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Margaret Thatcher, U.K.'s leading defender of capitalism passed away.

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davmat787

Diamond Member
Nov 30, 2010
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It is probably worth remembering the fact that she was in office during one of the most intense times of the cold war. Regardless of your opinion on the her, the political climate was very different in the early 80's than it is now. The prospect, or at least the perceived prospect, of thermonuclear war and mutually assured destruction was very real at that time.
 
Jun 26, 2007
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You missed that whole Poll Tax riot thing then? o_O

You really are incredibly stupid, incredibly uninformed or trolling your butt off.

I'm not sure which is more depressing really.
Don't bother, this twit has been telling Englishmen about what is REALLY happening in England for a long time.

Those of us who are Englishmen are not up to speed on our own nation but Incorruptible has read Pamela Gellers blog so he KNOWS.

Regarding Thatcher, i have respect for the dead so i won't say anything about her person but her policies made us Americas go to whore.

What amuses me is the comparisons to the utter socialist that Reagan was, the two were complete opposites. While Reagan upped spending on welfare Thatcher lowered them, while Reagan instituted full amnesty Thatcher worked to close our borders to anyone without a proper documentation, while the US increased taxes (grand total, the cuts were offset so many times with payroll increases that it was a net increase) Thatcher lowered them.

The experiment ended with Thatcher because it wasn't an experiment that actually helped the citizens of England.
 
Jun 26, 2007
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It is probably worth remembering the fact that she was in office during one of the most intense times of the cold war. Regardless of your opinion on the her, the political climate was very different in the early 80's than it is now. The prospect, or at least the perceived prospect, of thermonuclear war and mutually assured destruction was very real at that time.
Not really, scared of the commies then, scared of the arabs now.

Problem was that that fear couldn't be sold in England, didn't matter though since our politicians didn't care at all, too busy being Americas go to whore.
 
Apr 27, 2012
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Don't bother, this twit has been telling Englishmen about what is REALLY happening in England for a long time.

Those of us who are Englishmen are not up to speed on our own nation but Incorruptible has read Pamela Gellers blog so he KNOWS.

Regarding Thatcher, i have respect for the dead so i won't say anything about her person but her policies made us Americas go to whore.

What amuses me is the comparisons to the utter socialist that Reagan was, the two were complete opposites. While Reagan upped spending on welfare Thatcher lowered them, while Reagan instituted full amnesty Thatcher worked to close our borders to anyone without a proper documentation, while the US increased taxes (grand total, the cuts were offset so many times with payroll increases that it was a net increase) Thatcher lowered them.

The experiment ended with Thatcher because it wasn't an experiment that actually helped the citizens of England.
You are a twit. You are either an idiot or so ignorant that you can't see how radical Islam is taking over. You call me stupid now but when England loses more freedom to them you will know I was right.

And I am not a fan of Margeret Thatcher because she wasn't a real Conservative but I have to support her for cutting taxes and welfare. Along with closing the border was a good thing.
 
Jun 26, 2007
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You are a twit. You are either an idiot or so ignorant that you can't see how radical Islam is taking over. You call me stupid now but when England loses more freedom to them you will know I was right.

And I am not a fan of Margeret Thatcher because she wasn't a real Conservative but I have to support her for cutting taxes and welfare. Along with closing the border was a good thing.
Son, stop reading the blogs and listen to the Englishmen who are right here correcting you, we are Englishmen, Pamela Geller isn't and neither are you.

What you WANT to believe matters not at all to me, our problem with Islam is very small in comparison to the US and we DO NOT have the same problems you do.

Don't you get it? You listen to neo nazi groups like the EDL, whose leaders are convicted felons who never EVER had a job in their life, their members being chavs and neds who are unemployed little twats who only want more money for doing nothing and think that if a la Hitler we just get rid of a minority they'll get it.

Margret was a true conservative, she actually did all of the things Reagan didn't dare do.

Only problem is that in the US the words "conservative" and "liberal" have been perverted by two political parties which are neither conservative nor liberal to a point where Americans have no clue of the meaning of the words.

For you i suppose conservatism means a return to a Saudi Arabian version of society but with Christianity as the religion that the law is based on.

