League of Legends - F2P MOBA (like DOTA) part 2

[HumblePie]

vs bots i tried to build him AP and max empower first (lichbane, nashors, and rylais) and it seems decent, nowhere near what he was though. with the suggest AP leech build I couldn't do anything because of the long CD of the stun and the slow and dismal build up of the atk speed. Looks like he needs a buff in the next patch.

He needs to be built pure AD bruiser build now. Screw AP. He doesn't do squat with it except empower hits which now have lousy AP scaling and are high enough base after patch anyways.

Your best bet is build Triforce + Warmogs + Atmas + Zerker Greaves (possibly Merc Treads). They nerfed the duration of his stacks so you need a faster attack speed really to get him into the fight.

After that you can build gunblade and/or rage blade to complete his build. I did a bot game and was rocking with that build.

 

[xSkyDrAx]

Jungle jax needs red buff to do anything.

Yea I also feel that there should be a better window betweent he time he dodges and the time he stuns. I've been having a hard time getting it down. If I pop it too early it'll come out before I jump. If i pop it after I jump it misses half the time because they moved out of distance after my jump. It probably needs a tiny increase in range if anything.

I should try him in lane see how that goes.

 

[xSkyDrAx]

He needs to be built pure AD bruiser build now. Screw AP. He doesn't do squat with it except empower hits which now have lousy AP scaling and are high enough base after patch anyways.

Your best bet is build Triforce + Warmogs + Atmas + Zerker Greaves (possibly Merc Treads). They nerfed the duration of his stacks so you need a faster attack speed really to get him into the fight.

After that you can build gunblade and/or rage blade to complete his build. I did a bot game and was rocking with that build.

To be fair if you had all those items you should be rocking with anyone. I feel he does pretty good dmg with just rageblade and wriggles. Everything else can be used to beef him up preferably an atmogs. The hard part is farming/ganking enough to get get those items.

His ganks (if jungling) are a bit tricky trying to land the stun and pre 6 you dont get that nice dmg boost per 3rd hit.

 

[crownjules]

Cho'Gath seems to be a pretty good counter to Yorick. In our team game last night, I was matched up against an aggressive one top lane. He tried spamming his ghouls at me non-stop and all it did was waste his mana since Cho's passive triggers off killing his ghouls. Not that I could punish him enough to get him out of the lane since he'd still get enough out of his regen ghoul. But more importantly I could basically farm in safety and not get pushed out of lane like Yorick has a tendency to do to his opponents.

 

[zebano]

Just an aside: Zirze and I have been running kill lanes bottom in ranked, mainly Teemo + Cass since the poison resets twin fangs cooldown and our last 4 games we've hit players good enough to deal with it. We won those games regardless due to better teamfighting, dragon control and Unholy Saint raping every mid lane he faces. In fact, he has been so good that I think I'm going to bind some text to an extra mouse key so I can easily spam "You have been Swain" every time he gets a kill.

I also thinking of changing up my primary bans to be Shaco/Ahri/Kenen/Soraka due to the massive annoyance each of these provide.


Another thing: I've seen tons and tons of people banning Morgana. I really feel this is a wasted ban as her primary strength is easy farming and a good teamfight ult. The number of Morganas who reliably land her dark binding is very small. Just pick an AP champ that clears waves quick enough that she cannot roam and proceed to burn her down every time she tries to ult. My favorite is zombie Karthus (ban Soraka) but Xerath and Cassiopia work quite well. Ryze is better late game but has enough mana problems early that I have trouble stopping her from roaming so I prefer the other two.

 

[Chiropteran]

The problem with a good morgana is the support capability as well as the aoe damage and binding. A fed ad carry with black shield support and soraka or sona tossing heals can be very very hard to stop.

 

[zebano]

The problem with a good morgana is the support capability as well as the aoe damage and binding. A fed ad carry with black shield support and soraka or sona tossing heals can be very very hard to stop.

eh, black shield can be burned off the same as Sions shield. It's annoying to be sure but it's no worse than dealing with a Kayle ult, Zilean ult or just a good Janna.

 

[Chiropteran]

eh, black shield can be burned off the same as Sions shield. It's annoying to be sure but it's no worse than dealing with a Kayle ult, Zilean ult or just a good Janna.

