Leaked ATI S.I. 6870 benchmark

[sandorski]

All this is for naught. In June when VIA releases their super secret Vidchip even AMD will abandon the Market.

 

[Markfw]

scali was banned for incessant trolling. he was warned by 3 THREE!! different mods in the same thread to cool it. he argued with idc, then argued with markfw900, then he even tried to argue with esquared. this is a little bit different, and frankly it appears that the rules here in video are much looser than in most of the other forums. in fact, scali was doing similar crap here but most of us just accepted it as video cards forum bs.

jfamd would almost certainly lose his job for posting an ipc claim before any board partners/professional review sites or even amd itself had working silicon. he's not here as some anonymous yahoo who can claim anything that he wants. besides, how many people here really believe that it would help amd's sales to come clean right now with expected ipc vs SB?

I will let Idontcare answer also, but lets just say, the times, they are a changing ! He hasn't been here long, but I am sure soon, he will get this under control, so be warned, "There is a new sheriff in town".

And I am spending more time here also. You guys can talk all you want about stuff, and disagre. The minute it gets personal, thats when we are going to say NO.

 

[tviceman]

I hear the 6750 is probably only going to be 10% faster than the 6730. The TDP being only 3% more though will probably make up for this.

I also think if the re-spin, 6890 (probably out Feb-March 2011 if AMD keeps its usual timeline up), can do at least 8-12% over the 6870, AMD will easily defeat the 512SP GTX485 by 10% or more.

6890? Timeline? You mean like the 5890 that was supposed to be released back in April and trounce on Nvidia's single performance crown parade?

 

[Idontcare]

I will let Idontcare answer also, but lets just say, the times, they are a changing ! He hasn't been here long, but I am sure soon, he will get this under control, so be warned, "There is a new sheriff in town".

And I am spending more time here also. You guys can talk all you want about stuff, and disagre. The minute it gets personal, thats when we are going to say NO.

Well said :thumbsup:

 

[bryanW1995]

I think there is a misunderstanding between the words "launch/announcement" and retail availability. The one person who said ATI is going to launch cards in October (12th?) didn't specify that the cards will actually be available in stores in October. From several rumours from online sources (i.e., http://www.thinq.co.uk/2010/8/13/rumour-radeon-hd-6000-set-october-launch/), it was generally the case that ATI intended to launch/announce HD6000 in October, with parts shipping in November, however.

Alternatively, this source also supports my assessment that high end cards won't ship until November: http://vr-zone.com/articles/-rumour...schedule-first-iteration-in-october/9688.html

"The first HD 6000 GPU to be released will be the Radeon HD 6700 series, codenamed Barts. The HD 6700 is scheduled for a release as early as October. As suggested by the nomenclature, the HD 6700 will directly replace the HD 5700 series. The HD 6700 release will be followed up by Cayman in November, expected to be branded as the ATI Radeon HD 6800 series, replacing the current HD 5800 series. The flagship will be Antilles, and branded as the ATI Radeon HD 6970. Antilles, as expected, will be a dual-GPU Cayman. The Radeon HD 6970 is scheduled for December. "

If ATI can also ship in October, great, but there is no evidence to support that.

If High end HD6870 is 35% faster than 5870, and mid-range is 1/2 of that, then 6770 is going to be 67.5% of the 5870's performance (or slightly slower than the 5850). Given the lackluster performance of the 5770 which could barely match the 4870 and couldn't beat either of the GTX275 or 4890, 6770 may not be much faster than the 5850, if not slower.

according to tempered81 6770 will be 320 alu vs 480 for 6870, so it will be 2/3 instead of 1/2. I don't remember where he got his info, but he posted a bunch of slides to support his data.

 

[Sylvanas]

Interesting article I found over at XS - http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=258344 . I'm not sure if this is good or bad, but if it's true AMD was pissed at Volterra (according to the thread), maybe these are better (overvolting potential/stability?). CHiL's are used on the GTX 480.

This is interesting, this means programs like MSI Afterburner might have support for voltage adjustment on launch or at least only require a small update. CHiL came out of nowhere really and it looks like they have been knocking out quality products, including developer software for their IC's. :thumbsup:

 

[Grooveriding]

according to tempered81 6770 will be 320 alu vs 480 for 6870, so it will be 2/3 instead of 1/2. I don't remember where he got his info, but he posted a bunch of slides to support his data.

So as per that data, 6770 will precede 6870 in October, then we get 6870 in November. Interesting that they may go that way.

So likely no 6970 until December or January.

