Miami police shoot unarmed man

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brianmanahan

Lifer
Sep 2, 2006
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Police unions, the one union most conservatives have no problem with...

i was actually just talking to a coworker about how i think they need to do away with the police unions completely

there's a big thread about this incident on reddit's /r/protectandserve sub, and someone said you can't expect the police union to disagree with any actions that police take. it's the union's reason for existing, to represent and implicitly agree with those they represent.

which is why i say, no more unions.
 

mizzou

Diamond Member
Jan 2, 2008
9,734
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i was actually just talking to a coworker about how i think they need to do away with the police unions completely

there's a big thread about this incident on reddit's /r/protectandserve sub, and someone said you can't expect the police union to disagree with any actions that police take. it's the union's reason for existing, to represent and implicitly agree with those they represent.

which is why i say, no more unions.

A union sort of operates like a criminal defense attorney's office. They will back you regardless of whatever scum you take.

It sucks for the rest of us who are reasonable, but it's useful for that 0.0009% chance you are accused of doing something crazy at work which you didn't do or someone is trying to fire you without good cause.

I personally don't think union's are good. If your employer won't give you the respect you need, leave!
 

glenn1

Lifer
Sep 6, 2000
25,383
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How about we just actually punish police officers that do things that any other citizen would go to prison for?

No problem with that although since they get full due process rights and presumption of innocence also, that might not be enough for those who simply want kangaroo trials with predetermined outcomes.

Wonder why we don't have the full unedited video. It just cuts out right at the important stuff.

We really need to stop letting cops respond to mental health issues.

Responding is fine, some mental health patients are violent. Whether they should be the lead people in responding versus simply backing up a mental healthcare professional is another story.
 

mizzou

Diamond Member
Jan 2, 2008
9,734
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No problem with that although since they get full due process rights and presumption of innocence also, that might not be enough for those who simply want kangaroo trials with predetermined outcomes.



Responding is fine, some mental health patients are violent. Whether they should be the lead people in responding versus simply backing up a mental healthcare professional is another story.

I don't think they will want to be backed up by cops after this video :eek:
 
Oct 16, 1999
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I grew up white, upper class, southern, and rural, and even I could see there's a fucking problem here well before this (infuriating) incident was added to the pile. What the fuck is wrong with all the people that still deny a problem with cops shooting (especially) black people even exists?
 

GarfieldtheCat

Diamond Member
Jan 7, 2005
3,708
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Just another shooting of an innocent unarmed black man. Happens all the time, but the apologist and racists don't mind, so it will keep happening. Start arresting and convicting officers for this shit, and it wills tart to go away. Keep giving them paid vacations and no jail time, it will keep happening.

Where are the apologists? Shouldn't they already be here posting about "wait for all the facts", or the "give the office the benefit of the doubt until everything is released"?
Usually they are here right away to deflect criticism from the cops and blame the victim.
 

SketchMaster

Diamond Member
Feb 23, 2005
3,100
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Wonder why we don't have the full unedited video. It just cuts out right at the important stuff.

We really need to stop letting cops respond to mental health issues.

I also would like to see how they put the autistic man in cuffs, I worry he was injured as well.

The lack of training officers receive on mental health is becoming irresponsible. My girlfriend is a Psychologist for k-12 schools and is always terrified when she gets an emergency call about a special needs teen becoming physical at one of her schools. It becomes a race to get there before the police arrive because the officer likely has no idea how the handle the situation, and usually end up hurting the kid and causing more mayhem in the process.

I also don't give two god damns if someone didn't have good trigger discipline, you don't shoot and man and leave him cuffed for 20 minutes before you bother getting them proper medical treatment.
 
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mxnerd

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2007
6,799
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If these fxxking stupid police can't adjust according to the situations, just quit being a cop!
 

NAC4EV

Golden Member
Feb 26, 2015
1,882
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Officer fired 3 times, striking Charles Kinsey in the leg. D:D:

As long as I've got my hands up, they're not going to shoot me. This is what I'm thinking. They're not going to shoot me," he said.

"Wow, was I wrong."
 
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kage69

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
27,303
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What's the quota for black people shooting black people?

According to statistics that is far, far more prevalent than a cop shooting a black person. Though, for some reason, it is rarely to never discussed in P&N.

I wonder why that is? Hmm...


I think your answer lies in the fact that when someone puts on a badge and a gun, there is an expectation by society for them to uphold standards of professionalism and competence required for the role. That is not an unreasonable expectation either.

You understand that teen thug wannabes are not held to the same standards and expectations as law enforcement, right? Pointing out an egregious abuse of authority, or even outright murder, committed by a LEO in no way means that black on black crime is excused, endorsed, whatever.

Also, I wouldn't look to P&N as an indicator or metric on issues that encompass the entire country, but then maybe that's intentional. So what you don't see it on Anandtech? Is that supposed to magically invalidate all the other sources and people out there who do take up the issue?

