MS sued again... f-ing communists...

[Jeff7181]

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: Xiety
OMG. I hate all MS-bashers and MS-suers with so much passion. Being an European, I just hate these dumb fvcks. How can you be so stupid.

I feel bad for Bill Gates and rest of the Microsoft... they're NOT doing anything but provide an excellent computing experience for 90% of world's population. What's wrong with that? I know, for sure, that my mom, dad, grandma, uncle, aunt wouldn't be able to send me photos from back home if they had to use Linux, Unix, OpenBSD, etc...

grrrr.

I bet they could use a mac just fine.
Ironic since MS gained its monopoly (ignoring the DOS os they got for a song) from 'reverse engineering' Apple's OS which was legally bought from Xerox. They lost the suit to apple but refused to pay for more than a decade and then finally copped out with a stock agreement. In short, they broke the law, were ruled against, ignored the ruling.
They're thugs and crooks.
People who say that real player sucks and media player is better (or in your case 'the computing experience') are very naive. Given the length of time that MS had held this monopoly and its anti-competitive (indeed anti-capitalist) practices of course the competition isn't as good (except in the browser market) How could they possibly produce as good of a product when they have been hedged out of the market?
No sales = no $$$$ for development.
Look at what happened to Corel.
The irony of the title of this thread. MS practices=communist.

If you believe what you say, why don't you take action? Refuse to buy their products... if you want to teach MS a lesson that's all you and your socialist/communist friends have to do... stop buying their products. The truth is, you can't do that, because without Microsoft you wouldn't be able to do what you do...

 

[Gibson486]

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Just look at how much IE has innovated since 2001. Not. At. All.

And how has Mozilla really been innovation?

-tabbed browsing
-popup blocking
-download manager
lots more.

Tabbed browsing???? Check out Opera

-popup blocking????
-download manager????

You can get a pop up blocker with the google toolbar for IE and download managers have been out for a long time....

 

[Jeff7181]

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Just look at how much IE has innovated since 2001. Not. At. All.

And how has Mozilla really been innovation?

-tabbed browsing
-popup blocking
-download manager
lots more.

Tabbed browsing???? Check out Opera

-popup blocking????
-download manager????

You can get a pop up blocker with the google toolbar for IE and download managers have been out for a long time....

AOL had a download manager back around '94 or '95 didn't they?

 

[Gibson486]

Yeah, AOL did have one.

There is a difference between having a better product and having innovation.....

 

[yllus]

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Just look at how much IE has innovated since 2001. Not. At. All.

And how has Mozilla really been innovation?

-tabbed browsing
-popup blocking
-download manager
lots more.

Tabbed browsing???? Check out Opera

-popup blocking????
-download manager????

You can get a pop up blocker with the google toolbar for IE and download managers have been out for a long time....

That's ironic. You want Microsoft to be more competitive by bundling in even more features into the standard IE installation. Then we'd really hear the 3rd party software vendors scream.

 

[AIWGuru]

Originally posted by: DWW

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: DWW
The whole thing gets me angry. Most people on Anandtech forums are computer enthusiasts. That is great--it really is. But for the rest of the world, 90%+ (guessing, probably higher) of the population just want a "solution". They just want something to use the Internet, type some documents, fire off a few emails, play a bit of music while their at it.

Most home users I know aren't too computer savvy now. The user base has changed and everyone uses computers--even my 75 year old neighbor. She doesn't know how to go find music software. She doesn't have the time nor the patience or understanding for what she "needs" to play music while she types emails. These people are oblivious and just want a solution.

What happens if Microsoft is eventually forced to sell Windows without any media player, web browser, mail client (whats the difference between a mail client and browser? not a whole lot on the moral grounds) hell even a calculator because I'm DWW Math firm and I make a great little calculator that I feel I can't get a market on because everyone has one FREE. What then? The OS itself will be unusable for most people. A kernel, file system, drivers and a GUI (of course more). But that is basically it. What would they do with it. Sit around and look stupid? Not get any work done? Yep!

I'd like to think Windows is Microsoft's product and they should have every right to do what they want with that piece of software. Monopoly laws need to change and are too OLD and don't take todays technological matters to hand. Same with patent laws--OLD and must change (common use stuff like one-click shopping shouldn't be patentable!).

