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Mini-teams: pro AND con?

petrusbroder

petrusbroder

Elite Member
Dear TeAm Mates,

Edit October 6: The title of this thread has been changed because the old title (How do we want it?) implicated a policy making thread, which never was intended. Parts of the previous subtitle (Mini-teams: pro or con?) also suggested a more aggressive tone of this thread, which again was not my intention.


some weeks ago we had a ethics thread in this forum about quite a few questions and - if I may say so - it was a sucess: more than 800 views and over 200 posts.

Now an other question has come up. It is not a new one: mini-teams. What speaks for them? Are they unfair? How important id fairness, how exact should this fairness be, do mini-teams skew the fairness? Do mini-teams contribute to team-spirit, fun, mini-races or do they promote dissent?

We have quite a few of these: TaBoo, TAS, Rebel Alliance, Team Enterprise and some others.

I have - before starting the previous ethics thread - communicated with the mods and 16 of the most frequent of posters here in this forum about a thread, where such sensitive issues could be discussed in a dispassionate way. Most of those whom I asked thought the idea was good. Almost all warned me that it would be hard to keep a polite and respectful tone in this thread, because - of course - it is so easy to offend ones sensibility.

I am aware of that the mini-team idea is a very sensitive issue and therefore I respectfully ask the posters to carefully read their posts, to be aware of the "ground rules" posted below.
I also ask the readers to have an friendly attitude, to put aside old frustrations (isn't it more fun to get new ones?) and to remember: we are one great team achieving very good results. Lets try to keep it that way.

1. Please read carefully and with an open mind. Not all contributors have english as their native language and we often do not know all the subtle meanings of all words, and may so write a word which may be misunderstood. Please take that into consideration and give us the benefit of the doubt.

2. Please post using a non-offensive language. That means: no four letter words, no sexual, racial, religous or otherwise offensive slurs. If you really want to make sombody know your personal opinion, please use PM.

3. If your feelings run hot (and I think they will some time or other) please allow your self to cool down.

4. Please love your enemies, because that will drive them crazy.

5. Only write about projects and issues and not about people. That alone may make a difference on how a post is understood.

6. If someone states something as a fact, he/she should be able to offer some proof or support. That will certainly make more impact and increase our collective understanding of the issue.

7. Assumtions, opinions and guesses should be clearly stated as such.

8. Jokes are good. They certainly make the posting more fun, and that is very important. However, would it be possible to keep this thread somewhat free from serious neffing? We have a very nice thread for that!

Since I kind of feel responsible for theis thread I will try to keep an eye on it although I am not a mod.
 
I really don't see the big deal with mini-teams. I've been on them, I've been by myself.

We are ALL part of the same team. And if someone is upset about a mini-team passing them, what about someone who has a home and work fleet. And what about a person who has a few friends crunching under his name. That's technically a mini-team as well. What about a person who has lots of spare $$ to build massive crack racks. Either way, you're probably going to get passed by someone.

If we ban mini-teams, would we need to ban work fleets, or set a quota for how many PCs you have, bar anyone else from using your id to crunch? How would and how could you monitor that?

I don't think so. I can only do as much as I can do, and I pass some people, and people (and mini-teams) pass me. Sure, it would be great if I could be in the top 10 of Team Anandtech SETI Classic, but that's not going to happen, and it's ok.

All of the work processed benefits the TeAm, and more importantly, benefits the project, which is the ultimate higher goal.

Be mature, see the bigger picture, and deal with it.

As long as the assimilations by a person, mini-team, or TeAm are legitimate, then I say go for it! 😀
 
Yes, I see absolutely no problem with mini-teams, I've just joined TAS for their October project and it's added a little bit of excitement back into DC for me!

The positives far outweigh the negatives - more crunching gets done, because we are motivated to add boxes or start overclocking, either to boost the mini-team's stats, or to keep up with one that's gaining on us!

As a result, TeAm Anandtech goes up in the standings in many different projects and is therefore given due consideration by new DCers looking for a team to join. I speak from experience because our diversity in many different projects is the primary reason I joined the TeAm - when I started on F@H last year, I was very tempted to join the Horde (HardOCP) because they are always 1st or 2nd in the standings, but they hardly do anything else outside of folding which would get very boring after a while!

