Japan apologizes to Asia for WWII

[Strk]

Originally posted by: TalonOP

Originally posted by: kogase

Originally posted by: nick1985
Who said anything about reparations and money? All they want them to do is say they are fvcking sorry for all the terrible sub-human sh!t they did. Is it to much to admit they were wrong, apologize, and move on? Apparently it is.

And who was wrong? Will China be satisfied with the 90 year old geezers who actually commited those atrocities? Or will they demand apologies from people who weren't even born when these crimes took place? China is demanding the latter, just like some apologist groups are demanding for reparations for blacks because their ancestors were enslaved by white people of 150 years ago. It's ridiculous.

Germany is still paying Jews for their WWII atrocities. I'll be satisfied when Japan teaches its kids that Manchuria and much of asia was brutally assaulted (rape of naking comes to mind). But its not just Japan, Russia needs to open up more investigation about the Stalin massacres, and China needs to stop portraying mao as a hero and tell their schoolkids about Mao Zedong's drastic backwards step, the great leap forward, which caused millions of deaths by famine.

Lets not point fingers at each other here. We've all got things we don't want to talk about. Hopefully though, we'll learn to risk public outcry and talk about these things anyways.

I suppose it could be worse. Turkey doesn't even acknowledge anything happened to the Armenians during WWI.

 

[FallingStar]

Originally posted by: Kenazo
Text

Ok, so they were awful during WWII, but consider this quote from China:

"Actions speak louder than words ... His words appeared faint and his sincerity is also in doubt," said an editorial in the China Daily, referring to Koizumi's past apologies.

What the heck is Japan supposed to do? Payback the billions in damages they've caused? That's retarded. It was war. My ancestors had everything taken away from them and a bunch were killed in Russia during the Bolschevik (sp?) revolution and we don't expect Russia to pay us back.

Learn from the past, but let it die.

I am a Chinese Canadian..so I can probably answer you this question. What the Chinese want is a formal apology from their legislature by passing a bill. A bill that would include a formal apology of what they have done and how they would prevent it from happening again. A bill that would be sign by the prime minister and the emperor of Japan. China didn't ask for any payment from Japan, but Japan should compensate to the victims such as the "comfort women."

Their prime minister and cabinet officer should also stop visitng the Yasukuni Shrine where WWII war criminals are honored. If you don't understand this, just imagine how the Jewish people would feel if the Germany president is to visit and pay respect to Hilter's tomb stone(if it even exist) at the date WWII ends.

The Japanese government should also stop and prevent the use of certain history textbook created by the right wing activists in school. These textbooks try to hide the truth (or soften the issue) about certain crimes that the Japanese Imperial army has done on China (such as "comfort women" and "The Rape of Nanking").

This is what the majority of what Chinese people just really want. It's not the money. I don't think the western media has done a very good job at reporting these facts (IMO).

 

[nick1985]

Originally posted by: FallingStar

Originally posted by: Kenazo
Text

Ok, so they were awful during WWII, but consider this quote from China:

"Actions speak louder than words ... His words appeared faint and his sincerity is also in doubt," said an editorial in the China Daily, referring to Koizumi's past apologies.

What the heck is Japan supposed to do? Payback the billions in damages they've caused? That's retarded. It was war. My ancestors had everything taken away from them and a bunch were killed in Russia during the Bolschevik (sp?) revolution and we don't expect Russia to pay us back.

Learn from the past, but let it die.

I am a Chinese Canadian..so I can probably answer you this question. What the Chinese want is a formal apology from their legislature by passing a bill. A bill that would include a formal apology of what they have done and how they would prevent it from happening again. A bill that would be sign by the prime minister and the emperor of Japan. China didn't ask for any payment from Japan, but Japan should compensate to the victims such as the "comfort women."

Their prime minister and cabinet officer should also stop visitng the Yasukuni Shrine where WWII war criminals are honored. If you don't understand this, just imagine how the Jewish people would feel if the Germany president is to visit and pay respect to Hilter's tomb stone(if it even exist) at the date WWII ends.

