Ivy Bridge or wait for Haswell

Discussion in 'CPUs and Overclocking' started by Shephard, Nov 3, 2012.

  1. Mars999

    Mars999 Senior member

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    Just get an IB CPU now, Haswell is only going to net 10-15% better performance over IB and maybe not much at all in games.

    Even with the new tech in Haswell, it will take a few years for developers to add it in, and by then you can get the latest CPU at that time anyway.

    And if you are still rocking a Q6600 worrying about a dead socket is a moot point you never moved your rig above the entry level Quad Conroe CPU (775 socket)

    Get a 660Ti or 7800 series GPU and 16GB of RAM, you be set, throw in a SSD walla!

    BTW I perfer Gigabyte MB's IMO they are better, and MSI would be my 2nd choice!

    HTH!

    Oh an yes Black Friday is only one day, and they have Cyber Monday the day after........ But yeah deals go quick and sell out FAST! SO unless you have that day off to be refreshing like mad F5 keystroking it!!!!!
     
  2. 2is

    2is Diamond Member

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    Monday doesn't come a day after Friday :p
     
  3. dragantoe

    dragantoe Senior member

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    when is haswell coming out and what are the specs for the i5k? (if they are still using that)
     
  4. laputan machine

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    I believe it's around Q2 next year. We don't know any specs yet.
     
  5. ShintaiDK

    ShintaiDK Lifer

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    March 2013.
     
  6. Gryz

    Gryz Golden Member

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    Shepard, I was in a similar situation that you are in.
    This spring, I still had my E8500 (bought in January 2008) and my gtx260 (bought in September 2008). I could play my games, like Skyrim, WoW, FO3 with reasonable eyecandy and reasonable framerates. Last year I decided to skip both Sandy Bridge (mistake) and the gtx580 (also mistake). So this year I really wanted to upgrade.

    First the nVidia gtx680 was released. I bought one.
    My framerates went up immediately. I mostly used Skyrim (and FO3) to measure framerates. But what was most noticable was that I could keep enabling more graphics features, and it wouldn't impact my framerates at all ! So it looked like my CPU (the old E8500) would set an upper limit on framerates, (e.g. 35 fps on the steps in Whiterun in Skyrim). But within that maximum, I could enable all features I wanted. 8xMSAA, Transparency SSAA, Ambient Occlusion, HighRes Textures, etc, etc. And my fps would stay at 35 ! The upgrade was well worth it, imho. Yes, the old CPU would hold back my framerates, but not the eyecandy. And personally I find eyecandy more important than constant 60 fps.

    Then 2 months later Ivy Bridge got released. I bought a i5-3570K. Framerates went up. Even in Skyrim, my fps on the stairs in Whiterun went from 35 fps to 45fps or so. When I later overclocked (from 3.4GHz to 4.0GHz without increasing voltage) my fps there went over. Note, if I'd disable SSAO, I'd go way over 60 fps. In 99% of all locations in Skyrim I get 60+ anyway.

    I also played Guild Wars 2 for a while. When I overclocked, my fps increased linearly. I conclude that GW2 (and MMOs in general) depend on the CPU as well. I didn't play GW2 on my old hardware ofc.

    So I think we can make this conclusion:
    1) your old CPU will set a maximum framerate, but the amount of eyecandy you can enable depends on your graphics card. If you buy a new GPU first, you can enable more eyecandy, but your framerates will go up only slightly. In some types of games (RTS and MMO, and some exceptions like Skyrim), CPU has a larger impact on framerates than in other games.
    2) your GPU will set the maximum amount of eyecandy you can enable. Even with a slow CPU, a fast GPU will allow you to enable lots more eyecandy. But your absolute framerates will be limited by the CPU (more in MMOs and RTSs, less in other games).

    If I were you, I'd upgrade both. (That's what I did this spring).
    If I had to make a choice, I'd probably buy a new videocard first (e.g. the gtx660Ti, gtx670 or an AMD 7000 series). And then wait till I had more money to buy an Ivy Bridge, or maybe even wait for Haswell.

    Your q6600 will indeed hold back a new videocard a bit.
    But even with a i5-3570K, your very old 9800gt will absolutely do nothing for you in games.
     
    #56 Gryz, Nov 5, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2012
  7. CHADBOGA

    CHADBOGA Golden Member

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    Delay seems to be the name of the game for everyone these days.

    I would be very pleasantly surprised if a regular fellow can buy a Haswell CPU from Newegg(not a Pre-Order), before May 2013.
     
  8. gramboh

    gramboh Platinum Member

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    Don't worry so much about Black Friday if you are in Canada. Yes, NCIX, Memory Express, Canada Computers will have Black Friday sales but they will not be as insane as what they get in the states.

    Haswell is far away still, and motherboards are always more expensive during launch month (the trade off is you get the CPU when it's brand new and have top of the line for longer, I did that with IB). For your situation, I would just pick up a well priced 3570K + motherboard bundle from one of the weekly NCIX.com sales.

    7870 is the lowest I would go, I would try to spend a bit more on a quality 7950 with aftermarket PCB/fans (MSI Twin Frozr III) and OC It hard.
     
  9. happysmiles

    happysmiles Senior member

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    I'd wait.

    it's only a few months away.
     
  10. 2is

    2is Diamond Member

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    Broadwell will only be a few months away once Haswell hits too. Skylake a few months after that.

    My point... a "few months" isn't exactly around the corner as far as CPU's are concerned.
     