Eh, if kayle and zilean ults had a 15 second cooldown I'm sure they would be considered a little bit OP wouldn't they? Janna's shield is closer in similarity, but it doesn't do the same thing. Black shield isn't good because of the damage it absorbs (although that is a benefit), it's good because it makes the carry immune to basically all CC. At base, it's like a banshee veil with much shorter cooldown. With high AP builds, it will absorb 2-3 damage spells which makes it counter productive to try to knock it off the target.

If you want to stun the carry you have to waste ~900 magic damage first, and morg can just recast the shield a few seconds later? That is a losing proposition.

Also, morg can play top or mid and still add support strength to your team, while other supports require the duo lane.

But there are lots of "OP" champions right now, I'm not even sure morg would reach my ban list given the other more critical bans.

 

[ImpulsE69]

Yea..Morg's ult has never been a concern of mine. It's that shield. I always ban her if I plan on playing an AP caster.

It's hard to say if she should be top list ban or not simply because it still comes down to skill of the player vs your teams skill.

 

[billbobaggins87]

anyone a avid ranked player.. im somewhat into it.. i got to 1380 but im back down in the 1250's.

 

[crownjules]

anyone a avid ranked player.. im somewhat into it.. i got to 1380 but im back down in the 1250's.

Depends on how you define avid. Most of us play normals because there's usually 3-4 on at any given time and you can't do ranked with that many. But we'll play ranked if there's 2/5 on.

The 1100-1300 range is tough to escape. It's not ELO Hell, but the problem is that it's the range where players are introduced when they're just starting. So there's a far greater variation in player skill to be found then you will find above or below it. You've got people on their way up to the higher ELOs and people on the way down. That's why it's so frustrating to get out of. I've read of how people struggled to get above the 1300 mark, but once they did it only took them half as much time to reach 1500+.

 

[douglasb]

Remind me again why I play this game. It brings out the scum of humanity, especially on the weekends. I just finished a game where we got STOMPED, I had Singed and went 5/7/4. Most kills and most assists on the entire team, and comparable number of deaths to everyone else. We had a 1/10/2 Nocturne jungling and a Soraka who went 0/5/2 that were trolling and calling me "incredibad". I had more kills and assists than the two of them combined...this game really does attract scumbags.

 

[Chiropteran]

I'll just leave this here...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EK5hiEdqWFw


Also, new way to play for me. Warmogs for all the AD! Twitch build, warmogs, berzerker boots, frozen mallet, atmas impaler, force of nature, phantom dancer- super speed, nearly 4k hp, ~140 armor/m resists, plenty of damage due to atma and crit, decent attack speed. 6% lifesteal from quints, can't fit a lifesteal item into the build.

At least, works well in smurfy games. Haven't tested it in a serious ranked game.

 

[Obsoleet]

I'll just leave this here...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EK5hiEdqWFw


Also, new way to play for me. Warmogs for all the AD! Twitch build, warmogs, berzerker boots, frozen mallet, atmas impaler, force of nature, phantom dancer- super speed, nearly 4k hp, ~140 armor/m resists, plenty of damage due to atma and crit, decent attack speed. 6% lifesteal from quints, can't fit a lifesteal item into the build.

At least, works well in smurfy games. Haven't tested it in a serious ranked game.

LOL@ that vid, forwarding to fellow coworkers tomorrow that play LoL.

Can't ever go wrong with more HP I suppose. I rarely find a champ and build where I like to use Warmogs. I've always been fairly anti-Warmogs, but at this point I'm not sure I even remember why.
On SR I'll combine it with a Frozen Heart when I build ChoGath as an AP tank when the other team has a lot of AD, but I don't use Warmogs anywhere else. Not even with Trundle where it's a pretty obvious match to due not needing a lot of defense otherwise.

 

[zebano]

anyone a avid ranked player.. im somewhat into it.. i got to 1380 but im back down in the 1250's.

Not avid anymore but I'm sitting at 1537, drop me an invite sometime if you want to duo queue. I'll play ranked 5s any chance I get but solo queue is bad unless I'm awake & completely sober which is rarely the case since I have kids and a job.

LOL@ that vid, forwarding to fellow coworkers tomorrow that play LoL.

Can't ever go wrong with more HP I suppose. I rarely find a champ and build where I like to use Warmogs. I've always been fairly anti-Warmogs, but at this point I'm not sure I even remember why.
On SR I'll combine it with a Frozen Heart when I build ChoGath as an AP tank when the other team has a lot of AD, but I don't use Warmogs anywhere else. Not even with Trundle where it's a pretty obvious match to due not needing a lot of defense otherwise.