The Japanese government should also stop and prevent the use of certain history textbook created by the right wing activists in school. These textbooks try to hide the truth (or soften the issue) about certain crimes that the Japanese Imperial army has done on China (such as "comfort women" and "The Rape of Nanking").

This is what the majority of what Chinese people just really want. It's not the money. I don't think the western media has done a very good job at reporting these facts (IMO).

QFT

 

[B00ne]

Originally posted by: Kenazo

Originally posted by: Genx87
Chinese didnt appreciate the Japanses Army in Manchuria using their babies as targets for their bayonets.

I

Well of course not. I've heard some crazy stories of what the Communists did to my ancestors in Russia too. Death is death and atrocities are awful, but for how long should a country be held liable for the damage done by people that aren't even alive anymore?

I dont know, but we are still paying reparation from WW1.

Btw, the Chinese are probably more upset about this shrine that is held so dearly by the Japanese, that politicians go to to pay tribute to the dead soldiers (including convited war criminals) and off course it might be due to the fact that Japan never really apologized for WW2 and that the majority (afaik) sees no reason to do so. Afaik they are still glorifying their past atrocities.
Could be wrong though - I aint Japanese

 

[Chinadefender]

And who was wrong? Will China be satisfied with the 90 year old geezers who actually commited those atrocities? Or will they demand apologies from people who weren't even born when these crimes took place?

------------------------------------------------
http://img.phoenixtv.com/image20010518/83880642571403264/106156.jpg

These are some Japanese young men who were born after WWII.

Angry with the past, but worried about the future.

Some Japanese groups and even government officials doubt the so-called justice and credibility of the Tokyo adjudgement after the WWII.

The Japan emperor did not get sentenced. It is perhaps the origin of those problems.

 

[Tab]

Originally posted by: FallingStar

Originally posted by: Kenazo
Text

Ok, so they were awful during WWII, but consider this quote from China:

"Actions speak louder than words ... His words appeared faint and his sincerity is also in doubt," said an editorial in the China Daily, referring to Koizumi's past apologies.

What the heck is Japan supposed to do? Payback the billions in damages they've caused? That's retarded. It was war. My ancestors had everything taken away from them and a bunch were killed in Russia during the Bolschevik (sp?) revolution and we don't expect Russia to pay us back.

Learn from the past, but let it die.

I am a Chinese Canadian..so I can probably answer you this question. What the Chinese want is a formal apology from their legislature by passing a bill. A bill that would include a formal apology of what they have done and how they would prevent it from happening again. A bill that would be sign by the prime minister and the emperor of Japan. China didn't ask for any payment from Japan, but Japan should compensate to the victims such as the "comfort women."

Their prime minister and cabinet officer should also stop visitng the Yasukuni Shrine where WWII war criminals are honored. If you don't understand this, just imagine how the Jewish people would feel if the Germany president is to visit and pay respect to Hilter's tomb stone(if it even exist) at the date WWII ends.

The Japanese government should also stop and prevent the use of certain history textbook created by the right wing activists in school. These textbooks try to hide the truth (or soften the issue) about certain crimes that the Japanese Imperial army has done on China (such as "comfort women" and "The Rape of Nanking").

This is what the majority of what Chinese people just really want. It's not the money. I don't think the western media has done a very good job at reporting these facts (IMO).

Actually, the issuse over Japan changing history was on CNN's frontpage for a while.

 

[imported_Dimicron]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
The Japanese, like all people everywhere, do not want to feel humiliated or bad. Like all people everywhere they have learned as children to hate themselves and hope to hide that self contempt by taking honor in their people. If their people are jerks then that false identification goes out the window too.

We are not Japanese or American or anything else. We are all human and we are all the same. It is self hate that makes us monsters and self love that heals. But be wary of the difference between real self love and pride for pride is nothing but hidden hate for the self.

Wheel of morality, turn, turn, turn. Tell us the lesson we should learn 😉

 

[FallingStar]

Originally posted by: Tab

Originally posted by: FallingStar

Originally posted by: Kenazo
Text

Ok, so they were awful during WWII, but consider this quote from China:

"Actions speak louder than words ... His words appeared faint and his sincerity is also in doubt," said an editorial in the China Daily, referring to Koizumi's past apologies.

