Man accidentally shoots himself in testicles! CCW FTL

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JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,630
2,014
126
I'm not sure how long it takes you to rack a slide but you must be doing it wrong.

There's a couple of things wrong with this.

1. Seconds count.
2. Good luck remembering to rack the slide when you're in one of those situations, chances are you won't.
3. There's a reason you don't train to rack the slide, in a high pressure situation you revert back to your training, so you'd probably end up racking the slide in between every shot.

Cops don't carry their weapons with a round in the chamber just for the fun of it.
 
Jun 27, 2005
19,251
1
61
Yep. Locked and loaded semi auto in the waistband. Glocks don't have a safety.

Not a traditional one anyway... There is a button on the back of the grip and another one on the trigger. Both have to be held down to fire. Basicall you have to have your hand on the gun to shoot.

Lynnwood police are continuing to investigate but "at this point it does look like it's accidental," Sessions said.

Like he'd shoot himself in the nuts on purpose...
 

TheVrolok

Lifer
Dec 11, 2000
24,254
4,076
136
Because you are implying I said the extra time is no big deal which is incorrect. I said that the time advantage is not worth the risk to me. That's a personal decision that I am making based on having all the information.

I do think it's interesting that the decision you've made "having the information" differs from the decision that experts have made. Sure, you can do as you please, but all we who are disagreeing with you are saying is that most people think you're doing it wrong.


That's correct.

So firearm manufacturers are perfect? There's no such thing as a gun recall? Wow, I'm impressed.

A non-tried and true firearm should NOT be your choice for concealed carry. Have guns changed over time due to mishaps? Absolutely. Look at the whole DAO movement in response to "accidental discharges." However, handguns have come a long way and most agree that the odds of your particular sidearm malfunctioning due to manufacturer error are far less of a risk than you're not being able to fire the first shot when needed.


I'm not sure how long it takes you to rack a slide but you must be doing it wrong.

Time and time again studies have shown that under stress situations you want to limit as many steps as possible. The bottom line is that racking a slide takes extra time, period. It is an additional movement between drawing the weapon and taking aim. It will delay your first accurate shot. Period. Will it only add 1-2 seconds? Yes, but you may be dead in 1-2 seconds. As long as we're talking about time, I'll mention Jerry Miculek. He holds the record for firing 6 shots, reloading, and firing another 6 shots. He did this with A DOUBLE ACTION REVOLVER. His time? 2.99 seconds. Yes, this is an extreme example as you will most likely not get jumped by someone with the training/practice of a championship shooter. However, more than likely you will be taken by surprise and be at a timing/tactical disadvantage. My point? 1-2 seconds can ABSOLUTELY be the difference between life and death.
 

JulesMaximus

No Lifer
Jul 3, 2003
74,456
854
126
ah good, we've deteriorated into name-calling. I'm glad someone with your maturity is not carrying.

I'm just messing with you nancy. Don't take it personally. :p

Don't you have any guy friends? Shirley they have teased you worse. :p
 

thepd7

Diamond Member
Jan 2, 2005
9,429
0
0
There's a couple of things wrong with this.

1. Seconds count.
2. Good luck remembering to rack the slide when you're in one of those situations, chances are you won't.
3. There's a reason you don't train to rack the slide, in a high pressure situation you revert back to your training, so you'd probably end up racking the slide in between every shot.

Cops don't carry their weapons with a round in the chamber just for the fun of it.

1. You are correct. Please show me in the thread where I disagreed with this.
2. I will because that's how I train
3. See above. Unless you shoot a magic gun at the range you rack the slide too, it just depends on how exactly/when you rack it when you are at the range. I happen to train exactly how I would act in a real situation.

I am not a cop. If I carried on a belt open or expected to draw on a daily basis I would have a round in the chamber too.


I do think it's interesting that the decision you've made "having the information" differs from the decision that experts have made. Sure, you can do as you please, but all we who are disagreeing with you are saying is that most people think you're doing it wrong.



A non-tried and true firearm should NOT be your choice for concealed carry. Have guns changed over time due to mishaps? Absolutely. Look at the whole DAO movement in response to "accidental discharges." However, handguns have come a long way and most agree that the odds of your particular sidearm malfunctioning due to manufacturer error are far less of a risk than you're not being able to fire the first shot when needed.




