Muslim attacks Athiest dressed as Mohammad, Pennsyl. Muslim Judge Sides w/ Attacker

[Juddog]

LOL @ the Muslims getting upset. This is America, adapt to the laws and culture here or gladly take your muslim ass back to another country.

 

[Orignal Earl]

This is America, adapt to the laws and culture here or gladly take your muslim ass back to another country.

Muslims have been living in and following American laws for hundreds of years.
So wouldn't Islam already be part of American culture?

 

[Mxylplyx]

Something to keep in mind is the term "creeping sharia" - its how sharia law is creeping into the society of western cultures.

This court case, the incidents in Dearborn Michigan, muslim students wanting interest free loans,,,,, is all part of two conflicting cultures.

I not saying muslims and islam are bad, its that islam and western ideologically do not mix very well. There are certain "virtues" that western society upholds, such as freedom of speech and freedom to follow the religion of your choice, both of which are prohibited by sharia law.

I have no problem with Islam as long as it is kept where it belongs, in the private sphere. The second they, or any religion, wants laws passed to accommodate their beliefs, is when I have a problem, which is why Santorum can fvck off.

 

[Texashiker]

I have no problem with Islam as long as it is kept where it belongs, in the private sphere. The second they, or any religion, wants laws passed to accommodate their beliefs, is when I have a problem,

That is where western society and islam conflict.

We will make cessions to accommodate muslims, but muslims will not make cesssions to other groups.

These cessions include everything from allowing muslim students to leave school to pray, to asking catholic schools to take down the cross and provide special prayer rooms for muslims.

If you want an example, a school in canada allows muslim prayers on campus, but banned other religions from doing the same.

http://www.christianpost.com/news/o...-prayers-while-allowing-muslim-prayers-52281/

 

[Orignal Earl]

If you want an example, a school in canada allows muslim prayers on campus, but banned other religions from doing the same.

http://www.christianpost.com/news/o...-prayers-while-allowing-muslim-prayers-52281/

In your words, what happened in this article you posted?

 

[woolfe9999]

I haven't read the thread beyond page 1, but why is the First Amendment even relevant here, and why was it relevant to the judge? The judge was probably wrong about whether the First Amendment protects the atheist protester but it isn't even relevant to whether the defendant was guilty.

Assume, hypothetically, that the person who was assaulted was instead distributing kiddy porn, which definitely isn't protected by the First Amendment. It would still be against the law to assault him. Vigilantism isn't legal. When you see someone committing a crime, you're supposed to report it to the police. Self-defense or defense of others against physical violence are the only exceptions. If there was an actual physical assault here, then the attacker is guilty and it doesn't matter what form of speech the victim was engaged in, and whether that speech was Constitutionally protected or not.

 

[thraashman]

Ok, so for all you out there that love to throw around the phrase "activist judge", now you finally have one that is ACTUALLY activist. He's ruling based on his personal belief instead of based on the laws and Constitution. As woolfe above me said, violence isn't a protected action regardless of any perceived First Amendment issues.

 

[Fern]

Muslims have been living in and following American laws for hundreds of years.
So wouldn't Islam already be part of American culture?

TBH, I didn't search much, but from what I've seen your premise is incorrect. Muslims haven't been here that long, and certainly not in any number great enough to heavily influence American culture.

In recent times the growth of Muslims here seems primarily driven by converts. Since they started out with American culture to begin with it's hard for me to see how they could have had much of a (different) cultural influence. Many Americans have different religions yet share the same culture. And by "different religions" I don't mean Baptist v Catholic, we have Americans even in my small town who are Buddhists etc. I doubt many know, or care, they seem to practice their beliefs quietly and in other respects (culturally) are indistinguishable.

Fern

 

[Orignal Earl]

TBH, I didn't search much, but from what I've seen your premise is incorrect. Muslims haven't been here that long, and certainly not in any number great enough to heavily influence American culture.

In recent times the growth of Muslims here seems primarily driven by converts. Since they started out with American culture to begin with it's hard for me to see how they could have had much of a (different) cultural influence. Many Americans have different religions yet share the same culture. And by "different religions" I don't mean Baptist v Catholic, we have Americans even in my small town who are Buddhists etc. I doubt many know, or care, they seem to practice their beliefs quietly and in other respects (culturally) are indistinguishable.

Fern

They influenced it enough that many American city's and towns have Middle Eastern names, no?

edit- They fought in all your wars, and lay beside their fellow Americans in Arlington

 

[chucky2]

What does that have to do with an adult physically assulting someone over how a particular version of a sky god is being displayed?

 

[Fern]

They influenced it enough that many American city's and towns have Middle Eastern names, no?

edit- They fought in all your wars, and lay beside their fellow Americans in Arlington

Like what Beirut or Lebanon?

Beirut was a beautiful place before the wars, and a lot of Christians lived there. IIRC, the Christians actually ran it for some time.

Anyhoo, here's an article about. They conclude it has little or nothing to do with Muslim/Arab settlers but involves quite a few different reasons. IDK if they are correct.

http://www.saudiaramcoworld.com/iss...banan.new.hampshire.to.bagdad.california..htm

Edit: Forgot to say that I'm not sure there is such a thing as "Muslim Culture". There are more Muslims in countries outside of the Middle East or the Magheb and they are non-Arabic (or non-Persian). Seems to me "culture" has more to do with ethnicity or country than religion.

Fern

 

[Orignal Earl]

Like what Beirut or Lebanon?

Beirut was a beautiful place before the wars, and a lot of Christians lived there. IIRC, the Christians actually ran it for some time.

