I've been concealed carrying for a little over a year now...

[Spungo]

Thanks OP

You confirmed all of the reasons why I don't have a gun.

Your response to crazy people being armed is to disarm yourself and be at their mercy? This should become part of official government policy. France has fighter jets and France sucks therefore the Air Force should disband.

 

[Jeffg010]

I don't disagree, but there is a difference between your life being in truly danger and taking an earful from a loudmouth knucklehead in line at a store.

Edit - and I'm not saying that was or wasn't the case here for the OP, just to clarify.

Just to be clear OP said the guy was coming at him. When do you think it is the right time to pull the gun? Before he touches you or after you get hit or maybe even put in a choke hold? If someone is moving toward me I'd be incline to think it was a threading manner. All it would take is one punch to seriously injure someone. Stop it before it happens because you don't know what the out come is going to be.

I also want to be clear OP did not pull the gun out but only moved his hand toward it.

 

[edro]

"Back off! I am armed!"

 

[momeNt]

I think OP needs to learn to not instigate situations that can easily turn violent and end in death. You can't be that retarded that you HAVE to laugh and then smile when somebody is angry, and if you are retarded, then you lied on your gun permit.

 

[KeypoX]

So you're going to pull a gun on somebody you pissed off, and continued to piss off, because he was walking towards you.

You are an epic pussy and should not be carrying. Can't wait to read about you in the paper for shooting some old lady who swung her cane at you.



Sounds like the sign of an immature mouth breather.

Doubt he would have been laughing or smiling if he didnt have a gun.

 

[momeNt]

Doubt he would have been laughing or smiling if he didnt have a gun.

It's a character flaw he apparently always has had, which makes him certifiably autistic, maybe highly functionally autistic like aspbergers, but still autistic to not have the restraint and understanding of how to act in social situations. A good chance if this comes to light his permit will be revoked.

 

[rh71]

I've known a few cops over the years as hockey teammates and every time they get into a verbal confrontation with someone (which is unsurprisingly often) I half expect them to make sure the other guy knows he's a cop. This is how I feel with CCW people. They never end up saying it though.

 

[kalrith]

OP:
First, good job on not having to use it. Interesting that you find it to make you more docile. I am open to people concealing.

but seriously,
The gun should be the LAST RESORT. Your first reaction to a guy confronting you was to thumb your shirt?! Thats ridiculous. You could have done/said any number of other things to quell the situation and avoid having to ever even think about reaching.
1. Raise hands with palm open and step back in non threatening manner.
2. Stop laughing.
3. Leave the room.

If the guy decided to start coming at you continuously - and he threatens to lay a hand on you, or follows you as you leave, then you can start to THINK about reaching. First you should announce "Im carrying, back off." and that should immediately shock and calm him down.

To be honest, it scares me that someone with your aggressive nature carries a weapon. Maybe if you became less of a shit disturber and were better at avoiding these situations you wouldnt need the gun?

I think this sums up the situation very well. If you were fearful that the guy would assault you, then the response should've been an apology and leaving the situation. A fight (or pulling your gun) is the absolute last resort once all other avenues are pursued.

BTW, I'm pro-gun and pro-carry. IMO those who carry should see the gun as a tremendous responsibility to do everything in your power to never let anyone know that you even have a gun. On that note, if big, scary, angry guy approaches you, you do absolutely everything to keep everyone from even knowing you have a gun. Apologize, leave, etc. Don't say, "I've got a gun; don't mess with me!" Don't put your thumb in your shirt. Mitigate the situation in some other way. Actually mitigate the situation in the exact same way you would have if you didn't have a gun, which would likely be to apologize, leave, etc.

Edit: In that situation if you were so proud to not apologize or leave that you would've let the situation escalate, then you have no right to draw your gun in that situation. In fact, if the guy didn't draw a weapon first, then you might've gotten in a lot of trouble just for saying you have a gun or drawing it with no intent of shooting.

Sorry if this sounds harsh. I understand that in the heat of a situation it's sometimes difficult to think clearly. However, if after the situation you still think the right choice was to draw your gun if he had taken another step, then I don't think you should carry. Someone's going to wind up getting shot who doesn't deserve it. I'm not saying the guy was right in approaching you. However, approaching someone without a weapon is not a reason to get shot. And since you should never point a gun at someone you don't want to shoot, then you should never pull your gun in a situation like that. It would be different if you were a 100-lb female being approached by an angry 250-lb. guy, but even in that situation, every effort should be made to keep from revealing the gun.

 

[TXHokie]

I was behind this old white haired lady who looked like a sweet person at a north Dallas Wal-mart checkout one time. She was asked to produce an ID for her check and she was fumbling in her purse. Then she asked the cashier if her CCW license would be acceptable (which it was). I'm thinking to myself "hmmm...Texas, heat packing grandma...how very cool". You'd never guess who carries really.

