Moveon.org does it again.

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: senseamp

Originally posted by: blackangst1
Well, I for one, am not suprised at the - ahem - ad, nor the reaction to it.

To me, it's a pretty good representation of not only the Democrats, but those who claim to be them. Naive and stupid.

/cue "But Bush! But Bush! But Bush!"

Naive and Stupid? This is from a Republican party that sent troops to Iraq in search of WMDs and thinking it would pay for itself. Yeah, OK. I'll be "naive and stupid" if the alternative is being a Republican.

Ah what a short memory you have. You fit the stupidity of the Democratic party to a tee 🙂

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: blackangst1
Well, I for one, am not suprised at the - ahem - ad, nor the reaction to it.

To me, it's a pretty good representation of not only the Democrats, but those who claim to be them. Naive and stupid.

/cue "But Bush! But Bush! But Bush!"

Yeah, because THIS thread is just overflowing with intelligence and clear thinking from you :roll:

This is the kind of dumb non-issue that only appeals to folks who can't actually make a real argument. Like those pictures of John Kerry awkwardly throwing a football, it might make a good punchline, but only a moron would try to use it as a stand-in for a real argument.

eh?

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: Pabster

Originally posted by: Rainsford
Give me a break, this is classic political debate by innuendo. The "link" between Democrats and MoveOn.org is ALWAYS drawn with the *wink**wink *nudge**nudge* behind it, insinuating that it's a bad thing and we're supposed to draw negative conclusions about the Democrats. Your protestations of purity of motive aside, I hardly see you taking the effort for anyone BUT MoveOn.org. Were you just after transparent campaign financing, your obsession with MoveOn.org would seem strange.

Yet I never saw such a passionate, feigned outrage about "innuendo" from you in any of the PNAC threads...

Who's outraged? And in any case, I think you need to look up "innuendo" in the dictionary, I don't think it means what you think it means. The "PNAC threads" are hardly the same thing, PNAC was a worrisome organization (and is a worrying ideology) because it represents a resurgence in old-school imperialism that has no place in the modern world. The fact that the PNAC ideas are heartily embraced by many high level Bush administration officials is not a good thing.

My problem with this topic is that you have suggested a link between MoveOn.org and the Democrats (in much the same way others showed a link between PNAC and the Republicans), but you have NOT shown why that's a bad thing or why we should care (which is something the PNAC threads DID). Yet you are obviously hinting in that direction. Thus the "innuendo".

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: blackangst1
Well, I for one, am not suprised at the - ahem - ad, nor the reaction to it.

To me, it's a pretty good representation of not only the Democrats, but those who claim to be them. Naive and stupid.

/cue "But Bush! But Bush! But Bush!"

Yeah, because THIS thread is just overflowing with intelligence and clear thinking from you :roll:

This is the kind of dumb non-issue that only appeals to folks who can't actually make a real argument. Like those pictures of John Kerry awkwardly throwing a football, it might make a good punchline, but only a moron would try to use it as a stand-in for a real argument.

eh?

I can't think of anything less important than whether or not MoveOn.org used a correct picture of our troops or not in their ad. You obviously think it's important enough to mention, and you apparently are highly bothered by it. This leads me to believe one of two things about you. Either that you are dumb enough that you think this is ACTUALLY an important issue, or you are just a partisan tool trying to make political hay out of something you know doesn't matter.

 

[Siddhartha]

Originally posted by: blackangst1
Well, I for one, am not suprised at the - ahem - ad, nor the reaction to it.

To me, it's a pretty good representation of not only the Democrats, but those who claim to be them. Naive and stupid.

/cue "But Bush! But Bush! But Bush!"

This photograph on the moveon.org is enough for you criticize all Democrats.

Do you go around making such, at best suspicious, gross generalizations about everything or do you only do it with the Democrats?

Is this thread really about moveon using the wrong image file?

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: Siddhartha

Originally posted by: blackangst1
Well, I for one, am not suprised at the - ahem - ad, nor the reaction to it.

To me, it's a pretty good representation of not only the Democrats, but those who claim to be them. Naive and stupid.