I hope we see a reference card of the 6870 with in excess of 1GB of VRAM. The 2GB 5870s were few and far between, even now. Hope ATI is going to take it up a notch, with the amount of power the 6870 is going to have, it ought to have more than the standard 1GB of memory to suit high resolutions.

 

[bryanW1995]

according to tempered81 6870 will still be 1gb.

 

[OCGuy]

according to tempered81 6870 will still be 1gb.

And unless you are the small % that play on 30 inch monitors, you really have no need for > 1GB.

What would happen if any other industry added a niche feature on a base model that drove up the MSRP such a large % for no reason?

 

[Tempered81]

I am only quoting atiforum.de about the 1gb on the ref cayman board. I don't know any of that stuff for a fact since I have no Northern Islands cards in my possession. Btw, some new rumors and pictures:
http://translate.google.com/transla...6000er-serie&hl=en&client=opera&hs=O4B&rls=en

Caicos: Low-end GPU replaced Cedar/RV810
Turks: Mid-range GPU replaced Redwood/RV830
Barts: High-Mid-Range GPU replaced Juniper/RV840
Cayman: High-end GPU replaced Cypress/RV870
Antilles: Dual-GPU top-model replaces Hemlock/R800
Furthermore, we could bring in experience that the series HD6000er probably the first to CHL a digital PWM control of the company will have CHIL.

And so gpuz says 256bit, but look at these:

Cayman pro will a bit longer than HD5870.
Core clcok=850Mhz
TDP<200W
Vapor heatsink(Not flat)
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showpost.php?p=4532813&postcount=263

New GPU family pricing structure:
(pricing relative to the launch price of the Radeon HD 5000 series cards)

Code:
Antilles:
Radeon HD 6970 ---------- N/A
Radeon HD 6950 ---------- Radeon HD 5970 ($599)

Cayman:
Radeon HD 6870 ---------- N/A
N/A ---------- Radeon HD 5870 ($399)
Radeon HD 6850 ---------- N/A
Radeon HD 6830 ---------- Radeon HD 5850 ($299)

Barts:
Radeon HD 6770 ---------- Radeon HD 5830 ($239)
Radeon HD 6750 ---------- Radeon HD 5770 ($159)
N/A ---------- Radeon HD 5750 ($109-129)

Turks:
Radeon HD 6670 ---------- Radeon HD 5670 ($99)
N/A ---------- Radeon HD 5570 ($79-85)
Radeon HD 6650 ---------- Radeon HD 5550 ($69)

Caicos:
Radeon HD 6xx0 ---------- Radeon HD 5450 ($49-59)
Radeon HD 6xx0 ---------- N/A
Memory bus width:
Antilles/Cayman 384-bit GDDR5
Barts 256-bit GDDR5
Turks 128-bit GDDR5
Caicos 64-bit DDR3
All variants has UVD 3.0.
Performance wise, Radeon HD 6770 will be slightly faster than GTX 460.

Cayman PRO (Radeon HD 6850?):
PCB is slightly longer than Radeon HD 5870 (by a small margin)
Card TDP <= 200 Watts
850 MHz core frequency at this stage (may subject to change on the retail version)
comes equipped with a vapor-chamber cooler with uneven surface, looks like it would be expensive to make

http://www.semiaccurate.com/forums/showpost.php?p=64560&postcount=333

~200w 6850 (up from 151 watts on 5850) and ~225w 6870 (up from 188 on 5870)... And now about 3 places are saying 384bit for the 6870... dunno if I should believe them or that gpuz screenshot...

Either way I'm looking forward to finding out!!!!

 

[OCGuy]

The good news fellas: Even when the leaks are suspect, you still get that feeling that a launch is imminent. And that should make us all happy 🙂

 

[brybir]

I am only quoting atiforum.de about the 1gb on the ref cayman board. I don't know any of that stuff for a fact since I have no Northern Islands cards in my possession.

*SNIP*

And so gpuz says 256bit, but look at these:

*SNIP*

Cayman pro will a bit longer than HD5870.
Core clcok=850Mhz
TDP<200W
Vapor heatsink(Not flat)
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showpost.php?p=4532813&postcount=263


*SNIP*

~200w 6850 (up from 151 watts on 5850) and ~225w 6870 (up from 188 on 5870)... And now about 3 places are saying 384bit for the 6870... dunno if I should believe them or that gpuz screenshot...

Either way I'm looking forward to finding out!!!!

Well a 384bit bus certainly implies a potential memory arrangement that is not an even 1GB given common memory package arrangements.


And since we have these rumors now, take a look a year ago at the rumors for 5X00 series:

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/hardware/2009/08/17/rumour-ati-rv870-gpu-to-use-384-bit-memory/1


That memory bus rumor is a perpetual rumor it seems.

