Mothers send sons to Somalia to avoid knife crime

[UglyCasanova]

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...nd-sons-abroad-to-protect-against-knife-crime

British teenagers are being sent by their parents to Somalia, itself recovering from a series of terror attacks, because of concern that the police cannot protect them from knife crime.

Representatives from north London’s Somali community say hundreds of children have been flown to Somalia, Somaliland and Kenya because of rising concerns over drug gangs and county lines, the criminal networks that use children to transport drugs from cities to the provinces.

..
The revelations follow a week of heated debate over the causes of and potential solutions to Britain’s knife crime epidemic. Seventeen people have died after attacks in London alone since the start of 2019. On Saturday, there were reports that three people were in hospital after an attack at a nightclub in Birmingham, a city reeling from three knife fatalities within days last month. And a 15-year-old boy was charged with murder after the stabbing of 17-year-old Ayub Hassan, in west London, on Thursday afternoon.

https://twitter.com/x/status/982906526334668800

I can’t fathom sending kids to Somalia would be better off than London, even it’s worse parts. I can’t help but laugh though that knife violence is a big concern across the UK. Shows that if we take guns away there will still be violence, there will always be violence. And as the violence continues so does the police state. Would taking knives away solve the issue these Somali moms are worried about or just morph it into something else. Our fear is an opening for the government to creep into our lives, don’t let that happen.

 

[fskimospy]

Considering London’s murder rate is somewhere around half of New York’s, and New York is one of America’s safest large cities, wouldn’t the more sensible takeaway be ‘holy shit, largely getting rid of guns is incredibly effective’?

 

[brycejones]

Obviously the solution is more knives.

OP serious question have you compared the outcomes of knife attacks with guns? Is the rate of knife attacks the same as fire arm violence in the US? Is the death rate from these knife crimes in the UK the same as gun deaths in the US on a per 100,000 population basis?

 

[brycejones]

Considering London’s murder rate is somewhere around half of New York’s, and New York is one of America’s safest large cities, wouldn’t the more sensible takeaway be ‘holy shit, largely getting rid of guns is incredibly effective’?

But if limiting access to guns won't solve all violent crime then we should just do nothing. Its perfection or nothing.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Considering London’s murder rate is somewhere around half of New York’s, and New York is one of America’s safest large cities, wouldn’t the more sensible takeaway be ‘holy shit, largely getting rid of guns is incredibly effective’?

Thank you to the forefathers for being sure to encode the 2A in the Bill of Rights to keep it safe from scared little men like yourself. Firearms homicides isn't a too-many-rights issue, it is a failed liberal societal issue.

 

[fskimospy]

Thank you to the forefathers for being sure to encode the 2A in the Bill of Rights to keep it safe from scared little men like yourself. Firearms homicides isn't a too-many-rights issue, it is a failed liberal societal issue.

Oh okay then. That probably explains why the rest of the developed world also has lower homicide rates despite being more liberal than we are.

Durrrrrrrrr.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Oh okay then. That probably explains why the rest of the developed world also has lower homicide rates despite being more liberal than we are.

Durrrrrrrrr.

In America, outside of large Democrat cities our homicide rates fall much closer inline with those countries you speak of despite there being guns everywhere and often many more "gun nutters" that have several or even many guns.

 

[fskimospy]

In America, outside of large Democrat cities our homicide rates fall much closer inline with those countries you speak of despite there being guns everywhere and often many more "gun nutters" that have several or even many guns.

‘Our crime rates would be comparable so long as you don’t include our high crime areas!’ Hahaha.

Durrrrrrrrrrrrr.

 

[KB]

Its actually amazing how dangerous London is since they ban guns, have strong and intrusive police powers and live on an island with strong borders. I think its a sign that anti-drug policies just aren't working and need to be rethought.

Interesting that according to https://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/compare/Somalia/United-States/Crime Somalia is safer than the US, but I expect some of that comes to the US having better reporting of crimes statistics. Some areas of Somalia could very well be safer than London so it may make sense for some to move.

 

[fskimospy]

Its actually amazing how dangerous London is since they ban guns, have strong and intrusive police powers and live on an island with strong borders. I think its a sign that anti-drug policies just aren't working and need to be rethought.

Interesting that according to https://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/compare/Somalia/United-States/Crime Somalia is safer than the US, but I expect some of that comes to the US having better reporting of crimes statistics. Some areas of Somalia could very well be safer than London so it may make sense for some to move.

I’m going to go out on a limb and say there were not 138 murders in Somalia that year, haha.