You didn't know any of what she did before i told you she did that so shut the fuck up you ridiculous twat.
 

Franz316

Senior member
Sep 12, 2000
861
188
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You didn't know any of what she did before i told you she did that so shut the fuck up you ridiculous twat.
As an American, I apologize for him. Please don't think we're all like him =)

He's the self appointed forum jester meant to entertain us, he just doesn't know it.
 
Jun 26, 2007
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As an American, I apologize for him. Please don't think we're all like him =)

He's the self appointed forum jester meant to entertain us, he just doesn't know it.
No need to apologize for him, i know him for the basementdwelling Pamela Geller reading idiot that he is.

I appreciate many people on here who i may not always agree with but who are good people, Haya would be a good example, we've gotten into it on several occasions and we're friends.

Incorruptible is just stupid as FUCK, so stupid that it should be illegal.

He should be in a zoo, not for amusement but as a deterrent for kids who don't study.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,874
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No need to apologize for him, i know him for the basementdwelling Pamela Geller reading idiot that he is.

I appreciate many people on here who i may not always agree with but who are good people, Haya would be a good example, we've gotten into it on several occasions and we're friends.

Incorruptible is just stupid as FUCK, so stupid that it should be illegal.

He should be in a zoo, not for amusement but as a deterrent for kids who don't study.
I have no idea why people are as they are. If there's something I feel bad about it's that it seems we aren't sending any representative at all. I'm hoping that's wrong.
 

Dari

Lifer
Oct 25, 2002
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It is probably worth remembering the fact that she was in office during one of the most intense times of the cold war. Regardless of your opinion on the her, the political climate was very different in the early 80's than it is now. The prospect, or at least the perceived prospect, of thermonuclear war and mutually assured destruction was very real at that time.
You're thinking of the 1950s or 1960s. The 1980s were far more sedate compared to those two aforementioned decades...
 

Dari

Lifer
Oct 25, 2002
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I have no idea why people are as they are. If there's something I feel bad about it's that it seems we aren't sending any representative at all. I'm hoping that's wrong.
If this is true (link) I have more respect for Obama than before. He has made it clear that he was never a fan of Churchill (returning the bust in the WH) and I can see him hating Thatcher even more. She was the exact opposite of Obama in every possible way imaginable and him sending Biden would've been too disgusting even for him...
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,874
4,203
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If this is true (link) I have more respect for Obama than before. He has made it clear that he was never a fan of Churchill (returning the bust in the WH) and I can see him hating Thatcher even more. She was the exact opposite of Obama in every possible way imaginable and him sending Biden would've been too disgusting even for him...
He's not going and neither is Biden because they are "too busy working on gun legislation"

I don't see why you think Obama would be deserving of respect considering he's putting his personal feelings before diplomacy and one of our closest allies. That's being a peevish child, not a statesman, but I never have accused him of being the latter.
 

Dari

Lifer
Oct 25, 2002
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He's not going and neither is Biden because they are "too busy working on gun legislation"

I don't see why you think Obama would be deserving of respect considering he's putting his personal feelings before diplomacy and one of our closest allies. That's being a peevish child, not a statesman, but I never have accused him of being the latter.
He's deserving of respect because, even though I am not his biggest fan, at least he sticks to his principals. Also, considering that, as the world has now seen, Thatcher was not exactly the most popular figure in her own damn country, why on earth would he want to get into a local fight, especially against those he would consider his natural British allies (Labour)? Britain may be one of our closest allies but that relationship is based on hundreds of years of shared common interests, not on cult worship or over individual relationships. She was a wise and beautiful woman and the president recognizes that. But she was also leader of Britain, and that is why he is sending representatives (of a lower stature). I would think he was being peevish if the president was not sending anyone. But he is sending someone, although not what you or others expected.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,874
4,203
126
He's deserving of respect because, even though I am not his biggest fan, at least he sticks to his principals. Also, considering that, as the world has now seen, Thatcher was not exactly the most popular figure in her own damn country, why on earth would he want to get into a local fight, especially against those he would consider his natural British allies (Labour)? Britain may be one of our closest allies but that relationship is based on hundreds of years of shared common interests, not on cult worship or over individual relationships. She was a wise and beautiful woman and the president recognizes that. But she was also leader of Britain, and that is why he is sending representatives (of a lower stature). I would think he was being peevish if the president was not sending anyone. But he is sending someone, although not what you or others expected.
Wait, who is he sending? Who from the administrative branch?