People whine that because Microsoft holds the desktop that it should be "regulated". Not fair I say. NetBSD, GNU/Linux, Solarix x86...all freely downloable online. I'd argue that NetBSD and GNU/Linux have even better hardware support than Windows. Plus they are -free-. So yep, there are no alternatives

These operating systems come with everything a home user needs, most larger distributions come with abiword and you can grab staroffice or openoffice if you'd like. Mozilla and Firefox are freely available amongst many others. Yep they even have a TCP/IP stack (

) so you can do the -exact- same sh!t more or less.

So what is stopping these people from installing Redhat's GNU/Linux or some other user friendly distribution of an Open Source operating system? Nothing. But they have nothing better to do.

And as far as making them share the source--that is not right. They spent millions upon millions (even billions over the whole lifetime of Windows) into R&D and some people can just come along and steal it? Makes it look like they are just hacks and can't roll their own. Kind of like those who think -all- software should be Open Source/Free Software just because they want to take code for sh!t they can't do.

As others have said Microsoft provides more than ample amounts of information to program software for Windows. Look how much information is on MSDN... crazy!

Ugh anyhow. I just think its a bunch of wankers trying to do this

That's a very narrow vision
A media player and web browswer are not integral to the OS.
They're integral to a complete system.
OEM builders like Dell, HP, etc should have the choice (as they once did) to install any program they want onto the system.
They could ship a windows system with netscape and some other media player etc.
Microsoft's current policies ARE anti-competitive and the EU's decision that Microsoft will have to ship windows without media player is correct. OEMs can install whatever player they want.
Also, your own US government ruled that IE in windows is anti-competitive and microsoft is trying to demonstrate that it's unremovable from the OS

What a paper tiger...

Yes they are to make a complete system but ....*drumroll*..... that is what people are -paying- for. They want it all. People being the 90%+ of the market who aren't computer enthusiasts--you know, the ones who drive the tech economy.

OEMs okay. But what about smaller businesses...the type that make up more than half of the sales I'd say (mom and pop shops get at least 75% of computer sales here). They are to use a bare installation without tools? What if they dont have the time AND money to develop their own collection of tools? They will go out of business if they can't offer what the bigger guys do.

And even those selling computers who manage to stay in business... do you really want to rely on all of them getting together and making a set of compliant tools that all interoperate??

I can see it now, picture IBM having mozilla, and Dell having Opera and Compaq having Lynx and Gateway has Firefox and another vendor has something else and another vendor has something else to the tune of hundreds of variants. Do you really think that bleak sort of future is good for desktop computing? Where little Joey can't go to little Mikey's house and take a burn disc along with him because Mikey's parents bought a different vendors machine that doesn't support his files or something equally stupid? Because that is esentially what it would end up like.

Yeah free choice is great for us enthusiasts. Nothing stops me from downloading Firefox and setting it as the default browser right now.

You [explitives] calling these rulings signs of communism are really ignorant. The basis for capitalism is competition and Microsoft is unfairly using their OS marketshare (which was obtained illegally BTW) Such anti-competitive behavior results in poorer products and less choice.
Just look at how much IE has innovated since 2001. Not. At. All.

That "anti-competitve behavior leads to less choice and worse products" card is so outdated. People will demand better and get it. I can't believe how many people whine about IE. Are you for real? ...once again...HOW MUCH INNOVATION CAN A BROWSER HAVE? do you want it to rub your stomach and call you daddy? It does what it NEEDS to do and thats it folks!.

It doesn't get outdated. It's not a jar of mayonaise.
Take a look at the superior capabilities of an open source browser which tears IE to pieces and the enthusiasts jumping on it.
Unfortunately, unlike the golden days when OEM builders shipped different browsers with their PCs, the general public will never know about the superior offerings.
In short, MS's anti-competitive bundling (and indeed ruled illegal) has resulted in years of stagnation.

 

[AIWGuru]

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: AIWGuru
Just look at how much IE has innovated since 2001. Not. At. All.

*raises eyebrow* The already excellent interface not changing in years does not remotely mean no advances in browser technology have taken place. You might want to do some reading on the subject.

MS's super-strict policies towards OEM builders needs to go. They also need to build in some level of de-integration to allow the end user to uninstall whatever we wish. Past that, let them throw in whatever extra value they can muster and that the market will bear.

