Lawmaker calls Congress 'underpaid', objects to salary freeze

[Fern]

http://library.clerk.house.gov/reference-files/113_20130124_Salary.pdf

You might also want to read up on the other ways lawmakers are paid.
$3,000 tax deduction for expenses - Not really that much.
They also receive Member Representational Allowance(MRA). In 2012 total MRA for congress was $573.9 Mill. I think this may include a home office and travel.

The MRA cannot be use for personal expenses (I.e., can't be used for food/lodging in DC). It's for their office staff etc. I see it includes allowance for travel, but IDK if it's adequate or not.

Fern

 

[Zaap]

I'm curious how many people here earn $174k, plus expenses, heath plan and pension- that you get after only putting in 5 years?

A show of hands.

If this were some private sector CEO (being paid with private funds) saying his salary was too low, half the bleeding hearts here would be screaming and whining and foaming at the mouth declaring that the most greedy, evil thing ever.

But one of the political class? (being paid with YOUR money...)

"Oh wait a minute, gee, you know- $174K + lifetime bennies isn't all that much... *sniffle* why, we might not attract people to serve in congress on that pittance! Aww gee, the poor, poor, poor political class..."

It's like some sort of mass Stockholm Syndrome when it comes to the turds in D.C. The more they abuse, spy on, work feverishly to limit the freedoms of, extract endless amounts of money from and put into debt shackles- the rest of the populace, the more their victims fall to their knees worshiping them.

Now we're going to wring our hands worried about how "poor" congressturds are??! How much of a continuous dickslap to the face from the political class did someone have to take to get to that level of sycophancy?

 

[code65536]

Right... because the current system of voters paying politicians less, and the special interests paying them more is clearly working so well. Oh, how about this? What if we reduce their salary to zero so that they have to get everything from the special interests instead. I'm sure that'll teach them a lesson.

Lets have some common-sense nuance here.

1) Yes, their official pay is low. Period. Why are you comparing them to people on the board? They should be compared to other people with their degree of influence and prominence. Why would someone let themselves get dragged through the mud of a campaign just so that they can work for a fraction of the salary of a lobbyist, unless that person knows what the "real" job salary of the job is?

2) Yes, they are bloody rich. Why? Because they have other income. Like the incentives that special interests offer. If Taxpayer Tom pays you $100, and Shady Sam pays you $1000, who are you going to take your orders from?

3) Yes, their pay should be raised, but only in conjunction with a crackdown on lobbying and other sources of political money. Go overturn Citizens United, and maybe we can talk about this.

 

[Zaap]

^ LOL! Case in point.

 

[MongGrel]

Congress needs to be disbanded and a new one that has nothing to do with lobbyists needs to be formed to begin with.

 

[OutHouse]

new rule. if you want be a politician you do so on your own dime. and you do not get a million bucks to decorate your god damn office.

 

[MongGrel]

It is, when you consider all the kickbacks and perks and bennies add up to the millions.



Seriously, its Americas fault. They keep voting for the same cocksuckers over and over again. Some of those fuckheads have been in office from age 30 to 80.

We got what we wanted, a pile of fat lazy overpaid useless conniving self-serving assholes who would not be able to hold a paper route if it wasnt for the warm, safe nest capital hill provides.

We need to clean the whole bunch of them out, replace them with guys who actually care about America, and keep close tabs on the gang after that.

That job should NOT be fun. It should be a grueling task only the most motivated, dedicated, hardcore, patriotic human being would wanna do. If they ever get comfortable then the system has failed. WE have failed.

STOP VOTING FOR THEM YOU FUCKIN MORONS!

+1000

 

[Newell Steamer]

Kick backs, perks and guaranteed private sector jobs after their political run isn't enough?

 

[shortylickens]

As long as laws allow congressional districts to be drawn like linguine this is what we get.

Congressional job approval 13%
Incumbents reelected >90%

Both gerrymandering and unlimited terms are major problems, and neither can be changed without the approval of congress.

Do we see the issue here? Its like passing a law that says only police can discipline police. Do we honestly expect people to deliberately go against their own selfish interests?

 

[OutHouse]

Why would someone let themselves get dragged through the mud of a campaign just so that they can work for a fraction of the salary of a lobbyist, unless that person knows what the "real" job salary of the job is?

damn dude what politician do you work for?

how about because they made the choice to run for office and be paid by the taxpayer?

