Just saw lotr:rotk today, had some questions...

[MAME]

Spoilers in case anyone cares...
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These things annoyed me...but I was hoping to get a logical answer to them:

Why didn't Gandalf ever use his magic other than that one time with the light? I thought he was a wizard!

Where was everyone going on the boat at the end of the movie? And they were going to die there, right?

How did Arwen give up her immortality exactly? She gave away her necklace and so she'll die?

The evil witch supposedly couldn't be killed by any man, and I know he was killed by a woman but the male hobbit stabbed him and he was hurt just the same. What was the point of saying he couldn't be killed by a human when in fact he was just as vulnerable as the next?

The ghosts in the mountains were pretty much invincible right? They could have killed everyone in the world if they wanted...?


Also, was there any story after this all ended (as far as books go)? There were a lot of bad guys running away so they kinda have room for more in a sense.


That's all I can think of right now...I'm going to go back to looking at the older ATOT threads posted about lotr now. Thanks!

 

[chocobaR]

Okay, about Gandalf. He's a wizard alright but his magic focuses on intimidation. He's a crappy wizard.

They we're going to the place where Elves go to live their immortality. (I think)

I think Arwen died because it's "forbidden" to have a Human and an Elf together. I've heard something about them getting diseases because of them not being the same race.

Yeah the Witch King was retarded. I never would of expecter her to win. I was sure that she was going to die.

 

[MAME]

Oh, so the elves will live forever but the other people will just die??

Once the elves go there, they don't come back ever?

 

[Hubris]

It's the time of man; it's for him to forge his own destiny now. That's why he was leaving with the elves.

To the Grey Havens, which is like Elf Heaven.

It was an internal and irrevocable choice she made. Had nothing to do with any object.

It's all about FEAR and psychological warfare.

Pretty much. Thought that was kind of a plot hole myself. Can't remember if it's explained better in the books.

Sauron's gone, and he was the strength behind getting all the 'evil' people to work together. They'll be much more manageable now that his will is gone. And Saruman got his ass whupped in the books, but that wasn't shown in the movie (cue nerd controversy a couple months ago).

 

[Yossarian]

Galdalf only uses magic directly against enemy magic (vs Balrog, vs Nazgul attacking the horsemen). Otherwise he lets men determine their own fate, using only his own mortal abilities to influence & lead. He doesn't go around dumping 12d6 fireballs into orc encampments

 

[flxnimprtmscl]

Originally posted by: chocobaR
Okay, about Gandalf. He's a wizard alright but his magic focuses on intimidation. He's a crappy wizard.

They we're going to the place where Elves go to live their immortality. (I think)

LOL, that's too funny He really is a pretty sucky wizard now that I think about it.

As far as where the books go. The hobbits go back to the shire and find that Sauraman (sp?) has escaped the ents and taken over the shire. They kick his butt out and Wormtounge kills him (I think?) Eh, something like that.

 

[NoReMoRsE]

Gandalf didn't use his magic cuz they cut the budget on CGI.

 

[MAME]

Yeah, I was going to ask what happened to Sauron but I guess he would just stay in the tower and die or the trees would just step on him.

 

[MAME]

Originally posted by: flxnimprtmscl

Originally posted by: chocobaR
Okay, about Gandalf. He's a wizard alright but his magic focuses on intimidation. He's a crappy wizard.

They we're going to the place where Elves go to live their immortality. (I think)

LOL, that's too funny He really is a pretty sucky wizard now that I think about it.

As far as where the books go. The hobbits go back to the shire and find that Sauraman (sp?) has escaped the ents and taken over the shire. They kick his butt out and Wormtounge kills him (I think?) Eh, something like that.

Really? How did he escape the ents? Who is Wormtounge?

 

[Hubris]

Originally posted by: MAME

Originally posted by: flxnimprtmscl

Originally posted by: chocobaR
Okay, about Gandalf. He's a wizard alright but his magic focuses on intimidation. He's a crappy wizard.

They we're going to the place where Elves go to live their immortality. (I think)

LOL, that's too funny He really is a pretty sucky wizard now that I think about it.

As far as where the books go. The hobbits go back to the shire and find that Sauraman (sp?) has escaped the ents and taken over the shire. They kick his butt out and Wormtounge kills him (I think?) Eh, something like that.

