Does it really matter where he was? Maybe he and the mother had a falling out? What made this case different was that the son was in serious, serious trouble and he came to his defense. There are countless variables that could've gone into why he wasn't there before but the fact that he shows up when his son is faced with murder charges is a negative? Give me a break. Like I said before, the author spun things as he wanted.
Does it really matter where he was? Maybe he and the mother had a falling out? What made this case different was that the son was in serious, serious trouble and he came to his defense. There are countless variables that could've gone into why he wasn't there before but the fact that he shows up when his son is faced with murder charges is a negative? Give me a break. Like I said before, the author spun things as he wanted.
I'm no lawyer and I saw that on a tv show. I began looking for it but you mentioned another case so I assumed that that's where the show got it from. If you really want me to look, give me time because, like I said, I'm not a lawyer.
Guys, this whole issue is about double-standards, not the fact that these black men are innocent of attacking the white student. Get back to me when the law is applied blindly to all the youths, both blacks and whites, equally.
Yes it really does matter where he was. Children benefit from having a mother and a father. Mothers for their nurturing side, fathers for their discipline. When one is missing, children miss out and often fall off the straight and narrow and get into trouble like this.
I often use this example in the animal world as Elephants have similar family structures. In one of the national parks in Africa poachers took out all of the adult male elephants. The result was fatherless elephants. The males in particular grew up and would destroy property, wildlife, kill other animals. Things elephants typically arent known to do. Female elephants were powerless to control them. Park rangers brought in two big bulls from another park in an attempt to control these adolescent elephants. What these two did was remarkable. Within weeks they had control over the young male elephants and things retured to normal.
I am sure you will come back with balthering about it being elephants. But this is a classic example of another species not having dominant males to look upto and learn from and the results are similar to what we see in Humans. Children who are out of control.
No it doesn't matter because, like I said, there are countless variables as to why he wasn't there. And even if he wasn't there, there are other variables that could've led to this. Furthermore, you don't know whether or not he had a father-figure absent of his natural father, so your point is extremely moot. the point I am making is that the author saw his natural father's return as a negative rather than a positive. In other words, this story has an agenda.
I get a picture of somebody with their fingers in their ears yelling "la la la la la"
Of course it has an agenda, most opinion pieces do, duh. The agenda is quite apparent and spelled out in several ways. One is "where the hell was his father and these black community activists before it got to this point?" With the obvious idea that showing up for the trial is too late and doesnt really help the kid out.
I'm glad you capitulated on your issue about the father and resorted to the obvious. My point was that since this story has an agenda it shouldn't be taken as gospel. And if it cannot be taken as gospel, it's quite easy to dispel the other points of the article as well, totally destroying it. In the end, the article doesn't move the conversation one inch. It's just holding us back.
My original point of contention here is not about any body's opinion. What really bothers me is when people only want to hear what they like. I prefer to look at every dimension of this case, from the school to the black kids to the white kids and to the DA. What people like you are doing is concentrating on the alleged crimes brought to court and not on the crimes that weren't brought to court. It can be argued that the physical assaults on the black kid was as deadly as the one on the white kid. The big difference between the two is that the DA decided to throw the books at the black kids but not the white ones. THAT is the issue here, not whether or not Bell's father was around or that he should be found guilty. The issue here is double-standard.
Starbuck1975
Lifer
- Jan 6, 2005
- 14,698
- 1,909
- 126
Because many black authors, journalists, academics and intellectuals have come forward to contend that the lack of positive male role models and father figures in the black community is one of the reasons why so many young black males find themselves in trouble with the law.
Sure, racism and profiling are part of the problem...but the black community certainly is contributing to the equation as well with several social dynamics that are, for some reason, taboo to discuss.
Far easier to blame white people for all the problems.
If six white kids beat up on a black kid, and it got this amount of media attention, those white kids would face allegations of hate crimes, and the collective black community would call for blood...you don't even have to look farther than the Duke case.