It never even entered my mind to get dismayed by a mini-team gaining on someone and causing sore feelings - DC is a competition where if you want to "thump the opposition" all you have to do is spend more money (boxes, electricity) and time (tweaking boxes) to be successful. Since I will never have infinite amounts of either I have to get my DC kicks in other ways - like earlier this week my X2 box was ranked as high as 9th in the world in average credit among all boxes worldwide running Rosetta@Home. (It's slipped to 11th now, out of nearly 3,000 hosts worldwide 😀 )
 
First, I agree with RaySun2Be on the work fleet and home fleets. I personally have machines at work, which could put me at an advantage compared to others who have only personal machines. Where would I fit in on this?
___________

On the team issue, are we talking about mini-teams like TAS, in which a group of members switch projects together but still crunch under their own names? Or something like the RA, which is multiple people under the same name?

Either way, I personally do not have a problem. I can say that in my own case, I like crunching under my own name because I know what is mine and how much credit I have gotten. But just as I am personally in TAS, I would also have no issue doing something like RA.

I do not think it should be a problem, arent we all still crunching for the same team? And there will always be someone who has the potential to crunch more than you. That should not be a problem, and is only good for the Team. Our team is great not only because of the heavy hitters, but the small crunchers too. All are equally welcome in my book. Even welcome when banded together.

And lastly, mini-teams can create more spirit and fun (not to mention little competition races) for those involved. And that is what a team should be about.
 
Each mini-team has its own story. This is how ?TeAm Enterprise? came to be.

Many years ago I got conned 😛 into joining the TeAm by WIZ and ASSIMILATOR1. WIZ, as is his usual nature, was quick to help a newbie get his 1st home-built computer to run properly. When I express my appreciation for the help, ASSIMILATOR1, as is his usual nature, quickly asked me to join TeAm AnandTech and took credit. 😛 😀

In those days I was known as SMOKEBALL.

I quickly built two more computers for my adult children. It seemed only fitting that I included those computers into my account. Next I built computers for my grand-children that were old enough. Those also became part of the SMOKEBALL account.

Then I asked a couple of my close friends, who I had started helping with their computers, if they would mind running this screen-saver and help me find ET. 🙂

Then I recruited my cousins, uncles, aunts, brothers, and other close friends. Next, I got almost all of the guys who belonged to my gun club to also crunch along. It was then I made the 1st name change. It didn?t seem right to call the account only SMOKEBALL so I changed it to TEAM SMOKEBALL.

I was now completely engrossed in building not only my own mini-team but in helping TeAm AnandTech hold off the dastardly BBR guys who proclaimed they would STOMP us.

I then started offering to all of my mini-team mates, and to any new ones that joined, the proposition that I would provide ?light? technical assistance as a quid pro quo for running SETI on their computers. Before long I had organized the largest group of individuals operating as a mini-team for TeAm AnandTech.

One detail that I felt put TEAM SMOKEBALL apart from the other mini-teams of the time was the fact that all of the members of my mini-team would not have been running any distributed computing client if it wasn?t for my efforts in recruiting them. We were not the most powerful mini-team but we were the mini-team with the most individuals. That?s when I came up with the expression, ?Little folks working together.?

About a year or so ago I was able to wrangle the nickname, SMOKE, to be used on the AT Forums. This is my real-life nickname so it really meant a lot to me to obtain it. Then the name changes started in a flurry. ?Team Smoke? ? ?Team Smoke ? TeAm AnandTech? ?..?The TeAm? ?.. and others. Lol

Then one day I got a message from CRAZEE that a bunch of caseless computers he had built strictly to run SETI needed a new home. I agreed to house the ?crack rack? and thus became the allegiance of CRAZEE and SMOKE. A few more name changes ( I see CRAZEE is still calling the mini-team by its previous name, ?The Enterprise? - lol) and I finally settled on ?TeAm Enterprise?. I feel I have established the mini-team so it can carry forward even after I?m gone (which recently was a little closer than I thought). 😉

So that?s how TeAm Enterprise came into being what it is today.

Other mini-teams have similar stories and still others have stories completely different. My TeAm hero of the mini-teams was and still is JWMiddleton. He has either bought or built every one of the computers on his mini-team. It was almost ironic that he and Dave hooked up in a very similar fashion for very similar reasons as Crazee and I.

Other mini-teams have been made up of existing members of TeAm AnandTech. I think each person should have the independence to choose how he wants to participate. That said, I have worried on many different occasions about how some individual crunchers might feel when ranked against a whole groups of individuals. I have racked my brains over the years trying to come up with some sort of way to categorize the various participants (accounts). Not all of our big producers are mini-teams, you know. Some of our strongest producers have awesome computer power at their disposal due to their work environment.