Time and time again studies have shown that under stress situations you want to limit as many steps as possible. The bottom line is that racking a slide takes extra time, period. It is an additional movement between drawing the weapon and taking aim. It will delay your first accurate shot. Period. Will it only add 1-2 seconds? Yes, but you may be dead in 1-2 seconds. As long as we're talking about time, I'll mention Jerry Miculek. He holds the record for firing 6 shots, reloading, and firing another 6 shots. He did this with A DOUBLE ACTION REVOLVER. His time? 2.99 seconds. Yes, this is an extreme example as you will most likely not get jumped by someone with the training/practice of a championship shooter. However, more than likely you will be taken by surprise and be at a timing/tactical disadvantage. My point? 1-2 seconds can ABSOLUTELY be the difference between life and death.

As I said, it's a personal decision. Just because people disagree doesn't mean it's the wrong decision for me. If anything anyone good with guns should know that if you are uncomfortable doing something that's going to cause a lot of problems. I grew up around guns and have 6 but I don't feel comfortable carrying with a round in the chamber. So I don't.

Is Ruger a tried and true firearm company? I already said that the risk of a misfire is unlikely. I also said the possibility of me needing to use my gun is unlikely. Which risk I choose to take is my decision.


I already addressed your last point. I'm not interested in killing someone about to rob me or even kill me. I carry to prevent things such as mall shootings or other violent crimes in my vicinity. I carry to be a first responder, not for personal protection. In a first responder type situation it's most likely I will have time to rack the slide and identify the target. Again, the second or two it takes does matter, but I make the decision to completely negate any risk of misfire and take on the risk of needing that extra second.


I'm just messing with you nancy. Don't take it personally. :p

Don't you have any guy friends? Shirley they have teased you worse. :p

Just because you have a crush on me doesn't mean you need to tease me, this isn't elementary school Julie.
 

jlee

Lifer
Sep 12, 2001
48,511
219
106
Again, the second or two it takes does matter, but I make the decision to completely negate any risk of misfire and take on the risk of needing that extra second.

Are you worried about a misfire or an accidental discharge? Carrying on an empty chamber isn't going to decrease your chance of a misfire.
 

Analog

Lifer
Jan 7, 2002
12,755
3
0
Several things.

1. There's nothing wrong with carrying your gun with a round in the chamber, I don't understand why you WOULDN'T carry with one in the chamber. If you're gun is secure it's not going to discharge and the only time you should pull it out is if you're going to use it, if you're going to use it then you probably don't have time to rack a round in the chamber anyways.

2. There's nothing wrong with carrying a gun in your waistband, if you're using a holster designed for that. I used to have one and it was really comfortable.

3. There's nothing wrong with guns that don't have safeties, they all have internal safety mechanisms so the gun won't discharge unless you actually pull the trigger.

4. I've noticed that Analog has a habit of posting news articles in off topic with inflamatory titles that have nothing to do with the actual article and he rarely returns to the thread. He is a troll.

I am actually an avid shooter, if you knew me. I do return to threads all the time, but I don't needlessly respond to posts, and if you think I'm a troll, that's your opinion. I don't endlessly defend the things I post so that I feel better about myself. I do think, that if you ask this guy, carrying concealed from his point of view, was a loss, therefore FTL. It has nothing to do with anyone else, and anything inferred is strictly in your mind. As a professor, I tend to let my students think things through. This might be one of those teaching moments - embrace it.
 

JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,630
2,014
126
1. You are correct. Please show me in the thread where I disagreed with this.

Don't play stupid, you know exactly what I was talking about.

2. I will because that's how I train

That's odd. You rack the slide as you bring your gun up and acquire your target?

3. See above. Unless you shoot a magic gun at the range you rack the slide too, it just depends on how exactly/when you rack it when you are at the range. I happen to train exactly how I would act in a real situation.