 

[RussianSensation]

hehe if 6870 is really ~225W, I wonder what the hardcore ATI crowd will then say to dismiss it as they have been bashing Fermi cards running at 215-250W TDP. I fully expect power consumption to go up since we are still talking about a 40nm process and increased room is necessary for tessellation, which ultimately will increase die size.

Based on the chart provided above, it's hard to get excited about the 6770. If it's a replacement for the 5830 and NOT the 5850, then $239 MSRP would be way too high. Also, I would have thought that 6850 was going to be for sure faster than the 5870. I hope the chart above is only a reflection of price and not performance.

Thanks for the info Tempered.

 

[Will Robinson]

RussianSensation hehe if 6870 is really ~225W, I wonder what the hardcore ATI crowd will then say to dismiss it as they have been bashing Fermi cards running at 215-250W TDP.

They'll say: "nice try NVDA....ain't no performance crown for you again"😎

 

[HurleyBird]

If the 384-bit rumor is true, we may be looking at a core of Fermi-like proportions. Sounds like a full NI simply designed on 40nm despite the size. Or at the very least, an NI with somewhat fewer shaders, but a moderately expanded memory subsystem thanks to the die size.

In any case, rumor is just as likely to be wrong, but damn do I love all the speculation prior to a graphics launch.

 

[Grooveriding]

And unless you are the small % that play on 30 inch monitors, you really have no need for > 1GB.

What would happen if any other industry added a niche feature on a base model that drove up the MSRP such a large % for no reason?

Well that would be like the GTX 480 with 1.5GB, yes ? :whiste:

It needs to be done, especially with the whole eyefinity thing they want to push.

I am excited for these cards and plan to pick up 2 in a few months, but if they come with 1GB VRAM, will have to pass on them.

 

[OCGuy]

Well that would be like the GTX 480 with 1.5GB, yes ? :whiste:

It needs to be done, especially with the whole eyefinity thing they want to push.

I am excited for these cards and plan to pick up 2 in a few months, but if they come with 1GB VRAM, will have to pass on them.

Nobody on this forum will ever call me an AMD fanboi, believe me. But I will defend them releasing a 1GB card if it keeps the MSRP down.

If you can show me where > 1GB of VRAM on a 1080p monitor makes a *noticeable* difference in game, I will run home with my tail between my legs.

As soon as you get above 1080p, you get to a market where people have enough disposable income that a $30 premium on a card with 2GB is not a big deal.

 

[cusideabelincoln]

Nobody on this forum will ever call me an AMD fanboi, believe me. But I will defend them releasing a 1GB card if it keeps the MSRP down.

If you can show me where > 1GB of VRAM on a 1080p monitor makes a *noticeable* difference in game, I will run home with my tail between my legs.

As soon as you get above 1080p, you get to a market where people have enough disposable income that a $30 premium on a card with 2GB is not a big deal.

I'm pretty sure Groove runs 2560x1600, so he would want >1GB. Why would he be concerned with 1080p? He didn't say anyone should NOT buy these new cards if they only have 1GB of VRAM; he only said he wouldn't buy them.

 

[HurleyBird]

The way I see it, right now we're on the verge of needing more than 1GB of ram for general usage. It was pretty much the same for 4870... it only launched with 512MB and at the time it was fine, but six months later it started to become a hindrance and at the end of that generation most 4870/90's were at 1GB and it SHOWED in benchmarks.

However, if the 384-bit rumor is true, then 2GB is out of the picture, and I can't see AMD releasing a 3GB, no matter how great that would be for eyefinity. Chances are we'll see a 1.5GB card like Fermi which will be good for another year.

 

[Grooveriding]

The way I see it, right now we're on the verge of needing more than 1GB of ram for general usage. It was pretty much the same for 4870... it only launched with 512MB and at the time it was fine, but six months later it started to become a hindrance and at the end of that generation most 4870/90's were at 1GB and it SHOWED in benchmarks.

However, if the 384-bit rumor is true, then 2GB is out of the picture, and I can't see AMD releasing a 3GB, no matter how great that would be for eyefinity. Chances are we'll see a 1.5GB card like Fermi which will be good for another year.

I agree, with ATI and Nvidia both offering 3 monitor gaming, they need to offer more than 1GB of VRAM. Also, with the level of power these new cards are delivering, they're making it possible to play games at high resolutions with high settings now. A lack of VRAM brings the cards to a chug though at high resolutions, regardless of gpu horsepower.

I don't want 2GB necessarily. I was going on the comments of it possibly being a 256 bit card. If it is 384 bit, 1.5GB is fine. I have not hit a VRAM wall with my current cards, but did with my 5870s.

