So the guy can detect the hormones/DNA of an attacker and is invincible if they match with male humans? That's really weak. If a guy ran up from behind and stabbed him, I'd imagine it would have done the same as the Hobbit and the girl.
Also, like 5 people have given different explainations as to Sauron and who killed him
- Mar 20, 2000
- 102,402
- 8,574
- 126
First off, Gandalf, Sauron, and Saruman are all ainur, that is, they existed before the world and the world came about because of them. Some of the ainur chose to live in the world they created, of which Gandalf, Sauron, and Saruman were very minor. In the history to the Lord of the Rings, one of the ainur, melkor, tried to create as much chaos as possible. He was the original bad guy. He chose to live there as well, but was defeated by a combination of other ainur and a union of elves and men, culminated in the love of Beren and Luthien, human and elf (who actually defeated Melkor, iirc).
After Melkor was defeated the ainur chose to mainly stay in the West, where only immortals could dwell. The Numenoreans were given an island very close to the West, and could trade with the elven ships that came, but they could never reach the West themselves. Sauron exploited this fact, spoke poison to the Kings, and eventually caused the downfall of Numenor. Numenor tried to challenge the West, for which it was destroyed. But some managed to escape, to see Sauron's lies for what they were. That was Isildur, his father, and his brother, along with their people. They sailed to Gondor, which was already set up this time as a trading post for Numenor. They then met up with the elves in the second alliance of elves and men, and beat sauron as was shown in the movies. But of course Isildur was corrupted by the ring, which you know of.
But the ainur knew that sauron was still around. So they sent the Ishtari, the wizards, to help the races of middle earth (there is an eastern part of which little is known, and the western part where the ainur and high elves live). But the Ishtari could only guide. They were not powerful enough to challege Sauron himself. It was up to middle earth to do for middle earth. That is why Gandalf never really uses his powers.
The witch king of angmar could not be killed by a man. Literally, a man. It must have been some sort of prophecy that he would not be killed by a man, and everyone just assumed he wouldn't be killed, not that something else could kill him. The thing that isn't mentioned in the movies is that the sword the hobbit was carrying was gotten from a barrow wight, and was left there from the time that the witch king had first been defeated, created by elven smiths to injure the witch king and others like him. So the hobbit stabs the witch king with the magic sword, the magic binding him together was broken, and a woman, not a man, kills him.
As for Arwen, I really think it was just that she chose to stay after the other elves had all left. Had nothing to do with the giving of the necklace. The only thing it says is that she turned from the Twilight (being the West), and embraced the Doom of Man (death). Arwen really isn't in the books, so most of the stuff in the movie about her is contrived.
The guys at the end of the movie were going into the West, on a special ship that only Cirdan (the elf standing in the background) had the ability to build.
Tolkien didn't write much about anything that happened after the War of the Ring.
I suppose the ghost army could have defeated anything, but Aragorn wouldn't have used them that way.
if anything is wrong, well, its been a long time since i read the silmarillion
After Melkor was defeated the ainur chose to mainly stay in the West, where only immortals could dwell. The Numenoreans were given an island very close to the West, and could trade with the elven ships that came, but they could never reach the West themselves. Sauron exploited this fact, spoke poison to the Kings, and eventually caused the downfall of Numenor. Numenor tried to challenge the West, for which it was destroyed. But some managed to escape, to see Sauron's lies for what they were. That was Isildur, his father, and his brother, along with their people. They sailed to Gondor, which was already set up this time as a trading post for Numenor. They then met up with the elves in the second alliance of elves and men, and beat sauron as was shown in the movies. But of course Isildur was corrupted by the ring, which you know of.
But the ainur knew that sauron was still around. So they sent the Ishtari, the wizards, to help the races of middle earth (there is an eastern part of which little is known, and the western part where the ainur and high elves live). But the Ishtari could only guide. They were not powerful enough to challege Sauron himself. It was up to middle earth to do for middle earth. That is why Gandalf never really uses his powers.
The witch king of angmar could not be killed by a man. Literally, a man. It must have been some sort of prophecy that he would not be killed by a man, and everyone just assumed he wouldn't be killed, not that something else could kill him. The thing that isn't mentioned in the movies is that the sword the hobbit was carrying was gotten from a barrow wight, and was left there from the time that the witch king had first been defeated, created by elven smiths to injure the witch king and others like him. So the hobbit stabs the witch king with the magic sword, the magic binding him together was broken, and a woman, not a man, kills him.
As for Arwen, I really think it was just that she chose to stay after the other elves had all left. Had nothing to do with the giving of the necklace. The only thing it says is that she turned from the Twilight (being the West), and embraced the Doom of Man (death). Arwen really isn't in the books, so most of the stuff in the movie about her is contrived.
The guys at the end of the movie were going into the West, on a special ship that only Cirdan (the elf standing in the background) had the ability to build.
Tolkien didn't write much about anything that happened after the War of the Ring.
I suppose the ghost army could have defeated anything, but Aragorn wouldn't have used them that way.
if anything is wrong, well, its been a long time since i read the silmarillion
No, they are much more powerful than they lead you to believe. But, have no real need to use it.