I rarely buy warmogs, it's a ton of HP but I just prefer Mallet in most cases. Even 2 of Shurelyia's, Raduin's Omen and Triforce is a decent chunk of HP.

 

[HumblePie]

I got to troll a game yesterday. Got forced to pick support as last pick. No big deal. Other team had banned soraka and taric and took sona. So I picked alistar which is still no big deal for me. I state at the beginning I do not take heal until level 3 so that my laning partner knows to just farm and not be stupid early.

So we start to head to lane and the Sivir I'm with wants to take mini golems first. Sure I can do that. I get into position and Sivir says, "Let me hit first so I can kite them."

I'm thinking if that's how the person wants to do it I'll do it. So sivir hits the golem, I knock up with pulverize, and then I auto attack. Sivir just stands there auto attacking and getting beat down. She kills the golems but only has about a third of her health left at 200 hps. Then starts bitching at me why I'm not healing her. !-.-

Really? I stated earlier that I don't get heal until level 3. I said go back and heal. She said she would be okay and goes out into lane. Yah dumb move. Dies pretty quickly to a combo from tristana and sona powerchord right off the bat. Leaving me screwed at bottom solo for a bit against two range champs who can also poke me at the tower before I have my heal. Speaking of which, Alistar's heal isn't much in the first place. It's nice, but the heal isn't the main attraction to play him. So of course I die being tower poked to hell before sivir could come back. I come back and sivir is about half health but both Tristana and Sona are low life with zero mana. I ping I'm going in to do headbutt + pulverize on one to kill that person. Sivir responds sure. So I go in on sona who was closet. Tristana uses the rest of her mana to jump away. Sivir just stands at tower farming. I start auto attacking sona as she turns to run. I hit her two more times at which point both sona and trist realize that sivir is still back there farming and I'm now an easy kill for them even at full health since all I can do is auto attack or run. They start hitting me and I decide to stay on Sona. I die with sona literally having 1 hitpoint left. I'm pinging away at sivir while asking "WTF" and she responds, "Your just a baddie."

Seriously? Whatever. So right after I die, Sona gets enough mana to heal a couple of times. Shyvana, our jungler, thinks to gank bottom. Shyvana has red buff, but less than half health. Sivir has about half health but no mana from just spamming abilities to farm. So Shyvana pings that she is going in. Sivir doesn't budge at first. Sona and Trist destroy Shyvana at which point Sivir finally moves in to help Shyvana at the end to try and get a kill. Unfortunately Sona's summoner heal comes back at that moment. Trist and Sivir both die giving Trist the red buff.

I finally get back to bot lane after Trist and Sona head back to buy and come back themselves. Here I am 2v1 as a level 3 against a level 5 Trist and Sona. Both fed with items and having red buff. What the hell do you suppose is going to happen to me? I sit by tower waiting for sivir to come back who decides to make a side trip at mini golems. I'm standing at the tower bitching out both Shyvana and sivir because both are blaming me for their last death despite the fact I wasn't there and they were both idiots. Although I'm standing right on the tower, the other team's lee sin decides to tower dive me with trist and sona even without the minions there to take a tower hit first. Of course I die. Lee gets low so Sivir chases into the three of them. Dies. Shyvana comes around and chases. Dies. Our mid comes down followed by their mid. Dies. The four on the other team take bot tower then drag.

I'm getting blamed the entire time. I'm like fuck it. Don't care anymore. This team is so bad there isn't a damn thing I could do to change it around. Not as alistar at least. I'll just go in and push/farm. If I die, I die. So I did. I ended up 1/10 or something by the time we finally surrendered at 20. Almost lost before then because they took bottom inhib at 18 minutes. But the other team didn't want to finish it too quick. Assholes.

It was a game I just didn't want to play anymore so I trolled after how bad my team mates were. Thankfully it was just a normal game or I'd have been more pissed.

 

[xSkyDrAx]

I got to troll a game yesterday. Got forced to pick support as last pick. No big deal. Other team had banned soraka and taric and took sona. So I picked alistar which is still no big deal for me. I state at the beginning I do not take heal until level 3 so that my laning partner knows to just farm and not be stupid early.

So we start to head to lane and the Sivir I'm with wants to take mini golems first. Sure I can do that. I get into position and Sivir says, "Let me hit first so I can kite them."

