Mixing running and weight training

[JoeFahey]

My main goal is to lose weight/fat. I started roughly following Bill Phillips Body-for-Life. I didn't want to lose any muscle from my diet, although, fat-loss usually leads to some to a degree.

The weekly plan that I try to follow is to do 20 minutes of cardio interval training on Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday, although I will try to do some some AM cardio on the other days when I can. The rest of the days are Upper-body weight training on Monday and Friday, and Lower-body on Wednesday.

I am starting to running right after a weight session due to the convenience of there being cardio equipment in the gym that I go to for weight training. What are my risks? Again, my plan doesn't necessarily have cardio on weight days, but I use my plan as a baseline, and I add more where I can.

All input is welcome, as long as it is from a reliable source.

Thanks!

 

[presidentender]

This thread was about the same thing. You'll be fine.

 

[JoeFahey]

Another question:
Does adding weight training help fat loss? I know I can't gain muscle while I am losing weight, but it does get my heart rate up some. Will it atleast keep my muscles toned?

 

[SociallyChallenged]

Originally posted by: JoeFahey
Another question:
Does adding weight training help fat loss? I know I can't gain muscle while I am losing weight, but it does get my heart rate up some. Will it atleast keep my muscles toned?

Lifting helps boost your metabolism and burns calories so in that respect, it does help. However, "tone" is a relative term. It essentially means you have a low body fat %. Therefore, if you are controlling your calories and such, then yes it will help you.

 

[StageLeft]

Don't worry about it--no problem, yes weight training does help, and yes you can gain muscle while losing fat.

 

[JoeFahey]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Don't worry about it--no problem, yes weight training does help, and yes you can gain muscle while losing fat.

But how can you if you are intaking fewer calories than you burn?

 

[presidentender]

Originally posted by: JoeFahey

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Don't worry about it--no problem, yes weight training does help, and yes you can gain muscle while losing fat.

But how can you if you are intaking fewer calories than you burn?

Try a thought experiment. Imagine a very obese astronaut who hasn't been doing his calisthenics and so has lost much of his muscle mass. He returns to earth so weak that he can barely move (for the sake of argument, pretend this doesn't kill him). Does he gain muscle, just by virtue of moving around? Of course. Does he, similarly, lose fat? Yes.

The thing is, to lose fat requires a caloric deficit. That's established. To gain muscle requires energy, as well as protein and other micronutrients. Fat is a reserve fuel source. Your body can burn it for energy. The problem is that muscle can also be burned for energy; that's why it's common to lose muscle while dieting. The other problem is that when you're in a catabolic (fat-burning) state, adding muscle isn't a priority. Not starving to death, though, that's a priority.

You'll have much better luck with fat loss if that's all you're trying to do. You'll have much better luck with muscle gain if that's all you're trying to do. But God did not issue an eleventh commandment stating "Fat shalt be burned for energy, but that energy may never be used for the building of muscle; lo, also shalt muscle require energy to be builded, but that energy may never come from fat."

Edit: Source

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: presidentender

Originally posted by: JoeFahey

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Don't worry about it--no problem, yes weight training does help, and yes you can gain muscle while losing fat.

But how can you if you are intaking fewer calories than you burn?

Try a thought experiment. Imagine a very obese astronaut who hasn't been doing his calisthenics and so has lost much of his muscle mass. He returns to earth so weak that he can barely move (for the sake of argument, pretend this doesn't kill him). Does he gain muscle, just by virtue of moving around? Of course. Does he, similarly, lose fat? Yes.

The thing is, to lose fat requires a caloric deficit. That's established. To gain muscle requires energy, as well as protein and other micronutrients. Fat is a reserve fuel source. Your body can burn it for energy. The problem is that muscle can also be burned for energy; that's why it's common to lose muscle while dieting.

You'll have much better luck with fat loss if that's all you're trying to do. You'll have much better luck with muscle gain if that's all you're trying to do. But God did not issue an eleventh commandment stating "Fat shalt be burned for energy, but that energy may never be used for the building of muscle; lo, also shalt muscle require energy to be builded, but that energy may never come from fat."

Exactly, and even though fat cannot turn directly to protein, if the fat is used for energy, it can spare energy that otherwise may be used and that in this case instead will go into muscle.

Like your astronaut, take a complete couch potato and put him on a very mild calorie deficit but hit the weights hard. He will, of course, gain muscle. I have gained muscle while losing fat, friends of mine have, millions of people have. Most potatoes who start exercising will find fat loss and muscle gain and it's not "only that newbies" can do it, either.

We know that an established bodybuilder can, from one year to the next, be not only leaner but more muscular, so how short a time frame could that be? Could he do it from month to month? day to day? Hour to hour? Doesn't it seem possible that I could be on a calorie deficit of 400 calories for half the day, losing mostly fat and only a tiny bit of muscle, and then the rest of the day a 200 calorie surplus, putting on much less fat but more muscle than I lost, so that at the end of the day I've had a net loss of 200 calories and a gain of muscle?

We could argue the point in various ways, but at the end of the day losing fat and gaining muscle can occur at the same time even though the optimal situation for them is massive calorie deficit and massive calorie surplus, respectively.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Originally posted by: presidentender

Originally posted by: JoeFahey

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Don't worry about it--no problem, yes weight training does help, and yes you can gain muscle while losing fat.

But how can you if you are intaking fewer calories than you burn?

Try a thought experiment. Imagine a very obese astronaut who hasn't been doing his calisthenics and so has lost much of his muscle mass. He returns to earth so weak that he can barely move (for the sake of argument, pretend this doesn't kill him). Does he gain muscle, just by virtue of moving around? Of course. Does he, similarly, lose fat? Yes.