I have envisioned categorizing the stats by the number of CPUs represented. Seems like a reasonable idea but how to script stats in that fashion is way beyond my skill level. It would be a very burdensome thing to manage, that?s for sure.

The only idea I have ever had to distinguish mini-teams from individuals is to make it plain that a mini-team is a mini-team by incorporating in their name the word Team and in our case, more appropriately ?. TeAm. 🙂

But then again, I wouldn?t want to pressure anyone to name their account any certain way. We are all FREE SPIRITS and we will continue to be so no matter what.

Mini-teams and big power house accounts may turn off some individuals but for TeAm AnandTech to compete at the top levels of the Distributed Computing World we absolutely need them. That said, we also need the small individual contributors. Any of you remember my reports bragging on how it is the small guys that really provide the foundation of all our accomplishments? Maybe, I need to work that old report up again. 😉
 
I'd be happy to have my own mini-team. If my new developments don't pan out, it's the only way I'll catch borgie. 😛

BTW, pro mini-team here. It's not about the individual, it's about the team. The whole. The collective (if you will).
 
Before Smoke and I hooked up to make TeAm Enterprise from the Crazee account and the TeAm Smoke account, I only ran Seti on systems that I built myself. I got to a respectable level of production (I think I peaked around number 5 or 6 in daily production). I had turned this little hobby of ours into a rather expensive hobby (I think Networkman and JWM can identify with this 😉 ) I had between 4-6 machines at my house running (I wasn't married at the time and have no kids) and I put together a 13-14 node crack rack at work. This was all done at my expense.

At that time I welcomed the challenge of going up against a mini-team. I thought it provided people who didn't have the resources or insanity that I possessed to compete with the likes of me. As Smoke pointed out above, things changed at my former work and I had to move the rack. At first Wirelessenabled (A great TeAmmate) housed the rack for me. I felt obligated to him and offered to contribute my WU total (at that time about 70K) to his account as payment for keeping the rack going. My main concern was to keep the rack running for the team. At that time we were still too close to BBR to let up (when have we not been too close to let up). Wirelessenabled declined the offer because he didn't want to alter the identity of the mini-team he had built to crunch under his account. When he could no longer host the rack I once again reached out. Smoke and I had become good friends talking behind the scenes and found that we shared many of the same concerns and interests as it related to the TeAm. At that point we decided that if he would host the rack we would merge. It wasn't done so much to become a power in DC but a union of two friends with common interests.

I have to say that I would be very reluctant to crunch a project where mini-teams were not allowed. In fact I am not sure I would crunch on a project that did not. I have a work fleet of 5,000 workstations that I hope to have back online crunching projects. As Ray pointed out how fair is it that I have that and others do not simply because I am a systems administrator at a college? To me the order of reasons for running a project were always this:

1) Furthering the goals of the project
2) Furthering the reputation and standing of the TeAm
3) Furthering the statistics for our mini-team.




 
Personally, I don't care. If you want to be on a mini-team or have a mini-team by all means go for it, but I will always crunch F@H for myself under my own name.
I currently only have systems that I personally own crunching for myself.
 
I've always been amazed when a post would spring up here or there condemning mini-teams.

I remember laughing with a friend after reading a post from a person who complained he/she only had so many computers in the lab and didn't think it was fair.

Well I have NO lab and still think mini-teams only enhance the DC world.

I see absolutely no difference between scrounging resources from a lab or scrounging resources from individuals.

Frankly it sounds a bit like "sour grapes" when I hear those complaints.

I would quit DC immediately if I got wind of censorship occuring or efforts to exclude any individual or mini-team because they had more computing power at their disposal than some other "individual" who thought the whole deal should be rigged to let them "win".

More power to ya mini-teams........ You help these projects grow!

Respectfully,

-Sid
 
Everyone knows who the "mini-teams" are and who the individuals are. At the end of the day, we are all crunching for two reasons:

1) The TeAm.
2) The project.

Note: the above are not necessarily in order of importance.

Frankly, I think it's awesome that we have mini teams out there like Team Enterprise and others that are churning out HUGE numbers for the TeAm.

I also think it's pretty cool that we have individuals (*cough* such as myself *cough*) who have taken every possible opportunity to have as many PC's under their control as possible crunch for the TeAm.

Both are great achievements, and both contribute significantly to the larger goal(s) of boosting the TeAm and helping out the project. I can't see anything wrong with either from my point of view.