I'm thinking if that's how the person wants to do it I'll do it. So sivir hits the golem, I knock up with pulverize, and then I auto attack. Sivir just stands there auto attacking and getting beat down. She kills the golems but only has about a third of her health left at 200 hps. Then starts bitching at me why I'm not healing her. !-.-

Really? I stated earlier that I don't get heal until level 3. I said go back and heal. She said she would be okay and goes out into lane. Yah dumb move. Dies pretty quickly to a combo from tristana and sona powerchord right off the bat. Leaving me screwed at bottom solo for a bit against two range champs who can also poke me at the tower before I have my heal. Speaking of which, Alistar's heal isn't much in the first place. It's nice, but the heal isn't the main attraction to play him. So of course I die being tower poked to hell before sivir could come back. I come back and sivir is about half health but both Tristana and Sona are low life with zero mana. I ping I'm going in to do headbutt + pulverize on one to kill that person. Sivir responds sure. So I go in on sona who was closet. Tristana uses the rest of her mana to jump away. Sivir just stands at tower farming. I start auto attacking sona as she turns to run. I hit her two more times at which point both sona and trist realize that sivir is still back there farming and I'm now an easy kill for them even at full health since all I can do is auto attack or run. They start hitting me and I decide to stay on Sona. I die with sona literally having 1 hitpoint left. I'm pinging away at sivir while asking "WTF" and she responds, "Your just a baddie."

Seriously? Whatever. So right after I die, Sona gets enough mana to heal a couple of times. Shyvana, our jungler, thinks to gank bottom. Shyvana has red buff, but less than half health. Sivir has about half health but no mana from just spamming abilities to farm. So Shyvana pings that she is going in. Sivir doesn't budge at first. Sona and Trist destroy Shyvana at which point Sivir finally moves in to help Shyvana at the end to try and get a kill. Unfortunately Sona's summoner heal comes back at that moment. Trist and Sivir both die giving Trist the red buff.

I finally get back to bot lane after Trist and Sona head back to buy and come back themselves. Here I am 2v1 as a level 3 against a level 5 Trist and Sona. Both fed with items and having red buff. What the hell do you suppose is going to happen to me? I sit by tower waiting for sivir to come back who decides to make a side trip at mini golems. I'm standing at the tower bitching out both Shyvana and sivir because both are blaming me for their last death despite the fact I wasn't there and they were both idiots. Although I'm standing right on the tower, the other team's lee sin decides to tower dive me with trist and sona even without the minions there to take a tower hit first. Of course I die. Lee gets low so Sivir chases into the three of them. Dies. Shyvana comes around and chases. Dies. Our mid comes down followed by their mid. Dies. The four on the other team take bot tower then drag.

I'm getting blamed the entire time. I'm like fuck it. Don't care anymore. This team is so bad there isn't a damn thing I could do to change it around. Not as alistar at least. I'll just go in and push/farm. If I die, I die. So I did. I ended up 1/10 or something by the time we finally surrendered at 20. Almost lost before then because they took bottom inhib at 18 minutes. But the other team didn't want to finish it too quick. Assholes.

It was a game I just didn't want to play anymore so I trolled after how bad my team mates were. Thankfully it was just a normal game or I'd have been more pissed.

That's exactly why in random normals I will refuse to play a low dmg support. Placing my trust into a random ad carry that ends up being bad is a waste of a minimum of 20 minutes for me esp if all I can do is heal and support.

When everyone role is selected before I select I just just end up picking some kind of offensive 'support' capable champ. Favorite is probably GP. I just end up harassing with Q and popping his buff every now and then. One game ended up where I just farmed into the carry since my lane mate wasn't doing anything and our teams were back and forth for long enough for me to do some farming with 2 gp/5 items.

Other than that either Blitz or Garen are also fun 'support' laners :whiste:

 

[HumblePie]

That's exactly why in random normals I will refuse to play a low dmg support. Placing my trust into a random ad carry that ends up being bad is a waste of a minimum of 20 minutes for me esp if all I can do is heal and support.

When everyone role is selected before I select I just just end up picking some kind of offensive 'support' capable champ. Favorite is probably GP. I just end up harassing with Q and popping his buff every now and then. One game ended up where I just farmed into the carry since my lane mate wasn't doing anything and our teams were back and forth for long enough for me to do some farming with 2 gp/5 items.

