Jobless Claims on the Rise

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rjain

Golden Member
May 1, 2003
1,475
0
0
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: rjain
They just smooth the numbers so that 400k is the rate that is equal to the normal rate of job creation. Kinda goofy, if you ask me. The people fixating on that number must have some strange fetish.

There's a few of those in here, you seemed to be in that club for a while, welcome back. I thought you were part of a Tag Team with DirtBoy :D

Last I checked, you were one of the ones with that fetish.
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,894
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: gordy
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
Walmart is paying better these days?

i don't know what walmart pays...do you?

$324 week for 38 hr workweek. $8.50 hr.

<loud wrong answer gameshow buzzer>

stepdaughter makin' 11.25 @ wal*mart (3rd shift) regular shift a buck less

</loud wrong answer gameshow buzzer>

Did she start at that rate? How long has she been there?

 

rjain

Golden Member
May 1, 2003
1,475
0
0
Dave, the facts show that the average pay rates are going up (slightly). Your desire for them to go down is irrelevant.
 

heartsurgeon

Diamond Member
Aug 18, 2001
4,260
0
0
1% less work means 1 in every 100 ppls looses a job ...
whaat??? Read the report more people are working now, not less.

the analysis does indicate an unfavorable rate of wage increase and job condition.
wages are up, more people are working..try to get your facts correct.

the economy is improving, more people are working, wages are up,
and liberals just don't know how to deal with it.

 

LunarRay

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2003
9,993
1
76
Somesin is goofy.. first my hocus pocus post and now this.. hmmmmm

Our conclusion: A single parent employed full-time at Salina?s Wal-Mart and raising children aged 4 and 12 does not earn enough money to supply the family?s basic needs by shopping at that same Wal-Mart.

According to the personnel manager at Salina?s Supercenter, a cashier earns a starting hourly wage of $6.25. After Social Security and Medicare taxes, the paychecks for a month would total $1016 for a full-time 176 hours. (That?s 40 hours a week, which would put this cashier in a better financial position than the many employees who work 32 or fewer hours a week. Of course, hourly pay rises eventually, but the 2001 PBS report "Store Wars" found that most employees have left by the end of their first year.)
I googled in 'walmart wage' and all sorts of lies like this popped up.. Must be some kinda mystery how so many can make up such stories..

Another bunch of bitter minimum wage walmart employees... lies,,, just lies...
 

LunarRay

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2003
9,993
1
76
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: rjain
They just smooth the numbers so that 400k is the rate that is equal to the normal rate of job creation. Kinda goofy, if you ask me. The people fixating on that number must have some strange fetish.

There's a few of those in here, you seemed to be in that club for a while, welcome back. I thought you were part of a Tag Team with DirtBoy :D

DM, the 400K number would be nice if the numbers they used were accurate.. a few posts back I posted 'hocus pocus' where California sorta messsed up and counted like 70,000 they shouldn't of.. wonder what that did to that months national numbers.. probably nothing..

 

LunarRay

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2003
9,993
1
76
Just so we are all on the same page regarding the numbers provided by the BLS, I thought this ought to be posted.. It sorta makes clearer the value of what we debate as it approaches the 400K or any other number threshold.

Reliability of the estimates

Statistics based on the household and establishment surveys are subject
to both sampling and nonsampling error. When a sample rather than the
entire population is surveyed, there is a chance that the sample estimates
may differ from the "true" population values they represent. The exact
difference, or sampling error, varies depending on the particular sample
selected, and this variability is measured by the standard error of the
estimate. There is about a 90-percent chance, or level of confidence, that
an estimate based on a sample will differ by no more than 1.6 standard
errors from the "true" population value because of sampling error. BLS
analyses are generally conducted at the 90-percent level of confidence.

For example, the confidence interval for the monthly change in total
employment from the household survey is on the order of plus or minus
290,000. Suppose the estimate of total employment increases by 100,000
from one month to the next. The 90-percent confidence interval on the
monthly change would range from -190,000 to 390,000 (100,000 +/- 290,000).
These figures do not mean that the sample results are off by these
magnitudes, but rather that there is about a 90-percent chance that the
"true" over-the-month change lies within this interval. Since this range
includes values of less than zero, we could not say with confidence that
employment had, in fact, increased. If, however, the reported employment
rise was half a million, then all of the values within the 90-percent
confidence interval would be greater than zero. In this case, it is likely
(at least a 90-percent chance) that an employment rise had, in fact,
occurred. At an unemployment rate of around 4 percent, the 90-percent con-
fidence interval for the monthly change in unemployment is about +/- 270,000,
and for the monthly change in the unemployment rate it is about +/- .19
percentage point.


