Moment of Silence Tomorrow (8:46am)

[Mill]

Originally posted by: VioletAura

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: VioletAura

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: VioletAura

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: konichiwa
*vomit*

What the fvck is your problem? Do you have something against 3,000 innocent people?

Bush had a problem with over twice as many.

"grenade-thrower" "'enemy tanks and tracked vehicles'; Republican Guards"

Yeah that is a totally innocent people. Do you like your tinted glasses or what?

child
civilian vehicle
Mosque
10 year old boy
syrian passenger bus
etc.

My tinted glasses see just fine.

How are the ones I listed innocent? Please show me the amount of spin you have to put on that to say they were innocent.

It was a list of CIVILIANS killed.
Yeah, its ok to kill civilians once you were aiming for a tank

. Bin Laden could say the same thing, "I just wanted to hit the building, not my fault those people were there."
And of course you checked the 9/11 losses to make sure that they were all perfect people

So someone throwing a grenade is a civilian? Since when?

 

[Mill]

Life must be grand being so full of hatred and bullsh!t. Glad that you call me Xenophobic and all. That is a hoot considering we were talking AMERICAN tragedies and you started your verbal diarrhea up on something that was unrelated to the thread. Sure you don't just hate this country and its people?

More and more rhetoric. Who said American tragedies? Not me.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure I don't hate this country and and its people. I happen to live in it and be one of them. Seems that around here the last vestige of the mal-interlocutor is to simply suggest that his adversary is a "Bush hater" or an "anti-American."

I'm sad to see that your post has degenerated this thread to that, but what could I expect. I tried to be civil anyway.[/quote]

Who said American tragedies? Look at what the thread is about dude. 9/11.... That was an AMERICAN tragedy. Yes other people died that day, but the discussion in this tread was ABOUT 9/11 and our President asking for a moment of tragedy. Maybe you can't read; maybe you are so jaded that you refuse to see it, but there is no way you can imply this thread was about an American tragedy.

I never said you were an anti-American or a Bush hater. You just labeled yourself with those names. All I said was that it seems you hate this country and its people. I have never seen you post a positive comment about ANYTHING in the past 3 years on this board, so the evidence I have at hand suggests that. If you think differently then how about saying that instead of jumping off the deep end and proselytizing about the great evil of anyone that disagrees with you.

The only rhetoric coming out in this thread is the steaming pile of feces and trash coming out of your mouth.

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

Why not a moment of silence for the 2,000 people that will die from smoking-related cardiovascular or respiratory disease? Oh nevermind . . . then you would have to do it . . . . every day.

9/11 was sad but it is not the most significant mass casualty to occur in the world. Some of you need to move on.

 

[Tom]

If you expect America is going to forget about 9/11 you don't understand us.

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: BaliBabyDoc
Why not a moment of silence for the 2,000 people that will die from smoking-related cardiovascular or respiratory disease? Oh nevermind . . . then you would have to do it . . . . every day.

9/11 was sad but it is not the most significant mass casualty to occur in the world. Some of you need to move on.

That is quite shocking to hear that crap come out of your mouth. I thought you were above that, but it seems you have been jaded by your increasing time here.

Smokers are not INNOCENT civilians. They are taking a risk and they all know it. You can't compare the two and you know it. Plus, why do we need to move on? People in other parts of the world still have holidays about tragedies that happened 500 years ago. Do you not understand that EVERYONE does that?

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

If you expect America is going to forget about 9/11 you don't understand us.

I know language skills are typically weak in Americans so I will try again . . .

9/11 was sad but it is not the most significant mass casualty to occur in the world. Some of you need to move on.

Move on . . . does not mean forget. If you need a moment of silence at 8:46AM every Sept 11th for the rest of your life . . . by all means indulge yourself. But ask yourself a question . . . what's the purpose of your moment of silence? Is it morning the death of innocents? If so then why not mourn the thousands of children that die every day in developing countries b/c they cannot afford basic sanitation, vaccines, or killed by landmines (for a treaty the US refuses to sign). There's plenty of death happening every day that doesn't need to be mourned but can be prevented . . . why not invest a powerful nation's resources on that instead of indulging the self-centered "moment of silence?"