    #60 2is, Nov 5, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2012
  11. tweakboy

    tweakboy Diamond Member

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    No I started babbling thats not advice for his particular situation.

    My call is don't wait for Haswell or youll be waiting possibly until Q2 2014
    Grab the Ivy that best suits you. i5 or i7 3570k :eek: and if you dont care too much about power savings.. Instead spend less and grab a Sandy 2700k for 270 dollars. Also dont forget black friday. gl
     
  12. dragantoe

    dragantoe Senior member

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    aaahhh too hard to keep track of cpus when they come out so often lol
     
  13. Shephard

    Shephard Senior member

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    well there is another Haswell topic at top of the forum and the guys say it's going to be way better.

    But still I will not wait. There are good suggestions in this thread.

    Is i5 3570k good for rendering? How long does it take to render 1080p 10 minute video with little compression for youtube.

    thanks
     
  14. LoveMachine

    LoveMachine Senior member

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    Far too many variables to quote specific render times, but suffice to say, the 3570K is only a couple percentage points slower than the significantly more expensive 3770K on Handbrake encodes. The only chips that will be much faster are 6 core Sandy Bridge-Es that are far more expensive.

    In the tech world, there is always something faster just around the corner. Haswell is likely 6ish months away (I don't have a whole lot of faith in optimistic release estimates), so if you have the cash and have the itch for an upgrade, it is in no way foolish to jump in now.
     
  15. Exophase

    Exophase Diamond Member

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    A lot is known about Haswell. It's a highly safe bet that at stock speeds it'll perform better than IB.

    The unknown is in how high it'll overclock. Intel could be sacrificing the overclocking market, eating in some of its frequency headroom to improve stock performance and perf/W. Intel is already showing signs of disregarding overclockers with IB.
     
  16. kleinkinstein

    kleinkinstein Senior member

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    You don't say! You are genius. Of course it'll be > Ivy. Why else build it! Gudgawd man!
     
  17. WhoBeDaPlaya

    WhoBeDaPlaya Diamond Member

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    Jeez, who shit in your wheaties? What he probably meant to say was "perform noticeably better than IVB". No, ~3% coupled with crappy TIM (IVB vs. SB) isn't decidedly better.

    OP : Your choice would be a lot more difficult if you were near a MicroCenter in the States. They just dropped their price on the 3570K by $20 ($169.99, w/$50 off mobo combo).
     
  18. Shephard

    Shephard Senior member

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    well if there was a Microcenter close to the border on the west coast I would go get one.
     
  19. Hubb1e

    Hubb1e Senior member

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    Just because your MB is micro doesn't mean it can't overclock that Q6600. To reach 3ghz you just set the FSB to 400 which is a fully supported clock rate for Core2. At 3ghz I was very happy with my Q6600. At that clock rate it's easier to tell you to wait for Haswell, but at 2.4ghz I think you would do very well upgrading to Ivy. And remember that when the CPU is new the prices on the CPU and boards are pretty high. Ivy is a good deal right now, and it is really easy to overclock them. If Haswell is 10-15% faster than Ivy, that's still only a 300-400 mhz overclock difference which is the difference between a mild overclock and an aggressive one. The K models are unlocked and are very easy to clock up to at least 4.2 ghz which will already be faster than Haswell at stock clock.

    So, either get some more speed out of your current chip, or bite on the reasonable prices of Ivy since Haswell will be expensive when it first drops, forcing you to wait another few months while prices come down. Ivy will last you a long time. This chip is seriously fast when overclocked.
     
  20. Beavermatic

    Beavermatic Senior member

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    I personally wish they'd push it back until the end of 2013, beginning of 2014.

    I can't even sit down for 5 minutes with my Ivy Bridge machine without worrying about the next upgrade. And before that, I only had my Sandy bridge machine for literally just over 11 months.

    Same goes for the video cards.

    Seriously, no reason to be pushing out a new processor or card every 8 to 12 months. Even switching sockets was getting ridiculous there for a while until 1155, and now, boom, gotta do it again. It kills the value of building anything, and seems kind of senseless from a finanicial perspective. The improvements between them are so marginal and minimal, it just seems like a rush.
     
  21. WhoBeDaPlaya

    WhoBeDaPlaya Diamond Member

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    Hell no! I want my Haswell now if possible!
    I just built a SB Z77 number cruncher and while nice, it didn't blow my socks off compared to my trusty 920 D0 @ 4.1GHz.
     
  22. Exophase

    Exophase Diamond Member

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    You don't think that makes it more than a complete unknown? Bulldozer and Willamette actually performed worse than their best predecessors at some tasks..

    I spoke pretty conservatively, but I think it's a safe bet that it'll be at least 10-20% better in some but not necessarily all applications.

    But even if it weren't faster than IB at the higher end it'd still be worth building if it has better perf/W at the lower end, which is where much more of the money is for Intel.
     
  23. Mars999

    Mars999 Senior member

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    An Anandtech already stated Haswell will only be around 10% and at most 15% faster than IB. So that amount is subjective, if you want to wait or not if it is worth it to you....
     
  24. gramboh

    gramboh Platinum Member

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    Just curious, what caused you to upgrade from SB to IB? I can't think of too many use cases that would justify upgrading on every tick-tock cycle Intel releases.
     
  25. kleinkinstein

    kleinkinstein Senior member

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    All the head-2-head benchmarks are here.