Judge Orders DraftKings and FanDuel To Cease Doing Business in NY State

[zinfamous]

Try Desitin for that case of butthurt.





1% of the players win more than 90% of the money and in your Bizarro world that is defined as "a little bit of skill"?


It's an almost entirely skill-based gambling game.

they win because they spend hundreds of thousands of dollars per day, to win some percentaged of hundreds of games that they play.

I don't think you have any clue as to how those 1% of people play.

THis is a full time job for them, and just like eveyr other gambling game, which this absolutely is, they win 90% of the time because they play 200x the number of events that the other 90% of players play.

Their "skill," as it relates to success, is entirely beholden to a shear numbers game. They lose a lot, but they win a shit ton more, and higher stakes games, than any of those other players.

spreadsheets and algorithms are useful, but nothing more than tools that allow them to efficiently play shittons more games than the plebians.

Also, that recent damning study that it looks like the highest percentage of those 1%ers are actually employees of other fantasty sports gambling sights, that have privledged access to numbers that no one else has: daily percentages of player drafts pre-lockout time.

so, yeah, it is about knowing the numbers. You're just conveniently ignoring the numbers that actually spell success in this game.

 

[GagHalfrunt]

Any given Sunday.

Wasn't Buffalo supposed to win today? Did you have Charles Clay in your fantasy lineup by any chance? Did your skill tell you not to play him because there was a chance he was and did get injured early in the game today?

The daily fantasy sites are a game of chance, not a game of skill.

Your ignorance continues to shine through.

1) Buffalo was an underdog today.

2) The line is not predicated on who is supposed to win, it's designed to split the bets 50/50 so that bookies have no skin in the game and are guaranteed to win money from the vig. Nothing more than that. The line is the oddsmakers predicting the betting patterns, not the outcome of the games.

3) Explain how 1% of the players win more than 90% of the money in a "game of chance". Please! I'm dying to hear one of you "game of chance" or "little bit of skill" morons come up with a way that can happen long term over millions and millions of iterations on anything other than the skill of that 1% of players.

 

[zinfamous]

Half of the derivatives markets qualify under that definition, just stop.

which is why that is also gambling to a large degree and, as you know, is also largely fixed.

what's your point?

 

[zinfamous]

Your ignorance continues to shine through.

1) Buffalo was an underdog today.

2) The line is not predicated on who is supposed to win, it's designed to split the bets 50/50 so that bookies have no skin in the game and are guaranteed to win money from the vig. Nothing more than that. The line is the oddsmakers predicting the betting patterns, not the outcome of the games.

3) Explain how 1% of the players win 90% of the money in a "game of chance".

I did in the post above yours here, so read my post.

also, this

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/04/13/dream-teams

also, Jon Oliver's segment that was posted earlier.

OK fuck it, I'll summarize: 1% of the players win 90% of the games because that 1% of the players play 90% of the games compared to everyone else.

They win between 5 and 6 figures per day, or can lose 5 or mid five figures on some days. Just like a professional poker player. All you need is the proper tools (knowledge and efficiency), a good cash base--enough winnings to buffer those frequent big losses, to simply win out through brute force and pure numbers games.

 

[OutHouse]

I haven't played the daily fantasy sites at all, but if they follow the standard fantasy leagues in any form they are just as much a game of chance, or a lottery if you will as one could consider them a game of skill.

Even if they don't follow the same format, is essentially is a lottery and New York State's law is written as such that only the State of New York can administer lotteries within the state of New York.



Yeah, I miss seeing the Viagra and Cialis commercials every 30 seconds instead.

Or payton's annoying as fuck nationwide commercials

 

[videogames101]

which is why that is also gambling to a large degree and, as you know, is also largely fixed.

what's your point?

That as an adult I should be allowed to gamble. :thumbsup:

We all do it, it's just not called gambling.

 

[zinfamous]

That as an adult I should be allowed to gamble. :thumbsup:

We all do it, it's just not called gambling.

I totally agree.

I don't think anyone is against Draft Kings or daily fantasy and what they do. It's that this argument has become silly in the sense that some are letting the lawyers and owners of these companies fill their minds with the same semantic tomfoolery that convinces very few people that their gambling service is not gambling.