 

[OutHouse]

It is, when you consider all the kickbacks and perks and bennies add up to the millions.



Seriously, its Americas fault. They keep voting for the same cocksuckers over and over again. Some of those fuckheads have been in office from age 30 to 80.

We got what we wanted, a pile of fat lazy overpaid useless conniving self-serving assholes who would not be able to hold a paper route if it wasnt for the warm, safe nest capital hill provides.

We need to clean the whole bunch of them out, replace them with guys who actually care about America, and keep close tabs on the gang after that.

That job should NOT be fun. It should be a grueling task only the most motivated, dedicated, hardcore, patriotic human being would wanna do. If they ever get comfortable then the system has failed. WE have failed.

STOP VOTING FOR THEM YOU FUCKIN MORONS!

preach on brother!

 

[trenchfoot]

Seems to me a politician would think their pay should be commensurate with how much power and influence they peddle on a daily basis along with the compulsion to "feel" equal to those very wealthy and influential folks they "socialize" with on a daily basis. This in comparison with how much real work they get done for the majority that actually voted them into office.

 

[poofyhairguy]

I think they should get a pay increase the first year the government has a surplus of income to pay for one.

 

[code65536]

damn dude what politician do you work for?

how about because they made the choice to run for office and be paid by the taxpayer?

But my point is, who is the current system attracting to run?

The current pay structure is one that attracts corruptness. That encourages corruptness. That rewards corruptness more than it rewards integrity.

And as I've said, salary is only half of the current pay structure. The other half is where their "real" pay comes from. Snip the reward for corruption, improve the reward for actually working for the voter. Seems like common sense to me.

 

[classy]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/politics/sns-rt-us-usa-congress-salary-20140404,0,7747191.story

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. lawmakers have quietly gone along with an annual salary freeze since 2010, but a Virginia Democrat has had enough and said members of Congress are underpaid.

Representative Jim Moran, who is not seeking re-election in November, has objected to fiscal 2015 spending legislation that calls for another pay freeze for Congress, keeping lawmakers' salaries at $174,000 a year.



Is he fucking nuts? 174k is underpaid?

Its a WHOLE lot more than that. That's just pocket money

 

[Zaap]

I love the "logic" of the "just pay them more!!" mindset.

Corrupt person: "I want to take this 'low paying' position of power so I can line my pockets as people line up to buy my influence."

Oh yeah?!! Well now the job pays a lot more, scumbag! Take that!!!!


Corrupt person: "Whaaaaat!!!???? Of all the dastardly...!!!! Now the job PAYS MORE!!???? That sucks!!!! Forget it!!!!! Let some honest person take the gig now, I don't want to get paid more for having this position of power and influence!!!!"

 

[BurnItDwn]

We should pay congress double the minimum wage of whatever district they represent.

 

[code65536]

I love the "logic" of the "just pay them more!!" mindset.

Corrupt person: "I want to take this 'low paying' position of power so I can line my pockets as people line up to buy my influence."

Oh yeah?!! Well now the job pays a lot more, scumbag! Take that!!!!


Corrupt person: "Whaaaaat!!!???? Of all the dastardly...!!!! Now the job PAYS MORE!!???? That sucks!!!! Forget it!!!!! Let some honest person take the gig now, I don't want to get paid more for having this position of power and influence!!!!"

And I love your convenient omission of the second part of my post (of all my posts in this thread), the part about overturning CU and other measures to slash outside funding. It's not about paying them more, it's about shifting their income from the people who we don't want influencing them to the people who do.

Or, you know, common-sense solutions to the principal-agent problem.

Your solution is, "They are scumbags (which I agree with, BTW), so let's punish them... by giving them even more incentive to be scumbags." Knee-jerk isn't always the best response.

 

[shortylickens]

We should pay congress double the minimum wage of whatever district they represent.

Umm, even in rich districts theres always some soccer mom that sells Amway once a month and has maybe 200 bucks in take home.

Thats not enough for a family to live on.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

I think we may have hit upon the lone topic where both sides of p&n can agree. Jeepers! :awe:

Yea, they are overpaid and deserve not a dime more.

 

[Zaap]

And I love your convenient omission of the second part of my post (of all my posts in this thread), the part about overturning CU and other measures to slash outside funding.

