Michael Cohen will testify to House Oversight Feb 7 about his work for Trump

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woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
16,242
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Here is the funny thing about Trump. Normally nobody would give a shit about his grades some may like the weird group that hounded Obama but it would be a small fraction of the people. Since he has made such grandiose claims about being really, really well educated and really, really smart. I kind of want to see them.

That and his racist attacks on Obama, typical of the right, assuming he was undeserving of admission to prestigious schools. The same assumption made by opinion leaders on the right about every successful black person. F-you Trump. He's not the moron. You're the moron.
 

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
16,242
14,245
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Also to be clear, Trump did not go to Wharton as the term is commonly used. Generally saying 'I went to Wharton' refers to their doctoral or MBA programs while he just got his BA from there.

I'm surprised he was even able to pass enough classes to get the BA. Maybe they gave him a pass because bone spurs.
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,686
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Or that Clinton's lawyer and the Dems handed him a script. I liked the part of his epiphany that caused him to lie again to Congress. I guess he will get everything he wants.

He's scheduled to go to federal prison May 6, iirc, largely because of things he did on Trump's behalf. That's not exactly getting everything he wants.

Everybody who supports Trump lies to protect him, first to themselves. You're no different.
 

SMOGZINN

Lifer
Jun 17, 2005
14,359
4,640
136
Poll: 50% believe Cohen. 35% believe Trump.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/03/05/vot...en-over-president-donald-trump-poll-says.html

Meaning that a convicted perjurer beats Trump by 15 points in a credibility contest.

I also have to wonder, given Trump's 42% current average approval rating, who are the 7% who think he's a lying criminal but still approve of his job performance?

Probably a bunch of those moderates who often vote Democrat that come around here to support anything he does all the time. They seem to have a limitless capacity for cognitive dissonance.
 
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Feb 4, 2009
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Probably a bunch of those moderates who often vote Democrat that come around here to support anything he does all the time. They seem to have a limitless capacity for cognitive dissonance.
Or Trump found a new & more effective guy to rig surveys.
 

VRAMdemon

Diamond Member
Aug 16, 2012
8,099
10,803
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Poll: 50% believe Cohen. 35% believe Trump.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/03/05/vot...en-over-president-donald-trump-poll-says.html

Meaning that a convicted perjurer beats Trump by 15 points in a credibility contest.

I also have to wonder, given Trump's 42% current average approval rating, who are the 7% who think he's a lying criminal but still approve of his job performance?

To be honest...It doesn't matter IMO. Trump's popularity/unpopularity is basically fixed, within a few points. It makes no difference whatsoever what he does now, or what comes out. If it came out that he told the Russians were the nuclear subs are, the Trumpists would be fine with that. Better Russian than Democrat.

It's possible the Democratic strategy going forward is not to try to remove Trump from office before 2020; that's a fool's errand without the GOP on board, and it would give the GOP something to rally around. So, between now and then, they are going to lay bare the rot at the core of the Republican party, and unless the GOP starts begging them to impeach, which is admittedly unlikely, they are going to make the case that the Republican party has morphed into a bunch of tax and spend lunatics centered around protecting a crime family.

And as more and more evidence comes out, they get to point to Republicans and say, "Sure, we think he shouldn't be president for obvious reasons, but the Republican party is protecting him and unless we get them to see reality, there's nothing that we can do alone.

Having a psychopath as president for two years would be the downside to this plan.
 

SMOGZINN

Lifer
Jun 17, 2005
14,359
4,640
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Trump is extremely intelligent. Part of his game is to convince you that he's not.

Or he is not and part of his game is to convince you that he is but because he is not he is not very convincing.
 
Mar 11, 2004
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When forced to reflect, I think Cohen had an epiphany. That moment of realization, that "My God! What have I done? How could I have been so wrong, so foolish?" moment. So he confessed to get right with himself & hopefully with the world. He'll do his time as penance.

I think its more that Cohen finally realized the gravity of the situation and that he was part of history in the making. Not Turmp's made up history, but history that would be studied for probably decades. And I think he didn't like what it was likely to conclude about him, and that he'd rather not be remembered as a shitlicking lackey trying to enable treason.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
88,254
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I think its more that Cohen finally realized the gravity of the situation and that he was part of history in the making. Not Turmp's made up history, but history that would be studied for probably decades. And I think he didn't like what it was likely to conclude about him, and that he'd rather not be remembered as a shitlicking lackey trying to enable treason.