 

[SViper]

I also have a CCW permit in Texas (CHL).

When I reflect on other peoples' experiences, I try to think about how a witness would describe the situation to police if it escalated. Would witnesses describe you as "standing your ground" and not trying to leave the situation? Would they describe you as saying "I don't want any trouble, stay back!!"? Would they describe you as laughing at the guy only to escalate the situation?

I bring this up because depending on your state of residence, each one of the situations I described would have a completely different legal outcome. In Florida, you can meet "force with force" without a duty to retreat. In Texas, you have to show that you clearly wanted to exit the altercation as it is escalating, but the other person would not allow you to do so before using force (not necessarily deadly force). Both states do not justify the use of deadly force if you provoke the other person.

Was the OP correct in his decision-making process? I can't say because I wasn't in the situation personally. I just hope to give some insight into our law system and what you would and would not be justified in doing.

 

[alkemyst]

First, if people know you are carrying concealed you are fucking doing it wrong.

Second, if you personality changes because you are packing that is based on the fact that you know feel you are in control of people and many 'play nice' hoping someone calls them on it.

Don't be that guy.

 

[endlessmike]

Just to be clear OP said the guy was coming at him. When do you think it is the right time to pull the gun? Before he touches you or after you get hit or maybe even put in a choke hold? If someone is moving toward me I'd be incline to think it was a threading manner. All it would take is one punch to seriously injure someone. Stop it before it happens because you don't know what the out come is going to be.

I also want to be clear OP did not pull the gun out but only moved his hand toward it.

All he said was the guy was heading towards him and cussing. Running? Walking? Waving a tire iron? From 4 feet away or 20? Which is why I clarified in #99 that I don't claim to know how this all went down.

However, it sounds like it could have been (and was) otherwise mitigated without the use of the gun, as the OP said. I really don't understand how you can continue to argue that this was a situation that merited pulling a gun, since the issue was resolved without doing so.

And I want to be clear that I am aware that he did not pull the gun.

Edit - Also, I don't think anyone here disagrees that you wouldn't draw the gun in a threatening or dangerous situation. This really does not seem to be the usual pro vs. anti-gun/CC thread and has actually been pretty good.

 

[kage69]

Bring back swords. Guns are for pussies. You cant hide a sword.

False.

There was a time when cane swords were quite popular with European aristocracy, it also caught on in The South.

Farther back, Japanese commoners became quite adept at hiding weapons during the feudal times. Uptight samurai didn't like dirty peasants offending their station by also carrying blades.
Google 'Zatoichi' for an easy example of what I'm talking about.

Swords are for pussies, bring back the polearms. You can't hide a bec de corbin!

 

[alkemyst]

There are a lot of problematic gun owners above. You don't 'reach' for your gun, open your coat, etc because a situation has started. You do so when that situation has gone to a possible lethal encounter.

The attitude that 'why should I have to wait?' is part of the reason so many don't want anyone armed.

I am not for more and more laws/restrictions, but personally if someone hasn't taken a few self-defence classes at the very minimum; they have no business owning a gun.

 

[SolMiester]

Wow, is it any wonder you guys have so many gun disasters over there?

 

[rudeguy]

All he said was the guy was heading towards him and cussing. Running? Walking? Waving a tire iron? From 4 feet away or 20? Which is why I clarified in #99 that I don't claim to know how this all went down.

However, it sounds like it could have been (and was) otherwise mitigated without the use of the gun, as the OP said. I really don't understand how you can continue to argue that this was a situation that merited pulling a gun, since the issue was resolved without doing so.

And I want to be clear that I am aware that he did not pull the gun.

Edit - Also, I don't think anyone here disagrees that you wouldn't draw the gun in a threatening or dangerous situation. This really does not seem to be the usual pro vs. anti-gun/CC thread and has actually been pretty good.

I actually appreciate both the positive and negative input. I put my experience in there on purpose. Nothing actually happened but it was very close to happening. How I react to situations is always about how I've prepared for those situations.

I never thought to prepare for an angry, unruly guy at Pep Boys. My reaction was to decide that at that moment, pulling was not the right thing to do. I also decided at what point I would no longer feel safe. I've always been a scrapper...but at that time I felt that brandishing a weapon would be a better end to the situation than fighting with the guy. There was no talking to him since he clearly wasn't in the mood for having a discussion. Was it the right call? Well the situation ended with no cops, no one getting hurt and everyone going on with their days.

Again I have always acknowledged that my reaction to others being mad is not the best one and its something I am working on. However given the choice of matching the guy's yells and curses or smiling at him....I'm always going to choose smiling.

 

[sourceninja]

I see a lot of bad advice here. Most verbal confrontations are going to be well within the safety zone of using a firearm. Most attackers can cover 10 feet faster than you can draw, aim, and fire.