I wouldn't spend too much time on statistics if I were you. Not that they're worthless, just that they can cause you to post in a thread and not just ignore the actual story, but cut straight to a narrative seeking to undermine and invalidate facts about it that are not in dispute.

This Miami cop just proved to everyone he is not fit for the job, and who shot who in Chicago or Detroit lately doesn't change that.
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,314
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Yea in this case the officer should be charged with attempted murder and the victim should walk away with a 6 figure settlement. Anything less would be a travesty of justice.
 

Sunburn74

Diamond Member
Oct 5, 2009
5,027
2,595
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This story just makes you shake your head. It really does suggest a systemic issue as it cannot be a coincidence that all these shootings are involving black males
 

1prophet

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2005
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http://politicalblindspot.com/police-officially-refuse-to-hire-applicants-with-high-iq-scores/


It’s long been rumored amongst law enforcement critics, but did you know that police departments officially disqualify high-scoring applicants? That’s not to say that all cops are stupid… Just that if you’re too smart, the police simply won’t hire you.

The policy became solidified as a concrete federal ruling almost a decade and a half ago with little fanfare from the mainstream media. Back in 1999, a Federal judge dismissed a lawsuit by a police applicant who was barred from the New London, Connecticut police force. The reason for the disqualification was literally because he had scored “too high” on an intelligence test. The department made it clear, they didn’t want the bottom of the barrel in terms of intelligence, but they didn’t want anyone “too smart” either.

The ruling made public in September of the same year, with the ruling judge Peter C. Dorsey of the United States District Court in New Haven confirming that it was in fact the case that the plaintiff, Robert Jordan, 48, who has a bachelor’s degree in literature, was denied an opportunity to even interview for a job with the New London Police Department, solely because of his high test scores.

Judge Dorsey, however, ruled that Mr. Jordan that there was no protection offered to intelligent people from discriminatory hiring practices by individual police departments. Why? Because, Dorsey explained, it was proven that police departments held all to this same standard and thus rejected all applicants who scored high.

So next time you cross paths with a cop and wonder how someone so stupid could get hired by their department, you now know that their stupidity might be the very thing that qualified them for the job.
Perhaps it's time to make intelligent people a protected class when it comes to civil service.:hmm:
 

WHAMPOM

Diamond Member
Feb 28, 2006
7,628
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"quote?" What?

And for the sensationalist-grabbing headline nutbags in here that don't quite grasp what I am saying, black on black crime is a much greater problem yet it is rarely, if ever, discussed in P&N. Why is there a penchant to turn a blind eye and only focus when LEO is involved?

That's a rhetorical question, so please continue with your parade of stupidity and ignorance.

'cause LEOs are too scared to patrol Black areas properly, thus letting crime run rampant in that neighborhood.
 

Ackmed

Diamond Member
Oct 1, 2003
8,477
523
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Cop royally messed up. No way to rationalize it or even attempt to defend the situation. I would not allow the cop on the street again if he remains on the force. Shitty intel sure didnt help the cops at all, reports of a guy with a gun were totally wrong and had them in the wrong mindset when they got there, still no excuse.

Its black people being shot, so never.

Its not only black people being shot. Unless you're claiming that they are the only ones that matter?

I don't think anyone condones rioting, even when white people do it after hockey games.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/riots-erupt-in-vancouver-after-canucks-loss-1.993707

But again a black man gets shot by police (or the state) and people bring up bad actions by individual citizens. It's pathetic that people pretend not to know the difference.

Actually... a BLM leader who was teaching a class at Yale said just that, that looting is ok and even beneficial; http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/10/08/black-lives-leader-defends-looting-in-yale-lecture.html

I grew up white, upper class, southern, and rural, and even I could see there's a fucking problem here well before this (infuriating) incident was added to the pile. What the fuck is wrong with all the people that still deny a problem with cops shooting (especially) black people even exists?

Why "especially" black people? Their lives matter more? Whites get shot more than blacks, just a fyi. Police shooting innocent people period is the problem, not just one color over another. Efforts need to be better in lowering and hopefully stopping this all together.

Those are your results.

1.) We can start by requiring every cop to wear body cameras. If the body camera is found to be inoperable, you get fired. Police work for the people, not the other way around. I'm not sure why in this age of technology this is even being debated.

2.) Any cop that is found to be lying on a police report is fired. Again, how can the police be required to enforce the laws if you don't enforce the police.

3.) The rules of engagement should change.

Who is going to pay for the cameras and the storage? It is incredibly expensive. Even for large cities it would be very hard, it could cripple smaller forces. I would love to see every cop wear one, just doesn't seem feasible yet. So if there is a malfunction the cop gets fired, if it falls off during a fight the cop gets fired, if they are outside the broadcast range, the cop gets fired? Terrible logic, things happen. If found out that the cop intentionally stopped the recording then yes, otherwise no.