I suspect there is nowhere in Somalia, Somaliland included, where mortality rates are lower than in London.

 

[soulcougher73]

I can’t fathom sending kids to Somalia would be better off than London, even it’s worse parts. I can’t help but laugh though that knife violence is a big concern across the UK. Shows that if we take guns away there will still be violence, there will always be violence. And as the violence continues so does the police state. Would taking knives away solve the issue these Somali moms are worried about or just morph it into something else. Our fear is an opening for the government to creep into our lives, don’t let that happen.

I dont think anyone has argued taking guns away would not result in other forms of violence. But knifes are a lot less dangerous than guns in the wrong hands. Knives are easy to run away from, hard to kill multiple people with, easier to fend off an attack of or take away the knife, less deadly than guns when actual shot or stabs with. etc.

 

[TheVrolok]

Considering London’s murder rate is somewhere around half of New York’s, and New York is one of America’s safest large cities, wouldn’t the more sensible takeaway be ‘holy shit, largely getting rid of guns is incredibly effective’?

Emotional arguments are way more satisfying, for some, than rational ones.

 

[fskimospy]

I dont think anyone has argued taking guns away would not result in other forms of violence. But knifes are a lot less dangerous than guns in the wrong hands. Knives are easy to run away from, hard to kill multiple people with, easier to fend off an attack of or take away the knife, less deadly than guns when actual shot or stabs with. etc.

Reminds me of this article:

https://www.theonion.com/you-take-away-guns-and-someone-s-just-gonna-invent-ma-1819585008

You Take Away Guns, And Someone’s Just Gonna Invent, Manufacture, And Use A High-Powered Knife Launcher

The way you hear so many TV personalities and online commenters talk about it, you’d think that ending violence in the U.S. would be as simple as rounding up all the guns, or stringently regulating their sale from here on out. But think about how absurd that idea is. Does taking away guns make crazy, murderous people any less crazy or murderous? Does taking away guns prevent someone from getting their hands on a knife, then crafting a launching mechanism that propels the knife through the air with immense force, then buying a lot more knives to load into that mechanism, then pulling that device out unsuspectingly and spraying knives across a public area? Of course it doesn’t, and that’s why their argument is so foolish.

What I love so much about this article is that you could totally see multiple people on here saying something similar.

 

[SlowSpyder]

‘Our crime rates would be comparable so long as you don’t include our high crime areas!’ Hahaha.

Durrrrrrrrrrrrr.

Considering you are blaming guns, the point is that when you remove a handful of Democrat cities, despite guns still prevalent in the remaining population and areas, our homicide rate isn't out of whack with those westernized countries that do not allow guns.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

But if limiting access to guns won't solve all violent crime then we should just do nothing. Its perfection or nothing.

The knife laws are getting silly though. It's hard to make a firearm but a piece of metal and a grinding wheel with a half hour of effort makes an effective knife. Ugly, but it will slice and kill. No more lawn mower blades?

 

[zinfamous]

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...nd-sons-abroad-to-protect-against-knife-crime

British teenagers are being sent by their parents to Somalia, itself recovering from a series of terror attacks, because of concern that the police cannot protect them from knife crime.

Representatives from north London’s Somali community say hundreds of children have been flown to Somalia, Somaliland and Kenya because of rising concerns over drug gangs and county lines, the criminal networks that use children to transport drugs from cities to the provinces.

..
The revelations follow a week of heated debate over the causes of and potential solutions to Britain’s knife crime epidemic. Seventeen people have died after attacks in London alone since the start of 2019. On Saturday, there were reports that three people were in hospital after an attack at a nightclub in Birmingham, a city reeling from three knife fatalities within days last month. And a 15-year-old boy was charged with murder after the stabbing of 17-year-old Ayub Hassan, in west London, on Thursday afternoon.

https://twitter.com/x/status/982906526334668800

I can’t fathom sending kids to Somalia would be better off than London, even it’s worse parts. I can’t help but laugh though that knife violence is a big concern across the UK. Shows that if we take guns away there will still be violence, there will always be violence. And as the violence continues so does the police state. Would taking knives away solve the issue these Somali moms are worried about or just morph it into something else. Our fear is an opening for the government to creep into our lives, don’t let that happen.

again, show me where a drive-by knifing or any kind of knifing leads to death or injury of bystanders, and I won't consider you a fucking moron for making this absurdly pedestrian failure of an analogy.

 

[brycejones]

The knife laws are getting silly though. It's hard to make a firearm but a piece of metal and a grinding wheel with a half hour of effort makes an effective knife. Ugly, but it will slice and kill. No more lawn mower blades?