IE 6 came out in 2001 with windows XP. It hasn't added any new features.
Period.
On the other hand, if it weren't for MS's anti competitive behaviour, OEMs would have chosen superior product if equal choice was present (as in the netscape days) meaning that the following features would be commonplace for everyone:
-tabbed browsing
-popup blocking
-download manager
-built in proper FTP
-built in proper IRC
-built in WYSIWYG HTML editor
-email client with proper and comprehensive spam filter
But they're not.

 

[AIWGuru]

Originally posted by: Jeff7181

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: Xiety
OMG. I hate all MS-bashers and MS-suers with so much passion. Being an European, I just hate these dumb fvcks. How can you be so stupid.

I feel bad for Bill Gates and rest of the Microsoft... they're NOT doing anything but provide an excellent computing experience for 90% of world's population. What's wrong with that? I know, for sure, that my mom, dad, grandma, uncle, aunt wouldn't be able to send me photos from back home if they had to use Linux, Unix, OpenBSD, etc...

grrrr.

I bet they could use a mac just fine.
Ironic since MS gained its monopoly (ignoring the DOS os they got for a song) from 'reverse engineering' Apple's OS which was legally bought from Xerox. They lost the suit to apple but refused to pay for more than a decade and then finally copped out with a stock agreement. In short, they broke the law, were ruled against, ignored the ruling.
They're thugs and crooks.
People who say that real player sucks and media player is better (or in your case 'the computing experience') are very naive. Given the length of time that MS had held this monopoly and its anti-competitive (indeed anti-capitalist) practices of course the competition isn't as good (except in the browser market) How could they possibly produce as good of a product when they have been hedged out of the market?
No sales = no $$$$ for development.
Look at what happened to Corel.
The irony of the title of this thread. MS practices=communist.

If you believe what you say, why don't you take action? Refuse to buy their products... if you want to teach MS a lesson that's all you and your socialist/communist friends have to do... stop buying their products. The truth is, you can't do that, because without Microsoft you wouldn't be able to do what you do...

Wrong. I don't own any MS products.
Also, pointing out that "you won't be able to do what you do" without MS's products is irellevant. That's like saying that the diamond monopoly is okay because without debeers you couldn't get those great diamonds.
That's circular logic.

 

[AIWGuru]

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Just look at how much IE has innovated since 2001. Not. At. All.

And how has Mozilla really been innovation?

-tabbed browsing
-popup blocking
-download manager
lots more.

Tabbed browsing???? Check out Opera

-popup blocking????
-download manager????

You can get a pop up blocker with the google toolbar for IE and download managers have been out for a long time....

Yes, Opera. A browser which isn't IE. That's my point.
Third party programs, that's my point.

 

[AIWGuru]

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: Gibson486

Just look at how much IE has innovated since 2001. Not. At. All.

And how has Mozilla really been innovation?

-tabbed browsing
-popup blocking
-download manager
lots more.

Tabbed browsing???? Check out Opera

-popup blocking????
-download manager????

You can get a pop up blocker with the google toolbar for IE and download managers have been out for a long time....

That's ironic. You want Microsoft to be more competitive by bundling in even more features into the standard IE installation. Then we'd really hear the 3rd party software vendors scream.

Jesus you don't get it. That's not what I'm saying at all. I'm saying that IE shouldn't be bundled at all unless an OEM chooses to bundle it over a competing product which could just as easily be chosen and bundled for its superior functionality. This is how competition and capitalism works. Thus these features would be standard and common through competition.
I swear, the majority of the people that visit this forum have the cognitive ability of an 8 year old.

 

[DWW]

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: AIWGuru
Just look at how much IE has innovated since 2001. Not. At. All.

*raises eyebrow* The already excellent interface not changing in years does not remotely mean no advances in browser technology have taken place. You might want to do some reading on the subject.

MS's super-strict policies towards OEM builders needs to go. They also need to build in some level of de-integration to allow the end user to uninstall whatever we wish. Past that, let them throw in whatever extra value they can muster and that the market will bear.

IE 6 came out in 2001 with windows XP. It hasn't added any new features.
Period.
On the other hand, if it weren't for MS's anti competitive behaviour, OEMs would have chosen superior product if equal choice was present (as in the netscape days) meaning that the following features would be commonplace for everyone:
-tabbed browsing
-popup blocking
-download manager
-built in proper FTP
-built in proper IRC
-built in WYSIWYG HTML editor
-email client with proper and comprehensive spam filter
But they're not.

