Just ordered 5870. Have p35 with celly: i5 vs. Q9550

[AzN]

Originally posted by: Pneumothorax
Ok so we came back with a q9550. He decided to spend the extra on a x25m instead. Thanks for all the replies we'll see how much she overclocks

Yes please do tell. What was your FSB limit before the quad? Do you know?

 

[BTRY B 529th FA BN]

Originally posted by: Azn

Originally posted by: BTRY B 529th FA BN
Azn are you overclocking a Yorkfield @ 500fsb on the 3yr old board you are talking about? I've personally never used a quad on a P35 chipset but even with the better P45 chipset a Wolfdale will still hit higher fsb for overclocking than a Yorkfield. The king of the quadcore 775lga OCing imo is the Gigabyte UD3R or P and the low 500's is getting near a quads max on that board. So you see your point about your 3yr old board doing 500fsb is somewhat good to hear but in the case of what chip you were or are using on that board is also relevant as the OP is thinking of going with a Q9550, not a Wolfdale. So it is important to include such information

Now you are just baiting/trolling me. You know as hell know I don't have yorkfield and I'm not upgrading yet because I'm satisfied with my setup for now. I could go buy it if you are willing to put a little wager just to make it little interesting.

What is the average overclock of Q9550 on P45 board? It sure as hell isn't 4.5ghz @ 500fsb. My board has been stressed all the way up to 500fsb as my memory is the limit not if it's a quad or dual.

Heh

3.8 - 4Ghz is average with proper cooling & on the right board and usually they are within Intel's 1.365vcore spec. 479 was my max fsb on my Asus MIIF board. 500fsb is the highest stable fsb I have tested on my UD3R board. I've had my Q9550 at 4Ghz doing 500 fsb x an 8 multi, but for its particular use & cooling, i've tuned it down to 3.8Ghz. side note: What is funny is that with my DDR2 900 kit, it will not do 450fsb as I started a discussion about it here. So the board can push the chips potential to 4.25Ghz but I've never tried it. And with the 4Ghz configuration I was using a DDR2 1000 kit & an 8 multi. Currently I am running 4 sticks of that DDR2 900 kit at 475fsb with the timings opened up at 5.5.5.15 and she is running smooth as glass. I know I just threw all that info in there like a tossed salad but it all makes sense at one point or another.

 

[VooDooAddict]

Originally posted by: Pneumothorax
Ok so we came back with a q9550. He decided to spend the extra on a x25m instead. Thanks for all the replies we'll see how much she overclocks

Good call.

 

[Schmide]

Originally posted by: Azn
(edit snip)
Tell me what is different about quad vs core 2 duo overclocking... Absolutely nothing! No offense

Quads are way way more finicky. I had an 8200 that could barely do 400fsb on a 650i or a p35. Same chip on a p45 would do 470fsb and on an 780i 490fsb. There is a lot of arbitration when two separate chips share the same FSB.

 

[TurtleCrusher]

Originally posted by: Azn

Originally posted by: BTRY B 529th FA BN

Originally posted by: Azn

Originally posted by: Pneumothorax
Would his P35 based board limit his FSB o/c to only about 400?

I don't think so. I have a original P965 board that is 3 years old when first core 2 duo were released. It does 500fsb no problem.

we are talking about a quad which is a different ballpark not an E6300 - no offense

get this guys board for 100$ shipped and you are good with that quad up to about 525fsb - mine yawns at 500fsb

Tell me what is different about quad vs core 2 duo overclocking... Absolutely nothing! No offense

Lolz.. You made a funnie.

 

[error8]

Originally posted by: happy medium
I believe that its the northbridge that limits your overclock on p35 boards with quads. No direct experience with it but I've read this to be true.

I believe it's more dependent of the power circuit. All P35s ( although I'm not that sure) have a maximum of 4 phases for the cpu, which isn't enough to provide stable voltage and current for a quad at very high frequencies.

 

[BTRY B 529th FA BN]

Originally posted by: error8

Originally posted by: happy medium
I believe that its the northbridge that limits your overclock on p35 boards with quads. No direct experience with it but I've read this to be true.