What the heck is Japan supposed to do? Payback the billions in damages they've caused? That's retarded. It was war. My ancestors had everything taken away from them and a bunch were killed in Russia during the Bolschevik (sp?) revolution and we don't expect Russia to pay us back.

Learn from the past, but let it die.

I am a Chinese Canadian..so I can probably answer you this question. What the Chinese want is a formal apology from their legislature by passing a bill. A bill that would include a formal apology of what they have done and how they would prevent it from happening again. A bill that would be sign by the prime minister and the emperor of Japan. China didn't ask for any payment from Japan, but Japan should compensate to the victims such as the "comfort women."

Their prime minister and cabinet officer should also stop visitng the Yasukuni Shrine where WWII war criminals are honored. If you don't understand this, just imagine how the Jewish people would feel if the Germany president is to visit and pay respect to Hilter's tomb stone(if it even exist) at the date WWII ends.

The Japanese government should also stop and prevent the use of certain history textbook created by the right wing activists in school. These textbooks try to hide the truth (or soften the issue) about certain crimes that the Japanese Imperial army has done on China (such as "comfort women" and "The Rape of Nanking").

This is what the majority of what Chinese people just really want. It's not the money. I don't think the western media has done a very good job at reporting these facts (IMO).

Actually, the issuse over Japan changing history was on CNN's frontpage for a while.

That's a good thing to hear. I don't really read CNN so I probably missed it. Thanks for letting me know!

I remember reading a column in the Canada Globe and Mail one day about this issue. I can't remember what it is exactly, but it was pretty biased towards the Japanese (IMO).

But I think the majority of the western media never really report what kind of formal apology that the Chinese want.

 

[FallingStar]

Originally posted by: kogase

Originally posted by: nick1985
Who said anything about reparations and money? All they want them to do is say they are fvcking sorry for all the terrible sub-human sh!t they did. Is it to much to admit they were wrong, apologize, and move on? Apparently it is.

And who was wrong? Will China be satisfied with the 90 year old geezers who actually commited those atrocities? Or will they demand apologies from people who weren't even born when these crimes took place? China is demanding the latter, just like some apologist groups are demanding for reparations for blacks because their ancestors were enslaved by white people of 150 years ago. It's ridiculous.

The Chinese demand an apology from the Japanese legislature. An apology bill that would be passed and signed by the primer minister and the emperor. A lot of those right wing activists actually experienced the war themselves. They were born already. What's more annoying is they are trying to influence the new generation with false information.

Some of those "90 year old geezers" actually apologized many times already. They actually visited mourning sites in China and pay respects to the victims. The Chinese people never gave any hard time to these "90 years old geezers).

Please excuse my grammar. I am not very good at writing

 

[UncleWai]

Jesus Christ, do you guys just like to bash China?
Read what FallingStar posted. Japan is the ass in this situation, stop letting your hate against commies overcome common sense.

 

[raildogg]

Germany paid many Holocaust survivors. Why can't Japan pay the families of those it slaughtered?

Remember, Japan was much worse than Germany. It killed many more people. Since this was Asia, people have forgotten.

japan was probably the worst abuser of prisoners in recent human history during ww2. it killed thousands, if not millions of POWs in captivity. one of the punishments they applied on Americans POWs was to force them to drink a lot of water (remember, these guys were basically bones since they had no proper diet). if the prisoner refused to drink water, they forced more down his throat. --- then they would jump on him

can you ever forget the Death March? can you ever forget the images of men, looking like bones, walking and building bridges for the japanese?

considering japan bombed Pearl Harbor, killed thousands of US POWs and thousands of soldiers, considering japan killed millions of Chinese civilians and countless Filipinos, Burmese and other people in that region, Japan has no right to complain about the nukes. and neither should any of you. japan got what it deserved, its punishment should have been even greater

japan should thank us that we dropped 2 nukes instead of invading. our invasion of japan would have meant a possible destruction of a whole japanese generation, or came close to that

 

[FallingStar]

I am actually quite suprise and shock about some American's view on Japan regarding WWII. Maybe it's because Japan is an important ally to US in Asia. China is considered to be a potential threat to the US.