Yes, you rack the slide when you have to change mags, not when you initially draw your weapon to shoot. Drawing your weapon and acquiring your target should be one fluid motion, racking the slide shouldn't be part of that. If that was the best way to do it then that's how cops would train. It isn't, so they don't. Drawing your weapon and having to rack the slide could cost you your life, if you're fine with taking that risk then that's up to you, but it's not the correct way to do it. That's all I'm saying.

I am not a cop. If I carried on a belt open or expected to draw on a daily basis I would have a round in the chamber too.

I'm not sure what the difference is between carrying the weapon in a holster on your belt and carrying your weapon in an inside the waistband holster, aside from weapon retention. Neither one of those methods would be more likely to cause an accidental misfire...

Comments in bold.
 

JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,630
2,014
126
I am actually an avid shooter, if you knew me. I do return to threads all the time, but I don't needlessly respond to posts, and if you think I'm a troll, that's your opinion. I don't endlessly defend the things I post so that I feel better about myself. I do think, that if you ask this guy, carrying concealed from his point of view, was a loss, therefore FTL. It has nothing to do with anyone else, and anything inferred is strictly in your mind. As a professor, I tend to let my students think things through. This might be one of those teaching moments - embrace it.

Really? You think this guy has thought through conceal carry laws? You're the one that implied that CCW is a bad thing due to this incident. I'm not the only one that noticed that, sounds like you need to work on thinking things through yourself.

As I'm sure you know, CCW refers to CCW laws and carrying a weapon legally, it didn't say anywhere in the article that this guy had a CCW permit. That's why so many people called you out, professor.
 
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jlee

Lifer
Sep 12, 2001
48,511
219
106
I am actually an avid shooter, if you knew me. I do return to threads all the time, but I don't needlessly respond to posts, and if you think I'm a troll, that's your opinion. I don't endlessly defend the things I post so that I feel better about myself. I do think, that if you ask this guy, carrying concealed from his point of view, was a loss, therefore FTL. It has nothing to do with anyone else, and anything inferred is strictly in your mind. As a professor, I tend to let my students think things through. This might be one of those teaching moments - embrace it.

C'mon dude. Your thread title is like "Man severely injured in DUI crash. Cars FTL."
 

pontifex

Lifer
Dec 5, 2000
43,806
46
91
I'm not concerned with my personal safety, for me carry is solely about preventing instances where I am not the primary target.

I hope your state laws allow that. some states only allow you to use lethal force only if you personally (or family member) are being attacked. There may even be states that don't allow you to use it outside of your home.

I carry to be a first responder, not for personal protection. In a first responder type situation it's most likely I will have time to rack the slide and identify the target. Again, the second or two it takes does matter, but I make the decision to completely negate any risk of misfire and take on the risk of needing that extra second.

wow...just....wow....my comment above really stands! you some kind of vigilante or mall ninja?
 
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spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
65,469
5
76
I am actually an avid shooter, if you knew me. I do return to threads all the time, but I don't needlessly respond to posts, and if you think I'm a troll, that's your opinion. I don't endlessly defend the things I post so that I feel better about myself. I do think, that if you ask this guy, carrying concealed from his point of view, was a loss, therefore FTL. It has nothing to do with anyone else, and anything inferred is strictly in your mind. As a professor, I tend to let my students think things through. This might be one of those teaching moments - embrace it.

Nah, you can't defend your position. I am not your student, if you want this to be a teaching moment then let it be how to properly carry and handle a weapon.

If you are a professor on campus be careful, we can't protect you from an armed killer.

God I hate intellectual masturbaters, until their masturbation is interrupted their fantasy isn't interrupted by reality.
 

thepd7

Diamond Member
Jan 2, 2005
9,429
0
0
Are you worried about a misfire or an accidental discharge? Carrying on an empty chamber isn't going to decrease your chance of a misfire.

Do you correct someone every time they call a pistol magazine a clip too? What's up your butt today?


Comments in bold.

1. I don't know what you are talking about. I said seconds count. I also said I care more about completely eliminating the possibility of an accidental discharge. You then brought up seconds counting again. ???

2. Yes, I rack my slide immediately before I fire and shoot slightly quicker than a once per second pace, 3-5 shot bursts.