As far as principles go, he needs to shove them somewhere else. How about people who aren't for abortion but are in government? Shouldn't they use their power to stick to their principles too instead of following the law?

No, he's being a dick because he can be. If you think that's some virtue then so be it. "Sorry Great Britain, she was a wise and beautiful woman so fuck you, but ever so kindly."
 
Jun 26, 2007
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I have no idea why people are as they are. If there's something I feel bad about it's that it seems we aren't sending any representative at all. I'm hoping that's wrong.
1989, pretty much all of Europe and definetly all of England thinks of the US as a great nation where true equality has been attained.

Today, It's a place where you need a gun to be able to defend yourself when in your own home, loaded with one in the barrel on your nightstand. Immigrants are flooding the place and no American is working.

Most of all, your xenophobia is on the rise and the whole world knows it, you adapt it to Europe as a horrifying example of what is to come for the US if you let them thrive in your midst... Meanwhile Europe asks what the fuck you're talking about, farts and don't care.

America is largely irrelevant to Europe now, no one really cares anymore, too much "omg this happened and this is true and this is bullsheit" while that didn't happen, that was a lie and that other thing was true.
 

Dari

Lifer
Oct 25, 2002
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Wait, who is he sending? Who from the administrative branch?

As far as principles go, he needs to shove them somewhere else. How about people who aren't for abortion but are in government? Shouldn't they use their power to stick to their principles too instead of following the law?

No, he's being a dick because he can be. If you think that's some virtue then so be it. "Sorry Great Britain, she was a wise and beautiful woman so fuck you, but ever so kindly."
What? You are confusing decorum with legality? The analogies are not right. The president isn't breaking any laws by sending Eagleburger and Baker. He's just making it clear that she was not deserving of Administration officials.
 

davmat787

Diamond Member
Nov 30, 2010
5,514
24
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You're thinking of the 1950s or 1960s. The 1980s were far more sedate compared to those two aforementioned decades...
Perhaps more overtly this may be true, but behind the scenes and at the highest levels, perhaps not.

Remember the early 1980's for a moment. In the USSR, their leadership consisted of someone with an average age of 78 and with incredibly poor health. They remember the horrors of Germany pushing into the motherland during World War II, and have sworn NEVER AGAIN. At this point, some paranoia has set in to some degree.

In the west, you have a President that the USSR views as a crazy cowboy, and a President that perhaps courts that image for effect. In each year of his presidency he has spent incredible amounts of money on the military. A President who introduced a program that the USSR has since revealed it would have made every ruble they spent on ICBMs and nuclear tech a waste, and negated the MAD concept. That being SDI of course, you have to think how the USSR viewed it at the time. The B1-B program was resurrected, a supersonic bomber capable of delivering nuclear bombs. And on and on.

And don't forget, the closest we ever came to actual full blown nuclear war was perhaps not during the Bay of Pigs, but during a little known event in November 1983 called Able Archer. I have seen interviews with former KGB officials supporting this. See below links for more info.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Able_archer
https://www.cia.gov/library/center-for-the-study-of-intelligence/csi-publications/books-and-monographs/a-cold-war-conundrum/source.htm#HEADING1-13

Gordievsky described the reaction in stark terms:

In the tense atmosphere generated by the crises and rhetoric of the past few months, the KGB concluded that American forces had been placed on alert--and might even have begun the countdown to war.... The world did not quite reach the edge of the nuclear abyss during Operation RYAN. But during ABLE ARCHER 83 it had, without realizing it, come frighteningly close--certainly closer than at any time since the Cuban missile crisis of 1962.86 [emphasis added]
 

Dari

Lifer
Oct 25, 2002
17,136
37
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Perhaps more overtly this may be true, but behind the scenes and at the highest levels, perhaps not.