 

[jpeyton]

Well call me a super patriot, because I'm going to get up around seven, get all spiffed up, light some candles, hang a few Patriot Day banners, slap some "United We Stand" and "9/11" stickers on my car, and observe a moment of silence at 8:46AM. Good for Bush, I hope his job approval rating jumps at least 5 points with all this commemorative stuff.

Or not.

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

That is quite shocking to hear that crap come out of your mouth. I thought you were above that, but it seems you have been jaded by your increasing time here.

Try poo . . . I like the term "poo" more than crap . . . it seems you have been jaded by your increasing time here.

Smokers are not INNOCENT civilians. They are taking a risk and they all know it. You can't compare the two and you know it. Plus, why do we need to move on? People in other parts of the world still have holidays about tragedies that happened 500 years ago. Do you not understand that EVERYONE does that?

Smokers have no clue. Now a smoking doctor . . . of which there's a surprising number . . . perfectly understand the risk. I compared the two b/c thousands of people die from smoking-related illness every day as opposed to the one-time event of 9/11. Of the 40K people that die every year on our highways the vast majority are innocent but where's the moment of silence for them. Of the tens of thousands of people that die each year b/c prescription drugs are inadequately tested or improperly used by physicians how many get a moment of silence? The fact that people memorialize tragedies the world over is not surprising. And as I said before by all means . . . indulge yourselves. Spend a nation's worth of silence while thousands the world over continue to die of preventable causes . . . it's your time . . . use it as you see fit. But every time Bush or his mindless followers practice such false piety it makes me want to show them a picture of the millions of malnourished, unvaccinated children in the world that would have their lives changed forever by a 1/10th of that $87B plus the cumulative 'time' of 270m people's moment of silence.

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: BaliBabyDoc

That is quite shocking to hear that crap come out of your mouth. I thought you were above that, but it seems you have been jaded by your increasing time here.

Try poo . . . I like the term "poo" more than crap . . . it seems you have been jaded by your increasing time here.

Smokers are not INNOCENT civilians. They are taking a risk and they all know it. You can't compare the two and you know it. Plus, why do we need to move on? People in other parts of the world still have holidays about tragedies that happened 500 years ago. Do you not understand that EVERYONE does that?

Smokers have no clue. Now a smoking doctor . . . of which there's a surprising number . . . perfectly understand the risk. I compared the two b/c thousands of people die from smoking-related illness every day as opposed to the one-time event of 9/11. Of the 40K people that die every year on our highways the vast majority are innocent but where's the moment of silence for them. Of the tens of thousands of people that die each year b/c prescription drugs are inadequately tested or improperly used by physicians how many get a moment of silence? The fact that people memorialize tragedies the world over is not surprising. And as I said before by all means . . . indulge yourselves. Spend a nation's worth of silence while thousands the world over continue to die of preventable causes . . . it's your time . . . use it as you see fit. But every time Bush or his mindless followers practice such false piety it makes me want to show them a picture of the millions of malnourished, unvaccinated children in the world that would have their lives changed forever by a 1/10th of that $87B plus the cumulative 'time' of 270m people's moment of silence.

You are comparing a mass murder to individual deaths.

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

You are comparing a mass murder to individual deaths.

I assume these terms having some visceral meaning for you. So let me try to give you some objective perspective . . . since Sept 11, 2001 . . . more than 80K people were killed on American roads. What's the difference between having those 80K people die in their cars versus having them show up at Doak Campbell stadium and die on one day? The innocent and dead remain innocent and dead . . . senseless killing by intent or negligence is still preventable and deplorable.