As an individual, I know I can never "compete" one-on-one with a team like Team Enterprise, but I sure am glad that they're on my side at the end of the day. Each morning when I check the board and see HB's stats showing us kicking BBR's rear (though it did tighten for a while a couple months ago), I'm proud of the larger TeAm I chose to join. When I'm loading Greg's stats, and waiting for my stats to load, I see some of the top teams churning out hundreds of WU's daily for the TeAm and am glad they chose as I did.

The stats point out another thing. If it weren't for the "mini teams", we'd have no shot at holding off BBR, or gaining on other teams (though given Seti's status, that's pretty much a moot point). Also, if it weren't for the little guys churning out 5, 10, 20, or 40 WU's a day, the efforts of the mini-teams wouldn't be enough on their own.

OK, so I'm long winded here. Bottom line is it takes every single person, whether part of a "mini-team" or crunching individually to make the larger TeAm go. I've only been crunching for the TeAm since Feburary, but even in that short time I know that no one is going to discount what I do and say "yeah, but Team XYZ contibuted 500 WU's, and you only had 38." When I recently made my modest 5K WU milestone, kind words flowed in from individuals and (mini) team members alike. That, to me, is the bottom line. Every one of us supporting each other, regardless of how modest our contributions are. We're helping Team AnandTech, and helping some very worthy projects. At the end of the day, how can that be a bad thing?
 
Well, this is a surprise to me: so many pro-mini-teams. Then there is a neutral who doesn't mind mini-teams but runs successfully under his own name.
But, where are the cons-mini-teams? We must keep open minds and forums, because this is not supposed to be a hunt for opponents, but a way to understand each other so that neither aggressive arguments and flamewars nor hidden bad feelings develop.
I have - indirectly from hints in the posts and past PMs - understood, that this is a hidden bone of contention. Is my feeling wrong or right? Should we let this hidden bone of contention remain dug down in the ground? I myself am convinced, that we as TeAm mates can talk about this openly and get an even better TeAm-spirit.
What say you?
BTW, Smoke and Crazee, thanks for the story of TeAm Enterprise, that is a great read! Now a relative newbee such as myself have that story too!
 
Originally posted by: petrusbroder
Well, this is a surprise to me: so many pro-mini-teams. Then there is a neutral who doesn't mind mini-teams but runs successfully under his own name.
But, where are the cons-mini-teams? We must keep open minds and forums, because this is not supposed to be a hunt for opponents, but a way to understand each other so that neither aggressive arguments and flamewars nor hidden bad feelings develop.
I have - indirectly from hints in the posts and past PMs - understood, that this is a hidden bone of contention. Is my feeling wrong or right? Should we let this hidden bone of contention remain dug down in the ground? I myself am convinced, that we as TeAm mates can talk about this openly and get an even better TeAm-spirit.
What say you?
BTW, Smoke and Crazee, thanks for the story of TeAm Enterprise, that is a great read! Now a relative newbee such as myself have that story too!
Click to expand...


If we explore the influences that have prevented you from posting your opinion about the mini-team question and break down that barrier, maybe we can remove all the barriers that are inhibiting others from expressing their opinions.

😛
 
I fully support mini teams :-

Originally posted by: RaySun2Be
I really don't see the big deal with mini-teams. I've been on them, I've been by myself.

We are ALL part of the same team. And if someone is upset about a mini-team passing them, what about someone who has a home and work fleet. And what about a person who has a few friends crunching under his name. That's technically a mini-team as well. What about a person who has lots of spare $$ to build massive crack racks. Either way, you're probably going to get passed by someone.

If we ban mini-teams, would we need to ban work fleets, or set a quota for how many PCs you have, bar anyone else from using your id to crunch? How would and how could you monitor that?

I don't think so. I can only do as much as I can do, and I pass some people, and people (and mini-teams) pass me. Sure, it would be great if I could be in the top 10 of Team Anandtech SETI Classic, but that's not going to happen, and it's ok.

All of the work processed benefits the TeAm, and more importantly, benefits the project, which is the ultimate higher goal.

Be mature, see the bigger picture, and deal with it.

As long as the assimilations by a person, mini-team, or TeAm are legitimate, then I say go for it! 😀
Click to expand...


Perfectly said Ray! ,I can't add any more to that ,though I will repeat a part

Be mature, see the bigger picture, and deal with it.

Directed at those who harrass & complain to mini teams & their members!