Get back to me when all sides involved in this debate are able to do so in an equitable and consistent matter...double standards clearly exist on both sides of the fence.
What are we in a contest or something? Childish if you ask me. I stopped talking to you about the father because it was like talking to a brick wall. No point in debating with somebody who sticks their head in the sand.
The piece is a perfect article on what is wrong with this case from top to bottom on all sides of the issue. If you cant understand that and want to argue minute details like why his father wasnt there when the fact he wasnt there is all that matters, that is your problem, not mine.
Fern
Elite Member
- Sep 30, 2003
- 26,907
- 174
- 106
Although this story indicates problems of racial tension, the way it has been presented is EXTREMELY misleading.
I see protesters in Jena complaining aginst 2nd degree murder charges against Bell etc. There are no such charges. Too much inflammatory mis-information being spread.
Over the past few days, I have come to believe it is inappropriate to connect the beating of the white kid with the nooses. He had nothing to do withe nooses. Now, we find out the events took place 3 months apart, and perps were identified and punished in the meantime. But the connection has been presented to though a direct one, that is pure fabrication by the MSM and the activists.
Then many here claim that a gruop of white kids in an earlier fight got off with less punishment for the same thing. Now we know if was one white man (not even a student) who assualted one black kid at a private event. Hardly similar in circumstances. And totally unrelated to the high school.
Moreover, the one black kid (Bell IIRC) had a prior arrest for such violent activity, thus elevating the seriousness of his treatment. This is normal in all states. Do it once, whether an assualt or DUI and you're likely on probation. Do it again and you're in big trouble. I see nothing inherently wrong with that. I'm all for giving first time offenders a break.
I do belive the Bell kid deserves an opportunity for bail.
But otherwise, this whole "story" as presented to us has been so heavily spun as to depart from reality and offensive.
Fern
I see protesters in Jena complaining aginst 2nd degree murder charges against Bell etc. There are no such charges. Too much inflammatory mis-information being spread.
Over the past few days, I have come to believe it is inappropriate to connect the beating of the white kid with the nooses. He had nothing to do withe nooses. Now, we find out the events took place 3 months apart, and perps were identified and punished in the meantime. But the connection has been presented to though a direct one, that is pure fabrication by the MSM and the activists.
Then many here claim that a gruop of white kids in an earlier fight got off with less punishment for the same thing. Now we know if was one white man (not even a student) who assualted one black kid at a private event. Hardly similar in circumstances. And totally unrelated to the high school.
Moreover, the one black kid (Bell IIRC) had a prior arrest for such violent activity, thus elevating the seriousness of his treatment. This is normal in all states. Do it once, whether an assualt or DUI and you're likely on probation. Do it again and you're in big trouble. I see nothing inherently wrong with that. I'm all for giving first time offenders a break.
I do belive the Bell kid deserves an opportunity for bail.
But otherwise, this whole "story" as presented to us has been so heavily spun as to depart from reality and offensive.
Fern
jonks
Lifer
- Feb 7, 2005
- 13,918
- 20
- 81
Well, initially Bell was charged with attempted murder, though the prosecutor did change it to battery later.
Yeah, I actually do wonder who came up with the spin on the Noose = Causation for beating, the MSM or JJ/Sharpton. But the white kids who threw the nooses over the tree were recommended for expulsion by the principal, but the bd of ed overruled and suspended them for 3 days. That did not help smooth over racial tension with the black community. Personally, I think they deserved more than 3 days suspension, but less than expulsion. Maybe 2 weeks suspension plus mandatory counseling or sensitivity training or something. Not that I think it would do any good, but kicking them out of school would only result in 3 more uneducated idiots out there who would probably blame blacks for their downfall.
Actually, I read he's been previously convicted FOUR TIMES for battery and criminal damage to property. On the other hand, the jury agreed with the prosecutor that Bell's tennis shoes constituted "deadly weapons" when he was kicking Barker (the white kid.)
Pretty Much.
