this is very true....
be prepared. well trained and well equipped...
your best tools for survival...
that being said a bike a great way to save time and gas as most states allow them to use thier commuter lanes...
take MSF, take track classes, take any kind of rider classes you can find... Keith Code Jason Pridemore etc etc etc...
when you can react without thinking out of pure instinct you have a much higher chance or survival when dealing with cars...
if you can deal with how fast thing happen on the race course then you can deal with cars and unexpected crap on the roads...
for a bit ?
Kaido
Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
- Feb 14, 2004
- 51,560
- 7,238
- 136
well, yes and no. my dad had a friend in college who bought a bike to save on gas going around campus. one day he was driving through an intersection and an old lady ran the red light at 10mph. he got hit and is a quadripilegic for life now. he was a perfectly safe driver, but you can't control what others will do. he was following all the rules, not speeding, not running red lights, but somebody else made a mistake and he's hosed forever.
sure you can the awareness you learn on the race track and the reactions may have saved his life...
on a bike there is awlays an exit.. I need less than 1 foot of room to survive...
after 25 years road exp on sportbikes.. you bet ill find that 1 foot of space if my life depends on it..
err wait a sec 10 mph... your dads freind wasnt wearing his gear then.... i call shens ive been down at 140 mph with my full gear on and not even got a broken bone...
100 dollar helmets dont count as gear... my ridign gear adds up to almost 3k US dollars...
the helmet alone is 800 bucks....
and it has to be replaced every 3 years...
or every crash...
my leathers are another 1400 bucks... and you better beleive they have saved my ass..
back protector.. 100 bucks..
kevlar race gloves... 200 bucks...
Riding boots... 200 bucks...
on and on...
I laugh at these idiots wearing 100 dollar helmets cloth gloves if any and a tee shirt....
they are the ones these stats are mainly about...
me and my friends all wear ALL our gear any time you enter the streets or the track...
adn ALL of us been down at one time or another...
on the streets I wear a Shoei XSP Helmet.
Spidi Gloves kevlar/leather race gauntlets
Spidi Leather race jacket
Kevlar sliding jeans (look like blue jeans but are reinforced for crashing on bikes)
Spidi Race boots.
I have been hit by a car in a parking lot at 15 mph and didnt even get tossed off the bike...
Amused
Elite Member
- Apr 14, 2001
- 57,355
- 19,537
- 146
Fairly good advice up 'till this one. Sorry, but this is BAD advice.
Eye contact means NOTHING!!! Do not rely on it and then disregard that driver just because you THINK they saw you.
In fact, the SMART reaction to eye contact is the defensive reaction:
If you think they saw you, they now have you targeted.
halik
Lifer
- Oct 10, 2000
- 25,696
- 1
- 81
Meh,
that's little overkill depending on what you do. I've got maybe 400 bucks in gear, but 95% of the time i ride around 35mph around campus. I do need better gloves... i'd prolly go thru 'em sliding maybe 100 yards.
Shens on the quadriplegic thing too. He must've been flying like no other and not paying attention.
nothing is overkill when you ride a bike...
if you have ever had road rash on a large portion of your body or seen a harley kill its rider at 35mph in a simple layover casue they didnt have a helmet on.. you yould never skimp on gear again.
cheap helmets and gear do not stand up in crashes... buy the best if you treasure your skin and life..
Amused
Elite Member
- Apr 14, 2001
- 57,355
- 19,537
- 146
The best, while more expensive, is not always the MOST expensive.
Look for ratings, not price tags. For helmets, look for Snell tested and approved helmets.
For leathers, look for thick, naked leather with enough comfort that you'll be more likely to wear it than not.
Boots are good, but so is walking and a social life. Look for boots you can comfortably walk around in for extended periods.
Face it, once you get over a certain amount it's about fashion, not safety.
Triumph
Lifer
- Oct 9, 1999
- 15,031
- 14
- 81
For the OP, if you're looking for statistics, the so called Hurt Report is pretty much the largest, and only, compilation of data about motorcycle accidents, and even it has alot of problem that would make a statistician cringe. Read up on it. There is also another study done recently on European riders, but it basically reiterates what the Hurt report says.