-tabbed browsing is a preference not necessarily an advance
-popup blocking you can have
-download manager? Who needs one ? I get my 700MB ISO from FTP--a better protocol thanks
-FTP? In a web browser? Keep em separate please
-IRC? That is absurb and definitely unnecessary
-Editor? This is a browser not a web "developer" (is that what they are called?) tool
-Email client? Sorry , once again it is a browser.

 

[Jeff7181]

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: Jeff7181

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: Xiety
OMG. I hate all MS-bashers and MS-suers with so much passion. Being an European, I just hate these dumb fvcks. How can you be so stupid.

I feel bad for Bill Gates and rest of the Microsoft... they're NOT doing anything but provide an excellent computing experience for 90% of world's population. What's wrong with that? I know, for sure, that my mom, dad, grandma, uncle, aunt wouldn't be able to send me photos from back home if they had to use Linux, Unix, OpenBSD, etc...

grrrr.

I bet they could use a mac just fine.
Ironic since MS gained its monopoly (ignoring the DOS os they got for a song) from 'reverse engineering' Apple's OS which was legally bought from Xerox. They lost the suit to apple but refused to pay for more than a decade and then finally copped out with a stock agreement. In short, they broke the law, were ruled against, ignored the ruling.
They're thugs and crooks.
People who say that real player sucks and media player is better (or in your case 'the computing experience') are very naive. Given the length of time that MS had held this monopoly and its anti-competitive (indeed anti-capitalist) practices of course the competition isn't as good (except in the browser market) How could they possibly produce as good of a product when they have been hedged out of the market?
No sales = no $$$$ for development.
Look at what happened to Corel.
The irony of the title of this thread. MS practices=communist.

If you believe what you say, why don't you take action? Refuse to buy their products... if you want to teach MS a lesson that's all you and your socialist/communist friends have to do... stop buying their products. The truth is, you can't do that, because without Microsoft you wouldn't be able to do what you do...

Wrong. I don't own any MS products.
Also, pointing out that "you won't be able to do what you do" without MS's products is irellevant. That's like saying that the diamond monopoly is okay because without debeers you couldn't get those great diamonds.
That's circular logic.

You don't OWN them? Or you don't USE them? Two different things.

 

[AIWGuru]

Originally posted by: DWW

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: AIWGuru
Just look at how much IE has innovated since 2001. Not. At. All.

*raises eyebrow* The already excellent interface not changing in years does not remotely mean no advances in browser technology have taken place. You might want to do some reading on the subject.

MS's super-strict policies towards OEM builders needs to go. They also need to build in some level of de-integration to allow the end user to uninstall whatever we wish. Past that, let them throw in whatever extra value they can muster and that the market will bear.

IE 6 came out in 2001 with windows XP. It hasn't added any new features.
Period.
On the other hand, if it weren't for MS's anti competitive behaviour, OEMs would have chosen superior product if equal choice was present (as in the netscape days) meaning that the following features would be commonplace for everyone:
-tabbed browsing
-popup blocking
-download manager
-built in proper FTP
-built in proper IRC
-built in WYSIWYG HTML editor
-email client with proper and comprehensive spam filter
But they're not.

-tabbed browsing is a preference not necessarily an advance
-popup blocking you can have
-download manager? Who needs one ? I get my 700MB ISO from FTP--a better protocol thanks
-FTP? In a web browser? Keep em separate please
-IRC? That is absurb and definitely unnecessary
-Editor? This is a browser not a web "developer" (is that what they are called?) tool
-Email client? Sorry , once again it is a browser.

I'm just going to leave this thread. The stupidity and ignorance is too much for me.
Unbelievable.

 

[Kaiser__Sose]

Originally posted by: xboxist

Originally posted by: Jeff7181

Dave Stewart, one of Realnetworks' lawyers, said in an interview with Reuters that the ruling probably will allow the company to increase its market share.

No it won't. I hate Real Player with a passion and will never have it installed on my computer even if there is no other media player in existance. I just won't listen to music or watch video clips if I must use real player.

Same here! I don't feel so out of line now by being so damn adamant about not installing that piece of junk on my computer. I'll just not watch the clip. Oh well.

download and install real alternative.. you can watch real files through windows media player with the real alt. codecs.