/cue "But Bush! But Bush! But Bush!"

This photograph on the moveon.org is enough for you criticize all Democrats.

Do you go around making such, at best suspicious, gross generalizations about everything or do you only do it with the Democrats?

Is this thread really about moveon using the wrong image file?

1. Everything.
2. Twice? lol

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: blackangst1
Well, I for one, am not suprised at the - ahem - ad, nor the reaction to it.

To me, it's a pretty good representation of not only the Democrats, but those who claim to be them. Naive and stupid.

/cue "But Bush! But Bush! But Bush!"

Yeah, because THIS thread is just overflowing with intelligence and clear thinking from you :roll:

This is the kind of dumb non-issue that only appeals to folks who can't actually make a real argument. Like those pictures of John Kerry awkwardly throwing a football, it might make a good punchline, but only a moron would try to use it as a stand-in for a real argument.

eh?

I can't think of anything less important than whether or not MoveOn.org used a correct picture of our troops or not in their ad. You obviously think it's important enough to mention, and you apparently are highly bothered by it. This leads me to believe one of two things about you. Either that you are dumb enough that you think this is ACTUALLY an important issue, or you are just a partisan tool trying to make political hay out of something you know doesn't matter.

did I express outrage? Was I in digust? all I said is it was amazing. Dont go creating shit that isnt there.

As far as posting it...half the threads on his board are bullshit meaningless threads anyway...it isnt like this is the only irrelevant thread here.

Get off your throne of judgement. You look like an ass.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

did I express outrage? Was I in digust? all I said is it was amazing. Dont go creating shit that isnt there.

As far as posting it...half the threads on his board are bullshit meaningless threads anyway...it isnt like this is the only irrelevant thread here.

Get off your throne of judgement. You look like an ass.

Man, you're backpedaling now. You responded to me with that it was lies, deceit, and misrepresentation of our military. Now.. you were just surprised.

You're right most of the threads on this board are meaningless bullshit, but the vast majority of them come from just a few people. Don't be one of them.

 

[OutHouse]

Originally posted by: Jhhnn
Heh. So it's the wrong photo...

Which changes the truth of the situation, that Bush is holding 160K american troops hostage to neocon delusions of grandeur, in what way?

If the photos are the problem, then what happens when the ad comes back with the right photos? What criticism then, other than the usual "Defeatist!" & "Moonbat!" raving?

Anything of substance?

Probably not... If this is the best you've got, guys, then you're in much deeper trouble than you ever imagined. Chained to the oars of the SS Bush, the reaction to the rats coming up out of the bilges is... Denial... and distraction.

"Look! The enemy raised a signal flag upside-down! Ha-ha!"

the point is that it is pretty damn pathetic that the biggest group to support the Democrats doesnt even know what kind uniform a American wears.... on and lets do it twice. very pathetic.

 

[teclis1023]

If you're going to make a statement, then get a photo that fits. Doctoring a photo to 'prove your point' is slimy; exactly the sort of stuff they claim that the Bush Administration does (which I'm sure they do).

 

[OutHouse]

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: blackangst1
Well, I for one, am not suprised at the - ahem - ad, nor the reaction to it.

To me, it's a pretty good representation of not only the Democrats, but those who claim to be them. Naive and stupid.

/cue "But Bush! But Bush! But Bush!"

Yeah, because THIS thread is just overflowing with intelligence and clear thinking from you :roll:

This is the kind of dumb non-issue that only appeals to folks who can't actually make a real argument. Like those pictures of John Kerry awkwardly throwing a football, it might make a good punchline, but only a moron would try to use it as a stand-in for a real argument.

eh?