I feel like Cohen realized he probably had to flip on Trump to avoid going to prison for a very long time and there’s no half-flipping on Trump. If Cohen was going to turn on him he might as well burn the whole thing down. This is the downside of surrounding yourself with shady criminals. If their ass is on the line they are likely to do the same thing to you that they’ve been doing to others for you all those years.

I don’t really buy the epiphany thing either. Cohen had clearly been recording Trump and collecting evidence on all the shady shit Trump had him doing for quite some time. You aren’t secretly recording your employer unless you think you might have to use it against him someday.
 

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
33,746
17,401
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My conspiracy theory is that trump and stone are trying to recreate the Nixon Watergate saga but they believe that had Republicans held their ground and not lost faith that Nixon would have been fine.


:p
 

esquared

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 8, 2000
25,422
6,428
146
An aspect of the Cohen testimony I missed had to do with his efforts to suppress all of Trump's school records. Trump has claimed he was number 1 at Wharton, among other things. He also repeatedly accused Obama of being "a terrible student" undeserving of admission to Columbia and Harvard.

Turns out Cohen's testimony is corroborated by school officials and others. Due to pressure from wealthy donor friends of Trump, his records have been locked away.



https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...ecords-tells-us-about/?utm_term=.dc12d8c0825e

I know this is a shock, but I think this effort to hide Trump's academic records may suggest that he just isn't an entirely truthful person.

And a dumbfuck who probably just barely passed and got into Wharton on rich white guy affirmative action: his daddy made a yuge donation.
Remember this? "“Donald Trump was the dumbest goddamn student I ever had."
https://www.chicagotribune.com/news...chapman-donald-trump-dumb-20171103-story.html

"The late William T. Kelley, who taught Trump at the University of Pennsylvania, said, “Donald Trump was the dumbest goddamn student I ever had.” Tony Schwartz, the ghostwriter of “The Art of the Deal,” says Trump had “a stunning level of superficial knowledge and plain ignorance.” "
 

thilanliyan

Lifer
Jun 21, 2005
12,085
2,281
126
To be honest...It doesn't matter IMO. Trump's popularity/unpopularity is basically fixed, within a few points. It makes no difference whatsoever what he does now, or what comes out. If it came out that he told the Russians were the nuclear subs are, the Trumpists would be fine with that. Better Russian than Democrat.

It's possible the Democratic strategy going forward is not to try to remove Trump from office before 2020; that's a fool's errand without the GOP on board, and it would give the GOP something to rally around.
Exactly. I don't think he will get impeached, considering the GOP seem to be fully onboard with his administration (base).

I think the best the Dems can hope for is to stymie any harmful (to the general population) policies and wait until 2020. Admittedly, even 2020 is gonna be a tough fight for the Dems, it's not gonna be a walkover.
 
Mar 11, 2004
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Trump is extremely intelligent. Part of his game is to convince you that he's not.

We'll just have to disagree on that. Its not that rare to find people who are uniquely gifted but near total and complete idiots in all other ways. Although honestly, I don't even think Turmp is especially gifted in any way (well beyond having been born into ridiculous wealth, which even comics considers an actual superpower). Turmp has that common innate psychopathic ability to manipulate people and he was born with the money to get them to look the other way when similarly skilled ones would have long ago been called out for their shit. And then he just happened to find one the largest groups of gullible idiots (many willful) in all of human history, willing to anoint him their Dicktater. That's not intelligence, that's just a confluence of factors enabling a small time liar to carry out historically significant events.

Turmp is a perfect fit for modern Republicans and American conservatives. He perfectly epitomizes them.
 
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hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
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My conspiracy theory is that trump and stone are trying to recreate the Nixon Watergate saga but they believe that had Republicans held their ground and not lost faith that Nixon would have been fine.


:p
I'm sure they absolutely believe that. Guess what else was different then. No Fox News. My conspiracy theory about Fox News is that it was created because of Nixon's forced resignation.
EDIT: Never again will we let the liberal press inundate the world with facts in abandon!
 
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Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,686
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All I can tell you guys is that the intelligence of con artists isn't measured in conventional terms. They are a breed apart, a different dimension of human consciousness. You can see thru the con, Trump's con, but a lot of people don't.
 
Mar 11, 2004
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I feel like Cohen realized he probably had to flip on Trump to avoid going to prison for a very long time and there’s no half-flipping on Trump. If Cohen was going to turn on him he might as well burn the whole thing down. This is the downside of surrounding yourself with shady criminals. If their ass is on the line they are likely to do the same thing to you that they’ve been doing to others for you all those years.

I don’t really buy the epiphany thing either. Cohen had clearly been recording Trump and collecting evidence on all the shady shit Trump had him doing for quite some time. You aren’t secretly recording your employer unless you think you might have to use it against him someday.

