Even if it shot at a wall, there would still be some ricochet and debris. But i can guarantee you the force of that bullet directly on the sword blade was more than a bullet that goes through rifling.
Even if it shot at a wall, there would still be some ricochet and debris. But i can guarantee you the force of that bullet directly on the sword blade was more than a bullet that goes through rifling.
Some swords would. The test DOEs show the sword has a strong edge, but I'd like to see a close up shot of where the bullet impacted before I really make that call. My ground is simply saying most good steel sharpened to a edge and not having a good deal of thickness would pass this test. Now, how the edge holds up is the true worth of the steel. Hell, he could turn the blade around and fire at the back and I'll bet most any commercially available steel would still hold up to the impact, although the edge may deform some.
The problem is, theres a TON of varieties of steel. So, we cant just say "steel" without getting into a look of the composition of the steel. Theres high carbon, low carbon, plated, theres heat treated etc etc etc.
Rifling 'cuts into' the bullets? Maybe, it's the expression I'm not used to and that it has a different meaning than what the words suggest. There's a difference smacking a basketball directly with a hammer and spinning it with a hammer. Any good blade would loose its tooth once it gets the 'impact' from a kind of solid(or near solid) object.
Absolutely, I wont argue that point. But the point is, the rifling does it for thousands and thousands and thousands of rounds without fail, BECAUSE its steel and holds up so well to stress. People even use steel as penetration tests, ranging from 1/4" to 3/4" in thickness. Steel is very, very hard to penetrate with any bullet under a .50 caliber round, and even then it takes a specially designed "armor piercing" core to really get penetration.
Why would you say that? The impact point on the blade is most likely razor sharp and the rifling is just cut steel.
But I can make the rifling to loose 'its tooth' if I hit it directly with an object.
Hmm...I gotta ask about this issue to a gun techician I used to work with.
I'll post what he says about this issue. Until then, I'm clueless.
BTW, rifling vs. impact the sword is getting from a bullet is a totally different issue.
A gun barrel is NOT designed to impact the bullet directly; it barely touches the bullet and that's why a barrel is the part that's hard to make(and this is why many people can personally make shotguns(doesn't have rifling).
Neither the sword nor rifling are "directly" hit really. I mean, essentially the rifling is directly hit due to the bullet not engaging the rifling until after its has started to travel. Engaging the rifling before it has been fired is DANGEROUS and could cause your gun to explode!! So, theres always a bit of dead space between the bullet and the rifling to get the bullet moving before slamming into the rifling. Granted, its not inches deep, but the rifling does make contact with the bullet.
Same with the sword. Thats why i use a reference to rifling. The bulelt is getting cut by the rifling, the bullet is getting cut by the sword. Again, if they sword was turned wideways so it actually was fully impacted by the bullet, then thats a different story. But as it is, the blade is what, 1/4 of the thickness of the bullets diameter? So, theres no way the sword could absorb the entire impact of the bullet.
I think your confusing impact with cutting. While the bullet DOES impact the sword, it doesnt "impact" it in the way a normal bullet would and dump the energy into the target. Bullets are designed to impact something that can absorb their energy and cause them to mushroom. Something larger then the bullet is, that way ALL the energy is dumped into the target. In this case, the sword is narrower then the bullet, so even best case scenario the bullet couldnt possibly dump all the energy it has contained into the target (the blade). So right there the video is skewed, as the sword doesnt get the full eenrgy of the bullet. Secondly, lead (The bullets composition (mainly, some copper)) is notoriously soft and weak. Steel on the other hand is usually noted for its hardness. Worked, conditioned steel can be wicked hard AND still flex so as to not be brittle. Think of this as cutting cardboard with a knife. While both substances are hard (Ever get hit with a cardboard tube?) the knife is vastly harder then the cardboard.
What you're saying does make (not enough) sense, at the same time, what I'm saying only makes (not enough) sense, too.
I'll keep myself quite until I get the answer from the professional.
Like I said, not detracting from the sword, Its definately VERY good steel (Watched the whole video) cause on the close ups at the end you can see the blade, and more precisely, the edge, didnt fold or lose shape. So, its definately good steel, but I'd like to see how well it held up to a Claymore wielded by a pissed of drunk Scotsman.
