Manhattan DA subpoenas Mazar for 8 years of Trump's personal and corporate tax returns

[dank69]

This is a state matter and has nothing to do with the DOJ nor the feds.

Good luck with that.

 

[fskimospy]

It's the long standing DoJ policy.


It hasn't been to the SCOTUS yet. I'm guessing they (Trump's lawyers) intend to take it there.

Fern

It is not. Being immune from indictment does not mean being immune from investigation.

There are also additional people other than Trump under investigation.

Also OLC opinions are not binding on anyone outside of the executive branch. So really. All kinds of no.

Also, from a practical perspective how absolutely horrifying would it be if the president not only can’t be indicted for crimes but where the country isn’t even allowed to know if he committed crimes? That’s basically the nightmare scenario.

 

[shortylickens]

Watching the Trumpettes rant all over the internet is hilarious. "Witch Hunt" still gets tossed around quite frequently. And of course almost all of them still blame Hillary for random shit from the last 50 years.

 

[Fern]

It is not. Being immune from indictment does not mean being immune from investigation.

There are also additional people other than Trump under investigation.

Also OLC opinions are not binding on anyone outside of the executive branch. So really. All kinds of no.

Also, from a practical perspective how absolutely horrifying would it be if the president not only can’t be indicted for crimes but where the country isn’t even allowed to know if he committed crimes? That’s basically the nightmare scenario.

You asked what their basis was, i.e., what they are claiming. I answered it.

Fern

 

[Fern]

This is a state matter and has nothing to do with the DOJ nor the feds.

They are asserting a Constitutional principle; states are bound by it too.

Fern

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

They are asserting a Constitutional principle; states are bound by it too.

Fern

It seems you are saying that in a criminal investigation accountants are immune to the consequences of defying a subpoena and indeed forensic accountancy is unconstitutional as it may compel cooperation. The DOJ has zero say in any of this because this is a state matter to be resolved in a state court unless the SCOTUS sees fit to override historical actions, rendering states powerless to compel testimony or documentation. What Constitutional provision does the DOJ have to demand that NY not execute its own laws? The DOJ is not part of the court system.

 

[Jhhnn]

It's the long standing DoJ policy.


It hasn't been to the SCOTUS yet. I'm guessing they (Trump's lawyers) intend to take it there.

Fern

Just because the President can't be prosecuted doesn't mean he can't be investigated. Several have been with Nixon, Clinton & Trump among them. House Dems could readily craft a NYS indictment into a writ of impeachment.

 

[fskimospy]

You asked what their basis was, i.e., what they are claiming. I answered it.

Fern

That is not what they are claiming. Just as a simple fact.

Like full stop. What you are saying is factually false.

 

[woolfe9998]

Trump's lawyers just intervened in this case and filed a brief arguing that not only can a sitting POTUS not be investigated for any criminal wrongdoing under any circumstances, but neither can Trump's companies or even his co-conspirators. No, this is not a joke. I recommend watching O'Donnell's interview with Lawrence Tribe:

The Last Word with Lawrence O’Donnell | MSNBC The Last Word

More about The Last Word on MSNBC. Join The Last Word Lawrence O Donnell community for more news, videos and articles about politics & global change.

www.msnbc.com

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Trump's lawyers just intervened in this case and filed a brief arguing that not only can a sitting POTUS not be investigated for any criminal wrongdoing under any circumstances, but neither can Trump's companies or even his co-conspirators. No, this is not a joke. I recommend watching O'Donnell's interview with Lawrence Tribe:

The Last Word with Lawrence O’Donnell | MSNBC The Last Word

More about The Last Word on MSNBC. Join The Last Word Lawrence O Donnell community for more news, videos and articles about politics & global change.

www.msnbc.com

I doubt that will go anywhere. Prosecution? Sure. Investigation? There's no suggestion in the Constitution that this is true.