 

[DWW]

BTW AIWGuru I edited the post above of mine. It looks like my text got stuck with yours in the quote block so you probably missed a couple paragraphs/skipped over the majorly important part.

 

[Jeff7181]

Originally posted by: DWW

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: AIWGuru
Just look at how much IE has innovated since 2001. Not. At. All.

*raises eyebrow* The already excellent interface not changing in years does not remotely mean no advances in browser technology have taken place. You might want to do some reading on the subject.

MS's super-strict policies towards OEM builders needs to go. They also need to build in some level of de-integration to allow the end user to uninstall whatever we wish. Past that, let them throw in whatever extra value they can muster and that the market will bear.

IE 6 came out in 2001 with windows XP. It hasn't added any new features.
Period.
On the other hand, if it weren't for MS's anti competitive behaviour, OEMs would have chosen superior product if equal choice was present (as in the netscape days) meaning that the following features would be commonplace for everyone:
-tabbed browsing
-popup blocking
-download manager
-built in proper FTP
-built in proper IRC
-built in WYSIWYG HTML editor
-email client with proper and comprehensive spam filter
But they're not.

-tabbed browsing is a preference not necessarily an advance
-popup blocking you can have
-download manager? Who needs one ? I get my 700MB ISO from FTP--a better protocol thanks
-FTP? In a web browser? Keep em separate please
-IRC? That is absurb and definitely unnecessary
-Editor? This is a browser not a web "developer" (is that what they are called?) tool
-Email client? Sorry , once again it is a browser.

If they added these features, he'd be screaming even louder that they're trying to eliminate the competition.

 

[Jeff7181]

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: DWW

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: AIWGuru
Just look at how much IE has innovated since 2001. Not. At. All.

*raises eyebrow* The already excellent interface not changing in years does not remotely mean no advances in browser technology have taken place. You might want to do some reading on the subject.

MS's super-strict policies towards OEM builders needs to go. They also need to build in some level of de-integration to allow the end user to uninstall whatever we wish. Past that, let them throw in whatever extra value they can muster and that the market will bear.

IE 6 came out in 2001 with windows XP. It hasn't added any new features.
Period.
On the other hand, if it weren't for MS's anti competitive behaviour, OEMs would have chosen superior product if equal choice was present (as in the netscape days) meaning that the following features would be commonplace for everyone:
-tabbed browsing
-popup blocking
-download manager
-built in proper FTP
-built in proper IRC
-built in WYSIWYG HTML editor
-email client with proper and comprehensive spam filter
But they're not.

-tabbed browsing is a preference not necessarily an advance
-popup blocking you can have
-download manager? Who needs one ? I get my 700MB ISO from FTP--a better protocol thanks
-FTP? In a web browser? Keep em separate please
-IRC? That is absurb and definitely unnecessary
-Editor? This is a browser not a web "developer" (is that what they are called?) tool
-Email client? Sorry , once again it is a browser.

I'm just going to leave this thread. The stupidity and ignorance is too much for me.
Unbelievable.

Translation: "I can't respond to that without contradicting myself so I'm leaving this thread."

 

[AIWGuru]

Originally posted by: Jeff7181

Originally posted by: DWW

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: AIWGuru
Just look at how much IE has innovated since 2001. Not. At. All.

*raises eyebrow* The already excellent interface not changing in years does not remotely mean no advances in browser technology have taken place. You might want to do some reading on the subject.

MS's super-strict policies towards OEM builders needs to go. They also need to build in some level of de-integration to allow the end user to uninstall whatever we wish. Past that, let them throw in whatever extra value they can muster and that the market will bear.

IE 6 came out in 2001 with windows XP. It hasn't added any new features.
Period.
On the other hand, if it weren't for MS's anti competitive behaviour, OEMs would have chosen superior product if equal choice was present (as in the netscape days) meaning that the following features would be commonplace for everyone:
-tabbed browsing
-popup blocking
-download manager
-built in proper FTP
-built in proper IRC
-built in WYSIWYG HTML editor
-email client with proper and comprehensive spam filter
But they're not.