Other than that either Blitz or Garen are also fun 'support' laners :whiste:

The day before I had it the opposite. I picked a graves because someone said they would like to play support. They picked taric. I went bottom against a caitlyn and sona. Both of which just constantly poked me while taric stood there. No stuns and no heals. He stood at the tower and watched me get poked to death. I tried farming but even on the tower once the wave gets pushed up both sona and caitlyn can walk up, poke me, and walk back before the tower hits them. That's all they did while taric stood there and watched me die. I was like WTF? Do something! He called me a baddie for dying and not farming. Then he died and left lane to go steal jungle and wander around. So here I am now stuck bot lane solo against a caitlyn and a sona while this Taric is trolling for no reason. Horrible game.

 

[Chiropteran]

Warmogs first on twitch worked for me because twitch has a passive taunt against most players. If enemy twitch is visible on screen, you must attack him! I feel it's less viable on a more tanky tank champion, because it doesn't make you more of a threat like a sunfire cape does, it just makes you a fat target to kill last.

I also like it on twitch because regrowth pendant seems to be one of the better first items for my play style. I like to trade blows with my opponent, and if I can do it and regen faster than my enemy I can easily force him to B or die. Regrowth pendant combined with 6% lifesteal quints gives me more sustain than most other single lane champions.

 

[zebano]

Warmogs first on twitch worked for me because twitch has a passive taunt against most players. If enemy twitch is visible on screen, you must attack him! I feel it's less viable on a more tanky tank champion, because it doesn't make you more of a threat like a sunfire cape does, it just makes you a fat target to kill last.

I also like it on twitch because regrowth pendant seems to be one of the better first items for my play style. I like to trade blows with my opponent, and if I can do it and regen faster than my enemy I can easily force him to B or die. Regrowth pendant combined with 6% lifesteal quints gives me more sustain than most other single lane champions.

Are you jungling? If I saw a twitch just building Warmogs first I'd either kill him or force him to B and take his tower... I might be able to see it if you build 3 D. Blades first and you're bottom lane with a support helping you though even then a good team should be able to take dragon + your tower because you don't do enough damage to deter them.

 

[Chiropteran]

Are you jungling? If I saw a twitch just building Warmogs first I'd either kill him or force him to B and take his tower... I might be able to see it if you build 3 D. Blades first and you're bottom lane with a support helping you though even then a good team should be able to take dragon + your tower because you don't do enough damage to deter them.

I prefer to jungle, but in a solo queue game I am not going to argue and rage when someone else takes it. I just go for top or mid in those cases. I don't take a regrowth pendant to jungle, haven't tried it but I don't think it would be as useful as a doran's blade. Last night I went mid a couple times, destroyed mid Kassadin 1v1 killing him 3 times solo early game.

I hate being bot lane with support on twitch. It's very hard to get a kill 2v1 which it basically is once you engage in that lane, because to be effective you must stealth behind the target where you will be out of range of your support. It might work better with a non-standard support like gangplank, but I'd rather just take a solo lane.

Mid just seems like the best because it's harder for the mid opponent to reach the bush compared to top.

Twitch's damage is often underestimated. He has the highest base damage of any ranged champion, and his passive increases it further- I don't know the exact numbers, but looking at the wiki:

(Innate): Twitch's attacks infect the target with Deadly Venom, which deals 2.5 / 5 / 7.5 / 10 true damage each second, stacking up to 6 times, and lasting up to 6 seconds.

Sounds right. So if you hit once, it's 2.5 true damage per second for 6 seconds, or 18 extra damage. This is huge for a free passive. With decent positioning, I can hit 4 times before the enemy gets out of range, this is 50~ damage per auto attack after armor, plus another 75~ from poison, 275 total real damage, if I follow with expunge for another 100+ damage most champions must B immediately or risk dying the next time I attack. Add a red buff and the damage is even higher, plus probably a 5th auto-attack thanks to the slow. This is at level 2. Twitch's damage seems low only because he dies so fast in most game,s if you can give him mitigation and sustain his damage will add up quickly.

Twitch lacks burst damage, but his overall damage is fine.

 

[zebano]

I prefer to jungle, but in a solo queue game I am not going to argue and rage when someone else takes it. I just go for top or mid in those cases. I don't take a regrowth pendant to jungle, haven't tried it but I don't think it would be as useful as a doran's blade. Last night I went mid a couple times, destroyed mid Kassadin 1v1 killing him 3 times solo early game.