We should ban any material that can hold an edge just to be sure. Force women to turn in their diamond rings as well.

 

[fskimospy]

Considering you are blaming guns, the point is that when you remove a handful of Democrat cities, despite guns still prevalent in the remaining population and areas, our homicide rate isn't out of whack with those westernized countries that do not allow guns.

Yes, we get your point that if we cut out the high crime areas in the US and then compare our rates with other countries that don’t cut out their high crime areas the US looks better.

This is moronic though so nobody would ever do that unless they were trying to find a way to make the facts hurt their feelings less.

 

[brycejones]

Yes, we get your point that if we cut out the high crime areas in the US and then compare our rates with other countries that don’t cut out their high crime areas the US looks better.

This is moronic though so nobody would ever do that unless they were trying to find a way to make the facts hurt their feelings less.

His real point is that Democrats are the real criminals.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

again, show me where a drive-by knifing or any kind of knifing leads to death or injury of bystanders, and I won't consider you a fucking moron for making this absurdly pedestrian failure of an analogy.

I'm not biting on the analogy but I looked at the Mayor who said there is no reason, ever, to carry a knife and people will be harshly punished. That's a Trumpian lie. If I'm carrying my Paramilitary 2 (run, scary name!) and am imprisoned for the peaceful possession of a tool laws notwithstanding, I have been done a wrong for no good reason. Why? Because if my intent is to do harm I go to a Big Box store, get a piece of metal and grind it, or use hard plastic, or... a hundred things including concrete. And to protect the British, the powers in charge who do have protection, enact laws that make them look like thugs all because the people there are conditioned to fear as much as many here in the US.

As you may note I am not a fan of what the British lords and ladies, elected or not, have done to amass power and control.

 

[SlowSpyder]

The knife laws are getting silly though. It's hard to make a firearm but a piece of metal and a grinding wheel with a half hour of effort makes an effective knife. Ugly, but it will slice and kill. No more lawn mower blades?

You might be surprised at how easy it is to make a gun. Making a repeating firearm is a bigger endeavor, but something that can fire a round is very simple.

And they can be made with even simpler firing mechanisms.

And when you look at the fact that knives kill far more than all rifles and shotguns....

 

[SlowSpyder]

Yes, we get your point that if we cut out the high crime areas in the US and then compare our rates with other countries that don’t cut out their high crime areas the US looks better.

This is moronic though so nobody would ever do that unless they were trying to find a way to make the facts hurt their feelings less.

But guns are still throughout the low crime areas just the same. And yet they aren't being used to kill people at a rate that different than people are murdered in other westernized countries that do not allow for guns. So your argument doesn't hold water. If you said Democrat cities can't handle guns, that might have some truth to it, but to blame our homicides on guns is to look at things in a vacuum and dismiss every other bit of data no matter how relevant. You do this quite often, though.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

You might be surprised at how easy it is to make a gun. Making a repeating firearm is a bigger endeavor, but something that can fire a round is very simple.

And they can be made with even simpler firing mechanisms.

I am familiar with the principles. The argument about your weapon is limited range and is not a repeater. The reliable range of that weapon is likely less than a ground down lawnmower blade with the information found on youtube. The Brits can, of course, monitor your communications with the Snooper's Charter so they need to be very careful what they say, see and do.

PS I had a relative who was a gun and bladesmith and he taught me a few things during summer breaks. I could be a potential nightmare in the UK. Imagine someone who can forge a blade. I'm a potential terrorist threat.

Maybe I should be using Tor and VPN?

 

[fskimospy]

But guns are still throughout the low crime areas just the same. And yet they aren't being used to kill people at a rate that different than people are murdered in other westernized countries that do not allow for guns. So your argument doesn't hold water. If you said Democrat cities can't handle guns, that might have some truth to it, but to blame our homicides on guns is to look at things in a vacuum and dismiss every other bit of data no matter how relevant. You do this quite often, though.

This is false. US murder rates are higher across the board. In addition, empirical research shows that after controlling for other relevant factors the presence of more guns increases the homicide rate. Even down to the individual level the presence of a gun in the home increases risk factors for homicide and suicide. This information has been shown to you repeatedly but you are either unwilling or unable to process it logically.

Your problem is that you reason emotionally instead of factually.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Without looking how about someone naming the 5 top causes of unneeded death?

Everything about this thread is emotion. Humans are terrible with risk assessment. Look at the Lord Mayor as an example.