3-4. Now you just plain aren't reading anything I write. I'm not a cop and I never contested that in their situation they should carry with a round in the chamber. I can shoot just as fluid racking the slide as you can without, it just takes me slightly longer. If you'd like to have a contest drop by Austin anytime.


I hope your state laws allow that. some states only allow you to use lethal force only if you personally (or family member) are being attacked. There may even be states that don't allow you to use it outside of your home.

wow...just....wow....my comment above really stands! you some kind of vigilante or mall ninja?

I live in Texas. In my state we allow responsible citizens to protect others, every people we don't know. I can use lethal force to stop any felony as well as a myriad of personal property crimes.

I'm neither, simply someone who wants to be able to stop a tragedy from occurring around me.
 

jlee

Lifer
Sep 12, 2001
48,511
219
106
Do you correct someone every time they call a pistol magazine a clip too? What's up your butt today?
Magazine/clip are fairly interchangeable..not technically the same thing, but close. Misfire and accidental discharge are entirely different. Carrying a gun in a purse without a holster could cause a misfire when you attempt to use it, due to crap getting jammed in the gun somewhere...misfire and AD are essentially opposites. :p
 
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Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
I didnt see shit about CCL I doubt this retard had a license to carry. They kinda make you jump through hoops to make sure you're not an idiot and it's like $200 for 5 years and $75 class. Basically nobody I know in RL carries in their waist band ....only gang banger I see in movies. This thread sucks.
 

JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,630
2,014
126
You mean you can't call timeout with the baddy?

I'm not sure how long it takes you to rack a slide but you must be doing it wrong.



1. I don't know what you are talking about. I said seconds count. I also said I care more about completely eliminating the possibility of an accidental discharge. You then brought up seconds counting again. ???

TheVrolok was basically saying that you wouldn't have time to rack the slide when shit hits the fan. It seems to me that you were saying that the time that it takes to rack the slide is negligable, which is why I said that every second counts.

2. Yes, I rack my slide immediately before I fire and shoot slightly quicker than a once per second pace, 3-5 shot bursts.

And like I said, there's a reason why law enforcement doesn't train this way, it's slow and could really cause you some problems in the heat of the moment.

3-4. Now you just plain aren't reading anything I write. I'm not a cop and I never contested that in their situation they should carry with a round in the chamber. I can shoot just as fluid racking the slide as you can without, it just takes me slightly longer. If you'd like to have a contest drop by Austin anytime.

I read what you wrote, you're not comprehending what I'm saying. The reason that I keep coming back to the way that police train is because they're the experts and they've spent countless hours analyzing this stuff. I was a cop and they went over this stuff at the academy.

Obviously it's gonna take you slightly longer, which is the whole point. It's also NOT as fluid as simply drawing your weapon, acquiring your target, and firing. It's one fluid movement to draw your weapon with your right hand and bring your left hand up to your right hand as you're acquiring your target. Your hands come together in the middle of your body as you're bringing your gun up. If you throw racking the slide in there then you have to either bring your hand up above the weapon to rack the slide then bring it back down to the handle of the weapon, or you'd have to turn the gun sideways while you're drawing it to rack the slide, then turn it back up and bring your left hand back to the gun, kind of like a "tap rack ready" drill.

It's not nearly as fluid, that's not even debatable.

It's simply quicker and more efficient to keep one in the chamber when it comes time to actually use your gun. I'm pretty sure the odds of your gun randomly going off in your holster is much lower than the odds of you needing to use your gun to defend yourself or someone else. If it just makes you feel better then fine, I understand that, but it's not supported by facts or reality. To each his own I guess.
 

thepd7

Diamond Member
Jan 2, 2005
9,429
0
0
It's simply quicker and more efficient to keep one in the chamber when it comes time to actually use your gun. I'm pretty sure the odds of your gun randomly going off in your holster is much lower than the odds of you needing to use your gun to defend yourself or someone else. If it just makes you feel better then fine, I understand that, but it's not supported by facts or reality. To each his own I guess.

You say you are reading my posts but you aren't considering this is exactly what I've said 3 times. I am going to go ahead and ignore you now since you've already started ignoring me.
 

JD50

Lifer
Sep 4, 2005
11,630
2,014
126
You say you are reading my posts but you aren't considering this is exactly what I've said 3 times. I am going to go ahead and ignore you now since you've already started ignoring me.