I believe it's more dependent of the power circuit. All P35s ( although I'm not that sure) have a maximum of 4 phases for the cpu, which isn't enough to provide stable voltage and current for a quad at very high frequencies.

sounds right..

 

[heyheybooboo]

Originally posted by: Denithor
Probably not worth the premium.

EDIT: Grab the Q9550 and put the extra cash toward an Intel G2 SSD instead.

+1

I believe I'd hold off on the SSD for a bit (though there is an OCZ Agility Gen2 120Gb for around $300) as some price cuts and sales are inevitable.


Edit:

Oops ---- I see he got the SSD anyway.

No worries but prepare for a bit of buyers remorse as prices drop through the end of the year - :d:

Let us know how that 5870 performs ....

 

[CurseTheSky]

Sounds like you made the right choice to me. I opted for a platform upgrade, since my 680i is getting a bit too old. It doesn't support AHCI, which is a huge benefit for my X-25M.

Unfortunately for me, I was going to have to throw down $130 for a motherboard AND $170 for a processor, both of which are already EOL, just to keep it a bit more "future proof." Instead I opted to spend $160 on a motherboard, $220 on a processor, and $80 on DDR3. My P7P55D Pro, i7 860, and 4GB G.Skill should be here Monday.

If I were in his shoes where all I needed was one part, I'd definitely stick with LGA 775.

 

[Pneumothorax]

Well, he ended staying up late (pissed off his GF) and only got around 415 FSB stable, tried boosting FSB/Chipset/termination voltage/lowering multi and can't get prime95 stable in win7x64. I had the same Gigabyte P35-DS3L in the past and got around 450 or so on a E8500. I'd love to drop that q9550 in my EP45-UD3P board and max it out, but he's pretty happy with his o/c. The 5870 feels (seat of the pants, didn't bench it) faster in several games we tried vs. my 4890, but for the 24" monitors we use, it's just not enough of an upgrade for me. Runs much cooler though, by the amount of heat felt coming out the back. And no the holes in front of the card don't dump hot air into the case.

He ordered the X-25M 80gb from amazon as ZZF/Newegg will charge him almost 10% in TAX! (he lives in LA county 9.75% FTL)

I already have a 920 D0 at 3.8, but seeing all those i5 750 for so cheap made me almost buy one just to see how far I can o/c it.

 

[RussianSensation]

Ya 415 is what I said it'll do roughly.

ou can't compare E8500 450FSB overclocking. My DS3L can do 500FSB with E6400. It has been said that 45nm quad overclocking on P35 chipset sucks. Still even at 3.4ghz, this cpu will be a big improvement for him.

 

[BTRY B 529th FA BN]

If you don't have to buy ram, then why not get the Gigabyte UD3R or P board? - over 500fsb of quad core overclocking goodness!

 

[AzN]

Originally posted by: Schmide

Originally posted by: Azn
(edit snip)
Tell me what is different about quad vs core 2 duo overclocking... Absolutely nothing! No offense

Quads are way way more finicky. I had an 8200 that could barely do 400fsb on a 650i or a p35. Same chip on a p45 would do 470fsb and on an 780i 490fsb. There is a lot of arbitration when two separate chips share the same FSB.

Nvidia's 650i SLI boards sucks at fsb overclocking compared to intel's official core 2 duo boards I hope you knew that.

Motherboard will determine the max FSB speed not which processor.

 

[AzN]

Originally posted by: RussianSensation
Ya 415 is what I said it'll do roughly.

ou can't compare E8500 450FSB overclocking. My DS3L can do 500FSB with E6400. It has been said that 45nm quad overclocking on P35 chipset sucks. Still even at 3.4ghz, this cpu will be a big improvement for him.

Where are you getting this info from? Who said this?