Remember the early 1980's for a moment. In the USSR, their leadership consisted of someone with an average age of 78 and with incredibly poor health. They remember the horrors of Germany pushing into the motherland during World War II, and have sworn NEVER AGAIN. At this point, some paranoia has set in to some degree.

In the west, you have a President that the USSR views as a crazy cowboy, and a President that perhaps courts that image for effect. In each year of his presidency he has spent incredible amounts of money on the military. A President who introduced a program that the USSR has since revealed it would have made every ruble they spent on ICBMs and nuclear tech a waste, and negated the MAD concept. That being SDI of course, you have to think how the USSR viewed it at the time. The B1-B program was resurrected, a supersonic bomber capable of delivering nuclear bombs. And on and on.

And don't forget, the closest we ever came to actual full blown nuclear war was perhaps not during the Bay of Pigs, but during a little known event in November 1983 called Able Archer. I have seen interviews with former KGB officials supporting this. See below links for more info.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Able_archer
https://www.cia.gov/library/center-for-the-study-of-intelligence/csi-publications/books-and-monographs/a-cold-war-conundrum/source.htm#HEADING1-13
Wait, aren't exercises and war games supposed to be announced publicly or even have nominal enemies invited so as to prevent such a miscalculation?
 
Jun 26, 2007
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Perhaps more overtly this may be true, but behind the scenes and at the highest levels, perhaps not.

Remember the early 1980's for a moment. In the USSR, their leadership consisted of someone with an average age of 78 and with incredibly poor health. They remember the horrors of Germany pushing into the motherland during World War II, and have sworn NEVER AGAIN. At this point, some paranoia has set in to some degree.

In the west, you have a President that the USSR views as a crazy cowboy, and a President that perhaps courts that image for effect. In each year of his presidency he has spent incredible amounts of money on the military. A President who introduced a program that the USSR has since revealed it would have made every ruble they spent on ICBMs and nuclear tech a waste, and negated the MAD concept. That being SDI of course, you have to think how the USSR viewed it at the time. The B1-B program was resurrected, a supersonic bomber capable of delivering nuclear bombs. And on and on.

And don't forget, the closest we ever came to actual full blown nuclear war was perhaps not during the Bay of Pigs, but during a little known event in November 1983 called Able Archer. I have seen interviews with former KGB officials supporting this. See below links for more info.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Able_archer
https://www.cia.gov/library/center-for-the-study-of-intelligence/csi-publications/books-and-monographs/a-cold-war-conundrum/source.htm#HEADING1-13
This was provided for you as how the world viewed your president, the world never viewed your president like that, just like the Soviets you were fed the propaganda and you ate it up just like they did.

The closest you ever came was never even in a million years close. Everyone with any insight knows that and everyone with half a brain can figure it out.

It's not close unless someone attempts to fire and fails, THEN it was close, before that it's always equally close.
 

davmat787

Diamond Member
Nov 30, 2010
5,514
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Wait, aren't exercises and war games supposed to be announced publicly or even have nominal enemies invited so as to prevent such a miscalculation?
I included several links with detailed information on this, go read them up if you want more detailed info. There is also a decent documentary on the Military Channel about this, don't recall the name at the moment. Several former KGB officers are interviewed, interesting stuff.
 

davmat787

Diamond Member
Nov 30, 2010
5,514
24
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This was provided for you as how the world viewed your president, the world never viewed your president like that, just like the Soviets you were fed the propaganda and you ate it up just like they did.

The closest you ever came was never even in a million years close. Everyone with any insight knows that and everyone with half a brain can figure it out.

It's not close unless someone attempts to fire and fails, THEN it was close, before that it's always equally close.
What are you talking about? Don't try and tell me how I understand something when you have shown no knowledge on the subject, this is a classed JohnofSheffield troll maneuver. Are you saying all those former KGB officers and government officials are lying? Many former USSR officers and officials have been quoted saying they viewed Reagan (then in the early 80's) as some crazy cowboy who just might be the end of them.

Your last sentence I don't understand. You need to read up on the Able Archer incident if you want to argue degrees of closeness in a potential nuclear war, and all of the little human factors that were in play.