I don't know, could be wrong, and maybe it was something simpler, like he was pissed off at Turmp over something relatively minor (we know he wasn't pleased with having to try to wrangle out getting reimbursed over the payoffs), but that ballooned into his office getting raided and then he saw quickly there was no turning back, so he just decided to grit his teeth and bare it, knowing that it would be worse the more he tried to weasel out of it. And they probably presented enough evidence showing they knew more than he thought was probably possible without them being there and knew he was fucked, so he might as well try to make the best of the situation. But stuff like refusing a pardon, I feel like that is somewhat symbolic, and is him trying to save face (possibly more for his family and kids and their kids than himself), where he started to recognize that this was a historic situation, and wanting to not be remembered for who knows how long (decades almost certainly) as fully onboard with the corruption (if not outright treason) of Turmp.

Honestly, I think him cataloging stuff was probably just how he had to operate with shitbags like Turmp, where if he didn't have hard evidence to shove in their face they'd try to weasel out and/or fuck people (like himself) over. Heck, wasn't the reason they got Cohen because he had to work to get Turmp to reimburse him for paying off the porn women? I have a hunch that was just standard procedure, and likely Cohen had to keep things just so he wouldn't get screwed over. Certainly there's the covering his own ass aspect, but I think that was likely inherent to dealing with scummy sleazeballs like Turmp, so its less that he was sure Turmp was headed there and more was just standard procedure. I just can't fathom that Cohen would've been certain that Turmp was going down but continue on with him, since his gathering would've started before the DNC hack and Russian connection to all that. I figure if Cohen was cognizant of Turmp going down that far back, he wouldn't have continued on, which made things worse for himself. So I'd guess it was about covering his ass, but less that he knew he'd be using it in such a manner and I think it was more simply so he could keep shit straight and make sure he didn't get left holding an empty bag of IOGoFuckYourselfs since he was quite aware Turmp like doing that.

All I can tell you guys is that the intelligence of con artists isn't measured in conventional terms. They are a breed apart, a different dimension of human consciousness. You can see thru the con, Trump's con, but a lot of people don't.

I can agree (it never ceases to amaze me how serial killers, cult leaders, and other people that are outright malicious, were able to continue to operate because of some weird ability to obstruct people's brains from properly using logic), but I think that's more a comment on society than it is actually supporting them as masterminds. Like I said, its that inherent psychotic aspect, that isn't actually all that rare. And I think modern society has, through a confluence of factors, made people particularly susceptible to manipulation because its ingrained so thoroughly (from food, to entertainment).

But even with regards to manipulators, I don't find Turmp very profound. Simply put, you take away the money and no one would have cared about him and he never would have been in the position. And he didn't earn the money himself (and frankly I'd even call his attempts at manipulating things for himself to actually have backfired since it regularly ended up with him having to declare bankruptcy, and it looks like it might be setting up major implications of people that had been able to do that type of thing but once they got in Turmp's collective black hole of corruption, found themselves facing scrutiny they couldn't handle). A lot of the rest was basically ingrained in the system or enabled by him paying people that knew the ins and outs of how to do that (so the stuff like the tax schemes). Most of what Turmp himself tried to do failed, and often pretty badly. The two exceptions were his reality show, where normally they have to coach people to act like Turmp (and people are watching it for the deliberately over the top bullshit aspect of it all), and then of course him speaking to a base that had subsisted on the same garbage political discourse that Turmp himself had, where he simply regurgitated most of it (with some of his unique stupidity thrown in) and then got them to cheer. It isn't that much different from the behavior you see from people over sports. And he still needs to be coached for what to actually say a ridiculous amount, and regularly fucks things up because he gets frustrated that people won't just accept his nonsense.

He's no Pied Piper, he basically just found crackheads that like the same form of crack he does and who have been jonesing for more crack because their normal dealers jacked up the prices on them after distributing it to them to get them hooked.
 

interchange

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,031
2,886
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Do you think if Trump's grades got out it would mean anything? The fact he's been lying through his teeth about his academic exploits is plain to see. It is possible seeing it on paper changes things, although I think only if they are actually bad and not simply well below Trump's boasts.
 
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HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
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He's scheduled to go to federal prison May 6, iirc, largely because of things he did on Trump's behalf. That's not exactly getting everything he wants.

Everybody who supports Trump lies to protect him, first to themselves. You're no different.
Slow falls into the same category. Look at his comments on the NK 2nd summit. When Trump's failure and lies are opened up in front of him he just claims Trump was successful.

Cohen may be a liar but he knows from where he speaks concerning the Trump effect.