I can't think of anything less important than whether or not MoveOn.org used a correct picture of our troops or not in their ad. You obviously think it's important enough to mention, and you apparently are highly bothered by it. This leads me to believe one of two things about you. Either that you are dumb enough that you think this is ACTUALLY an important issue, or you are just a partisan tool trying to make political hay out of something you know doesn't matter.

its very important you tool. they say to bring home our troops but done even know what a American troop uniform looks like. oh and not once but twice. to me this this screams that moveon.org cares more about slinging mud at the republicans than the content or accuracy of their message or images.

for the record before you start calling me a neocon, bushie or some other stupid label. i am a registered independent. I hate both parties and a stunt like this is exactly why.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: Citrix

its very important you tool. they say to bring home our troops but done even know what a American troop uniform looks like. oh and not once but twice. to me this this screams that moveon.org cares more about slinging mud at the republicans than the content or accuracy of their message or images.

for the record before you start calling me a neocon, bushie or some other stupid label. i am a registered independent. I hate both parties and a stunt like this is exactly why.

It's not important in the slightest and you know it. I bet the only reason 95% of people even know it was British troops is because some right wing blog started making a stink about it. I was in the military for 7 years and I wouldn't know the difference. Surprisingly the people making the ad probably got the picture out of a gigantic bin of stock war photos, the same as anyone else would.

You people trying to make this into an issue by attacking a picture instead of the content of the ad are making yourselves look stupid. Really stupid.

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Originally posted by: Citrix

its very important you tool. they say to bring home our troops but done even know what a American troop uniform looks like. oh and not once but twice. to me this this screams that moveon.org cares more about slinging mud at the republicans than the content or accuracy of their message or images.

for the record before you start calling me a neocon, bushie or some other stupid label. i am a registered independent. I hate both parties and a stunt like this is exactly why.

It's not important in the slightest and you know it. I bet the only reason 95% of people even know it was British troops is because some right wing blog started making a stink about it. I was in the military for 7 years and I wouldn't know the difference. Surprisingly the people making the ad probably got the picture out of a gigantic bin of stock war photos, the same as anyone else would.

You people trying to make this into an issue by attacking a picture instead of the content of the ad are making yourselves look stupid. Really stupid.

No suprise there, giving which side of the political spectrum youre on.

/cue "IM AN INDEPENDANT!" bullshit.

 

[OutHouse]

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Originally posted by: Citrix

its very important you tool. they say to bring home our troops but done even know what a American troop uniform looks like. oh and not once but twice. to me this this screams that moveon.org cares more about slinging mud at the republicans than the content or accuracy of their message or images.

for the record before you start calling me a neocon, bushie or some other stupid label. i am a registered independent. I hate both parties and a stunt like this is exactly why.

It's not important in the slightest and you know it. I bet the only reason 95% of people even know it was British troops is because some right wing blog started making a stink about it. I was in the military for 7 years and I wouldn't know the difference. Surprisingly the people making the ad probably got the picture out of a gigantic bin of stock war photos, the same as anyone else would.

You people trying to make this into an issue by attacking a picture instead of the content of the ad are making yourselves look stupid. Really stupid.

yes it is a big deal. they were making a ad to pull at the heartstrings of the American people by showing American troops eating thanksgiving dinner from a field kitchen. but used a picture of Brit troops instead. totally irresponsible.

its amazing how people can defend this kind of partisan crap. if you served 7 years and didn't learn what a brit uniform looks like then you are sad.

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Originally posted by: blackangst1

did I express outrage? Was I in digust? all I said is it was amazing. Dont go creating shit that isnt there.

As far as posting it...half the threads on his board are bullshit meaningless threads anyway...it isnt like this is the only irrelevant thread here.

Get off your throne of judgement. You look like an ass.

Man, you're backpedaling now. You responded to me with that it was lies, deceit, and misrepresentation of our military. Now.. you were just surprised.

You're right most of the threads on this board are meaningless bullshit, but the vast majority of them come from just a few people. Don't be one of them.

Man you absolutely suck at comprehension. Is english your second language?

It IS exactly what I said it is: lies, deceit, and misrepresentation of our military.

Was it American troops they pictured not once, but TWICE? And once photoshopped? NO.
*That would be a lie. TWICE. Knowingly.
Was it a representation of our military? No. It was another country's PORTRAYED as ours. Not once, but twice, and once photoshopped.
*That is called deceit. TWICE. Knowingly.
See my Question above.
*That is called misrepresentation.

quit apologizing. it REALLY, and I mean REALLY makes you look like an ass.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

No suprise there, giving which side of the political spectrum youre on.