-tabbed browsing is a preference not necessarily an advance
-popup blocking you can have
-download manager? Who needs one ? I get my 700MB ISO from FTP--a better protocol thanks
-FTP? In a web browser? Keep em separate please
-IRC? That is absurb and definitely unnecessary
-Editor? This is a browser not a web "developer" (is that what they are called?) tool
-Email client? Sorry , once again it is a browser.

If they added these features, he'd be screaming even louder that they're trying to eliminate the competition.

I guess you can't read because I've already addressed this idiotic statement. I'll quote it for you:
"Jesus you don't get it. That's not what I'm saying at all. (that IE should have these features) I'm saying that IE shouldn't be bundled at all unless an OEM chooses to bundle it over a competing product which could just as easily be chosen and bundled for its superior functionality. This is how competition and capitalism works. Thus these features would be standard and common through competition.
I swear, the majority of the people that visit this forum have the cognitive ability of an 8 year old. "

 

[AIWGuru]

Originally posted by: Jeff7181

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: DWW

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: AIWGuru
Just look at how much IE has innovated since 2001. Not. At. All.

*raises eyebrow* The already excellent interface not changing in years does not remotely mean no advances in browser technology have taken place. You might want to do some reading on the subject.

MS's super-strict policies towards OEM builders needs to go. They also need to build in some level of de-integration to allow the end user to uninstall whatever we wish. Past that, let them throw in whatever extra value they can muster and that the market will bear.

IE 6 came out in 2001 with windows XP. It hasn't added any new features.
Period.
On the other hand, if it weren't for MS's anti competitive behaviour, OEMs would have chosen superior product if equal choice was present (as in the netscape days) meaning that the following features would be commonplace for everyone:
-tabbed browsing
-popup blocking
-download manager
-built in proper FTP
-built in proper IRC
-built in WYSIWYG HTML editor
-email client with proper and comprehensive spam filter
But they're not.

-tabbed browsing is a preference not necessarily an advance
-popup blocking you can have
-download manager? Who needs one ? I get my 700MB ISO from FTP--a better protocol thanks
-FTP? In a web browser? Keep em separate please
-IRC? That is absurb and definitely unnecessary
-Editor? This is a browser not a web "developer" (is that what they are called?) tool
-Email client? Sorry , once again it is a browser.

I'm just going to leave this thread. The stupidity and ignorance is too much for me.
Unbelievable.

Translation: "I can't respond to that without contradicting myself so I'm leaving this thread."

More like: "you're a bunch of retards who are ignoring valid points and repeating the same illogical garbage. You clearly have no understanding of the issues or any desire to learn about them so I'm not going to waste my time."

 

[Jeff7181]

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: Jeff7181

Originally posted by: DWW

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: AIWGuru
Just look at how much IE has innovated since 2001. Not. At. All.

*raises eyebrow* The already excellent interface not changing in years does not remotely mean no advances in browser technology have taken place. You might want to do some reading on the subject.

MS's super-strict policies towards OEM builders needs to go. They also need to build in some level of de-integration to allow the end user to uninstall whatever we wish. Past that, let them throw in whatever extra value they can muster and that the market will bear.

IE 6 came out in 2001 with windows XP. It hasn't added any new features.
Period.
On the other hand, if it weren't for MS's anti competitive behaviour, OEMs would have chosen superior product if equal choice was present (as in the netscape days) meaning that the following features would be commonplace for everyone:
-tabbed browsing
-popup blocking
-download manager
-built in proper FTP
-built in proper IRC
-built in WYSIWYG HTML editor
-email client with proper and comprehensive spam filter
But they're not.

-tabbed browsing is a preference not necessarily an advance
-popup blocking you can have
-download manager? Who needs one ? I get my 700MB ISO from FTP--a better protocol thanks
-FTP? In a web browser? Keep em separate please
-IRC? That is absurb and definitely unnecessary
-Editor? This is a browser not a web "developer" (is that what they are called?) tool
-Email client? Sorry , once again it is a browser.

If they added these features, he'd be screaming even louder that they're trying to eliminate the competition.

I guess you can't read because I've already addressed this idiotic statement. I'll quote it for you:
"Jesus you don't get it. That's not what I'm saying at all. (that IE should have these features) I'm saying that IE shouldn't be bundled at all unless an OEM chooses to bundle it over a competing product which could just as easily be chosen and bundled for its superior functionality. This is how competition and capitalism works. Thus these features would be standard and common through competition.
I swear, the majority of the people that visit this forum have the cognitive ability of an 8 year old. "

I guess you're not leaving the thread just yet huh?