You need to be thinking about how to prevent the escalation, watching for signs of escalation, and positioning yourself to have the best advantage. If that means unbuttoning a jacket, putting your thumb in your shirt, or anything else that doesn't scream "I have a gun and will shoot you", then you do it.

Obviously you don't threaten, you attempt to de-escalate, and you try to get the attention of anyone who can help diffuse the situation before you decided to use force to defend yourself. But there is nothing wrong with positioning yourself to have an advantage should force be needed.

If someone was screaming at me, I'd make sure I'm standing, with my weapon side the furthest from the aggressor with good posture and balance. I'd attempt to keep as much distance as possible without aggressively fleeing, running, or moving in a way that would provoke. I would apologize, no matter if I did anything. I would speak loudly but not yelling to try to get others to the area. I would start to make mental notes of walls, obstacles and other things I may use to keep distance from the aggresor or that could be used to corner me. I would watch his shoulders, as they are always the first sign of an attack.I wou ld be prepared to move in a circular fashion, not just backwards or forwards. Finally I would probably bring my hands to my waist (hands on my hips like I'm resting them), to close the draw distance.

I personally would rather hear that someone decided to be prepared when someone was getting aggressive and it turn out it was not needed, then someone not be prepared when the aggressor escalates.

 

[Jeffg010]

All he said was the guy was heading towards him and cussing. Running? Walking? Waving a tire iron? From 4 feet away or 20? Which is why I clarified in #99 that I don't claim to know how this all went down.

However, it sounds like it could have been (and was) otherwise mitigated without the use of the gun, as the OP said. I really don't understand how you can continue to argue that this was a situation that merited pulling a gun, since the issue was resolved without doing so.

And I want to be clear that I am aware that he did not pull the gun.

Edit - Also, I don't think anyone here disagrees that you wouldn't draw the gun in a threatening or dangerous situation. This really does not seem to be the usual pro vs. anti-gun/CC thread and has actually been pretty good.

I never said this situation merited pulling a gun I'm the one that claimed he only moved his hand toward the gun. You guys sure love to make it sound like anyone that CC is going to pull it out at any moment which is not the case.

I'd do what Sourceninja posted and scope out as much as I could and get as much space as I could from the threat. If that meant me slowly moving away then that's what I would do but I'd also be ready to pull if I ran out options to defuse the situation.

 

[endlessmike]

I never said this situation merited pulling a gun I'm the one that claimed he only moved his hand toward the gun.

Again, nobody actively involved in this dicussion is claiming that he actually pulled the gun, despite what you choose to keep repeating. And your previous statement of "When do you think it is the right time to pull the gun? Before he touches you or after you get hit or maybe even put in a choke hold? If someone is moving toward me I'd be incline to think it was a threading manner." implies that you think this was the right time to pull a gun. If that is not the case then that's my misunderstanding.

You guys sure love to make it sound like anyone that CC is going to pull it out at any moment which is not the case.

Actually, everyone here has for the most part defended the right to CC. And for the record, the OP was the one to state that he made the decision to pull the gun if the guy took one more step. He said that. Not anyone else. That's his fact, not our assumption.

I'd do what Sourceninja posted and scope out as much as I could and get as much space as I could from the threat. If that meant me slowly moving away then that's what I would do but I'd also be ready to pull if I ran out options to defuse the situation.

And that's fine. Have you noticed that what Sourceninja and many others here have said include A LOT of other considerations and options in between "guy walking towards you" and "draw"? THAT is the point that most here are trying to make.

 

[alkemyst]

If one was really a 'scrapper', they'd not even think about needing to pull their gun out when a fight could have just resolved it. Better yet, as one; I'd have just been like 'U mad bro?' or something equally stupid.

Most of the loud and obnoxious are easily put into their place prior for any need to be physical.

 

[IronWing]

I've been concealed carrying for a little over a year now...

That's gonna be one big baby and I bet grandma has already guessed.

 

[IGemini]

It's a character flaw he apparently always has had, which makes him certifiably autistic, maybe highly functionally autistic like aspbergers, but still autistic to not have the restraint and understanding of how to act in social situations.

*taps sarcasm meter* Not sure if working...

Not necessarily true. I know a guy with the exact same character flaw except he's an antisocial sycophant, no where near the realm of ASD. Typically it's more mundane than that.

 

[Thebobo]

Is your penis any bigger?

 

[OutHouse]

 

[FuzzyDunlop]

I dunno if its thread backfire. He posted asking for opinions on what we thought of his reactions and we all gave him our honest opinions. Mostly negative, but sometimes thats needed for a reality check.

Again, ill say it, OP, good job with NOT pulling. It should be your goal NEVER to have to pull it. Either remove yourself from those kind of situations or find other ways to mitigate. Yes, its ok to be prepared to pull it if necessary (as sourceninja says), but it should be the last resort.