I'm not saying I think all the cards should come out with lots of memory either, ocguy. I'll pay a small premium for more memory. When 5870 released, there were no 2GB cards at all, anywhere, and weren't any for a long time. I just hope for them to have them available at release.

6870 may well shape up to be ATI's fermi. Bigger, hotter and louder. Considering how hot the 480s can be, I think they can get away with it. There should not be too many howls over it so long as they are not at 480 levels of heat.

If anything, the GTX 480 opened the window for them to deliver a more obnoxious to run video card 😀

 

[netxzero64]

6890? Timeline? You mean like the 5890 that was supposed to be released back in April and trounce on Nvidia's single performance crown parade?

i think 5890 was not released due to the fact that the 5870 OC editions didn't offer much OC potential unless you go to watercooling solutions and overvolting...

 

[HurleyBird]

I don't want 2GB necessarily. I was going on the comments of it possibly being a 256 bit card. If it is 384 bit, 1.5GB is fine. I have not hit a VRAM wall with my current cards, but did with my 5870s.

That's the rub, I guess. In a years time 1.5GB will be in the same position as 1GB right now -- namely, enough for most things, but on the verge of being not enough anymore. 2GB would probably be fine for another couple of years.

Eyefinity is a whole 'nother ballgame. Of course with those kinds of resolutions bandwidth is important, but at the same time the fact that you usually need to drop quality settings mitigates that. The faster these new radeons are, the higher settings which can be used in eyefintity, which means more video memory is needed.

 

[bunnyfubbles]

A 384bit bus makes sense because it would deliver more memory and bandwidth. However it doesn't make sense because it adds cost. I still think its fantasy, and the rumor mongers are trying to appeal to our fantasy by justifying that 1GB is too little and that 2GB is too much (when thinking in terms of old GDDR5), and a 384bit bus would put us at 1.5GB, a reasonable sounding compromise, plus it would provide more performance, the hitch that makes us want to hold onto the idea no matter how unlikely it really is.

But lets think about this rationally. Memory manufactures first introduced 7Gbps GDDR5 as far back as Feb of 2009, up from the 5Gbps GDDR5 used in the 5000 series. It takes about that long to get that memory ready for implementation and mass production, so if things are going to schedule we should be seeing 7Gbps GDDR5 in the 6000 series. Not only has speed increased, but memory density has doubled.

This means it shouldn't be unreasonable to expect 2GB parts as common place, at least amongst the 6800s. And a 256bit bus would be able to supply a healthy ~224GB/s of bandwidth, compare that to the 153GB/s of the 5800s, of which many tests will show the 5800s not bottle-necked by memory bandwidth.

That being said, I'll remain skeptical that ATI is going to implement a 384 bit bus at this juncture unless something went wrong with GDDR5 production, or perhaps the 6800s actually need the bandwidth, which doesn't seem likely. nVidia had to go with 384bit with GF100 because they were GDDR5 virgins and they were not able to tame GDDR5's potential with their memory controller at the time, otherwise I believe they would have gone 256bit for GF100 as well.

384bit bus infers to me either:
A. GDDR5 productions is way behind schedule
B. ATI really wants to push Eyefinity

If its A. that sucks

If its B. that means the 6800s will offer way more power than the average user needs unless they really are going to run 3+ monitors. That could be great news because it would likely mean the 6700s are going to offer incredible price/performance.

 

[3DVagabond]

MrK6. So you and Kenmitch both fully support a dude just showing up that seems to have VERY detailed information, NDA information and aren't the least bit curious how he came across and just take all this in as gospel?
Well, that's your perogitive, but would you have reacted the same way had Silverforce11 came in here giving out NDA information for Nvidias next line of cards? Would you have received it just as well as you are now and even offer explanations for him?
Dude, you and I both know you'd be breaking out the cattle prods. So what gives?

He stated that there'd be 5000 price drops "next week?". That's a pretty definitive statement. Not too long to wait to see if he's for real or not. In the mean time, loosen up your sphincter a bit 😉, nVidia might end up in the same position as AMD CPUs, but they aren't going to go out of business because they loose another round. they'll just offer their fans some better deals (Their paying fans, anyhow. 😛).

 

[3DVagabond]

I hear the 6750 is probably only going to be 10% faster than the 6730. The TDP being only 3% more though will probably make up for this.

I also think if the re-spin, 6890 (probably out Feb-March 2011 if AMD keeps its usual timeline up), can do at least 8-12% over the 6870, AMD will easily defeat the 512SP GTX485 by 10% or more.

6890 8-12 percent over 6870? WTF!!! 😀