I still believe the majority of the Japanese people regret what their country has done in WWII (I can be wrong?). It's just the minority of Japanese that's on the opposite side. Unfortunately, it's this minority group of people that's in control of politics in Japan. Their aggressive behavior is not helping Japan improving the relation between China, Korea, and many other Asia countries.

 

[stratman]

Originally posted by: raildogg
Japan has no right to complain about the nukes. and neither should any of you. japan got what it deserved, its punishment should have been even greater

japan should thank us that we dropped 2 nukes instead of invading. our invasion of japan would have meant a possible destruction of a whole japanese generation, or came close to that

Yeah, the civilians in Hiroshima and Nagasaki deserved to die because the Japanese government and the Japanese army commited atrocities. Right on raildogg. They shouldn't complain.

I agree that the decision to drop the A-bombs was a good one, but your post is beyond ridiculous. I am a two year old Japanese infant born in 1943, still learning to talk, being raised by a loving mother. I deserve to die because some fvcked up government official orders that women be recruited/coerced/forced in to becoming sex slaves for the army, or some fvcked up Colonel orders the slaughtering of others? Bullsh!t.

The dropping of the A-bomb was worthwhile because it was the path which caused the least death by rendering a full-scale invasion unnecessary, and at the same time making sure Russia didn't end up controlling Japan. NOT because civilians deserved to die.

 

[stratman]

Originally posted by: HamSupLo
Japan is going to follow up this apology with the visits to the war shrine and white washing it's role in WWII in its history books. How would jews feel if the chancellor of germany visited a momument dedicated to hitler every year?

While I think Japan should do more to apologize for it's crimes during WWII, I have some quibs with your post. The textbook that caused the ruccous in the media is used is going to be used in a tiny fraction of schools, something like .01% of all schools. It's only going to be used in some ultra-conservative private schools.

And I was told that the war shine paid homage to all Japanese soldiers throughout the ages, not just the ones in WW2. Like, some American soldiers committed atrocities in Vietnam, but there is still a Vietnam memorial honouring the soldiers who died there. Of course, the crimes the Japanese army committed in China were much worse than the ones the US commited in Vietnam, but that's a difference of scale.

Japan definately needs to do a better job educating it's citizens on the crimes it definately committed in WW2 in China and Korea, and while the PM has apologized several times, the Emperor (who is much more at fault than the PM for the war) has still never apologized to China or Korea. This needs to change.

But I think the textbook issue and the war shrine issue are overblown in the media, and I think China as well can do a lot more as well to ease the tension between the two countries. I have a suspicion that the PRC, the government, wants the average Chinese citizen to hate Japan, so that any future war between the two powers would be easily accepted and supported by the populace.

 

[FallingStar]

Originally posted by: stratman

Originally posted by: HamSupLo
Japan is going to follow up this apology with the visits to the war shrine and white washing it's role in WWII in its history books. How would jews feel if the chancellor of germany visited a momument dedicated to hitler every year?

While I think Japan should do more to apologize for it's crimes during WWII, I have some quibs with your post. The textbook that caused the ruccous in the media is used is going to be used in a tiny fraction of schools, something like .01% of all schools. It's only going to be used in some ultra-conservative private schools.

And I was told that the war shine paid homage to all Japanese soldiers throughout the ages, not just the ones in WW2. Like, some American soldiers committed atrocities in Vietnam, but there is still a Vietnam memorial honouring the soldiers who died there. Of course, the crimes the Japanese army committed in China were much worse than the ones the US commited in Vietnam, but that's a difference of scale.

Japan definately needs to do a better job educating it's citizens on the crimes it definately committed in WW2 in China and Korea, and while the PM has apologized several times, the Emperor (who is much more at fault than the PM for the war) has still never apologized to China or Korea. This needs to change.

But I think the textbook issue and the war shrine issue are overblown in the media, and I think China as well can do a lot more as well to ease the tension between the two countries. I have a suspicion that the PRC, the government, wants the average Chinese citizen to hate Japan, so that any future war between the two powers would be easily accepted and supported by the populace.