Inccidently my own account constists of a range of location of PCs.
2 of them are my own ,3 from work ,& the rest are a mixture of family & friends crunching for me.Though it is a kind of mini team they wouldn't be crunching if it wasn't for my efforts so hence no 'team' in my name 😉.If they deciede they don't want to crunch for me then I encourage them to create their own account (& join TA of course😀) ,which is exactly what my little brother did some years ago.

For those interested ,Team TaBoo started when over 2yrs ago (when we thought S@H1 was going end soon!:roll: lol) I noticed that Mgallik was 1-2k away from hitting the 10k milestone,at the time I thought he had no chance of hitting 10k before the end by himself(how wrong was I?😛).Seeing that he'd been a longterm & loyal cruncher to TA I thought I'd offer him a boost to 10k ,he accepted & some months after hitting 10k he decieded to return the favour to other loyal members ,& the rest of the (long) story is still here 😉

Btw anyone had contact with Mgallik? TaBoos 'President' has been MIA for a longtime now🙁

Smoke
No fair! 😉 ,I believe I always said it was a 50/50 thing between me & Wiz reeling you in 😀
And yea I remember the 'small guys report' ,quite interesting🙂

Btw I thought their would be quite a bit of support for mini teams 🙂
 
Peter, I don't think there was ever a lot of "cons-mini-teams" attitude out there.

Maybe a newer person that doesn't understand about the DC/team dynamic could be "cons" for a while. But as other posts say, how can and why would you want a team of just individuals with one computer running.

Yes we need to be sensitive to and understanding of everyone, but they need to reciprocate: Everyone be considerate of everyone.

Doh! I am trying to rewrite the Golden Rule 😕 :roll:

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

🙂
 
Peter, I don't think there was ever a lot of "cons-mini-teams" attitude out there.

I agree ,but I think it is worth having this thread showing the support there is for mini teams 🙂 (more supporters post please 😉)
 
just feel the need to add my $0.02 in support of mini teams.

I crunched under my own name for a short time doing seti, then D2OL, and then FAD. I only have two boxes at my disposal (well a few family members off and on) and slowly climbed the stats due to my longevity.

With FAD, I found that it was more enjoyable to me to join the RA so that we could give the top member of our FAD team a "run for his money", and have a little competition at the top, which would encourage both side and some new blood to add more boxes,and I think this happened.

I like the concept of mini teams, mainly I like it because it is great advertisement for the TeAm as a whole to have some names at the top of the list in the various stats.

Oh yeah, and we are by far not the only team to use mini teams...the Dutch Power Cows very effectively use mini teams all the time, especially during their stampedes.

Ok...enough support for mini teams, I agre with Petrus that it will be valuable to hear from some those opposed to mini-teams

Slatz
 
I was quite surprised when i heard that the RA left a project because they got some grief over being a mini-team. Maybe i missed something before but i don't ever recall anyone on the TeAm being mad over mini-teams... OK, one time but i didn't know till well after they left the TeAm.

I suppose, technically, i'm a mini-team now. My parents run SETI under my account.
In the past i've had work computers & friends running under my account.

I have in the past run projects under a mini-team & will probably do it again after SETI is overwith.

I just have a hard time seeing any problem with them or why anyone would 😕
 
Well, it seems that there is a lot of sentiment pro mini-teams.

Just to give some background:
When I lived in the US (for almost 5 years, during Presidents Reagan's and Carter's administartions) I experienced a lot of personal competitivness: people would "fight" for almost everything. OK, I worked at a highly competitive place: the National Institutes of Health (NIH). There sometimes I had to fight for 2 minutes time in the restroom ( 🙂 is a joke 😀 ) and (verbally) for a 1 hour run on the ultra-high-speed-centrifuge (no joke).

Then I have read about RA being forced out because they were a mini-team, and I heard/read quite some comments about mini teams: how unjust they were, how impossible it was for small crunchers to climb higher in the lists, and that the mini teams kind of destroyed the competions. I also read here and there posts about what min-teams were: work-fleets, bunch of people with single comps, so on. Then there was this issue with mondobyte's thoughts when he had the chance to assimilate hundreds of comps for his project.

I had a hard time understanding the probs with mini teams (if somebody wants to climb fast and cannot obtain crunching power by himself - why not band together with others like Smoke and Crazee did). When I started the previous ethic thread I got warnings from several (almost all) sources about flamewars and this mini team issue was one of the examples. Fortunately, nothing such happened in the previous thread ... 🙂

Now this seems to be a non-issue. Then all is well. Or have all the "con mini-teams" left because they felt less than welcome? Is that the case? Or did I misunderstand the whole issue - which seems quite possible to me :Q and in that case I apologize.
 