I was in the WTC 9/5/01 (came for the US Open). My best friend's sister-in-law (visiting from Korea) was in the South tower the day before. Should I thank someone that our timing was good . . . or curse someone b/c the timing for other's was bad? My answer would be no. I have nothing but sympathy for the families and friends that lost someone of significance that day. But I have that feeling every day for every person that loses a loved one. In short, why not make the world a better place . . . a safer place for everyone from this day going forwards . . . instead of piousness that serves not to remember but to advance an agenda. I am not implying anyone at AP&N is insincere but our political leaders are FOS.

 

[TheBoyBlunder]

I love this forum...give any thread five minutes and i'll be a flame war, guarenteed.

And I'll probably participate because I'll be in a US History class for the 13th time at 846am tomorrow, quite possibly sound asleep.

 

[sMiLeYz]

.........

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: BaliBabyDoc

You are comparing a mass murder to individual deaths.

I assume these terms having some visceral meaning for you. So let me try to give you some objective perspective . . . since Sept 11, 2001 . . . more than 80K people were killed on American roads. What's the difference between having those 80K people die in their cars versus having them show up at Doak Campbell stadium and die on one day? The innocent and dead remain innocent and dead . . . senseless killing by intent or negligence is still preventable and deplorable.

I was in the WTC 9/5/01 (came for the US Open). My best friend's sister-in-law (visiting from Korea) was in the South tower the day before. Should I thank someone that our timing was good . . . or curse someone b/c the timing for other's was bad? My answer would be no. I have nothing but sympathy for the families and friends that lost someone of significance that day. But I have that feeling every day for every person that loses a loved one. In short, why not make the world a better place . . . a safer place for everyone from this day going forwards . . . instead of piousness that serves not to remember but to advance an agenda. I am not implying anyone at AP&N is insincere but our political leaders are FOS.

How do you know that Bush is FOS about his sincerity? That requires an awful large jump in logic that you can know what he is thinking in this own brain. The point is, Bali, that 3000k dying in one spot within just a few minutes is a lot different than piling up smokers, AIDS victims, fat people, and accident victims. They all didn't die of the same exact thing at the same exact time in the same exact place. Fact of the matter is that individual deaths that are not clustered are only felt by those who know the person. When you have an event on this level almost everyone feels that emotion of death and helplessness. Same thing happened after Pearl Harbor and it isn't some weird thing that only happens in the US. People have been remembering major accidents for hundreds of years.

It is human nature to be more emotional about a larger event. Don't ask me why but it just is. Maybe you feel going against human nature and being a stoic is a good idea, but it isn't healthy for me and a majority of Americans.

 

[Mill]

Another thing Bali is that you are a doctor and typically see a lot more death and the causes of death than the average joe. That colors your perspective on issues and I am not saying that is bad thing, but you mustn't confuse your reality with the reality of others.

 

[Orsorum]

I will hold a moment of silence as well as a prayer tomorrow, as I do on December 8th and on August 6th.

 

[NesuD]

Originally posted by: konichiwa
How about Here?

"Looks the French are all to quick to surrender to the heat as well. What a great civilized country, I see it takes great care of its elderly."

Five times as many died, and this is a comment on it? But I can't vomit at Bush demanding mourning?

Of course, they are the French, so I guess that makes it okay, right? *roll*

President Bush has asked all Americans to observe a moment of silence tomorrow at 8:46 a.m...

Your mischaracterizing it. asked and demanding have to very differrent meanings. You characterizing this as a demand or an order is patently a partison attempt to critisize him unfairly for it. You are entitled to not like the man but lets stick to the truth here ok?

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

Another thing Bali is that you are a doctor and typically see a lot more death and the causes of death than the average joe. That colors your perspective on issues and I am not saying that is bad thing, but you mustn't confuse your reality with the reality of others.

I'm not being picky but you mean "perception" . . . trust me I understand all too well how "perception" is colored by experience. But the reality is that 9/11 per se will not happen again but throughout the world and every year for many years before now . . . thousands of people have died in horrific events (natural and unnatural). When people talk about how "9/11 changed everything" that means their reality (read: perception) was always very limited. Anybody that has traveled this world knows that suffering exists in bounty . . . wonderful people living (and dying) in unimaginable conditions . . . unimaginable for people more concerned with JLo/Ben and Brad/Jennifer than the condition of their fellow human beings.