 

[DWW]

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: DWW

Originally posted by: AIWGuru

Originally posted by: yllus

Originally posted by: AIWGuru
Just look at how much IE has innovated since 2001. Not. At. All.

*raises eyebrow* The already excellent interface not changing in years does not remotely mean no advances in browser technology have taken place. You might want to do some reading on the subject.

MS's super-strict policies towards OEM builders needs to go. They also need to build in some level of de-integration to allow the end user to uninstall whatever we wish. Past that, let them throw in whatever extra value they can muster and that the market will bear.

IE 6 came out in 2001 with windows XP. It hasn't added any new features.
Period.
On the other hand, if it weren't for MS's anti competitive behaviour, OEMs would have chosen superior product if equal choice was present (as in the netscape days) meaning that the following features would be commonplace for everyone:
-tabbed browsing
-popup blocking
-download manager
-built in proper FTP
-built in proper IRC
-built in WYSIWYG HTML editor
-email client with proper and comprehensive spam filter
But they're not.

-tabbed browsing is a preference not necessarily an advance
-popup blocking you can have
-download manager? Who needs one ? I get my 700MB ISO from FTP--a better protocol thanks
-FTP? In a web browser? Keep em separate please
-IRC? That is absurb and definitely unnecessary
-Editor? This is a browser not a web "developer" (is that what they are called?) tool
-Email client? Sorry , once again it is a browser.

I'm just going to leave this thread. The stupidity and ignorance is too much for me.
Unbelievable.

You have the audacity to call me stupid and ignorant. Gee whiz thanks. I tried to have a fair discussion with you. I didn't resort to name calling like "communist" etc. I don't think I did anything to the tune of what you accuse.

Can anyone else point out why I was "stupid" and "ignorant"?

Or maybe I'm the only person who doesnt want FTP, IRC, an editor and mail client IN my browser. You know....the HTML & XHTML browser.

 

[Jeff7181]

More like: "you're a bunch of retards who are ignoring valid points and repeating the same illogical garbage. You clearly have no understanding of the issues or any desire to learn about them so I'm not going to waste my time."

That's not it at all. I understand the issues. I know Microsoft does their best to beat the competition. It's not their fault the competition sucks and can't keep up... and it's not their duty to HELP the competition.

*EDIT* It's real world business... not "lets get together and play with our OS's."

 

[ShotgunSteven]

I'm going to sue Apple because their OS comes with that damn yellow sticky note program included, it's preventing me from using all the other wonderful yellow sticky note programs out there, OMGHI2U!

 

[Jeff7]

Originally posted by: Jeff7181
I suppose we should just do away with capitalism completely then huh? Make the USA a socialist country... or better yet, lets just revert to communism.

I'm guessing you grew up during the Cold War era? Brainwashed by the media into thinking communism is evil...geez. It's not really evil. It's just not a feasible system for an often adversarial, sometimes unpredictable species.


The MS case - Microsoft does definitely have a huge market share, and they do throw their weight around. Question is, what do you really do to stop the problem with such a large corporation with such vast influence? And where do you draw lines?
They integrate many things, but what can and what can't be integrated under current laws? Media Players? Internet browsers? File browsers and/or compression? CD Writing software? At what point does something go from being called "integrated" or "bundled" to being called "standard"?
Plenty of difficult questions, which can have rather abstract answers. It depends on who you are. Most end users probably like having all sorts of nifty utilities included, rather than buying an OS, and then having to possibly pay more money to equip it with "basic" things like an Internet/file Browser and media player. Developers of such programs though may see things differently, as they could stand to lose out.

Quick passing thought - what about motherboards, and integrating components there? nForce2's MCP+T has probably kept a number of people from buying another sound card. Creative, Voyetra - both aren't liking that, but the end user will. Just plug the speakers into the motherboard.
Maybe that's relevant, maybe not. As I said, just a passing thought.

 

[Jeff7181]

Originally posted by: ShotgunSteve
I'm going to sue Macintosh because their OS comes with that damn yellow sticky note program included, it's preventing me from using all the other wonderful yellow sticky note programs out there, OMGHI2U!

You can't do that cause Apple isn't the evil one... Microsoft is.