 

[woolfe9998]

I doubt that will go anywhere. Prosecution? Sure. Investigation? There's no suggestion in the Constitution that this is true.

No, he won't win this argument. But the issue here is that we've come to a point where a POTUS has his lawyers even make such a repugnant argument in court.

 

[fskimospy]

No, he won't win this argument. But the issue here is that we've come to a point where a POTUS has his lawyers even make such a repugnant argument in court.

I feel like people might be complacent because they take the fact that America is a stable democracy for granted. I’m not sure if everyone is aware of the gravity of the situation here. The president is an active criminal and he is abusing his powers of office to cover up crimes by himself and his associates. He is also abusing his powers of office to rig the next election in his favor.

The courts aren’t going to save us. They are too slow and in the end Trump will just ignore them. We need to impeach him now. Not next week or next year, now.

 

[tweaker2]

No, he won't win this argument. But the issue here is that we've come to a point where a POTUS has his lawyers even make such a repugnant argument in court.

His pursuing this ridiculous idea that he and anyone he is associated with is immune from being held accountable for their crimes shows how excruciatingly desperate he is.

Everything he does to avoid being held accountable for his crimes just makes him look that much more culpable.

 

[Jhhnn]

He is also abusing his powers of office to rig the next election in his favor.

He'd like to do so, I suspect, but you need to explain how you think that would be possible. What is the mechanism to do so?

 

[fleshconsumed]

Trump's lawyers just intervened in this case and filed a brief arguing that not only can a sitting POTUS not be investigated for any criminal wrongdoing under any circumstances, but neither can Trump's companies or even his co-conspirators. No, this is not a joke.

If/when this is all over the lawyers who filed the brief need to be disbarred and banned from practicing law. Period.

 

[fskimospy]

He'd like to do so, I suspect, but you need to explain how you think that would be possible. What is the mechanism to do so?

He is extorting foreign powers to create opposition research for him, something they is explicitly illegal under campaign finance law.

If Elizabeth Warren sat down with the government of a foreign country and did the exact same thing she would go to jail.

 

[Maxima1]

I feel like people might be complacent because they take the fact that America is a stable democracy for granted. I’m not sure if everyone is aware of the gravity of the situation here. The president is an active criminal and he is abusing his powers of office to cover up crimes by himself and his associates. He is also abusing his powers of office to rig the next election in his favor.

The courts aren’t going to save us. They are too slow and in the end Trump will just ignore them. We need to impeach him now. Not next week or next year, now.

People are complacent because Democrat leadership is squandering everything. What do you expect when Democrats remain silent on the massive corruption and let Trump and the Republicans run roughshod over the narrative every time? This better not be their strategy next year.

 

[TheVrolok]

He is extorting foreign powers to create opposition research for him, something they is explicitly illegal under campaign finance law.

If Elizabeth Warren sat down with the government of a foreign country and did the exact same thing she would go to jail.

Many people don't care, another large proportion simply doesn't vote, and what we're left with is a minority who see the writing on the wall.

 

[Jhhnn]

People are complacent because Democrat leadership is squandering everything. What do you expect when Democrats remain silent on the massive corruption and let Trump and the Republicans run roughshod over the narrative every time?

Please. What's this "keeping silent" bullshit? Dems are all over Trump like white on rice.

Trump exploits Brandolini's law like nobody else. He's trying to bury the world under continuously generated bullshit. This federal suit is just another episode. When NYS prosecutors get past the bullshit then Mazars will give them what they ask or Mazars' NYS operations will be shut down. The latter isn't really an option they'll take. It would damage their reputation & business world wide. They're an enormous outfit.

 

[Maxima1]

Please. What's this "keeping silent" bullshit? Dems are all over Trump like white on rice.

Trump exploits Brandolini's law like nobody else. He's trying to bury the world under continuously generated bullshit. This federal suit is just another episode. When NYS prosecutors get past the bullshit then Mazars will give them what they ask or their NYS operations will be shut down. The latter isn't really an option they'll take. It would damage their reputation & business world wide. They're an enormous outfit.