Originally posted by: petrusbroder
Or have all the "con mini-teams" left because they felt less than welcome?
Click to expand...

This TeAm goes to great lengths to make everyone feel welcome.

They have been very patient with me while I learn the ropes. It has taken a long time and I am still learning and you are still patiently teaching.

🙂
 
I am in support of mini-teams. Since I'm feeling a bit lazy, I'm just going to repost a post I made in the end of seti thread about miniteams:

I haven't been here long, but I will have to agree with Wolfsraider, RaySun2Be, and petrusbroder on the mini-team issue. I see nothing wrong with them. As long as everyone is crunching for the same team, it doesn't matter what name they are crunching under or if multiple people are using that same name or even what project they are currently working on, because they are still crunching for the same team: this team. If some people have more fun crunching together, and you don't like it, team up with others who don't like it and try and beat them.

In the end the point of crunching isn't for personal gain or fame or glory, its to help complete these projects as soon as possible so that the results can be spread to whatever field they apply to and we can help out humanity. It is finding the cure to cancer or aids, discovering a new drug to combat a deadly disease, or finding ET that really matters. And if people crunching together is going to make them have more fun and because of that put more CPU time into these projects, then let them!
Click to expand...

In responce to the people complaining that mini teams dont' let the small-time crunchers climb to the top:
I am a very small cruncher, with only one computer that is regularly on, and then for only about 8 hours a day. This obviously means I have low production. But I don't get mad at people who have higher production than me. They have higher production because they have more comptuer, and their having more computers is in no way "unfair". Thats because its not about who has the highest rank! Its about the results that come out of the crunching. Ray said it perfectly: Be mature, see the bigger picture, and deal with it.
 
Seeing as the anti mini teams people aren't posting I'll pick on one point you heard about Peter😉

and that the mini teams kind of destroyed the competions

That's rubbish ,it just means the competition between 'small' members is moved down the ranks ,but the competion is still there & the team gains overall output🙂.
As a 'small' member you (we) can't expect to stay high in the ranks of any team in any project unless it is unpopular!.Being shunted down the ranks is a good thing as it means bigger guns are joining the team 😀 (as mentioned before its for the team & the project not personal glory).
 
Good posts above from several of you.

I appreciate the credit you give Greg, you are a class act!!! :thumbsup:

Whether we crunch with one box part time or have thousands of machines at our disposal we are one TeAm working on many projects in many different ways.

I am reminded of this question - I have no desire to offend anyone with it's nature so if you are one who gets offended by anything "Christian" please stop reading now.

***************************

Many people worldwide know who Billy Graham is, but who knows the name of the person who led Billy Graham to Christ?

***************************

We all have our part to play, doing so with acceptance and humility is a key to true greatness. - IMHO 😉

BTW - I'm all for mini teams, especially those that are a part of TeAm AnandTech!!
 
Just to set the record straight:
I have never voiced any opinion against mini-teams - I mean I am one myself (considering I have a dozen comps crunching for me). OK, they are all purchased and built by me and are all sitting in my house. But it is a miniteam, if you want to.

But: as I mentioned before, there was - has been - some kind of frustration. Why else would for example monobyte ask about the team's reaction if he added some few 100 or so crunchers to his name? Why would some gentle and polite persons ask me to think over my idea about the previous ethics thread and refer to mini teams? So I thought: " I ljuset spricker trollen" which is a Swedish saying: "In the light all trolls burst", why not shed some light in this issue. And I wanted to know what this was all about. 😕

That has happened: this mini-team issue seems not to be a bone of contention anymore. Good. Now at least we can say that everybody has had his or her chance to post their opinions, arguments and let their voices be heard. That is good, isn't it? 🙂

And there is consensus: that the mini-teams are not a problem, but rather an asset for the TeAm, for the projects and for the crunchers.

The mini-teams compete in their part of the stats-tables, the others in their part. Also, most members have the chance to join - that is the mini- teams are open. I am quite sure, that I would be welcome if I asked RA or Team Enterprise or TAS or TaBoo (ooops, I am a member of those, hhm) and I felt welcome. 😀

Thanks, TeAm-mates, for letting me play in your - our - yard and enjoy the friendship and the team spirit of the best team in the known verbal universe! :heart:

Peter
 
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