Waah waah Citizens United. Please explain how a ruling about corporations and unions spending money on political advertising puts money directly in the pockets of elected officials as personal income. The last I checked, not disclosing/pocketing campaign funds is a crime, punishable by jail. (See Jesse Jackson Jr.)

If you have some major evidence that politicians are routinely collecting campaign funds as private income, please show it. I'd actually LOVE to see more of these turds go to jail.

It's not about paying them more, it's about shifting their income from the people who we don't want influencing them to the people who do.

Once again, your "logic" is idiotic. As pointed out, most of these people are already millionaires. If there's a huge problem with people bribing congressturds, their personal wealth isn't a deterrent.

Your logic is litterally that people that will sell their power and influence for money will somehow turn into trustworthy angels... for money. All while ignoring people who will STILL line up to buy their power and influence... for money.

Its akin to saying handing druglords tons of money and not punishing them when.caught will motivate them to become saints and stop making tons more money selling drugs.

Your solution is, "They are scumbags (which I agree with, BTW), so let's punish them... by giving them even more incentive to be scumbags." Knee-jerk isn't always the best response.

Again, your flawed logic. These people aren't scumbags because they're not being paid enough or don't have enough money in the bank already. They are scumbags and power-hungry greedbags because that's what high positions of power attract.

Saying to someone who is all about amassing power through corruption "I'm going to make you honest by handing you more of what you're engaging in corruption for in the first place... more money and power" is just laughably naive.

Anyone who can't do an honest, upright job for $174k plus lifetime bennies after a joke of a qualifying work term: FUCK that person. That's not any pauper amount to pull the "give me more to keep me from being on the take" dimbulb hostage crisis over.

 

[BurnItDwn]

Umm, even in rich districts theres always some soccer mom that sells Amway once a month and has maybe 200 bucks in take home.

Thats not enough for a family to live on.

Not sure what Amway has to do with anything. But, the minimum wage is usually set by either county, city, or state, and then there's a federal minimum wage too.

Make the salary of the congress person 2x the amount of 40 x legal minimum wage for their constituents.

Or, make it tied to the median income of the constituency.

 

[Fern]

Again, my concern is that Congresspersons are required to maintain two households and that DC is expensive. If you move to DC you're likely violating law in that Congresspersons need to be residents of the district they represent. IIRC, Rahm Emanuel had problems with this because he rented out his Chicago home.

Even if you could move your family to DC not many would want to uproot their kids and send them to DC public schools.

Add in that you cannot earn more than $26K from another job while in Congress. I.e., if you're a working person you will be unemployed when you leave. Is it any wonder many become lobbyists when their term is over?

If you like this system, fine. But I think it is a part of what makes legislators the exact kind of people most of you dislike.

This system basically mandates that we have:

- Career politicians, or they shuttle into lobbying upon leaving office

- They must be rich people.

- They be older so there's no concern about school age kids etc.

It keeps out younger and/or non-rich people who don't necessarily want a career as a politician but who would like to serve to see some changes made. I think these are the kind of people our FF envisioned as serving. Do your civic duty and go back home.

The rich, power hungry scum will always want to be in DC because of the power etc., but under this system we practically ensure that is all we'll have serving. We ensure they have no competition from the types many of would like to see serve.

It's not the total solution, but it's part of it. And we could likely do it while costing us little-to-nothing. The fed govt has literally billions is unused buildings. Swap some of those for living accommodations in DC and we've solved a good chunk of the problem I outlined.

I'm have no suggestions for what to do about the 'no other job' thing that I think is a problem for those don't want to be career Congresspersons or lobbyists.

Fern

 

[Zaap]

Their "household" in DC doesn't have to be a fucking mansion. They aren't being paid to live a rockstar lifestyle. If you can't maintain a reasonable place to live on 174k+ bennies+ pension... then once again, fuck off.

 

[Fern]

Their "household" in DC doesn't have to be a fucking mansion. They aren't being paid to live a rockstar lifestyle. If you can't maintain a reasonable place to live on 174k+ bennies+ pension... then once again, fuck off.

No one is talking about mansions.

Apartments near Capital Hill average about $2,500 per month per bedroom. I.e., a studio is about $30k a year before utilities etc.
http://www.washingtoncitypaper.com/...nd-least-expensive-neighborhoods-for-renters/

Unless you're rich, I think that's a pretty damn steep tab for a second household.

Fern