As Americans we live in an ignorant society. Which is inexcusable considering we are wealthiest (monetary) nation on the planet. 9/11 was indeed a wake up call for many but if our response is to mourn our dead and curse our attackers (well curse everyone except their Saudi supporters) then we are still lost in the wilderness. The lesson learned should be a respect for this small place that we all occupy. Injustice anywhere is injustice everywhere . . . we left Karzai the mayor of Kabul while the rest of country has descended into disorder which is worse than the Taliban . . . but America calls it victory.

Spotty electricity (before the war), water, and security for Iraq remains a work requiring billions of dollars, hundreds of thousands of workers, and many months to repair but our Commander-in-Chief calls it . . . "mission accomplished."

It is human nature to be more emotional about a larger event. Don't ask me why but it just is. Maybe you feel going against human nature and being a stoic is a good idea, but it isn't healthy for me and a majority of Americans.

Fear, anger, sympathy, empathy . . . are indeed emotions but there is no human hierarchy based on number.

Do you remember Hurricane Mitch? That was 3x the direct human casualties of 9/11 not to mention the devastation. A Colombian volcano in 1985 killed 20K more people than 9/11. So be honest it wasn't the loss of life b/c no one is talking about a moment of silence for 10/28/98 (Hurricane Mitch) or whatever the date was in '85. This moment of silence is b/c these were mainly American lives lost. The same BS when a news report comes on about some accident or natural disaster . . . they can scarcely catch their breath as they recount how many American lives were lost. What you call stoic is me keeping it real. Innocent people die every day for a myriad of causes . . . hence 9/11 is just another bad day for humanity . . . with the one caveat that we are doing it to ourselves.

 

[Insane3D]

See Millenium. See Millenium freak out at *gasp* a differing point of view. See Millenium hurl personal attacks and insults like they are going out of style.

I'll remember to crank some tunes extra loud at that moment just for you Mill...

🙂

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: Insane3D
See Millenium. See Millenium freak out at *gasp* a differing point of view. See Millenium hurl personal attacks and insults like they are going out of style.

I'll remember to crank some tunes extra loud at that moment just for you Mill...

🙂

What in the hell are you talking about? I haven't said anything yet that could be considered a personal attack. Maybe you just have really thin skin Insane...

 

[Mill]

Originally posted by: BaliBabyDoc

Another thing Bali is that you are a doctor and typically see a lot more death and the causes of death than the average joe. That colors your perspective on issues and I am not saying that is bad thing, but you mustn't confuse your reality with the reality of others.

I'm not being picky but you mean "perception" . . . trust me I understand all too well how "perception" is colored by experience. But the reality is that 9/11 per se will not happen again but throughout the world and every year for many years before now . . . thousands of people have died in horrific events (natural and unnatural). When people talk about how "9/11 changed everything" that means their reality (read: perception) was always very limited. Anybody that has traveled this world knows that suffering exists in bounty . . . wonderful people living (and dying) in unimaginable conditions . . . unimaginable for people more concerned with JLo/Ben and Brad/Jennifer than the condition of their fellow human beings.

As Americans we live in an ignorant society. Which is inexcusable considering we are wealthiest (monetary) nation on the planet. 9/11 was indeed a wake up call for many but if our response is to mourn our dead and curse our attackers (well curse everyone except their Saudi supporters) then we are still lost in the wilderness. The lesson learned should be a respect for this small place that we all occupy. Injustice anywhere is injustice everywhere . . . we left Karzai the mayor of Kabul while the rest of country has descended into disorder which is worse than the Taliban . . . but America calls it victory.

Spotty electricity (before the war), water, and security for Iraq remains a work requiring billions of dollars, hundreds of thousands of workers, and many months to repair but our Commander-in-Chief calls it . . . "mission accomplished."