The thing is, to lose fat requires a caloric deficit. That's established. To gain muscle requires energy, as well as protein and other micronutrients. Fat is a reserve fuel source. Your body can burn it for energy. The problem is that muscle can also be burned for energy; that's why it's common to lose muscle while dieting.

You'll have much better luck with fat loss if that's all you're trying to do. You'll have much better luck with muscle gain if that's all you're trying to do. But God did not issue an eleventh commandment stating "Fat shalt be burned for energy, but that energy may never be used for the building of muscle; lo, also shalt muscle require energy to be builded, but that energy may never come from fat."

Exactly, and even though fat cannot turn directly to protein, if the fat is used for energy, it can spare energy that otherwise may be used and that in this case instead will go into muscle.

Like your astronaut, take a complete couch potato and put him on a very mild calorie deficit but hit the weights hard. He will, of course, gain muscle. I have gained muscle while losing fat, friends of mine have, millions of people have. Most potatoes who start exercising will find fat loss and muscle gain and it's not "only that newbies" can do it, either.

We know that an established bodybuilder can, from one year to the next, be not only leaner but more muscular, so how short a time frame could that be? Could he do it from month to month? day to day? Hour to hour? Doesn't it seem possible that I could be on a calorie deficit of 400 calories for half the day, losing mostly fat and only a tiny bit of muscle, and then the rest of the day a 200 calorie surplus, putting on much less fat but more muscle than I lost, so that at the end of the day I've had a net loss of 200 calories and a gain of muscle?

We could argue the point in various ways, but at the end of the day losing fat and gaining muscle can occur at the same time even though the optimal situation for them is massive calorie deficit and massive calorie surplus, respectively.

That's kind of an odd situation that doesn't exactly translate well. You can gain very small amounts of muscle while losing fat, but you cannot gain as much muscle as when compared to bulking. If you do a very slow, clean bulk, then you will increase your lean muscle mass. If you do that, you weight goes up and technically, your body fat % goes down. You're not losing fat, but your BF% decreases. That's the best way to increase your mass and look leaner. You really should worry about one or the other because losing fat and gaining muscle at the same time is problematic for most.

 

[presidentender]

Originally posted by: SociallyChallenged

That's kind of an odd situation that doesn't exactly translate well. You can gain very small amounts of muscle while losing fat, but you cannot gain as much muscle as when compared to bulking. If you do a very slow, clean bulk, then you will increase your lean muscle mass. If you do that, you weight goes up and technically, your body fat % goes down. You're not losing fat, but your BF% decreases. That's the best way to increase your mass and look leaner. You really should worry about one or the other because losing fat and gaining muscle at the same time is problematic for most.

Yeah, I wish Skoorb had gotten in half a minute later than he did. The article I linked in the edit does a pretty good job of explaining what's going on, and why it's so difficult to do both at the same time, especially for more experienced athletes.

 

[StageLeft]

Well, although one can do both at the same time, the optimal is not to, and the great thign is most of us eat too much anyway, so we call that "bulking". It's really just slacking off, then we look in the mirror one day and realize "damn", and so we cut

 

[dbk]

I think it's gonna depend more on the diet.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

Originally posted by: dbk
I think it's gonna depend more on the diet.

Not quite. No matter what "diet" you have or how you control it, you can't gain muscle mass and lose fat mass at the same time. That's how your body works.

 

[presidentender]

Originally posted by: SociallyChallenged

Originally posted by: dbk
I think it's gonna depend more on the diet.

Not quite. No matter what "diet" you have or how you control it, you can't gain muscle mass and lose fat mass at the same time. That's how your body works.

However, overweight beginners on an exercise and nutrition program that's geared towards fat loss can gain a significant amount of muscle mass while losing fat. A good example of this comes from research published in the journal Medicine and Science in Sports and Exercise [2]. For the study, researchers from the United States Sports Academy tracked a group of previously sedentary men (i.e. overweight beginners) who performed both endurance and resistance exercise three days per week for 14 weeks.

You can lose fat and gain muscle simultaneously. But, unless you're a) an overweight beginner b) returning to exercise after a layoff c) very genetically gifted or b) using drugs, you can't expect to do both to a significant degree at the same time. It's far more realistic to expect to lose 10 pounds of fat while gaining a pound or two of muscle, or to gain five pounds of muscle while adding a couple of pounds of fat. Losing 10 pounds of fat at the same time as replacing it with 10 pounds of muscle is the exception and not the rule.

Source

 

[SociallyChallenged]

Originally posted by: presidentender

Originally posted by: SociallyChallenged

Originally posted by: dbk
I think it's gonna depend more on the diet.

Not quite. No matter what "diet" you have or how you control it, you can't gain muscle mass and lose fat mass at the same time. That's how your body works.

However, overweight beginners on an exercise and nutrition program that's geared towards fat loss can gain a significant amount of muscle mass while losing fat. A good example of this comes from research published in the journal Medicine and Science in Sports and Exercise [2]. For the study, researchers from the United States Sports Academy tracked a group of previously sedentary men (i.e. overweight beginners) who performed both endurance and resistance exercise three days per week for 14 weeks.

You can lose fat and gain muscle simultaneously. But, unless you're a) an overweight beginner b) returning to exercise after a layoff c) very genetically gifted or b) using drugs, you can't expect to do both to a significant degree at the same time. It's far more realistic to expect to lose 10 pounds of fat while gaining a pound or two of muscle, or to gain five pounds of muscle while adding a couple of pounds of fat. Losing 10 pounds of fat at the same time as replacing it with 10 pounds of muscle is the exception and not the rule.

Source

Pardon me, I forgot to add "significant" muscle mass. I know it is possible in beginners who have a fair amount of fat to lose, but it doesn't work in those who are cutting, for example, from 11% to 7% for better abs.