Jan. 6th Republican Debate Thread

[Lemon law]

From what little I hard of the debate, I have to agree with ZeroIQ on the in bed part. Had Romney run on his record as a Governor of a blue State, I would not dislike him. But when he totally reinvented himself to pander to the far right Republican base, he gets a share of my dislike of phonies like Giuliani. As those two are arguably 23.999 carat phonies.

I may not agree with most of the political positions of McCain, Huckabee, Paul, Hunter, and Thompson, but at least I can respect them as human beings. And given the way McCain has been treated by GWB&co, I can understand the very hard position he is placed in.

But no one made Giuliani and Romney into a phony, they chose it and are wallowing in it. Dislike of them is the wrong word and a total lack of respect for them as humans is better in MHO.

 

[MadRat]

Originally posted by: Fmr12B
Huckabee really appears to be likable in a "I'm everyones neighbor, relative, coworker" kind of way.

He really seems to be a champion of the middle class and has Bill Clinton likability.

I'm starting to really like the guy, he appears to be a straight shooter, no waffling, no political posturing. I was a big Fred supporter but Huckabee has me listening!

Huckabee has yet to taste truly negative attack ads. Just wait until his ethics record is exposed. You won't be singing his praises after that.

Fred Thompson showed he has a pulse. Its too little too late. I think he'll be working inside McCain's campaign by February.

Someone kick McCain, does that guy even breathe? He was about as lively as a three day old trout carcass.

Ron Paul also showed he had a pulse. But he's definitely out of the conversation 90% of the time in these debates. His presence is nothing akin to Ross Perot. I was hoping he'd present some ideas out there but he never capitalized on the time he did get to speak.

Quite frankly Mitt Romney is the only statesman-like personality in the group. He was able to corral the conversations to wrap repeatedly back to him. He really dominated the time.

 

[Lemon law]

Madrat has one version with---Quite frankly Mitt Romney is the only statesman-like personality in the group. He was able to corral the conversations to wrap repeatedly back to him. He really dominated the time.

Romney was also a magnet for criticism as everyone tried to gang up on him. Its difficult to see how that works for Romney. All eyes are on Ossama Bin Laden also, but it does not exactly win republican votes.

 

[MadRat]

I'm not a big fan of any of my choices as a Repub, but Romney is showing to be the most electable of the group.

I see Obama as the only electable Dem. Against the other I'd hope the Repubs win in that matchup.

 

[Wreckem]

Originally posted by: MadRat
I'm not a big fan of any of my choices as a Repub, but Romney is showing to be the most electable of the group.

I see Obama as the only electable Dem. Against the other I'd hope the Repubs win in that matchup.

Electable? Most republicans I know say the same thing Ive been saying.

He comes across like a slick car salesman.

If McCain beats Romney in NH, its pretty much over because that'll give Huck a boost in Michigan where hes already leading by a slim margin. Huckabee and McCain will shoot it out in SC, where Huckabee is likely to win because of Evangelicals. And depending on which poll you look at in Florida, Giuliani leads by 5%, Hucakbee leads by 5% or they are tied.

Its kinda hard to be electable if you cannot muster enough support by your own party. Romney is backed by the established GOP machine(Coulter, Rush et al) but that is all. Hes out spent everyone 10-20 to 1 and he looks to have back to back losses on his hands.

He is NOT the most electable. According to polls, John McCain is the only republican with shot at knocking of Obama or Hillary.

Lets face it, theres virtually ZERO chance a Republican can beat Obama or Hillary because the Dems are likely to turn out one of the largest votes in history all thanks to GWB. A Huckabee ticket brings out more GOP voters. More GOP voters = less Congressional losses. Romney isnt going to bring out the vote, Huckabee can. If Romney gets the nomination, the republicans are going to lose far more house seats, than they would have if Huckabee got the nod.

Like it or not the Christian right is a NEEDED voting bloc for the GOP, they make up a good precentage of the party. Romney isn't going to be turning out the Christian right. Christian right stays at home, not only does Romney lose by a fairly large margin but so do Congressional Republicans. You put Obama vs Romney, almost EVERY single competitive House race will go Dem. Meaning the Dems would EASILY pick up 30 House seats and quite possibly enough to reach 60 in the Senate. You can count on it.

 

[Jaskalas]

Originally posted by: Farang

Originally posted by: Wreckem
One of Fox News reporters called Huckabee to much of a hick(because of his name), three months ago. Fox News does NOT supprot Huckabee, because like you said the people that control Fox News are Republican Power Players who want to keep the status quo. They vhemently oppose a Populist Republican.