/cue "IM AN INDEPENDANT!" bullshit.

What are you talking about? Of course I'm liberal. That does nothing to change that "HURR HURR THOSE AREN'T US TROOPS BUT ONLY US ALLIED TROOPS!?!!LOL" is an incredibly juvenile point to make, and one that has absolutely no relevance to the larger point of the ad. It is the refuge of people who can't find anything legitimate to complain about and are desperately reaching for something.

Now I'm pretty sure you didn't come up with it yourself, probably from a right wing blog or something... and so I don't think that you personally are spending time to reach this far, but I do blame you for repeating it and then trying to defend it. It's dumb and it's pointless. Why don't you attack Moveon.org on one of twenty other things you could attack them on and not look dumb doing it? Attacking their choice of photographs reeks of desperation.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Man you absolutely suck at comprehension. Is english your second language?

It IS exactly what I said it is: lies, deceit, and misrepresentation of our military.

Was it American troops they pictured not once, but TWICE? And once photoshopped? NO.
*That would be a lie. TWICE. Knowingly.
Was it a representation of our military? No. It was another country's PORTRAYED as ours. Not once, but twice, and once photoshopped.
*That is called deceit. TWICE. Knowingly.
See my Question above.
*That is called misrepresentation.

quit apologizing. it REALLY, and I mean REALLY makes you look like an ass.

Uh oh, someone's getting grumpy now! As has been asked at least twice in this thread by me, and more by other people, what did moveon.org stand to gain by putting this picture there instead of another picture with actual US troops? What was their motivation to lie? I can't think of one. Because there is exactly zero motive, it is far more likely to believe that it was a mistake. That's of course if you are a reasonable person who isn't looking to make stupid threads on ATPN.

As for misrepresentation, how exactly did it misrepresent our troops? The dictionary definition of misrepresentation is "an untrue representation, usually an unfavorable one". What unfavorable thing is being presented here? That our soldiers wear pants? That they eat? Again, what is the motive here? Any person with a brain would immediately see that there isn't one.

So while I know you're mad that you got called out for making an idiotic thread on here, it's not going to change the fact that it's still an idiotic thread. Just admit it. It will feel good... you'll feel free. Liberated. You don't need to cling to this with your kung-fu grip, because it's not worth it.

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Originally posted by: blackangst1

No suprise there, giving which side of the political spectrum youre on.

/cue "IM AN INDEPENDANT!" bullshit.

What are you talking about? Of course I'm liberal. That does nothing to change that "HURR HURR THOSE AREN'T US TROOPS BUT ONLY US ALLIED TROOPS!?!!LOL" is an incredibly juvenile point to make, and one that has absolutely no relevance to the larger point of the ad. It is the refuge of people who can't find anything legitimate to complain about and are desperately reaching for something.

Now I'm pretty sure you didn't come up with it yourself, probably from a right wing blog or something... and so I don't think that you personally are spending time to reach this far, but I do blame you for repeating it and then trying to defend it. It's dumb and it's pointless. Why don't you attack Moveon.org on one of twenty other things you could attack them on and not look dumb doing it? Attacking their choice of photographs reeks of desperation.

dude...seriously...

I actually found it, and Googled it to make sure I was right. I visit moveon.org almost weekly to see what bullshit they post next. And as many wise strategists in war and business say, know your enemy as well as you know yourself. Otherwise how can you compete? A lesson you should learn. Thats how I knew it was Brit's fatigues. Apperantly you aint so smart if you dont kow your own countries fatigues..in a military you served in WTF LOL.

How is it I seemed to recognize they werent US uniforms and have never served int he military? Ah, thats right. Im informed.

I can understand once accidentally posting the wrong pic. But no. Moveon.org THE FIRST TIME just retracted it. They didnt even try to replace it and say oops.

But TWICE? And photoshopping it? LOL I guaran-fuckin-tee you if a right wing GOP website did that shit, you'd be allll over it. Give it rest man.

 

[Pabster]

Originally posted by: eskimospy
What are you talking about? Of course I'm liberal.