It is human nature to be more emotional about a larger event. Don't ask me why but it just is. Maybe you feel going against human nature and being a stoic is a good idea, but it isn't healthy for me and a majority of Americans.

Fear, anger, sympathy, empathy . . . are indeed emotions but there is no human hierarchy based on number.

Do you remember Hurricane Mitch? That was 3x the direct human casualties of 9/11 not to mention the devastation. A Colombian volcano in 1985 killed 20K more people than 9/11. So be honest it wasn't the loss of life b/c no one is talking about a moment of silence for 10/28/98 (Hurricane Mitch) or whatever the date was in '85. This moment of silence is b/c these were mainly American lives lost. The same BS when a news report comes on about some accident or natural disaster . . . they can scarcely catch their breath as they recount how many American lives were lost. What you call stoic is me keeping it real. Innocent people die every day for a myriad of causes . . . hence 9/11 is just another bad day for humanity . . . with the one caveat that we are doing it to ourselves.

No, I meant perspective. If I meant perception I would have said it.

Perspective:


A view or vista.
A mental view or outlook: ?It is useful occasionally to look at the past to gain a perspective on the present? (Fabian Linden).
The appearance of objects in depth as perceived by normal binocular vision.

The relationship of aspects of a subject to each other and to a whole: a perspective of history; a need to view the problem in the proper perspective.
Subjective evaluation of relative significance; a point of view: the perspective of the displaced homemaker.
The ability to perceive things in their actual interrelations or comparative importance: tried to keep my perspective throughout the crisis.
The technique of representing three-dimensional objects and depth relationships on a two-dimensional surface.

At any rate yes I remember Mitch very well because I cleaned out my parent's pantry and took tons of goods to school. We ended up raising a sh!tload of food, supplies, and other goods to go to Honduras after the flooding and damage that Mitch caused. I remember it very well because it was my first year in high school and because I am a weather nut. I still have printed satellite photos from Andrew, Mitch, Luis, and other storms that have happened in the past 10 or so years.

You aren't telling me anything I don't already know. What I am saying is that I am SURE that Mitch means a lot more to Hondurans that 9-11 and I am sure that 9-11 means a lot more to Americans than Mitch.

Every country is the same regarding past tragedy. America isn't so special that its teeming masses start to grow a clue about how many tragedies are every day. Just because you are informed about things doesn't mean the average Joe is.

 

[Insane3D]

Originally posted by: Millennium

Originally posted by: Insane3D
See Millenium. See Millenium freak out at *gasp* a differing point of view. See Millenium hurl personal attacks and insults like they are going out of style.

I'll remember to crank some tunes extra loud at that moment just for you Mill...

🙂

What in the hell are you talking about? I haven't said anything yet that could be considered a personal attack. Maybe you just have really thin skin Insane...

Hmmmm....no?

You can't name a single one so shut your pie hole.

I find your comments extremely disturbing and you yourself need serious mental help.

The only rhetoric coming out in this thread is the steaming pile of feces and trash coming out of your mouth.

That is quite shocking to hear that crap come out of your mouth.

Like I said...those that disagree with you are always responded to in the same manner...it's not like this is a new thing with you. Does using phrases like "steaming pile of feces and trash coming out of your mouth" help the discussion to remain civil? Does it add value to the thread? Can you argue your point without such descriptors?


My favorite is this, while not a personal attack, it's exactly how you react to differing opinions..most of the time.

If you think differently then how about saying that instead of jumping off the deep end and proselytizing about the great evil of anyone that disagrees with you.

But hey...whatever floats your boat Mill.

🙂


Edit:

I say "most of the time" because ocassionally you have civil discussion with people of differing opinions. Case in point, that thread on the Judge Moore and the 10 commandments happenings..

🙂

 

[xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx]

Originally posted by: konichiwa


Five times as many died, and this is a comment on it? But I can't vomit at Bush demanding mourning?


