x 1.05^5 =$ 6030.43

Last year's contribution
4500 x 1.05^1 =$ 4725.00

Sum total of the value of his contributions plus interest at 5% on Day 1 of medicare eligibility: $ 426,763.45

And again, that's assuming he was making $ 150,000 per year (nearly quadruple the CURRENT national average) for HIS ENTIRE CAREER. And it still only comes out to $426,763.45.

What about the people who were making 10,000 per year or 20,000 per year ?