I hate being bot lane with support on twitch. It's very hard to get a kill 2v1 which it basically is once you engage in that lane, because to be effective you must stealth behind the target where you will be out of range of your support. It might work better with a non-standard support like gangplank, but I'd rather just take a solo lane.

Mid just seems like the best because it's harder for the mid opponent to reach the bush compared to top.

He's a great counter to Kass (as are just about all ranged ADs, GP, Tryndamere and a few others) . If you can safely farm top I'd be impressed. I don't like him bottom lane because of the short range and the stealth not helping that much since most supports have CC + healing. I like jungle twitch a lot right now and feel that's where he best fits on most teams.

 

[Chiropteran]

He's a great counter to Kass (as are just about all ranged ADs, GP, Tryndamere and a few others) . If you can safely farm top I'd be impressed. I don't like him bottom lane because of the short range and the stealth not helping that much since most supports have CC + healing. I like jungle twitch a lot right now and feel that's where he best fits on most teams.

I agree with that, generally. I also think twitch might be a great choice a non-standard team. For example, solo tri-lanes, a dedicated jungle, and roaming twitch.

As twitch, optimal standard team positions.

A++ jungle
A+ mid solo vs AP
A roaming
B top solo
D- bottom

 

[HumblePie]

I prefer to jungle, but in a solo queue game I am not going to argue and rage when someone else takes it. I just go for top or mid in those cases. I don't take a regrowth pendant to jungle, haven't tried it but I don't think it would be as useful as a doran's blade. Last night I went mid a couple times, destroyed mid Kassadin 1v1 killing him 3 times solo early game.

I hate being bot lane with support on twitch. It's very hard to get a kill 2v1 which it basically is once you engage in that lane, because to be effective you must stealth behind the target where you will be out of range of your support. It might work better with a non-standard support like gangplank, but I'd rather just take a solo lane.

Mid just seems like the best because it's harder for the mid opponent to reach the bush compared to top.

Twitch's damage is often underestimated. He has the highest base damage of any ranged champion, and his passive increases it further- I don't know the exact numbers, but looking at the wiki:

(Innate): Twitch's attacks infect the target with Deadly Venom, which deals 2.5 / 5 / 7.5 / 10 true damage each second, stacking up to 6 times, and lasting up to 6 seconds.

Sounds right. So if you hit once, it's 2.5 true damage per second for 6 seconds, or 18 extra damage. This is huge for a free passive. With decent positioning, I can hit 4 times before the enemy gets out of range, this is 50~ damage per auto attack after armor, plus another 75~ from poison, 275 total real damage, if I follow with expunge for another 100+ damage most champions must B immediately or risk dying the next time I attack. Add a red buff and the damage is even higher, plus probably a 5th auto-attack thanks to the slow. This is at level 2. Twitch's damage seems low only because he dies so fast in most game,s if you can give him mitigation and sustain his damage will add up quickly.

Twitch lacks burst damage, but his overall damage is fine.

Twitch is fine for damage. No one I know disagrees there. Twitch just lacks any real escape besides his stealth with is countered and no real burst. This is why Vayne and Graves are so popular right now. They have good escape/chase, good initiates, CC, high burst, and high sustain. Their ults are also awesome.

I like twitch though for his early game dominance. One problem I find with twitches is their tendency to roam can be both an asset and a liability. All too often they get caught as their stealth comes off when they are roaming out of position "checking" things. Or they run past a pink ward without realizing it. Then BAM! Dead rat.

Which brings up his second problem. Reliance on stealth which is easily countered. If I am playing and see a twitch on the other team the FIRST item I buy is a pink ward no matter what lane I'm in. I only forgo the pink ward if I'm jungling that game. That early pink ward destroys twitches.

 

[Malak]

Yea..Morg's ult has never been a concern of mine. It's that shield. I always ban her if I plan on playing an AP caster.

It's hard to say if she should be top list ban or not simply because it still comes down to skill of the player vs your teams skill.

I was in a game yesterday where I told them not to ban Morgana. Frankly I don't think she is all that hot, but it's a bit like Malzahar in that maybe she's really useful but people just don't play her well. I just see a lot more better picks for a ban than a mage that really only has a shield going for her.

Some people bitched but the captain didn't ban her, and nobody picked her till it came to me so I picked her just to prove a point. I had said AD morgana is actually more useful to the team than AP morgana, because she becomes DPS then. I went 11/6/14 as AD morgana. Compared to other ranged AD champs, I actually like her more than most.