Really? How did he escape the ents? Who is Wormtounge?

If I remember correctly, Gandalf lets him go, thinking his power is broken and he's no longer a threat. And Womrtongue was the advisor who was poisoning Theoden in Rohan.

 

[95SS]

Originally posted by: MAME


Why didn't Gandalf ever use his magic other than that one time with the light? I thought he was a wizard!

When Gandalf rides out, he has his staff. Not shown in the theatrical release is his battle with the Witch King, during which the staff is broken. This will be in the Extended Edition, I believe.

 

[MAME]

Originally posted by: Hubris

If I remember correctly, Gandalf lets him go, thinking his power is broken and he's no longer a threat. And Womrtongue was the advisor who was poisoning Theoden in Rohan.

All the names of people and places are a blur to me (I had to look up Arwen) but I know who you're talking about now. How could hobbits kick out Sauramon?

 

[Hubris]

Dammit, he should have been the Warlock King.

 

[Yossarian]

Originally posted by: MAME

Originally posted by: Hubris

If I remember correctly, Gandalf lets him go, thinking his power is broken and he's no longer a threat. And Womrtongue was the advisor who was poisoning Theoden in Rohan.

All the names of people and places are a blur to me (I had to look up Arwen) but I know who you're talking about now. How could hobbits kick out Sauramon?

Grima kills him.

 

[MAME]

Originally posted by: 95SS

Originally posted by: MAME


Why didn't Gandalf ever use his magic other than that one time with the light? I thought he was a wizard!

When Gandalf rides out, he has his staff. Not shown in the theatrical release is his battle with the Witch King, during which the staff is broken. This will be in the Extended Edition, I believe.

Well that makes SOME sense but still doesn't explain the loss of magic during every other part of the moive(s)...

 

[MAME]

Originally posted by: PipBoy

Grima kills him.

Oi...who is Grima??

 

[95SS]

Originally posted by: PipBoy

Originally posted by: MAME

Originally posted by: Hubris

If I remember correctly, Gandalf lets him go, thinking his power is broken and he's no longer a threat. And Womrtongue was the advisor who was poisoning Theoden in Rohan.

All the names of people and places are a blur to me (I had to look up Arwen) but I know who you're talking about now. How could hobbits kick out Sauramon?

Grima kills him.

Then Sam kills Grima, I believe.

 

[Yossarian]

Originally posted by: Hubris

Originally posted by: MAME

Originally posted by: flxnimprtmscl

Originally posted by: chocobaR
Okay, about Gandalf. He's a wizard alright but his magic focuses on intimidation. He's a crappy wizard.

They we're going to the place where Elves go to live their immortality. (I think)

LOL, that's too funny He really is a pretty sucky wizard now that I think about it.

As far as where the books go. The hobbits go back to the shire and find that Sauraman (sp?) has escaped the ents and taken over the shire. They kick his butt out and Wormtounge kills him (I think?) Eh, something like that.

Really? How did he escape the ents? Who is Wormtounge?

If I remember correctly, Gandalf lets him go, thinking his power is broken and he's no longer a threat. And Womrtongue was the advisor who was poisoning Theoden in Rohan.

well in the book, Gandalf appoints Treebeard to guard Saruman in his tower. After a while Saruman uses his voice trickery to convince Treebreard that he's no longer a threat, and TB lets him go.

 

[95SS]

Originally posted by: MAME

Originally posted by: PipBoy

Grima kills him.

Oi...who is Grima??

Grima = Wormtongue

 

[slick230]

Originally posted by: chocobaR
Okay, about Gandalf. He's a wizard alright but his magic focuses on intimidation.

Hmm, kinda like the e-thugs that frequent this place.

 

[Yossarian]

Originally posted by: 95SS

Originally posted by: PipBoy

Originally posted by: MAME

Originally posted by: Hubris

If I remember correctly, Gandalf lets him go, thinking his power is broken and he's no longer a threat. And Womrtongue was the advisor who was poisoning Theoden in Rohan.

All the names of people and places are a blur to me (I had to look up Arwen) but I know who you're talking about now. How could hobbits kick out Sauramon?

Grima kills him.

