I'd argue that a lot of the "power users" here are also hardware enthusiasts.. it's easier to take a PC and OC/push it in various aspects. Sure, it's not really OS dependent, but playing with hardware is significantly easier with a PC than a Mac. As for development, sure Mac is just as good as PC (maybe a bit better?), which is just as good as Unix (I'd prefer Unix/Linux over either of the other two) so that really isn't part of the power use argument then. Also, a lot of power users enjoying tweaking.. and OSX isn't as tweak friendly as Windows. So please, don't over simplify and degrade power users just to support Apple.
You know, I slapped an Apple sticker over the Dell logo on my laptop (because I was angry with Dell's outsourced tech support), and it was faster, more powerful and significantly cheaper than a comparable Apple laptop.
So, I got the entire "Apple Experience" with more power, functionality and at half the price. :thumbsup:
So, I got the entire "Apple Experience" with more power, functionality and at half the price. :thumbsup:
- Sep 19, 2000
- 10,286
- 145
- 106
My dislike for macs has nothing to do with the fact that it is a *nix variant. It has more to do with the fact that it is expensive, those that market it are full of crap, and the users generally have an elitist attitude around them.
From "Worlds most powerful pc" to "A computer that doesn't get viruses and just works" mac ads have been full of fud that mac users seem to just lap up.
Apple should just stay out of the PC industry. Though, I will give them that they did do a good job with their Ipods and Iphones.
Ok, I don't think people go to the apple store for their next comp they're going to demo on XtremeSystems with phase change cooling. But as for their laptops, I see no reason why an Apple laptop won't work for many people. If you want the 17" monstrosities for gaming that Dell offers, sure, but if you're looking for something midsized like 13 or 15" solutions, I don't see what's bad about Apple. I decided between a MBP, Thinkpad T61 and a Dell XPS 15". Came down to the MBP in the end because it was the lightest with a solid LED backlit screen.
And to be honest AT doesn't have the most hardcore hardware enthusiasts. The tech section IMO is dying on this forum and less and less experts are here now.
effowe
Diamond Member
- Nov 1, 2004
- 6,012
- 18
- 81
Said hardware enthusiasts can build a Hackintosh that will run OSX side by side with Windows and Linux, giving them control over their hardware and OS. As far as tweaking is concerned, there are tons of ways you can customize and tweak OSX, here's a list with just 50 of them.
http://www.mactricksandtips.co...terminal-commands.html
halik
Lifer
- Oct 10, 2000
- 25,696
- 1
- 81
I'm not defending anything, but for my purposes OSX is far superior to Windows (xp, vista... haven't used 7 ). I don't play games, which is about the only reason I can think of you'd need windows for. That and excel.
But since you can run either on the same hardware (osx86 woop woop), the choice is pretty easy.
I used OSX every day for over a year. It is nothing special. It is a prettier Windows, though not really any more since Vista and especially Windows 7. They also charge for major patches/updates, whereas Microsoft provides major patches/updates for free.
It is also not "more secure"...it's just that nobody bothers writing viruses for an OS that accounts for like 3% of the computer market. Why would they waste their time with such an insignificant number?
Macs are also not "superior" to PCs in any way, shape and form. They all use the same parts since Apple switched to Intel x86 processors years ago. The only thing "greater" about Macs are that they charge 2x the price for nothing more than a brand name that is vastly underpowered to a comparable PC.
Platypus
Lifer
- Apr 26, 2001
- 31,046
- 321
- 136
Um, seriously re-read what I said. I'm not blindly defending a company, I'm taking the proper neutral stance in this case. Hating a certain product or brand in this case will cause you to make an uninformed decision. Let's say you need to buy a server but you hate Sun... but their product has the best performance at the best cost. You decide to go with IBM and end up with a higher cost and less performance. That's just one generic case of what I'm talking about. I see this CONSTANTLY in enterprise environments and it's just ridiculous.