Motorcycles as commuters aren't really a great idea. Tires cost $90 and up each, and you can easily go through them in as little as 3,000 miles or as much as ~10,000, depending on the tire and the riding style. And motorcycles are NOT "gas and go" devices. You do that for too long and the neglected clutch cable is going to snap while you're driving in traffic.
you're stupid.
Motorcycles as commuters aren't really a great idea. Tires cost $90 and up each, and you can easily go through them in as little as 3,000 miles or as much as ~10,000, depending on the tire and the riding style. And motorcycles are NOT "gas and go" devices. You do that for too long and the neglected clutch cable is going to snap while you're driving in traffic.
you're stupid.
halik
Lifer
- Oct 10, 2000
- 25,696
- 1
- 81
Well it's not like you're wasting money,
but theres no need to have kevlar ridden race gear when you go riding around town. Helmets are must, but anything that meets SNELL/DOT regulations is certified as good.
Quite honestly if you manage to crash so bad that you crack your helmet, you will be dead anyway. It's not as if a GP helmet will make your survive internal bleeding and/or soft tissue injury.
yeh k... i care less about how it looks.. its about function and how well it stands up in a crash..
the lesser companies just dont stand up well.
its very easy to get a snell rating.. and you can tell the differnce between companies that only do enough to get the rating.. ie HJC KBC Soumi and the big boys Arai and Shoei...
who do alot more work towards safety and crash performance.
vanson jackets are known as one of the best period for crash and confort but they are extremely expensive and not usually sold 100% off the rack.. ie in most cases you have to order from vanson.
the reason I got Spidi is becasue my friend is a Spidi authorized dealer and it also has very good reviews..
my Sidi boots were also on sale.. and are top rated...
there are different grades of leather toughness btw.. just casue its thicker doesnt mean its a better grade...
there is a reason Kushitani and other high dollar suits.. (2000+ dollars for a custom made race suit) are that expensive and it has very little to do with fashion...
in fact my suit isnt even close to top of the line...
its an Off the self item... the best suits are custom made only.
actually it will beacsue these helmets do not crack...
they eggshell
they are desgined to cusion the blow..
only cheap helmets crack like you describe...
Being a licensed roadracer I have seen MANY horrendous crashes you would think the riders would have died but do to thier gear only suffered minor injuries...
im taking about 170+ mph crashes on the racetrack walls and other unmovable objects...
I have only see one fatality in the last 10 years racing here in Texas...
and it was an Impalement that could not have been avoided by any gear...
As for you comment that the streets dont warrant such gear...
you obvisouly dont have much saddle time
the streets are 500% more dangerous than the racetrack...
in the past 5 years I have buried 14 peeps that thought gear didnt matter on the streets...
and visited another 40 in the hospital after severe road rash and other disfiguring injuries...
is being hot and uncomfortable worth it... damn right it is...
Easy way to think about it... have you ever been in a car accident? Think of how hurt you would be if you were on a bike.
Nuff said...
-Max
Nuff said...
-Max
I wouldn't do it because of other people. The average person isn't just stupid; the average person is dumb as a rock. This affects their driving skill, obviously.
no i haven't been in a car accident....nor have i ever gotten a speeding ticket...hell ive never been pulled over
because i drive defensively, don't speed a lot, and do that whole crazy 'following distance' thing which no one ever does
I keep my speeding and driving agressively on the track
the point of looking at those stats i posted was....i don't plan on drinking and riding a bike (or ever driving a car...not even after 1 beer)
and i don't plan on speeding like a mad man
so im not saying im invincible and that i won't get in an accident....im just thinking that i might get in an accident but it is not as likely as people doing the 2 previously mentioned things (and i would plan on getting the proper gear)
because i drive defensively, don't speed a lot, and do that whole crazy 'following distance' thing which no one ever does
I keep my speeding and driving agressively on the track
the point of looking at those stats i posted was....i don't plan on drinking and riding a bike (or ever driving a car...not even after 1 beer)
and i don't plan on speeding like a mad man
so im not saying im invincible and that i won't get in an accident....im just thinking that i might get in an accident but it is not as likely as people doing the 2 previously mentioned things (and i would plan on getting the proper gear)
halik
Lifer
- Oct 10, 2000
- 25,696
- 1
- 81
My dad taught me to ride when i was 10, so thats over 10 years ago...