Think of it like this.
Pop can = bullet
Table knife = sword
pop can vs pop can. (bullet vs bullet) and with even moderate force, they both essentially destroy each other. Both will shows marks from a head on confrontation.
Pop can vs Table knife. (bullet vs sword) The table knife wins every time. You can stab and chop and swing all you want, but you wont really do much aside from mar the finish on the table knife, because the pop can is just so much softer. Same with a sword vs bullet
table knife vs table knife. (sword vs sword) This is where you find the true mark of a blade. Countering an equally hard object with another equally hard object, especially if weilded with much force, you'll soon see which one really has the extra degree of quality. The lesser will lose shape and dull quickly, the higher quality one will hold its shape and edge longer and through more forceful blows. A true test of edge IMO is to use another quality sword, give it to two people and have them try to kill each other for 5 minutes. Then see which edge is still the sharpest with the least deformation. So, think of two swords slamming into each other, edge vs edge. Both are very hard. But, SOMETHING has to give. It might be the edge, it might be the blade or it might be the other guys balance as he backpedals to recover from the force. But, if you can repeatedly do this and the edge holds strong, you have a GOOD sword.
A disclaimer though, hardness and brittleness go hand in hand with steel (usually) Thats why I'm not saying the sword is any less in quality. While the bullet may be soft and easily cut by the hardest of materials, a brittle material would shatter from the shock. Think if that sword was glass? The bullet would shatter it to peices. So, the sword has to have both hardness to hold and edge and remain sharp, but also be soft enough to absorb impacts and flex so as to not shatter. With heat treating, tempering and proper forge work you can actually make blades that have bands and layers of varying degrees of softness and by mixing them get a best of both worlds as it were, having a blade thats both very hard and able to absorb impact.
But, thats why this test doesnt weigh too heavily with me. The bullet is just too soft. Go blow for blow with another peice of steel, THEN let me see the edge. If it can hold up to another steel blade, then you have a fine weapon.
Think of it like this.
Pop can = bullet
Table knife = sword
pop can vs pop can. (bullet vs bullet) and with even moderate force, they both essentially destroy each other. Both will shows marks from a head on confrontation.
Pop can vs Table knife. (bullet vs sword) The table knife wins every time. You can stab and chop and swing all you want, but you wont really do much aside from mar the finish on the table knife, because the pop can is just so much softer. Same with a sword vs bullet
table knife vs table knife. (sword vs sword) This is where you find the true mark of a blade. Countering an equally hard object with another equally hard object, especially if weilded with much force, you'll soon see which one really has the extra degree of quality. The lesser will lose shape and dull quickly, the higher quality one will hold its shape and edge longer and through more forceful blows. A true test of edge IMO is to use another quality sword, give it to two people and have them try to kill each other for 5 minutes. Then see which edge is still the sharpest with the least deformation. So, think of two swords slamming into each other, edge vs edge. Both are very hard. But, SOMETHING has to give. It might be the edge, it might be the blade or it might be the other guys balance as he backpedals to recover from the force. But, if you can repeatedly do this and the edge holds strong, you have a GOOD sword.
A disclaimer though, hardness and brittleness go hand in hand with steel (usually) Thats why I'm not saying the sword is any less in quality. While the bullet may be soft and easily cut by the hardest of materials, a brittle material would shatter from the shock. Think if that sword was glass? The bullet would shatter it to peices. So, the sword has to have both hardness to hold and edge and remain sharp, but also be soft enough to absorb impacts and flex so as to not shatter. With heat treating, tempering and proper forge work you can actually make blades that have bands and layers of varying degrees of softness and by mixing them get a best of both worlds as it were, having a blade thats both very hard and able to absorb impact.
But, thats why this test doesnt weigh too heavily with me. The bullet is just too soft. Go blow for blow with another peice of steel, THEN let me see the edge. If it can hold up to another steel blade, then you have a fine weapon.
Now, I'm more convienced toward your theory, but I still have a doubt.
I'll let you know once I get the words from the techician (I think he'd basically say the same thing as you though).