Appropriate BLS page..
 

alchemize

Lifer
Mar 24, 2000
11,489
0
0
Originally posted by: LunarRay
Somesin is goofy.. first my hocus pocus post and now this.. hmmmmm

Our conclusion: A single parent employed full-time at Salina?s Wal-Mart and raising children aged 4 and 12 does not earn enough money to supply the family?s basic needs by shopping at that same Wal-Mart.

According to the personnel manager at Salina?s Supercenter, a cashier earns a starting hourly wage of $6.25. After Social Security and Medicare taxes, the paychecks for a month would total $1016 for a full-time 176 hours. (That?s 40 hours a week, which would put this cashier in a better financial position than the many employees who work 32 or fewer hours a week. Of course, hourly pay rises eventually, but the 2001 PBS report "Store Wars" found that most employees have left by the end of their first year.)
I googled in 'walmart wage' and all sorts of lies like this popped up.. Must be some kinda mystery how so many can make up such stories..

Another bunch of bitter minimum wage walmart employees... lies,,, just lies...

And since when should a single parent be able to raise 2 kids and work at Wal-Mart?
rolleye.gif
I would hope a single parent working at Wal-Mart has some supplemental alimony and/or child support checks coming in.

I feel sorry for the <1% of Wal-Mart employees that are there because they are down on their luck. I don't feel sorry for the 99% who decided to drop out/not go to college/get married at 18/have a baby at 15/lost their retirement money in the stock market (try diversification next time)/other woe is me stories.

If working at Wal-Mart is now our new "you should be able to support a family on this" wage then what a sad state our country has come to.

P.S. Anyone want to do some research on the minimum wage? Was it ever intended to support a family?
 

rchiu

Diamond Member
Jun 8, 2002
3,846
0
0
Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
1% less work means 1 in every 100 ppls looses a job ...
whaat??? Read the report more people are working now, not less.

the analysis does indicate an unfavorable rate of wage increase and job condition.
wages are up, more people are working..try to get your facts correct.

the economy is improving, more people are working, wages are up,
and liberals just don't know how to deal with it.

People are working less (33.8 vs. 34.2 hours/week) and less percent of total population are employed (62.4% vs. 64.5%). The economy is worse than before and you just don't know how to deal with it.

I have no problem getting my facts correct.
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,894
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: LunarRay
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: rjain
They just smooth the numbers so that 400k is the rate that is equal to the normal rate of job creation. Kinda goofy, if you ask me. The people fixating on that number must have some strange fetish.

There's a few of those in here, you seemed to be in that club for a while, welcome back. I thought you were part of a Tag Team with DirtBoy :D

DM, the 400K number would be nice if the numbers they used were accurate.. a few posts back I posted 'hocus pocus' where California sorta messsed up and counted like 70,000 they shouldn't of.. wonder what that did to that months national numbers.. probably nothing..

Oh, I know, I saw and read the release. Typical constant "Revising" of the numbers. They try and hide their mistakes in the hopes that the very same News organizations that hyped their wrong numbers would somehow miraculously miss and not report the revision of their "mistake". Sounds exactly like the AT experts in here too, falling all over themselves and their "Magical" numbers.
rolleye.gif
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,894
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: LunarRay
Somesin is goofy.. first my hocus pocus post and now this.. hmmmmm

Our conclusion: A single parent employed full-time at Salina?s Wal-Mart and raising children aged 4 and 12 does not earn enough money to supply the family?s basic needs by shopping at that same Wal-Mart.

According to the personnel manager at Salina?s Supercenter, a cashier earns a starting hourly wage of $6.25. After Social Security and Medicare taxes, the paychecks for a month would total $1016 for a full-time 176 hours. (That?s 40 hours a week, which would put this cashier in a better financial position than the many employees who work 32 or fewer hours a week. Of course, hourly pay rises eventually, but the 2001 PBS report "Store Wars" found that most employees have left by the end of their first year.)
I googled in 'walmart wage' and all sorts of lies like this popped up.. Must be some kinda mystery how so many can make up such stories..

Another bunch of bitter minimum wage walmart employees... lies,,, just lies...