For example, KGB officers were put on alert all over the world to look for signs of impending US Military action. So of course each officer wants to be the one to save the day, so every little thing is reported. But the KGB does not do analysis back then, to look at data at a high level and look for truth, they just add it all up and say, yes, the US is about to turn Moscow into glass!

I'm not going to write out pages of info on this when you just like to tell people they are wrong to rile them up and not truly interested in a civil discussion. You have proven this ample times. Sorry, homie don't play that.
 
Jun 26, 2007
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What are you talking about? Don't try and tell me how I understand something when you have shown no knowledge on the subject, this is a classed JohnofSheffield troll maneuver. Are you saying all those former KGB officers and government officials are lying? Many former USSR officers and officials have been quoted saying they viewed Reagan (then in the early 80's) as some crazy cowboy who just might be the end of them.

Your last sentence I don't understand. You need to read up on the Able Archer incident if you want to argue degrees of closeness in a potential nuclear war, and all of the little human factors that were in play.

For example, KGB officers were put on alert all over the world to look for signs of impending US Military action. So of course each officer wants to be the one to save the day, so every little thing is reported. But the KGB does not do analysis back then, to look at data at a high level and look for truth, they just add it all up and say, yes, the US is about to turn Moscow into glass!

I'm not going to write out pages of info on this when you just like to tell people they are wrong to rile them up and not truly interested in a civil discussion. You have proven this ample times. Sorry, homie don't play that.
WOW, i really don't know what to day. It's like talking to an extremist JW where everything is preordained.

Just... not one thing was correct in what you wrote, it was ALL propaganda and has been admitted as such since, it was never true, has been known for a good 30 years by now.

to keep you fearful, to keep you silent, to make you accept giving up freedom for security which every single american will ALWAYS do and have done for a LONG time, but as long as they say they don't they don't care, actions mean nothing to americans, pretty words and poestic constitutional sayings mean much more.

Dance you fucking retards... dance.
 

davmat787

Diamond Member
Nov 30, 2010
5,514
24
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WOW, i really don't know what to day. It's like talking to an extremist JW where everything is preordained.

Just... not one thing was correct in what you wrote, it was ALL propaganda and has been admitted as such since, it was never true, has been known for a good 30 years by now.

to keep you fearful, to keep you silent, to make you accept giving up freedom for security which every single american will ALWAYS do and have done for a LONG time, but as long as they say they don't they don't care, actions mean nothing to americans, pretty words and poestic constitutional sayings mean much more.

Dance you fucking retards... dance.
So I will ask again, the former KGB officers were lying?

You are consistent at least in your douchebaggery, you get all foamy at the mouth telling people the are wrong and have bought into some lie without backing anything up. I have brought facts and quotes and links to the discussion, you have only provided your very worn out shtick of being a grade A asshole and trolling people trying to get them riled up. And you always top it off with childish insults. You should stick to youtube comments, the kiddy table of internet forums is more your style and speed.

Like I said above, homie don't play that, especially with someone who has been proven a liar on both this website, and at least one other.

It is so precious watching you trying to make yourself look intelligent and authoritative, when in reality you are proving the opposite.

Shot any dime size groups at a kilometer lately? :rolleyes:
 
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So I will ask again, the former KGB officers were lying?

You are consistent at least in your douchebaggery, you get all foamy at the mouth telling people the are wrong and have bought into some lie without backing anything up. I have brought facts and quotes and links to the discussion, you have only provided your very worn out shtick of being a grade A asshole and trolling people trying to get them riled up. And you always top it off with childish insults. You should stick to youtube comments, the kiddy table of internet forums is more your style and speed.

Like I said above, homie don't play that, especially with someone who has been proven a liar on both this website, and at least one other.

It is so precious watching you trying to make yourself look intelligent and authoritative, when in reality you are proving the opposite.

Shot any dime size groups at a kilometer lately? :rolleyes:
You may have noted that i rarely speak out on anything, in fact i rarely comment on any current events unless i am absolutely certain, for a couple of years i reported news in this forum before they were reported, some times lemon law said ít would never happen, sometimes you said they never would, when they did you were nowhere to be seen.

Look, you don't have to believe me, nor do you have to make sheit up to make a point.

I don't want to be your enemy so i'll just leave, if you have a problem, contact me in PM.
 

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