What specific reason do you hate Apple products? Hating their user base or their marketing is not a valid answer.
The crux of my point is, every OS and platform out there has strengths and weaknesses.. if it doesn't work for you then don't use it, but don't talk shit about it with a smug attitude because you think you're above it... and don't buy into marketing FUD. Judge a products worth by it's real world application. An absolutely perfect case of this is the user in this thread that said he hates apple because itunes sucks and he wants control over his ipod. Had he spent 5 seconds on google he would have found multiple alternatives. My post was not just directed at you OP.
Why build a Hackintosh (with the extra effort) rather than just pick up a PC? I'm really not trying to trash talk Apple, while it's not for my uses, I can completely understand the segment of the market that buys Apple (minus paying the extra $$ for the Apple name).
Platypus
Lifer
- Apr 26, 2001
- 31,046
- 321
- 136
Yes they charge more for their hardware but because they have a more strict scope of the interaction of their hardware and software it performs better than Windows on a similarly equipped machine. I'll 100% agree that it's overpriced but you're paying for the engineering behind it and it does perform better for some applications and because of that it's the preferred choice for said certain apps.
And you're stating your opinion as fact. Macs might not be 'superior' for YOU but that doesn't mean they are not for someone else.
GeekDrew
Diamond Member
- Jun 7, 2000
- 9,099
- 19
- 81
Eh, not so much. I've used linux plenty - I'm far from a decent sysadmin on linux, but I run a few webservers running various linux distros. I've had it on my home PC before as well. It isn't the underlying code that bothers me, it's the graphical user interface that annoys the hell out of me. If I knew where to directly change settings (text files, the registry in windows, etc) - IP address configuration, mail server configuration, etc., for the o/s and various apps, then I'd prefer to do that than click through the endless bullshit user interface. KDE and GNOME both make sense to me. I don't mind running computers that use either for a GUI. I don't mind running linux environments that don't have a GUI. I just *hate loathe and despise* the OSX GUI.
The high price also doesn't thrill me, particularly when I can set up a linux distro that allows me to do whatever I need to - without any up-front software costs at all.
And the single-button mouse/trackpad/whatever annoys me. I'm too used to having multiple buttons - at least 2 buttons and a scroll wheel - and even on a PC, I get frustrated when I have less than (Left, Right, Middle Click + Middle Wheel, Side Forward, Side Backwards).
Again, I'm not saying that Apple has no benefits or reason for existence, but I personally find almost 100% of what they do to be annoying to no end.
sourceninja
Diamond Member
- Mar 8, 2005
- 8,805
- 65
- 91
I'm a power user. I use OSX. Before that I used linux. I've not been in the windows scene in a long long time.
I use OSX for management of my unix servers, shell scripting (for said management), developing iPhone applications, developing OSX applications, developing linux applications, developing web applications, and playing a few games now and then.
I love OSX. I gave it a lot of grief for a long time. Now, I find it to be the best built unix operating system I can get in a notebook.
Oh yea, that's my other change, I don't want desktop computers anymore. I want notebooks. I like being outside.
I use OSX for management of my unix servers, shell scripting (for said management), developing iPhone applications, developing OSX applications, developing linux applications, developing web applications, and playing a few games now and then.
I love OSX. I gave it a lot of grief for a long time. Now, I find it to be the best built unix operating system I can get in a notebook.
Oh yea, that's my other change, I don't want desktop computers anymore. I want notebooks. I like being outside.
0roo0roo
No Lifer
- Sep 21, 2002
- 64,795
- 84
- 91
dude, atots sad seriously, you just heard of this and its from %@# march. it was the most pathetic portion of the contest really. don't buy headline hype.
"Last year, Miller's winning attack on Safari actually targeted the open source Perl Compatible Regular Expressions library used by WebKit?s JavaScript engine, an exploit he also made headlines with for using against the iPhone. Apple's extensive use of open source software makes it far easier for researchers to discover exploits for at their leisure, compared to closed proprietary software. It wasn't Apple's proprietary code in Safari that was cracked.