A lot has also been made of Bell's conviction by an all white jury. However, 150 jury subpoenas were issued, and blacks were included in those 150, although I don't know how many. The 50 people who responded were all white, thus the jury would be drawn from that pool. If blacks had responded to the jury summons, there would likely have been blacks on the jury. How can someone claim bias in jury selection when no blacks answered the jury summons??
jonks
Lifer
- Feb 7, 2005
- 13,918
- 20
- 81
Finally, here's an informed and intelligent response to the debate 
That's what us NY'ers call Being A Schmuck.
http://blogs.usatoday.com/onde...9/trucks-with-noo.html
Trucks with nooses seen near Jena Six marchers; Teens arrested
Two teenagers were arrested last night after officers received a report that they were driving a truck with nooses on it through a crowd of civil-rights marchers in Alexandria, La.
The marchers, waiting to leave town following the protests in nearby Jena, notified police that two trucks with nooses had been circling Main Street.
Police stopped one of them, a red pickup truck, and charged the 18-year-old driver with drunken driving, inciting a riot and contributing to the delinquency of a minor. A 16-year-old was taken into custody, too.
"The best charge would be aggravated ignorance, but that charge doesn't exist," Sgt. Clifford Gatlin of the Alexandria Police Department tells On Deadline.
The police report says officers searching the truck found three bottles of Coors Light, a rifle, brass knuckles and an extension cord made into a hangman's noose. "While sitting in the lounge the juvenile said that he had KKK tattooed on his chest and that his parents and kin folk were involved with the KKK. He also said that he was the one that had tied the hangman nooses," the report says.
That's what us NY'ers call Being A Schmuck.http://blogs.usatoday.com/onde...9/trucks-with-noo.html
Trucks with nooses seen near Jena Six marchers; Teens arrested
Two teenagers were arrested last night after officers received a report that they were driving a truck with nooses on it through a crowd of civil-rights marchers in Alexandria, La.
The marchers, waiting to leave town following the protests in nearby Jena, notified police that two trucks with nooses had been circling Main Street.
Police stopped one of them, a red pickup truck, and charged the 18-year-old driver with drunken driving, inciting a riot and contributing to the delinquency of a minor. A 16-year-old was taken into custody, too.
"The best charge would be aggravated ignorance, but that charge doesn't exist," Sgt. Clifford Gatlin of the Alexandria Police Department tells On Deadline.
The police report says officers searching the truck found three bottles of Coors Light, a rifle, brass knuckles and an extension cord made into a hangman's noose. "While sitting in the lounge the juvenile said that he had KKK tattooed on his chest and that his parents and kin folk were involved with the KKK. He also said that he was the one that had tied the hangman nooses," the report says.
You stopped talking about it because you hit a brick wall. Unless you know Bell's entire life, then you cannot claim he did not have a father figure in his life. Quit while you're behind.
Well, yeah. It was more like an official acknowledgement than a lifting of a ban, but being the last to do so does say something about the state, at least. Little tidbits like this don't really say much about the entire south IMO.
It's easy to throw out some random bit of information and declare some sort of correlation, but where Alabama stands in the order of lifting a ban on interracial marriage is hardly conclusive evidence for any assertion about Louisiana or any town in Louisiana.
Fern
Elite Member
- Sep 30, 2003
- 26,907
- 174
- 106
Such on laws being on the books mean exactly zip. All states have such things. In my state we still have an old law that says if an unmarried man & woman check into a hotel as husband & wife, they are considered as legally "married".
It's not what's on the books, but it would be a whole other matter if Alabama had been trying to enforce it, which they weren't.
Fern
rpanic
Golden Member
- Dec 1, 2006
- 1,896
- 7
- 81
Mychal Bell back in jail.
A judge ordered a black teenager back to jail, deciding the fight that put him in the national spotlight violated terms of his probation for a previous conviction.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/200...2/ap_on_re_us/jena_six
A judge ordered a black teenager back to jail, deciding the fight that put him in the national spotlight violated terms of his probation for a previous conviction.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/200...2/ap_on_re_us/jena_six
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