The truth finally comes out.

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Man you absolutely suck at comprehension. Is english your second language?

It IS exactly what I said it is: lies, deceit, and misrepresentation of our military.

Was it American troops they pictured not once, but TWICE? And once photoshopped? NO.
*That would be a lie. TWICE. Knowingly.
Was it a representation of our military? No. It was another country's PORTRAYED as ours. Not once, but twice, and once photoshopped.
*That is called deceit. TWICE. Knowingly.
See my Question above.
*That is called misrepresentation.

quit apologizing. it REALLY, and I mean REALLY makes you look like an ass.

Uh oh, someone's getting grumpy now! As has been asked at least twice in this thread by me, and more by other people, what did moveon.org stand to gain by putting this picture there instead of another picture with actual US troops? What was their motivation to lie? I can't think of one. Because there is exactly zero motive, it is far more likely to believe that it was a mistake. That's of course if you are a reasonable person who isn't looking to make stupid threads on ATPN.

As for misrepresentation, how exactly did it misrepresent our troops? The dictionary definition of misrepresentation is "an untrue representation, usually an unfavorable one". What unfavorable thing is being presented here? That our soldiers wear pants? That they eat? Again, what is the motive here? Any person with a brain would immediately see that there isn't one.

So while I know you're mad that you got called out for making an idiotic thread on here, it's not going to change the fact that it's still an idiotic thread. Just admit it. It will feel good... you'll feel free. Liberated. You don't need to cling to this with your kung-fu grip, because it's not worth it.

What was their motivation? Who the hell knows. But why couldnt they post a REAL pic? Hmmm? The better question is WHY. WHY TWICE!

Im not mad. Im frustrated by your apparent blindness and now lack of knowledge of the military you served in. Pretty pathetic. It's like arguing with a 6 year old-logic doesnt work.

 

[Lemon law]

At best, moveon.org represents the thinking of only a segment of the democratic party. Then we have an entire thread trying to discredit the message of moveon.org because they used some incorrect photograph.

When the message is that our troops over there in a dangerous and mis managed quagmire. And instead of answering that message, various idiots think they can discredit the message over basically trivial side issues.

Cheer up Republicans, you may have dodged answering the question for a few days, but you are going to have that same basic question hanging over your heads from plenty of other places you will not be able to discredit over trivial side issues.

At the end of the day, one has to produce results in Iraq. Being only slightly less bad is not results. Not when GWB&co. told us this was only going to be a 50 billion tops mission accomplished greeted with flowers and candy war. As another X-mas, Easter, and fourth of July pass into history, with our troops still stuck in a quagmire, the bad news for Republicans only builds. And heaven help the GOP if Iraq suddenly flares up again. Then its hopeless for the GOP come 11/4/2008.

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: Lemon law
At best, moveon.org represents the thinking of only a segment of the democratic party. Then we have an entire thread trying to discredit the message of moveon.org because they used some incorrect photograph.

When the message is that our troops over there in a dangerous and mis managed quagmire. And instead of answering that message, various idiots think they can discredit the message over basically trivial side issues.

Cheer up Republicans, you may have dodged answering the question for a few days, but you are going to have that same basic question hanging over your heads from plenty of other places you will not be able to discredit over trivial side issues.

At the end of the day, one has to produce results in Iraq. Being only slightly less bad is not results. Not when GWB&co. told us this was only going to be a 50 billion tops mission accomplished greeted with flowers and candy war. As another X-mas, Easter, and fourth of July pass into history, with our troops still stuck in a quagmire, the bad news for Republicans only builds. And heaven help the GOP if Iraq suddenly flares up again. Then its hopeless for the GOP come 11/4/2008.

youre so full of shit Lemon.

Here?s the script: ?Some folks won?t be home this holiday season. 150,000 American men and women are stuck in Iraq. Their president misled America to send them in and has no plan to get them out. Democrats in Congress are leading the way home. Where are the Republicans? Tell your representative, ?Support our troops. Bring them home.??