It's foolish to think that a race suit / $2Gs worth of gear will give you significantly better odds of surviving a fatal crash compared to $500 in a helmet and a good jacket. If you side into a curb / car at 50 mph, you will get busted up good no matter what you're wearing.
The kevler inserts in race suits don't act to add structural rigidy, but rather abrasion protection so you don't polish your body down to bones if you drop at the end of a stright away. If you nail a pole or the end of a highway divider doing normal highway speeds, you'll be done. The race suit just makes for easier clean up.
If you do decide to get a motorcycle, make sure to gear up for EVERY ride, even if it's one block. My spouse has an 8-inch long scar from his eyebrow across the top of his head from a 5mph collision with a curb (as in, his head hit the curb.) He was just rolling across a parking lot to park it, so he didn't bother with a helmet. That was about 18 years ago, but he ended up retaking a year of college because the resulting brain injury effectively erased portions of his memory, and he still has problems associated with it (bad migraine/cluster headaches, instances where he thinks he says one thing but really says another-the other day he was talking about something at work with his boss and thought he said the name of a segment of a chip he's working on but actually said something like "twenty dollars".)
Amused
Elite Member
- Apr 14, 2001
- 57,355
- 19,537
- 146
BINGO!!!
The BEST helmets are good for a 12-15 MPH impact at most. This means you wont damage your head when you go down and bonk your head on the pavement. (This would have saved Indian Larry) A helmet will NOT save your head if you go head first into a stationary object at high speed.
It's the same for leathers and "body armor." ALL these are good for is bike to ground impact and road rash protection. Body armor is a good idea for very high speed riding because it takes for ever to stop sliding, and the extra padding takes longer to wear down as you slide. Body armor will NOT save your bones from braking or lesson the impact.
If you hit a stationary object at speed, no amount of armor and no helmet, no matter how much you over paid, is going to save you. Your gear and body do not have crumple zones. Therefore, your body IS what takes the impact.
This is just reality, folks. Gear up for laying down the bike and sliding. Trying to gear up for being hit, or hitting a car is futility. You're just over dressing.
Originally posted by: halik
Originally posted by: Viper GTS
My brother is intent on getting a motorcycle.
He just turned 18, doesn't have much by way of income, & sees the high gas mileage + dirt cheap insurance as being worth the risk(s).
I think he'll avoid the majority of the things on that list, but I'm still worried for him.
Viper GTS
Commuting on a bike is playing russian roulette on a daily basis... with big enough sample size, the odds of your survival will converge to the stats the o/p posted...
The markov chain of Death ....awesome/
StageLeft
No Lifer
- Sep 29, 2000
- 70,150
- 5
- 0
Don't forget that even the best of leather can't stop the bumper of a car compacting your leg in and breaking it in two places, or save your ribs from the compression of getting nailed by the windshield and frame of that very same car.
Motorcycle gear definitely helps your chances when you crash. But this is still a motorbike, and when you crash it sucks. Regardless of your gear or driving habits they are FAR more dangerous than automobiles.
Motorcycle gear definitely helps your chances when you crash. But this is still a motorbike, and when you crash it sucks. Regardless of your gear or driving habits they are FAR more dangerous than automobiles.
TRENDING THREADS
-
Discussion Zen 5 Speculation (EPYC Turin and Strix Point/Granite Ridge - Ryzen 9000)- Started by DisEnchantment
- Replies: 25K
-
Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes + WCL Discussion Threads
- Started by Tigerick
- Replies: 22K
-
Discussion Intel current and future Lakes & Rapids thread- Started by TheF34RChannel
- Replies: 23K
-
News NVIDIA and Intel to Develop AI Infrastructure and Personal Computing Products- Started by poke01
- Replies: 411
-
Facebook
Twitter