Eric Holder just recently came out suggesting that we shouldn't prosecute Trump which is INSANELY stupid and a good way to getting a 1-term Dem president. Pelosi is suggesting that there isn't something impeachment yet, so why would people care? Hopefully she will at some point, but it's becoming increasingly likely that her strategy is just to look the other way. They may even end up being caught with their pants down if Trump manages to get us into a war with Iran.

 

[Jhhnn]

Eric Holder just recently came out suggesting that we shouldn't prosecute Trump which is INSANELY stupid and a good way to getting a 1-term Dem president. Pelosi is suggesting that there isn't something impeachment yet, so why would people care? Hopefully she will at some point, but it's becoming increasingly likely that her strategy is just to look the other way. They may even end up being caught with their pants down if Trump manages to get us into a war with Iran.

You need to provide links for those assertions. And you're Gish galloping, as well.

 

[Maxima1]

You need to provide links for those assertions. And you're Gish galloping, as well.

It's all over the news.

Holder cautions against potentially prosecuting Trump post presidency | CNN Politics

Former Attorney General Eric Holder predicted President Donald Trump may be prosecuted after his presidency if he doesn't first face impeachment proceedings while in office -- but warned of the possible risks to the nation.

www.cnn.com

 

[Jhhnn]

It's all over the news.

Holder cautions against potentially prosecuting Trump post presidency | CNN Politics

Former Attorney General Eric Holder predicted President Donald Trump may be prosecuted after his presidency if he doesn't first face impeachment proceedings while in office -- but warned of the possible risks to the nation.

www.cnn.com

I figure Holder is right to point out that there will be a lot to consider when we get there. He cares more about the country than about partisanship. We also shouldn't get ahead of ourselves. I figure Mike Pence would love to be President, if only for a day, just so that he could pardon Trump.

What will you offer in support of your scurrilous characterization of Pelosi as looking the other way? There are umpteen committees investigating some aspect of the Trump crime family.

 

[Maxima1]

I figure Holder is right to point out that there will be a lot to consider when we get there. He cares more about the country than about partisanship. We also shouldn't get ahead of ourselves. I figure Mike Pence would love to be President, if only for a day, just so that he could pardon Trump.

I totally disagree. This is far worse than Nixon. He doesn't deserve it. And it'll likely be a repeat of Ford, so Democrats would be shooting themselves in the foot.

What will you offer in support of your scurrilous characterization of Pelosi as looking the other way? There are umpteen committees investigating some aspect of the Trump crime family.

I'm willing to give her benefit of the doubt still. My point is that she's still beating around the bush saying we need all the evidence. If she won't outright say there are impeachable offenses already, people are generally going to be complacent (i.e. it must not be that bad) or frustrated with her leadership.

 

[Jhhnn]

I totally disagree. This is far worse than Nixon. He doesn't deserve it. And it'll likely be a repeat of Ford, so Democrats would be shooting themselves in the foot.



I'm willing to give her benefit of the doubt still. My point is that she's still beating around the bush saying we need all the evidence. If she won't outright say there are impeachable offenses already, people are generally going to be complacent (i.e. it must not be that bad) or frustrated with her leadership.

Oh, so she's not looking the other way? Of course Dems are reticent to impeach w/o the actual evidence being withheld by the Admin. Trump found his Roy Cohn in Bill Barr.

This whole thing with Mazars is a different arena, however. I don't expect it to yield short term results because it's complicated, like Enron, and yet different at the same time. We'll just have wait & see how it plays out. Trump wants to put it & everything else off until after the election, something he may not be able to manage at all. I suspect Mazars is putting the package together now so that they can more readily comply should the need arise. They don't want to be in the middle of this so they'll take the easy way out. Trump? He's just another client. Bye, Felicia.