You heard the AT experts here repeatedly over and over that this is great for the Country and this is an increase in wages. They even said if they need to make more to get by simply work another 40 hours at the same wage at another job.

Just great, work 24hrs a day 7 days a week and still not be able to put a roof over your head but that's OK it's the New American Dream.
 

dirtboy

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
6,745
1
81
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
You heard the AT experts here repeatedly over and over that this is great for the Country and this is an increase in wages. They even said if they need to make more to get by simply work another 40 hours at the same wage at another job.

Just great, work 24hrs a day 7 days a week and still not be able to put a roof over your head but that's OK it's the New American Dream.

People live and die by the decisions they make. You once made a decision to install distributed clients on your employer's computers and it got you fired.

Nobody forces people to work at Walmart. Walmart offers a wage and people decide to work there on their own free will. Do these workers deserve to be rich? No. I'd bet many of these workers have, at best, a high school education. Is it my fault they decided to have children at a young age instead of going to college? No. You say they don't make enough money to live on? Then tell me how it is they do. Answer me for once.

Many of these people probably rent an apartment or live in low income housing. There's nothing wrong with that. Again, nobody forced them into this lifestyle.

The American Dream, as you so proudly drag in the dirt, is not about everybody gets to be rich in America. It has never been that. It has always been about the opportunity to do whatever you want, life the life you want and if you work hard you can perhaps achieve a lifestyle that only a few do.

Go talk to some Walmart people. Ask them why they work there. Find out why they don't go out and do bigger and better things. Many people are unwilling to take risks and are afraid of change. People will often choose the path of least resistance, and for some, an low wage job is the easiest path to a check. For those reasons alone, that is why they belong there and will stay there.

Answer me Dave, why do these people suddenly deserve giant paychecks? Why do they deserve to be rich?
 

LunarRay

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2003
9,993
1
76
alchemize,
And since when should a single parent be able to raise 2 kids and work at Wal-Mart? I would hope a single parent working at Wal-Mart has some supplemental alimony and/or child support checks coming in.

I feel sorry for the <1% of Wal-Mart employees that are there because they are down on their luck. I don't feel sorry for the 99% who decided to drop out/not go to college/get married at 18/have a baby at 15/lost their retirement money in the stock market (try diversification next time)/other woe is me stories.

If working at Wal-Mart is now our new "you should be able to support a family on this" wage then what a sad state our country has come to.

P.S. Anyone want to do some research on the minimum wage? Was it ever intended to support a family?

But, the point of the post is that Walmart has come to town and hired these folks many of whom worked at Safeway, Von's or Ralph's (like in my experience here) where they could do as you suggest when they worked in Safeway etc.... raise a family etc.. The second link indicates that for every two jobs created Walmart eliminates three..
Now if walmart paid wages like other Union shops they'd not be in business - granted.. but, maybe they shouldn't...

edit to correct a store name..



 

LunarRay

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2003
9,993
1
76
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: LunarRay
Somesin is goofy.. first my hocus pocus post and now this.. hmmmmm

Our conclusion: A single parent employed full-time at Salina?s Wal-Mart and raising children aged 4 and 12 does not earn enough money to supply the family?s basic needs by shopping at that same Wal-Mart.

According to the personnel manager at Salina?s Supercenter, a cashier earns a starting hourly wage of $6.25. After Social Security and Medicare taxes, the paychecks for a month would total $1016 for a full-time 176 hours. (That?s 40 hours a week, which would put this cashier in a better financial position than the many employees who work 32 or fewer hours a week. Of course, hourly pay rises eventually, but the 2001 PBS report "Store Wars" found that most employees have left by the end of their first year.)
I googled in 'walmart wage' and all sorts of lies like this popped up.. Must be some kinda mystery how so many can make up such stories..

Another bunch of bitter minimum wage walmart employees... lies,,, just lies...

You heard the AT experts here repeatedly over and over that this is great for the Country and this is an increase in wages. They even said if they need to make more to get by simply work another 40 hours at the same wage at another job.

Just great, work 24hrs a day 7 days a week and still not be able to put a roof over your head but that's OK it's the New American Dream.