Everyone in the undying lands lives forever. I would imagine they learn and refine arts such as language, and metal working.
I believe in the book it's the saruman who comes back as <insert the name here> in hobbiton. Merry and Pippin "kill" him and his figure blows away in the wind. End of book. Of course, the whole journey back to hobbiton is a months long process. They kind of plod along and take their time.
speg
Diamond Member
I do belive that the hobbits swords were made of something special, which is why he was able to hurt the witch king.
Was it? I thought it was Jack something.
My books are all packed away, so I can't even look.
Of course google would probably help, but I'm too lazy for that.
Fangorn Forest, in The Two Towers. Aragron, Gimli, and Legolas are tracking Merry and Pippin through the forest, and sense that "The White Wizard approaches". Thinking that it's Saruman, they attack, and are easily disarmed, in the manner you described. If i recall, Gandalf knocks away the weapons with his staff as they fly at him, then you see Aragorn drop a glowing sword.
that happened in the movie? I guess I forgot it.
I also posted a reply to ElFenix but I lost my connection and everything I typed is gone.
NesuD
Diamond Member
- Oct 9, 1999
- 4,999
- 106
- 106
You must remember that Gandalf in fact isn't a man. If you read some of Tolkeins other works there are clues as to the origins of the wizards. They are more like a kind of Demigod and were sent to Middle earth by The Valar which are the true gods to aid the elves and men in their struggle against Morgoth and Sauron if i recall correctly. Morgoth was one of the Valar that had gone renegade ages before and had been destroyed by The Valar in a great war. Sauron was one of his henchmen and the only one to survive the war. To counter Sauron who in the beginning had been a demigod type being as well The Valar sent the wizards to middle earth but limited how much of their power they could use to aid the men and elves against Sauron. I think the basic rule was they could only match their immediate adversary in power expended such as the battle with the Balrog. In the books he does use his power a bit more but in subtle ways. Unfortunately because of the nature of movies much of that stuff didn't make it to the big screen.
Actually he does do that in The Two Towers when Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli first encounter him in Fangorn forest and mistake him for Saruman. Gimli throws an axe which he shatters in the air, Legolas shoots an arrow which i think he flames, and Aragorns sword turns redhot in his hand forceing him to drop it. The Scene is in TTT extended edition don't recall for sure if it was in the theatrical release.
Actually he does do that in The Two Towers when Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli first encounter him in Fangorn forest and mistake him for Saruman. Gimli throws an axe which he shatters in the air, Legolas shoots an arrow which i think he flames, and Aragorns sword turns redhot in his hand forceing him to drop it. The Scene is in TTT extended edition don't recall for sure if it was in the theatrical release.[/quote]
See my post above.
:beer:Originally posted by: PipBoy
Galdalf only uses magic directly against enemy magic (vs Balrog, vs Nazgul attacking the horsemen). Otherwise he lets men determine their own fate, using only his own mortal abilities to influence & lead. He doesn't go around dumping 12d6 fireballs into orc encampments
Is that by D&D or AD&D rules.
Siddhartha
Lifer
- Oct 17, 1999
- 12,505
- 3
- 81
Elrond was half human and half elven. His family were able to choice between being mortal and immortal. Elrond's brother, who is Aragon's ancestor, choose mortality. In her love for Aragon, Arwen choose mortality.
BTW, Arwen was over 2000 years old when she first meets Aragon.
Edit:
Tolkien wrote the LOTR as a heroic fantasy in which Hobbits are the main characters with the other men, races, elves, wizards, etc are secondary. This is a twist for this genre because usually it is strongest who are the main characters and heros.
BTW, Arwen was over 2000 years old when she first meets Aragon.
Edit:
Tolkien wrote the LOTR as a heroic fantasy in which Hobbits are the main characters with the other men, races, elves, wizards, etc are secondary. This is a twist for this genre because usually it is strongest who are the main characters and heros.
The other thing which I think is true and should be remembered..
Is that the book, LOTR, is the account of what happened as it would have been known by someone who was part of that world. It isn't written from the position of an overseeing God figure who can understand and explain every event that happens.
Kind of like the way the different authors of the Bible had various interpretations and explanations of the world and events of their time.
Is that the book, LOTR, is the account of what happened as it would have been known by someone who was part of that world. It isn't written from the position of an overseeing God figure who can understand and explain every event that happens.
Kind of like the way the different authors of the Bible had various interpretations and explanations of the world and events of their time.
TRENDING THREADS
-
Discussion Zen 5 Speculation (EPYC Turin and Strix Point/Granite Ridge - Ryzen 9000)- Started by DisEnchantment
- Replies: 25K
-
Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes + WCL Discussion Threads
- Started by Tigerick
- Replies: 23K
-
Discussion Intel current and future Lakes & Rapids thread- Started by TheF34RChannel
- Replies: 23K
-
-
News NVIDIA and Intel to Develop AI Infrastructure and Personal Computing Products- Started by poke01
- Replies: 411
Facebook
Twitter