Then Sam kills Grima, I believe.

nameless hobbit archers actually

 

Gandalf is a wizard, one of three that were created by "him".
As the world of tolkien goes, these 3 wizards are as much gods as they are men. So ultimatly the human world is really a minor thing.
From what I've read of tolkien, his idea of magic is much more spiritual and deeply rooted than traditional RPG style "magic".

Everyone on the boat was making the trip to the undying lands. Prior to a fall of numenor travel between the two lands was possible. After the numenoreans were tricked by Sauron to help him, the god sunk the island of numenor, and then made travel to the undying lands impossible, save for a select few.
The numenoreans who survived founded what is now known as Gondor. These humans were the descendants of elves, and thought to the be closest related being. For betraying their gods, they were denied passage and life to the undying lands.

Arwen gave up her mortality by choosing to stay in the mortal realm. I forgot the history behind it, but, all Elves were to make a homeage back to the undying lands, where they would stay for eternity. Just like it was before they made the trip to the mortal lands. By choosing to stay behind from this great migration destiny, she became immortal.

I know the plot hole about the witch king, but I can't remember how it works out. I know the book is better than the movie at explaining that.

Ultimatly I suggest you read the trilogy. There are also a few beatiaries out there that are written by, well, tolkien historians for lack of a better term.

 

[Xionide]

These things annoyed me...but I was hoping to get a logical answer to them:

Why didn't Gandalf ever use his magic other than that one time with the light? I thought he was a wizard!

Cause he is a wuss

Where was everyone going on the boat at the end of the movie? And they were going to die there, right?

dont know I think thats the point

How did Arwen give up her immortality exactly? She gave away her necklace and so she'll die?

I thought it was some sort of this where the necklace is a sort of life frorce that only works with elve's. She gave it to the dude as a sign that she wants to live in the lifespan of a human so she could be with him. But to each is own I guess

The evil witch supposedly couldn't be killed by any man, and I know he was killed by a woman but the male hobbit stabbed him and he was hurt just the same. What was the point of saying he couldn't be killed by a human when in fact he was just as vulnerable as the next?

They said man. Not human. She wasnt a man. The hobit wasnt a man, he was a male hobbit. That was hard to understand?

The ghosts in the mountains were pretty much invincible right? They could have killed everyone in the world if they wanted...?

Yep but they saw it as "if I kill everyone I will not be able to be released" so they didnt. They kept to themelves waiting for the guy to come and free them.

 

[Barrak]

No "MAN" can kill the witchking. Women and hobbits are not a MAN.

In the book Sauron was made powerless, but escapes and goes to hobbiton and takes over. Then then Merry and Pippin come back and kick his butt.

 

[MAME]

Originally posted by: SampSon
Gandalf is a wizard, one of three that were created by "him".
As the world of tolkien goes, these 3 wizards are as much gods as they are men. So ultimatly the human world is really a minor thing.
From what I've read of tolkien, his idea of magic is much more spiritual and deeply rooted than traditional RPG style "magic".

Everyone on the boat was making the trip to the undying lands. Prior to a fall of numenor travel between the two lands was possible. After the numenoreans were tricked by Sauron to help him, the god sunk the island of numenor, and then made travel to the undying lands impossible, save for a select few.
The numenoreans who survived founded what is now known as Gondor. These humans were the descendants of elves, and thought to the be closest related being. For betraying their gods, they were denied passage and life to the undying lands.

Arwen gave up her mortality by choosing to stay in the mortal realm. I forgot the history behind it, but, all Elves were to make a homeage back to the undying lands, where they would stay for eternity. Just like it was before they made the trip to the mortal lands. By choosing to stay behind from this great migration destiny, she became immortal.

I know the plot hole about the witch king, but I can't remember how it works out. I know the book is better than the movie at explaining that.

Ultimatly I suggest you read the trilogy. There are also a few beatiaries out there that are written by, well, tolkien historians for lack of a better term.

Wow, ok then.
So wizards aren't really that powerful? That sucks...I seem to recall that Gandalf blocks axes and arrows thrown at him when he first appears after beating the Balrog fire guy. He didn't do anything cool like that in the movies...

Does everyone in the undying lands live forever? What do they do there anyway?