Granted the second link is Flagstaff's opinion regarding Walmart.. they see what will happen to them.. I also see the argument made by the folks who opine the labors of the cashier is not worth the 16 - 18 $ per hour that Union shops pay.. and that in order for the rest of us to get cheap goods they the walmarteers should make less.. Well that argument goes in all directions.. don't it.. I think all you folks out there in what ever your profession or craft are over paid and I for one wish to pay less for what it is that you all provide.. so take a pay cut.. so I may benefit and the walmarteers may better afford what you all produce.
The idea used to be to never go back - to build upon what you have.. where everyone should be able to afford the basics of life if they worked hard full time at any job... now, it has become OK for some to work hard full time and not nearly be able to afford rent alone.. This does make economic sense in one regard (cheaper prices) but, not in the more important philosophy of the American Dream and way of life.. It eventually will reduce this nation to the life style of Chad!
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,894
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
"Answer me Dave, why do these people suddenly deserve giant paychecks? Why do they deserve to be rich?"

I didn't say anywhere they "deserve" giant paychecks. I also didn't say they "deserve" to be rich.

I simply stated that wages are going down.

Can you show me these Wal-mart jobs increasing wages like the AT experts are claiming wages are going up?
 

charrison

Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
17,033
1
81
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
"Answer me Dave, why do these people suddenly deserve giant paychecks? Why do they deserve to be rich?"

I didn't say anywhere they "deserve" giant paychecks. I also didn't say they "deserve" to be rich.

I simply stated that wages are going down.

Can you show me these Wal-mart jobs increasing wages like the AT experts are claiming wages are going up?

But you cant back your claim that wages are going down.
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,894
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: charrison
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
"Answer me Dave, why do these people suddenly deserve giant paychecks? Why do they deserve to be rich?"

I didn't say anywhere they "deserve" giant paychecks. I also didn't say they "deserve" to be rich.

I simply stated that wages are going down.

Can you show me these Wal-mart jobs increasing wages like the AT experts are claiming wages are going up?

But you cant back your claim that wages are going down.

You just saw in here the employees top pay is $11.25 hr on night shift. A little reading and opening eyes goes a long way.

 

charrison

Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
17,033
1
81
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: charrison
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
"Answer me Dave, why do these people suddenly deserve giant paychecks? Why do they deserve to be rich?"

I didn't say anywhere they "deserve" giant paychecks. I also didn't say they "deserve" to be rich.

I simply stated that wages are going down.

Can you show me these Wal-mart jobs increasing wages like the AT experts are claiming wages are going up?

But you cant back your claim that wages are going down.

You just saw in here the employees top pay is $11.25 hr on night shift. A little reading and opening eyes goes a long way.


ANd my salary is going up. THe goverment figures say income is rising. One anecdotal story does not tell what is happening nationwide.
 

LunarRay

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2003
9,993
1
76
Deserve Bigger Paychecks?????

I wish I had the energy to lead a boycott against Walmart and its brother Vampire entities.. They'd not sell a thing if no one worked there or delivered their foreign made goods. We need the Unions to regain their power or the Molly Maguires will reform.. The American worker can take only so much before he sees that no matter what he does the greed of the multinational and giant national corporation seeks only to get in and get theirs while the getting is there to be got and all at the expense of the American worker..

A full time job for an adult ought to result in at least a livable standard of living.. that should be the minimum! The better educated or craft journeyman should earn commensurate with her skill... be able to afford a better standard of living.. but, geepers how can anyone seek to reduce so many to below poverty.. It is just our greed! We want more and at a cheaper price.... at the expense of our neighbor.. we are sick!
 

dirtboy

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
6,745
1
81
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
"Answer me Dave, why do these people suddenly deserve giant paychecks? Why do they deserve to be rich?"

I didn't say anywhere they "deserve" giant paychecks. I also didn't say they "deserve" to be rich.

I simply stated that wages are going down.

Can you show me these Wal-mart jobs increasing wages like the AT experts are claiming wages are going up?

Actually you said, "is this the new American Dream?" I don't really care about Walmart jobs. I don't know why you're so hung up on them. There are plenty of other jobs and other opportunities out there. Oh...that's right...you think Walmart is the only employer in the world.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
72,617
6,174
126
Originally posted by: LunarRay
Deserve Bigger Paychecks?????

I wish I had the energy to lead a boycott against Walmart and its brother Vampire entities.. They'd not sell a thing if no one worked there or delivered their foreign made goods. We need the Unions to regain their power or the Molly Maguires will reform.. The American worker can take only so much before he sees that no matter what he does the greed of the multinational and giant national corporation seeks only to get in and get theirs while the getting is there to be got and all at the expense of the American worker..