This is true, Ann Coulter seems to be as much against him as she is Clinton or Edwards. I have made it a point to never read her columns, but I saw one about her bashing Huckabee and wanted to see what the far-right had to say about him, they are unhappy basically everything.

All the more reason to support him above the others.

 

[MadRat]

Originally posted by: Wreckem
If McCain beats Romney in NH, its pretty much over because that'll give Huck a boost in Michigan where hes already leading by a slim margin. Huckabee and McCain will shoot it out in SC, where Huckabee is likely to win because of Evangelicals. And depending on which poll you look at in Florida, Giuliani leads by 5%, Hucakbee leads by 5% or they are tied.

Manchurian candidate McCain will not make it another month in the campaign. He's unelectable across the majority of the country. And Huckabee will look like Huckleberry when people start bringing up his ethics problems in Arkansas.

 

[nageov3t]

Originally posted by: MadRat

Originally posted by: Wreckem
If McCain beats Romney in NH, its pretty much over because that'll give Huck a boost in Michigan where hes already leading by a slim margin. Huckabee and McCain will shoot it out in SC, where Huckabee is likely to win because of Evangelicals. And depending on which poll you look at in Florida, Giuliani leads by 5%, Hucakbee leads by 5% or they are tied.

Manchurian candidate McCain will not make it another month in the campaign. He's unelectable across the majority of the country. And Huckabee will look like Huckleberry when people start bringing up his ethics problems in Arkansas.

no doubt that's why McCain is leading the Republican race nationally

 

[glugglug]

McCain's new foreign policy view makes him pretty scary (and Ghouliani has always been).

Ron Paul is the only Republican I would be in favor of, but Huckabee isn't too terrible either. I would vote for Huckabee over Hillary. Not over Bill Richardson though. Him and Kucinich are my favorite Democratic candidates, though I realize neither stands a chance.

I would love to see the expression on the Faux News droids faces if Ron Paul were to win NH after they excluded him. I think Ron Paul were to somehow become the GOP nominee, he would win the general election quite easily. Other than that, Huckabee is probably their best chance. Romney is too slick for his own good.

 

[jonks]

Factcheck weighs in, full articles at factcheck.org:

Democrats:

Obama claimed we are "back where we started two years ago" in Iraq. Actually, all indicators of violence show dramatic improvement compared with two years ago.

Clinton repeated a misleading claim that the 2005 energy bill was "larded with all kinds of special interest breaks" for the oil industry. Actually, the bill resulted in a net increase in taxes on the oil industry, according to the nonpartisan Congressional Research Service.
Obama stated that U.S. medical care costs "twice as much per capita as any other advanced nation," which is incorrect. U.S. spending is double the average, but not double that of all others.


Clinton said there is no reason that U.S. troops should be in Iraq "beyond today," but she has also conceded that she might keep combat troops fighting there for years.


Richardson said the price of gasoline in New Hampshire is at a record high. It's close, but lower than he said, and lower than it was a few weeks ago.

In the analysis section we note further misstatements and twisted facts, and we find that Clinton was close to the mark when she criticized Obama for shifting positions on the USA Patriot Act

Republicans:

Romney claimed that the 47 million Americans who lack health care are not covered because they say "I'm not going to play. I'm just going to get free care paid for by everybody else." Experts say that very few who are offered insurance turn it down and that the uninsured get worse care.


Giuliani falsely blamed President Clinton for cuts in the military that occurred in large part under President George H.W. Bush and Secretary of Defense Dick Cheney. He said that ?the Army had been at 725,000; it?s down to 500,000.? That?s true, but it was down to 572,423 by the time Clinton took office.


McCain recalled that he "strongly disagreed" with Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld and had "no confidence" in his Iraq strategy "at the time." But he didn't say publicly that he had no confidence in Rumsfeld until December 2004, after Bush was reelected and well after the war began.
.
Romney falsely denied that an attack ad called McCain?s immigration bill "amnesty," though it does. One of his Web ads also attacks McCain for supporting "amnesty." He conceded during the debate that McCain?s bill "technically" isn?t amnesty.
Giuliani claimed that "economists" say health insurance rates would fall by up to 50 percent if millions more shopped for policies individually. Once again, his campaign was unable to produce a single economist who supports that figure.


Romney claimed his Massachusetts state insurance program had reduced the number of uninsured in Massachusetts by 300,000. That?s the number who have gained coverage under the system, but many were covered previously through other means.