2. Depending on the lie, I have no problem with that. Or a pattern of small "white" lies, they should be gone. Hard to expect someone to be honest on the stand if they lie on a report.

3. What rules would you suggest? Them wait to be presented with a gun before they are allowed to shoot, wait until they are actually shot at? I believe the rules are pretty good as is, just have to get cops to enforce them better. In the example you gave where the cop boarded the bus with the gun out, my bet would be that violated a policy, the rules of engagement wouldnt be the issue if so.

So, they shoot the black person with his hands up and don't shoot the non-black person who doesn't have his hands up, is the person that has the object in his hands and is not responding to police commands? And mind you, the black person was shot 3 times, the non-black person - 0.

This is a perfect encapsulation of why there is a Black lives movement. This guys life didn't seem to matter as much as the non black guy's. And anyone with a conscience or empathy should understand why there is so much outrage out there in the Black community.

You don't think white people have been shot with their hands up before? I suggest you research that, it's happened. One of the problems with the BLM movement as you put it, is that all attention goes to them. White guy gets shot? Hardly a peep around here or on news. Case in point, white guy without a gun, not fighting the cops was shot June 25th, no thread here until July 14th, 58 responses as of now. Black guy with an illegal gun resisting arrest and reaching for the gun? Day one post and 200 replies as of now. Police shooting of innocent people of every type needs to be handled. Not putting one over the rest. Yet we always hear of one color more, even though it happens less.
 
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Oyeve

Lifer
Oct 18, 1999
21,917
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You don't think white people have been shot with their hands up before? I suggest you research that, it's happened. One of the problems with the BLM movement as you put it, is that all attention goes to them. White guy gets shot? Hardly a peep around here or on news. Case in point, white guy without a gun, not fighting the cops was shot June 25th, no thread here until July 14th, 58 responses as of now. Black guy with an illegal gun resisting arrest and reaching for the gun? Day one post and 200 replies as of now. Police shooting of innocent people of every type needs to be handled. Not putting one over the rest. Yet we always hear of one color more, even though it happens less.

Yeah, but there are more videos of white people WITH guns or knives acting erratically and the cops don't shoot. Hell, there was one a couple of weeks ago, whiteman had a shotgun and they tazed him or something less devastating.
 

realibrad

Lifer
Oct 18, 2013
12,337
898
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Yeah, but there are more videos of white people WITH guns or knives acting erratically and the cops don't shoot. Hell, there was one a couple of weeks ago, whiteman had a shotgun and they tazed him or something less devastating.

Quick question, how many white people are in the US again?
 

realibrad

Lifer
Oct 18, 2013
12,337
898
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I was gonna retort then I saw you are from Florida. You opinion is moot.

Actually, while I live in this wretched state, I was born and raised in CA until the age of 19. The majority of my life was spent in that beautiful land.
 

Ackmed

Diamond Member
Oct 1, 2003
8,477
523
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Too many IMO.

That's nice of you to say. Just imagine if someone here said we had too many black people? Probably get a temp ban, get called out as a racist or bigot.

Meanwhile your comment is just fine, and someone speaking at a "new black Panther party" gig can openly call for deaths of whites, and their families. Never heard of it? Not surprising, just more hypocrisy by the media. That's a-ok though, he got what he wanted. Even posters here have called for "pigs" to be killed in front of their kids. It's all coming true. Cops getting glass in their food sending them to the emergency room, but hey that's ok too right? You're pathetic for saying there are too many white people here, you should know that.

Speaking of slave masters;
"Denmark Vesey had a plan to kill every last one of them and kill all of their goddamn families"

"We got to complete what Denmark didn’t finish"

http://downtrend.com/robertgehl/black-panther-tells-crowd-of-200-in-charleston-kill-every-last-white-man-and-kill-all-of-their-goddamn-families

But that's cool, other way around all hell would break loose.
 

CitizenKain

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2000
4,480
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Meanwhile your comment is just fine, and someone speaking at a "new black Panther party" gig can openly call for deaths of whites, and their families. Never heard of it? Not surprising, just more hypocrisy by the media. That's a-ok though, he got what he wanted. Even posters here have called for "pigs" to be killed in front of their kids. It's all coming true. Cops getting glass in their food sending them to the emergency room, but hey that's ok too right? You're pathetic for saying there are too many white people here, you should know that.

Yes, its fucking terrible what happened in Baton Rogue and Dallas, but, guess what? Police have abused the public trust for decades and eventually shit boils over. They can shoot someone who is unarmed, have it be filmed and nothing happens. They can shoot a child in a park, lie about what happened and nothing. Shoot a man in a store in the back on camera, also nothing. Other cops just shrug and carry on.
Now they are surprised when people turn against them?

What people like you seem to be confused about is you think there is a hidden Only in front of Black Lives Matter. While ignoring that there is actually a Too at the end.