A full time job for an adult ought to result in at least a livable standard of living.. that should be the minimum! The better educated or craft journeyman should earn commensurate with her skill... be able to afford a better standard of living.. but, geepers how can anyone seek to reduce so many to below poverty.. It is just our greed! We want more and at a cheaper price.... at the expense of our neighbor.. we are sick!
Well I agree wthat we are sick, but I disagree that it will change. Time was when people knew when their bellies were empty and there lives were dull. Not any more though. Now fox news tells people they are luck to be Americans, that they are doing great and that their lives are rich and full. Nobody can do anything without the ability to feel. Smile, LR. You've gotten way off track. You're just going to make people upset cause they won't know you're making them depressed. Being depresses is being a communist. Americans always smile. :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,894
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: dirtboy
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
"Answer me Dave, why do these people suddenly deserve giant paychecks? Why do they deserve to be rich?"

I didn't say anywhere they "deserve" giant paychecks. I also didn't say they "deserve" to be rich.

I simply stated that wages are going down.

Can you show me these Wal-mart jobs increasing wages like the AT experts are claiming wages are going up?

Actually you said, "is this the new American Dream?" I don't really care about Walmart jobs. I don't know why you're so hung up on them. There are plenty of other jobs and other opportunities out there. Oh...that's right...you think Walmart is the only employer in the world.

Walmart may not be the "only" employer in the world but it is the World's Largest Corporation in case you haven't noticed. That is fact not being "hung" up on.

11-9-1998 Wal-Mart and the Strip-Mining of America

"Our priorities are that we want to dominate North America first, then South America, and then Asia and then Europe," Wal-Mart's President and CEO David Glass told USA Today business reporter Lorrie Grant..

Walmart Employees Told How to Get Public Assistance While Company Makes Billions

One thing the new feel-good TV commercials fail to mention is that Wal-Mart is such a great place to work that the company will even help you get on welfare. That's right. If a worker's salary is so meager that they qualify for public assistance, Wal-Mart is right there to show them how to apply. At a July 23 press conference, California Assemblywoman Sally J. Lieber revealed that official Wal-Mart documents showed employees in the state where to go on the internet to apply for assistance.

 

alchemize

Lifer
Mar 24, 2000
11,489
0
0
Originally posted by: LunarRay
Deserve Bigger Paychecks?????

I wish I had the energy to lead a boycott against Walmart and its brother Vampire entities.. They'd not sell a thing if no one worked there or delivered their foreign made goods. We need the Unions to regain their power or the Molly Maguires will reform.. The American worker can take only so much before he sees that no matter what he does the greed of the multinational and giant national corporation seeks only to get in and get theirs while the getting is there to be got and all at the expense of the American worker..

A full time job for an adult ought to result in at least a livable standard of living.. that should be the minimum! The better educated or craft journeyman should earn commensurate with her skill... be able to afford a better standard of living.. but, geepers how can anyone seek to reduce so many to below poverty.. It is just our greed! We want more and at a cheaper price.... at the expense of our neighbor.. we are sick!

Why raise the bar when we can just lower it right? Why should the price I pay a hidden social tax for *insert consumer item here* to support some high-school dropout's "livable standard of living"? Start proving to me that all the new college grads and laid off IT folks are stocking shelves at wally world and I'll reconsider. But it isn't happening. Wal-Mart workers are generally uneducated and unskilled. This isn't 1950 anymore...

I agree with you, we in American need to get control over our greed. It's disgusting the way some live (but enticing at the same time, isn't it ;)). We don't all need 2 SUV's and a sports car, a 3 car garage and a well manicured lawn, and 2 kids in daycare.

Tell you what. I'll agree to a "livable" minimum wage if it matches the following:

- It must be based on a minimum 70 hour work week. You don't want to go to college, you gotta work HARD my friend.
- If you work the minimum of 70 hours, even over 2+ jobs, then you can dip into a public insurance fund
- You don't make overtime. Overtime funds instead are paid into the public insurance fund.

I'm sure I could come up with lots more restrictions :)

 

dirtboy

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
6,745
1
81
I fail to see what the big issue is about Walmart's wages. The same arguement can be used for all kinds of employers. I don't see the big deal. People can live on $10/hr. I used to once. Sure they may not be able to buy a house, 2 SUV's, a vacation home in order to live like you do, but nobody said they should be entitled to such a life. They'll have to rent an apartment and drive a used car. Look around the world, life could be worse.