415x9=3735mhz not 3.4ghz.

edit: Here are some links about the same subject by searching google.

http://forums.overclockers.com...howthread.php?t=659533

2 examples of p35 board that did 450fsb with Q9450.

http://www.overclock.net/attac...1.49vcore_9.953s_1.png

Another here 465fsb on p35 board.


http://episteme.arstechnica.co...7909774/m/117003502931

 

[n7]

Originally posted by: Pneumothorax
Ok so we came back with a q9550. He decided to spend the extra on a x25m instead. Thanks for all the replies we'll see how much she overclocks

I woulda likely suggested an i5 750 + cheaper P55 mobo, but nothing wrong with a Q9550 & definitely nicely done getting that SSD :thumbsup:

Originally posted by: Azn

Originally posted by: RussianSensation
Ya 415 is what I said it'll do roughly.

ou can't compare E8500 450FSB overclocking. My DS3L can do 500FSB with E6400. It has been said that 45nm quad overclocking on P35 chipset sucks. Still even at 3.4ghz, this cpu will be a big improvement for him.

Where are you getting this info from? Who said this?

415x9=3735mhz not 3.4ghz.

edit: Here are some links about the same subject by searching google.

http://forums.overclockers.com...howthread.php?t=659533

2 examples of p35 board that did 450fsb with Q9450.

http://www.overclock.net/attac...1.49vcore_9.953s_1.png

Another here 465fsb on p35 board.


http://episteme.arstechnica.co...7909774/m/117003502931

Dude, don't take this the wrong way, but you aren't making yourself too good.

You CANNOT overclock quads to the same FSB as duals stably on any motherboard.
It's not even close.

I have more than enough experience with this, as does anyone who owns a quad core CPU.
I don't know why you are arguing this, as it's so incredibly well known it's not even funny.

Also, OP got a Q9550, which has an 8.5x multi, not 9x.
So 8.5x415 = 3528 MHz, or with 8.5x400, 3400 MHz.

That board is not a good mobo for clocking high FSBs with quads.
For that you'd want a UD3R/P.

This statement kinda sums it up, sorry:

Originally posted by: Azn
My board has been stressed all the way up to 500fsb as my memory is the limit not if it's a quad or dual.

Wrong.
Just because your RAM can do 500 in no way shape or form means your CPU can.

Trust me, i own a P5B Deluxe...you certainly can get 500 FSB on that board, but again, with a dual core.
When you get a quad (if you do), on that board, you'll start to understand a bit more what we are talking about

 

[Schmide]

Azn, the motherboard and the chip determine the overclock. If you believe all chips will reach the same FSB on the same motherboard, more power to you. You're really arguing a moot point which you seem to have little or no experience with. How many quads so you own?

As for the examples. Sure you will find quads doing more than 400fsb on said motherboards. It is more an exception than and a commonality.

 

[BTRY B 529th FA BN]

Originally posted by: Azn

2 examples of p35 board that did 450fsb with Q9450.

http://www.overclock.net/attac...1.49vcore_9.953s_1.png

AZN. READ THE NB CHIPSET.

That is an X38 chipset.

 

[AzN]

Originally posted by: BTRY B 529th FA BN

Originally posted by: Azn

2 examples of p35 board that did 450fsb with Q9450.

http://www.overclock.net/attac...1.49vcore_9.953s_1.png

AZN. READ THE NB CHIPSET.

That is an X38 chipset.

Oh my bad. I googled for p35 I guess that came up. It still doesn't change the fact that the 2 examples of P35 board doing 450fsb with Q9450 in my other link.

 

[AzN]

Originally posted by: n7
Wrong.
Just because your RAM can do 500 in no way shape or form means your CPU can.

That wasn't what I meant. I meant my motherboard has been stressed upto 500fsb with the CPU I have now which I could go higher if my memory wasn't limiting.

Trust me, i own a P5B Deluxe...you certainly can get 500 FSB on that board, but again, with a dual core.
When you get a quad (if you do), on that board, you'll start to understand a bit more what we are talking about

Without links or study done proving your claims I have no reason to trust you. If you could provide that information I would be more than happy to agree with you.

 

[n7]

No thanx.

I have no desire to argue with someone who's made it very clear they prefer to ignorantly argue over a topic than learn something.

 

[RussianSensation]

Originally posted by: Azn

415x9=3735mhz not 3.4ghz.

Multi is 8.5 for Q9550. He said 415 is not stable under Prime95 in Win7 64.