But that really isn't the issue, either.The issue is that they are offering a gambling service that currently competes unfairly with every other gambling service that, we as a society, have collectively agreed is fine so long as we establish that they provide some benefit under regulations, and they play as fairly as we tolerate (the house is always stacked, of course, but this seems to be commonly-agreed upon standard for both parties, so no general foul, there). Of course this is the only reason that such "skill" semantics float around. I do find it strange, however, that smart people who are supposedly not invested in these services are so easily swayed by these arguments. It's strange, really.

The issue is that these groups are very clearly attempting to cheat the system, and quite boldly, too.

That established casinos and gambling services in certain states are arguing that these need to be regulated is not an issue of them whining that these upstarts are simply outplaying them and, "hey, free-market, bitches!" It is actually cheating the free market. These companies are leaches.

Further, when it is known that a very large majority of the winnings earned through each service are, in fact, trapped by employees of the very companies providing the services, this goes beyond cheating.

http://www.businessinsider.com/draftkings-daily-fantasy-sports-fanduel-2015-10
http://espn.go.com/chalk/story/_/id...transparency-integrity-daily-fantasy-industry
http://deadspin.com/draftkings-employee-with-access-to-inside-info-wins-35-1734719747
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-wont-win-money-playing-daily-fantasy-sports/

The more the feds and locals push, the more investigations these companies weather, the more likely they are going to see serious fraud charges against them

Hell, doesn't this remind anyone of the well-documented fraud perpetrated by the long-time handlers of McDonald's exceedingly popular Monopoly game?

http://priceonomics.com/the-mcdonalds-monopoly-fraud/


Draft Kings was founded in 2012
FanDuel was founded in 2009.

It is said that these companies each command several billions in revenue. That is an incredibly short amount of time to accrue an unprecedented amount of revenue, in a service that offers a "skill-based game."

Further, with the bulk of the actual winnings (Still outside of much of the total value of each company) trapped within some 1% of total players, and most of those wealthy winning players actually being employees of competing daily fantasy conpanies...what is that telling us?

It really isn't a surprising that these companies were founded by former online poker companies (you know--gamblers), and that many of the champions of these games are former professional poker champions.

This is the most obvious puzzle to put together, it is smacking everyone in the face, yet we still see these scummy companies put forth an argument of, essentially, "Nuh Uh!"

 

[Fenixgoon]

Half of the derivatives markets qualify under that definition, just stop.

That's because the stock market is legalized gambling in a sense. You are putting up something of value based on the chance of you winning (your stock increasing in value).

 

[SSSnail]

you clearly have no clue.

The rest of your sentence was superfluous, I fixed it for you.

 

[TheGardener]

No, but they all agree that you can't read or think. It's not being banned because it's a lottery, it's being banned because it's gambling. Although both are illegal under NY laws they're completely different things. If you truly don't understand the difference between a lottery and a game of skill then you need professional help.

I can and do read. I don't care what your definitions are of a lottery versus gambling. What counts are state laws and regulations. You only attack me, because you are so pigheaded that you refuse to understand and acknowledge arguments, that do not appear in your narrow view of the universe.

The NY AG and the first NY state judge do agree that they promote themselves like a lottery. In their eyes this is gambling AND a lottery. Here is document that you can read and that substantiates that you are misinformed, as to the nature of the rulings. Whether they hold up or not, I have no idea. My guess is that this will take a year or several years longer to resolve in appeals in NY state and likely US courts.

See page 3, where Justice Mendez says, "the companies... promote themselves like a lottery." On page 4 and 5 there is a legal definition of what gambling is according to NY state law.

https://iapps.courts.state.ny.us/fb...cumentId=yS/p3t9HLBAM2iHKjPymJQ==&system=prod

You only attacked me because you want to kill the messenger. Too bad. For the record, I do agree that most states should ban these companies, unless local laws and regulations are enacted, that allow these companies to operate under regulatory oversight and collect a percentage of the bets. Some states might ban them all together. Perhaps some states will ultimately run their own version of what these companies do. Something will have to bend, because too many people that vote want to wager on fantasy sports.

 

[TheGardener]

Fucking liberal nanny state becomes are annoying everyday. I'm still not even allowed to play online poker, what a joke.

Not for real money. Only play money. The overseas companies were threatened to be indicted for money laundering. Or maybe they were. Also the US govt has a lot to say about who can own an internet address. We are all just pawns.