See the bolded part? It's flat out bullshit. The Democrats havent, and arent, doing SQUAT to get the troops home. Sure a few fringe Dems have tried introducing legislation, but the majority have no intention nor the desire to end this war. Need proof? Start pouring through voting records.

Nice try though.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

dude...seriously...

I actually found it, and Googled it to make sure I was right. I visit moveon.org almost weekly to see what bullshit they post next. And as many wise strategists in war and business say, know your enemy as well as you know yourself. Otherwise how can you compete? A lesson you should learn. Thats how I knew it was Brit's fatigues. Apperantly you aint so smart if you dont kow your own countries fatigues..in a military you served in WTF LOL.

How is it I seemed to recognize they werent US uniforms and have never served int he military? Ah, thats right. Im informed.

I can understand once accidentally posting the wrong pic. But no. Moveon.org THE FIRST TIME just retracted it. They didnt even try to replace it and say oops.

But TWICE? And photoshopping it? LOL I guaran-fuckin-tee you if a right wing GOP website did that shit, you'd be allll over it. Give it rest man.

First of all Citrix and Blackangst, you're both being stupid. I was in the Navy. Guess how often you run into British troops wearing camoflage on a US Navy ship? Guess how often you run into ANYONE wearing cammies on a ship? (funny thing is that they were thinking about changing that when I left.) And how do I have a lack of knowledge of a military I served in? Are British troops in the US Navy now? I welcome a test of military knowledge with you any day of the week. That goes for all you other faux outrage people too. Citrix I'm looking at you.

The point is that if someone who was in the military for quite some time and therefore is more likely to be exposed to military things then the average person doesn't know, there's a good chance a staffer at moveon.org doesn't know when he picks a picture. As for it happening twice, that's even more reason to believe it wasn't nefarious in nature. Who goes back to your Evil Plan after its been exposed?

Show me one time that I've jumped on something as inconsequential as this. Just one and I'll admit you're right. It's not like right wing idiots don't do similar stuff too. In addition, the US has relatively recently changed from the more traditional type to that digital print stuff you see now. The thing is, that there were still significant segments of the US military that wore the regular cammies until recently, which is what it looks to me like the British troops are wearing in that picture. (it's small though). You are still searching for a way to discredit the message of the ad without having to deal with the ad's content. That is what this is all about and you know it.

As far as I can tell your basic point is that Moveon.org must be trying to malign the military and our government's leadership in some way with this picture. You freely admit that you can't discern any possible gain for them by using this picture as opposed to another one, but since it has happened twice it must be some sort of plot. I highly recommend you don't say that "logic doesn't work" when this is your fundamental argument. It's just awful, awful reasoning. There is no motive, and therefore it is unlikely it was done on purpose.

To be honest I'm still trying to figure out exactly how this picture has tarnished our military. Since that's supposed to be the source of all this outrage anyway, please let me know so I can be outraged too.

I still can't believe I'm having to argue with people over why a picture of a person wearing differently designed pants is evidence of willful misrepresentation and an attack on The Troops.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: Pabster

Originally posted by: eskimospy
What are you talking about? Of course I'm liberal.

The truth finally comes out.

Pabster, if you didn't know I'm a liberal from my postings previously then you are stupider then even I gave you credit for.

Actually this would explain a lot. I believe I have underestimated your brainlessness in the past. I'll try not to do so in the future.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

youre so full of shit Lemon.

Here?s the script: ?Some folks won?t be home this holiday season. 150,000 American men and women are stuck in Iraq. Their president misled America to send them in and has no plan to get them out. Democrats in Congress are leading the way home. Where are the Republicans? Tell your representative, ?Support our troops. Bring them home.??

See the bolded part? It's flat out bullshit. The Democrats havent, and arent, doing SQUAT to get the troops home. Sure a few fringe Dems have tried introducing legislation, but the majority have no intention nor the desire to end this war. Need proof? Start pouring through voting records.

Nice try though.

See? There you go. Now we're talking about the content of the ad instead of a stupid picture. Now you can try to make a rational argument as to why moveon is being dishonest or whatever without having to say "HURR HURR WRONG PANTS".

This is much better.