Other than the differences in the P45 vs. P35 chipset, you also have to consider that DS3L is a 4-phase power design, with no power circuitry cooling and no PLL/VTT adjustments in the BIOS for the processor. Even if it did 415FSB now, such high quad FSB on that budget board may bring it to its knees within months since it wasn't designed to run at such FSB from the beginning. It was the perfect budget board for Q6600/6700 cpus, due to low 1066FSB (or ocing under 400FSB on a quad), but not for 45nm quad overclocking.

I even replaced my northbridge heatsink and put Tuniq TX-2 to it when I was testing max FSB on the Q6600. Since my quad could do 3400mhz at 9x multiplier, and my OCZ Platinums could do DDR2-950, 475FSB should have been achievable, but it wasn't. Based on this, I suggested 400x8.5 = 3400 to be a safe 24/7 overclock long term.

Here is a whole thread dedicated to Q9550 and DS3L overclocking. Most agree that this board can only do 400-420FSB on Q9550. One user even reported browning of the 4-pin cpu power connector for the mobo.

For 45nm Quads you want Gigabyte P45-UD3R/P.

 

[Schmide]

Originally posted by: Azn

Originally posted by: n7
Wrong.
Just because your RAM can do 500 in no way shape or form means your CPU can.

That wasn't what I meant. I meant my motherboard has been stressed upto 500fsb with the CPU I have now which I could go higher if my memory wasn't limiting.

Trust me, i own a P5B Deluxe...you certainly can get 500 FSB on that board, but again, with a dual core.
When you get a quad (if you do), on that board, you'll start to understand a bit more what we are talking about

Without links or study done proving your claims I have no reason to trust you. If you could provide that information I would be more than happy to agree with you.

I have to count the irony at 2 here.

First reply proof needed users experience.

Second reply proof is only satisfied by links or study.

Huh.

 

[Pneumothorax]

Sorry to start an argument here, but I'll chime in with my own experience with a Q9550. My 1st hackintosh mobo was the P35-DS3L I could barely get it stable at 405 FSB. I later transferred that EXACT SAME CHIP into a EP45-UD3P. Now I'm getting 440FSB (440x8.5) on stock voltage, much better.

 

[AzN]

Originally posted by: Schmide
Azn, the motherboard and the chip determine the overclock. If you believe all chips will reach the same FSB on the same motherboard, more power to you. You're really arguing a moot point which you seem to have little or no experience with. How many quads so you own?

Schmide, I'm quite aware the motherboard and the chip determine the overclock. Again that's not even remotely close to what I said which I underlined.

Here let me explain again since you seem to have comprehension problems to what I was trying to get at.

My board does 500fsb with E6300 since my E6300 is capable of 3.5ghz @ 500fsb at least that's what I've tested up to because my memory was limiting my overclock or at least that's what it seemed as I only have ddr2-800.

Now If I get a Q9550 and this chip can is capable of 500fsb I don't see any reason that my p965 board can't do the 500fsb with that processor.

I don't own any quads in my system but I do have 2 i5 750 and i7 920 here in my hands and don't plan on upgrading anytime soon as I mentioned earlier but if you are willing to put your money where mouth is I would get a q9550.

As for the examples. Sure you will find quads doing more than 400fsb on said motherboards. It is more an exception than and a commonality.

You have yet to give examples of this p35 400fsb limiting on Yorkfield processors. No articles proving this theory nor proof of any kind other than your words. If you can find evidence post proof if not I suggest you stop giving bad examples of 650i motherboards that suck at fsb overclocking even on dual core to make your claims.,

 

[AzN]

Originally posted by: Pneumothorax
Sorry to start an argument here, but I'll chime in with my own experience with a Q9550. My 1st hackintosh mobo was the P35-DS3L I could barely get it stable at 405 FSB. I later transferred that EXACT SAME CHIP into a EP45-UD3P. Now I'm getting 440FSB (440x8.5) on stock voltage, much better.

Little more information is needed. Did you use the same memory from previous board? Are there better memory timing options on the P45 chipset? Settings used?

You say you did 440fsb @ 8.5 multiplier to get 3740mhz how about p35 chipset? Did you use 9x multiplier to get 3645mhz? So in all you got less than 100mhz by switching to P45 chipset? Did you try higher FSB by lowering multiplier on the p35 board?