Anyhoo, here's an article about. They conclude it has little or nothing to do with Muslim/Arab settlers but involves quite a few different reasons. IDK if they are correct.

http://www.saudiaramcoworld.com/iss...banan.new.hampshire.to.bagdad.california..htm

Edit: Forgot to say that I'm not sure there is such a thing as "Muslim Culture". There are more Muslims in countries outside of the Middle East or the Magheb and they are non-Arabic (or non-Persian). Seems to me "culture" has more to do with ethnicity or country than religion.

Fern

Fern

Yes, there is a lot of them.
The first one that came to my mind was Medina Ohio, named after some holy place in SA

*Edit: Forgot to say that I'm not sure there is such a thing as "Muslim Culture". *
American culture seems to mean a lot of different things to a lot of different people too

 

[Infohawk]

They influenced it enough that many American city's and towns have Middle Eastern names, no?

edit- They fought in all your wars, and lay beside their fellow Americans in Arlington

What does that have to do with an adult physically assulting someone over how a particular version of a sky god is being displayed?

I'm not sure.

 

[Orignal Earl]

I'm not sure.

Do you two not see the post I quoted and replied too?

 

[woolfe9999]

Yes, there is a lot of them.
The first one that came to my mind was Medina Ohio, named after some holy place in SA

*Edit: Forgot to say that I'm not sure there is such a thing as "Muslim Culture". *
American culture seems to mean a lot of different things to a lot of different people too

Yeah, but there are no Muslims in Medina, OH, or at least not enough to statistically rate.

http://www.bestplaces.net/religion/city/ohio/medina

That said, the city was originally to be named "Mecca" so I think it is in fact named after the city in Saudi Arabia. However, Medina, OH was founded in 1816 and there weren't but a tiny handful of Muslims in the U.S. at that time. Hard to say why it was named after a city in SA. U.S. cities get named after foreign cities all the time.

 

[cybrsage]

LOL @ the Muslims getting upset. This is America, adapt to the laws and culture here or gladly take your muslim ass back to another country.

What about Muslims who were born here...what country should they go back to when they are from here?

 

[Orignal Earl]

Yeah, but there are no Muslims in Medina, OH, or at least not enough to statistically rate.

http://www.bestplaces.net/religion/city/ohio/medina

That said, the city was originally to be named "Mecca" so I think it is in fact named after the city in Saudi Arabia. However, Medina, OH was founded in 1816 and there weren't but a tiny handful of Muslims in the U.S. at that time. Hard to say why it was named after a city in SA. U.S. cities get named after foreign cities all the time.

Yes, they could not name it Mecca because there already was a Mecca OH.
Usually there is a good reason people name their cities after foreign cities
But ya, I know I'm not going to get through to the Islamphobes on this board.

 

[cybrsage]

I have no problem with Islam as long as it is kept where it belongs, in the private sphere. The second they, or any religion, wants laws passed to accommodate their beliefs, is when I have a problem, which is why Santorum can fvck off.

The first amendment is NOT freedom FROM religion, no matter how much you wish it was.

 

[chucky2]

Do you two not see the post I quoted and replied too?

Yes, I see that. I'm still not getting your overall point though. Muslims have been in America for a long time. OK? In any significant number? 200 years ago the % was what? 100 years ago the % was what?

I'm not sure why the country as a whole would ever care internally WTF Muslims would want, especially considering how predominantly Muslim countries have fared. Based on that alone, I'd think we'd not want their culture here. Not PC? OK?

 

[Orignal Earl]

Yes, I see that. I'm still not getting your overall point though. Muslims have been in America for a long time. OK? In any significant number? 200 years ago the % was what? 100 years ago the % was what?

I'm not sure why the country as a whole would ever care internally WTF Muslims would want, especially considering how predominantly Muslim countries have fared. Based on that alone, I'd think we'd not want their culture here. Not PC? OK?

Yes, I really can't see a lot of Muslims wanting to immigrate to the US anymore.
There is just so many other better choices,

 

[Bateluer]

First Amendment aside, what about the right to not be attacked by a nut case?

If this had happened in Arizona or Texas, the attacker could very well have been shot by the victim. Open carry laws FTW.

 

[Rainsford]

Yes, I see that. I'm still not getting your overall point though. Muslims have been in America for a long time. OK? In any significant number? 200 years ago the % was what? 100 years ago the % was what?

I'm not sure why the country as a whole would ever care internally WTF Muslims would want, especially considering how predominantly Muslim countries have fared. Based on that alone, I'd think we'd not want their culture here. Not PC? OK?

There is no "they", there's no "what Muslims want" and for that matter, there's no "us" either. And if there was a particular way Muslims think, you're not going to get it from reading some cherry picked article about one Muslim chosen specifically to encourage anti-Muslim sentiment.

 

[chucky2]

Yes, I really can't see a lot of Muslims wanting to immigrate to the US anymore.
There is just so many other better choices,

Good?

 

[Rainsford]

First Amendment aside, what about the right to not be attacked by a nut case?

If this had happened in Arizona or Texas, the attacker could very well have been shot by the victim. Open carry laws FTW.

I'm sorry, but I don't really think killing someone in what was apparently a non-serious "attack" (at the very worst, and according to only one participant in the story) is a "win" outcome. Defending yourself is good, using lethal force in every single personal conflict is just dumb.

 

[Infohawk]

There is no "they", there's no "what Muslims want" and for that matter, there's no "us" either. And if there was a particular way Muslims think, you're not going to get it from reading some cherry picked article about one Muslim chosen specifically to encourage anti-Muslim sentiment.

How far do you take this nihilistic attitude? Do you refuse to say that Republicans are pro-life because there are some pro-choice Republicans out there? Or at some point do you recognize there are some trends, some patterns? How many cherry-picked articles become a pattern? How many opinion polls does it take to show that there are common beliefs among certain groups?

Refusing to recognize any common positions among Muslims is about as ridiculous as saying all Muslims are terrorists.