"
"Last year's contest was also distorted by the arbitrary timing of patches, with Miller's successful exploit for Safari happening to miss Apple's patch cycle, while other researchers armed with exploits for Windows Vista were stymied by the last minute application of the then-new Vista Service Pack 1.
"
"Internet Explorer 8 on the Windows machine was exploited shortly afterward by a different researcher calling himself Nil, followed by his demonstration of a successful crack of the Firefox browser. "
so lol at ie8 and suggesting firefox ...is off the mark as well
http://www.appleinsider.com/ar...s_pwn2own_contest.html
"Last year, Miller's winning attack on Safari actually targeted the open source Perl Compatible Regular Expressions library used by WebKit?s JavaScript engine, an exploit he also made headlines with for using against the iPhone. Apple's extensive use of open source software makes it far easier for researchers to discover exploits for at their leisure, compared to closed proprietary software. It wasn't Apple's proprietary code in Safari that was cracked.
"
"Last year's contest was also distorted by the arbitrary timing of patches, with Miller's successful exploit for Safari happening to miss Apple's patch cycle, while other researchers armed with exploits for Windows Vista were stymied by the last minute application of the then-new Vista Service Pack 1.
"
"Internet Explorer 8 on the Windows machine was exploited shortly afterward by a different researcher calling himself Nil, followed by his demonstration of a successful crack of the Firefox browser. "
so lol at ie8 and suggesting firefox ...is off the mark as well
http://www.appleinsider.com/ar...s_pwn2own_contest.html
- Sep 19, 2000
- 10,286
- 145
- 106
Fine, I can see where you are coming from.
Specific reasons for disliking apple.
* Dishonest marketing. I'm sorry if that doesn't qualify for you, but for me, I really hate companies that publicly advocate dishonesty.
* Price. Most apple products (not all) are over priced. It is easy to prove by just looking at comparable PCs. And there is little reason for it. Apple doesn't have products that are vastly superior or anything, they just have more expensive products.
Those are the two main reasons for me hating macs. Reasons I would never get a mac (And not necessarily something that apple is doing wrong, IE not something to get angry over).
* There is far less software for the mac operating system.
* Mac is just a unix variant, If I want a *nix environment I'll just go with Linux.
* IMO the mac interface is not better/easier to use then any other interface. So where is the benefit?
I can see why fanboyism is annoying, believe me, I've seen it first hand from people defending intel products over AMD products (When AMD offered a better price/performance in the K7/K8 era) and when Intel began producing better products then amd (The Core2 era). It is annoying as no reason can break through to them. (And whats worse, they will literally go into a state of denial when proven wrong).
I just can't see a good reason to choose a mac over a PC, hence I can't see what sort of place they can really have in the market.
mac sucks. the only thing they got going for them is build quality, however, the price premium pretty much negates this fact.
halik
Lifer
- Oct 10, 2000
- 25,696
- 1
- 81
You've never done any development, have you?
OSX is far, far superior if you need to work with open source libraries for any sort of coding. The only option on windows is cygwin to my knowledge and setting that up is a huge mess.
Also there's still no real implementation of virtual desktops on windows, that little MS powertoy is crap. Another thing, dragging files into a folder doesn't open it when you hover over the folder icon, so if you're trying to drop it 2 levels deep, you're sol.
Platypus
Lifer
- Apr 26, 2001
- 31,046
- 321
- 136
Completely untrue. If you've ever had to write code or create scripts or edit video or record music these applications are FAR better suited to the OSX platform in my opinion. It all depends on what you use your computer for. Windows might do everything you want to do on a Mac just as well, and that's great, go ahead and use it... but I cannot get anything remotely close to the level of professional quality for recording except for maybe ProTools and I don't have the money for it. Logic is one of the best applications out there. Final Cut is amazing. The ability to have a native UNIX shell environment is essential for me. These things do not exist in Windows unfortunately.
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