I see I start a thread yesterday and I come in this morning to the same childish bullchit; very nice. Oh, and who is "demanding" anything? I thought 'asking' and 'demanding' were two different things. I am sure the he/she who likes to post this nonsense is no more than 20 years old...probably in his/her second year of college...already have the entire world figured out. Bravo, Kuntichiwa! Why not go to NY this morning and "vomit" on the site of 9/11?

 

[phillyTIM]

*YAWN* the only thing i think about when i'm forced into silence for 9/11 is how much george w. bush S##T on this country and caused the deaths of those in the world trade center.

its obviously a political gain ploy, just like he'll try to do next 9/11/04 when he uses the deaths of thousands to kickoff his bid for reelection. who didn't see this joke coming?

 

[konichiwa]

Originally posted by: NesuD

Originally posted by: konichiwa
How about Here?

"Looks the French are all to quick to surrender to the heat as well. What a great civilized country, I see it takes great care of its elderly."

Five times as many died, and this is a comment on it? But I can't vomit at Bush demanding mourning?

Of course, they are the French, so I guess that makes it okay, right? *roll*

President Bush has asked all Americans to observe a moment of silence tomorrow at 8:46 a.m...

Your mischaracterizing it. asked and demanding have to very differrent meanings. You characterizing this as a demand or an order is patently a partison attempt to critisize him unfairly for it. You are entitled to not like the man but lets stick to the truth here ok?

"demand"

To ask for urgently or peremptorily
To claim as just or due
To require as useful, just, proper or necessary

It's called a synonym...

 

[konichiwa]

Originally posted by: Millennium

Life must be grand being so full of hatred and bullsh!t. Glad that you call me Xenophobic and all. That is a hoot considering we were talking AMERICAN tragedies and you started your verbal diarrhea up on something that was unrelated to the thread. Sure you don't just hate this country and its people?

More and more rhetoric. Who said American tragedies? Not me.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure I don't hate this country and and its people. I happen to live in it and be one of them. Seems that around here the last vestige of the mal-interlocutor is to simply suggest that his adversary is a "Bush hater" or an "anti-American."

I'm sad to see that your post has degenerated this thread to that, but what could I expect. I tried to be civil anyway.

Who said American tragedies? Look at what the thread is about dude. 9/11.... That was an AMERICAN tragedy. Yes other people died that day, but the discussion in this tread was ABOUT 9/11 and our President asking for a moment of tragedy. Maybe you can't read; maybe you are so jaded that you refuse to see it, but there is no way you can imply this thread was about an American tragedy.[/quote]

Since when is this becoming an argument around here? I seem to see people resorting to this more and more often when their logical arguments just don't pan out as they would like them to. The point of a forum is to have DISCUSSION on a topic. My posts are discussing this topic. This thread was not, as you claim, about american deaths, but it was about the president asking for mourning for a particular american tragedy. I can't expand that to other tragedies? Seems pretty on topic to me. Save your quasi-moderation for someone else.

I never said you were an anti-American or a Bush hater. You just labeled yourself with those names. All I said was that it seems you hate this country and its people.

Ah, my mistake. After all, "hating this country and its people" is quite different from being "anti-American," after all. Come on, milli, you're splitting hairs. Give me a break. Not to mention I spoke this not only referring to you but also whomever it was who mentioned "the president whom I hate" as their initial response to my post.

I have never seen you post a positive comment about ANYTHING in the past 3 years on this board, so the evidence I have at hand suggests that.

More rhetoric, rhetoric, rhetoric. I love how your inflammatory rhetoric turns into pseudo-intellectual rhetoric after you realize hurling insults isn't going to make me shrink away like others who, apparently, have some inkling of admiration for your opinion.

If you think differently then how about saying that instead of jumping off the deep end and proselytizing about the great evil of anyone that disagrees with you.

Again, it seems like you're characterizing yourself. You're the only one throwing insults around in here about mental health, feces, diarrhea and pie holes. You're preaching to the choir again...

The only rhetoric coming out in this thread is the steaming pile of feces and trash coming out of your mouth.

Oh, don't forget "trash" as one of those.