:rolleyes:
 

shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
82,854
17,365
136
1) No details on cause of incident
2) Wild accusation that CCW is bad

/lawnchair

matt-eat-popcorn.jpg
 

pontifex

Lifer
Dec 5, 2000
43,806
46
91
I didnt see shit about CCL I doubt this retard had a license to carry. They kinda make you jump through hoops to make sure you're not an idiot and it's like $200 for 5 years and $75 class. Basically nobody I know in RL carries in their waist band ....only gang banger I see in movies. This thread sucks.

depends on state. PA requires background check and like $20.
 

TheVrolok

Lifer
Dec 11, 2000
24,254
4,076
136
I already addressed your last point. I'm not interested in killing someone about to rob me or even kill me. I carry to prevent things such as mall shootings or other violent crimes in my vicinity. I carry to be a first responder, not for personal protection. In a first responder type situation it's most likely I will have time to rack the slide and identify the target. Again, the second or two it takes does matter, but I make the decision to completely negate any risk of misfire and take on the risk of needing that extra second.

This explains so much. I'm absolutely stunned. Stunned. So you DON'T want to use your firearm if someone is attempting to KILL you, but you DO want to use it to be a weekend warrior law enforcement officer? I'm sorry that this is offensive, but that's absolutely absurd. Many states don't even allow that, and even in your state of Texas you may be facing legal trouble based on certain precedents. The reason to carry a concealed weapon is first and foremost SELF-DEFENSE, you DO NOT get your CWL/CWP/CCW to become a "wanna-be" LEO. That's quite simply not what it's for... I can't even believe you'd say something like that and pretend to be responsible about firearms. My mind is literally blown. If you want to carry heat and protect those around you join the force, otherwise, stay out of the way.
 

thepd7

Diamond Member
Jan 2, 2005
9,429
0
0
This explains so much. I'm absolutely stunned. Stunned. So you DON'T want to use your firearm if someone is attempting to KILL you, but you DO want to use it to be a weekend warrior law enforcement officer? I'm sorry that this is offensive, but that's absolutely absurd. Many states don't even allow that, and even in your state of Texas you may be facing legal trouble based on certain precedents. The reason to carry a concealed weapon is first and foremost SELF-DEFENSE, you DO NOT get your CWL/CWP/CCW to become a "wanna-be" LEO. That's quite simply not what it's for... I can't even believe you'd say something like that and pretend to be responsible about firearms. My mind is literally blown. If you want to carry heat and protect those around you join the force, otherwise, stay out of the way.

What precedents? The law is very clear. I know this because I have the relevant law printed out sitting at my desk.

I'm not a wanna-be LEO, I'm a citizen who has the lawful right to stop certain crimes. If I choose not to stop them against me, that's my decision.

I'm really not following your logic: I'm irresponsible with firearms because I want to prevent mall shootings?

LOOK I CAN USE CAPS TOO. IF A CONCEALED CARRY LICENSE IS FOR SELF-DEFENSE THAN THE LAW SHOULD SAY THIS.

Question: if someone starting shooting people near you and you had your carry weapon, would you draw your weapon and fire at them? OMGHOLYSHITYOUWOULD? WANNABELEOWTFBBLEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

You crack me up.
 

thepd7

Diamond Member
Jan 2, 2005
9,429
0
0
This explains so much. I'm absolutely stunned. Stunned. So you DON'T want to use your firearm if someone is attempting to KILL you, but you DO want to use it to be a weekend warrior law enforcement officer? I'm sorry that this is offensive, but that's absolutely absurd. Many states don't even allow that, and even in your state of Texas you may be facing legal trouble based on certain precedents. The reason to carry a concealed weapon is first and foremost SELF-DEFENSE, you DO NOT get your CWL/CWP/CCW to become a "wanna-be" LEO. That's quite simply not what it's for... I can't even believe you'd say something like that and pretend to be responsible about firearms. My mind is literally blown. If you want to carry heat and protect those around you join the force, otherwise, stay out of the way.

also shens on anyone who has a CCL calling carrying a gun "heat"