I'll let you know once I get the words from the techician (I think he'd basically say the same thing as you though).
trust ATOT to get into a super in depth discussion about a stupid video clip. nah, nobody wants to just watch the clip, say "cool clip!" any more. nowadays you have to argue about metallic properties, spinning bullets, lifespan of barrels and god knows what.
jeeze guys. chill out a bit once in a while. i'm sure all of you know a lot about this stuff, but seriously- what are you achieving by this whole shpiel??
jeeze guys. chill out a bit once in a while. i'm sure all of you know a lot about this stuff, but seriously- what are you achieving by this whole shpiel??
Simply pointing out (In my mind) there would be more effective ways to demonstrate the strength of a sword.
Am i the only one who noticed the post about this bullet being titanium coated with a diamond core? Everyone keeps talking about how this is an easy feat because its just soft lead being split by a sharp edge. I think ANYTHING that splits a round like that is impressive.
So? None of the titanium or diamond was shot at the sword. Only the lead. The casing is irrelevant...it could have been made out of Kryptonite and it wouldn't have made any difference.
My question would be: Who give a crap if a sword is that tough or not? What the hell does anyone plan to do with it that they felt the need to prove how strong it is?
So, a sharp blade will cut a bullet every time.
Most of you have guns, try this, get a regular steel, not hardened or anything, sharpen it up and create a dual angled blade with a sharp edge, now fixate the blade and the gun, shoot and then look at the blade.
The short barrel of a handgun and the fairly large ammunition makes the test useless, let's see it with a .30-06 shot from a rifle.
A hot tip is that it would break the sword in half. The redirection of energy isn't nearly efficent enough (even from a very sharp blade) to withstand the impact of a high powered rotating copper casing bullet.
The titanium and diamond core, well, i call BS on that, a diamond core would break the steel. If it didn't, then there would be no way to sharpen that steel.
Most of you have guns, try this, get a regular steel, not hardened or anything, sharpen it up and create a dual angled blade with a sharp edge, now fixate the blade and the gun, shoot and then look at the blade.
The short barrel of a handgun and the fairly large ammunition makes the test useless, let's see it with a .30-06 shot from a rifle.
A hot tip is that it would break the sword in half. The redirection of energy isn't nearly efficent enough (even from a very sharp blade) to withstand the impact of a high powered rotating copper casing bullet.
The titanium and diamond core, well, i call BS on that, a diamond core would break the steel. If it didn't, then there would be no way to sharpen that steel.
Pretend they are samurais and jump around in their gardens wearing a silly outfit swinging the sword?
Actually, even if it WAS diamond core I think the results would have been very similiar. Diamond is notoriously hard. Its also very brittle. That type of impact most likely would have shattered a diamond. Additionally, I dont believe titanium to be that much harder then steel to the point a titanium casing would cut the steel. Although titanium IS harder then steel by a good margin, the outer jackets of bullets are so thin (a few thousanths) that there just isnt enough material to overcome the steel.
Doesn't matter, if it had a diamond core it would break the steel, steele hardened to this level is more brittle than diamond and the diamond would be harder.
The amount of the material does not matter unless it is real thin and hits flat on, in this case the material impacts with the SAME AMOUNT of material and the weaker material will break.
I am having a hard time believing a titanium casing too, the titatium wouldn't be cut, it would be shattered.
this titanium/diamond business is nonsense. if anything they were using a black diamond titanium riflescope. 
anyways, the bullet is soft lead and even 'softer' after while in motion because of both heat and kinetic energy. thats why hollow points explode simply by having flesh crammed into their center. Shockwave is probably right that most sharp edged steel will split a bullet, just as any good sword will cut through a 9mm diameter lead rod with sufficient direction and force. finer swords would no doubtedly hold up better. Heat up that lead rod to 267 C
and even weaker swords will remain flawless.
smme like a cool vid though. I couldn't get it to play ;(
anyways, the bullet is soft lead and even 'softer' after while in motion because of both heat and kinetic energy. thats why hollow points explode simply by having flesh crammed into their center. Shockwave is probably right that most sharp edged steel will split a bullet, just as any good sword will cut through a 9mm diameter lead rod with sufficient direction and force. finer swords would no doubtedly hold up better. Heat up that lead rod to 267 C
and even weaker swords will remain flawless.
smme like a cool vid though. I couldn't get it to play ;(
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