Thanks for your reply to my post!

You are right, the percentage of school is small right now. But what the Chinese worry about is the right wing activists pushing more school to use it. If I remember correctly, the mayor of Tokyo (a very famous right wing extremist) actually praised the content and say all the school in Japan should use it. The right wings have huge power to influence the government in Japan since they claim to represent 1 million families at least.

Here is an example of the right wings power. The Japan NHK TV station actually planned to air a documentary about WWII at Aug 15th. It turns out the documentary got edited by NHK without the permission of the author (NHK actually signed a contract which says NHK can't edit without permission) because the right wings pressure the upper levels management in NHK. NHK end up cutting all the parts about the war crimes that Japan commited during WWII. Words of apology from Japan WWII veterans were also edited out from the documentary(Sorry I don't have a link for this, I've read it on a newspaper).

I admit some issues are probably overblown. However, Chinese and Koreans had suggested some solutions to the textbook and the war shrine issues. Japan just ignore all these solutions. They won't even bother to discuss it with China or Korea.

There's actually a textbook that just came out this year that was written together by historians from Japan, China and Korea. The content of the textbook was carefully examined and edited by historians from all 3 nations. Japan government's reaction to this textbook was very disappointing.

For the Yasukuni Shrine, if they want government officials to worthship it, then move all those war criminals out of there. This had been suggested by the opposition in Japan's legislature, but the government also ignored it.

The PRC recently actually oppresses anti-Japan demonstration. They are afraid that it can go out of control and affects the stability of the society. They are also afraid it would end up being an anti-CCP (Chinese Communist party) demonstration because many Chinese considers the PRC was too passive towards the Japanese government.

I hope all my information are accurate. If there's any error, please feel free to point it out!

Some information if anyone is interested:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Japan...nment_textbook_demonstrations_in_China

 

[imported_benkenobi]

There are former victims who have NEVER received a formal apology from Japan for the Rape of Nanking. Read Iris Chang's Rape of Nanking, its gruesome but no one ever learnsa bout it in western WWII history. China has a long history, and a long memory, and they have been given and gave to others the shaft, but the thing about Japan is known human rights violators still hold positions of power in the govt, corporations, and are enshrined in memorials, even though they killed hundrends of thousnads of innocents, raped women, and set up the horrible comfort woman system.

 

[CanOWorms]

At least the Japanese do not celebrate their atrocities like the British.

 

[0roo0roo]

Originally posted by: benkenobi
There are former victims who have NEVER received a formal apology from Japan for the Rape of Nanking. Read Iris Chang's Rape of Nanking, its gruesome but no one ever learnsa bout it in western WWII history. China has a long history, and a long memory, and they have been given and gave to others the shaft, but the thing about Japan is known human rights violators still hold positions of power in the govt, corporations, and are enshrined in memorials, even though they killed hundrends of thousnads of innocents, raped women, and set up the horrible comfort woman system.

china has a short memory. how about 1 million in tibet. lets not even talk about the tens of millions under the unelected oppressive communist regeim. they shelter and support north korea as a buffer against democracy and have allowed them to starve over a million in the 90's..and who knows how many now. the chinese should be the last to speak about moral matters. at every chance they've been making business deals with pariah states. anything to get ahead. and of course theres the casual threats of nuclear war over their right to invade and oppress the only truely free chinese peoples in the world...in taiwan. until china gets their act together they can really stfu.

 

[judasmachine]

Originally posted by: Genx87
Chinese didnt appreciate the Japanses Army in Manchuria using their babies as targets for their bayonets.

I

QFT

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

Originally posted by: Kenazo

Originally posted by: Genx87
Chinese didnt appreciate the Japanses Army in Manchuria using their babies as targets for their bayonets.

I

Well of course not. I've heard some crazy stories of what the Communists did to my ancestors in Russia too. Death is death and atrocities are awful, but for how long should a country be held liable for the damage done by people that aren't even alive anymore?

As long as Japan exalts its fallen "heroes" . . . expect people to be pissed off.

 

[piasabird]

We can only learn from the past if we remember it.