It's Here. ACA.

[werepossum]

Our government is nothing but one big political theatre of the absurd. The stupid government basically 'shuts down' for two days every week just like everything else, and somehow everyone doesn't die, the sun still rises, life actually goes on.

But it's almost comical how they try to make anybody but the big government kissups give a flying F about shutting that money grubbing bunch of dipshits down for longer than they shut down anyway.

Govt (and their suckups): Oh noes! A bunch of bureaucrats shuffling papers to the tune of trillions will be furloughed!

Sane people: Good riddance.

Govt: Yeah? Well.. well... we'll stop delivering the mail!

Sane people: Hardly use it, and if I need to, UPS, FedEX, DHL, or just good ol' email.

Govt: Well... well... we'll stop paying the military!!! That'll show you!

Sane people: Why don't you assholes stop paying your own damned overpaid selves, and stop looking for desperate ways to prove you're actually relevant to anyone but your kiss-ups?

Govt: We're going to shut down the national parks! Surely you care about that!!! HA!

Sane people: Oh noes! Trees, rocks and mountains won't have human beings to look after them for a few days! How will nature ever survive on its own??!!!


Bunch of total dumbasses.


And as for that ACA: Great, all the young healthy people just got the biggest shaft they'll ever get in their lives- you now get to pay for sick and old people- or just pay fines- and by the time you're old, the whole damned thing will have collapsed because it's run by the same retards that are tripping over themselves threatening to shut down a forest for a few days.

LOL +1

Nonetheless, while I very seldom agree with Sportage I think he's got some good points here. The only reason we have employer-provided health insurance is because of government wage freezes. It's a burden on employers and in an age where workers seldom work for one company for decades, an anachronism. I dislike a lot about Obamacare and as a small business employee I'm destined to be collateral damage as the Dems break the private health insurance system as a necessary precursor to government health care, but making people responsible for their own health insurance is a good thing IMO.

 

[raildogg]

Many people seem to be base their opinion of the new healthcare law based on their politics. It's sad but that's the way it seems. The Democrat party supporters are defending this law while the Republican party supporters, of course, are saying how bad it is.

People are very partisan. They walk in lockstep with their party. It's similar to being in a gang, really, though I guess it's considered one or two notches above that kind of mentality.

 

[First]

You are going to guarantee that when the last time the gov shut down the GOP only lost 2 seats?

They lost 5 seats in an off election mid-term typically heavily older and conservative leaning and with the 6-year itch working in their favor. It was a well known disaster for them. Read up: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_House_of_Representatives_elections,_1998

 

[First]

Well that's what compromise is all about. We need to tell that to Obama and Reid.

There's nothing to compromise on when they're stated position is to get rid of Obamacare. Get it?

 

[werepossum]

This is a large part of the problem. The average American and our paid propagandists refuse to distinguish between health care and health insurance. Forcing everyone to purchase health insurance will do nothing to improve or reform the issues we have with our health care.

Well - it might help. My thyroid cancer was caught when I had an infected and ruptured lymph node checked out. Five or ten years later it might well have been very costly to treat. And if I had not had health insurance, I probably would have toughed it out or gone to my doctor for antibiotics but refused a specialist. Similarly, I know a lady whose son was diagnosed with stage 4 liver and stomach cancer. He had no health insurance but had no problem getting all the very expensive treatment he needed, but it was too late to save him. Had he had health insurance, maybe his cancer would have been caught earlier, at a treatable stage.

A flood of new people with better access to health care will definitely drive up costs, but there are some factors which will mitigate that.

 

[werepossum]

Many people seem to be base their opinion of the new healthcare law based on their politics. It's sad but that's the way it seems. The Democrat party supporters are defending this law while the Republican party supporters, of course, are saying how bad it is.

People are very partisan. They walk in lockstep with their party. It's similar to being in a gang, really, though I guess it's considered one or two notches above that kind of mentality.

Maybe not so much above it as safer. LOL

 

[boomerang]

We have been using 2 insurance types. We have one insurance with a deductible of about $6k. Then we have another insurance that covers all but $250 of the deductible.

Obamacare sucks. What idiot decided to cover people till age 26. Cant fix stupid.

I need some kind of insurance for my out of work wife who is 60. I just know I am going to get a kick in the ass. I will give it a week and then look for some info.

Is there anything that the government does not know about you? This is like giving the government another spy network.

Wait until you hear the questions the Doctor is mandated to ask you. You're gonna love it!

 

[BoberFett]

Funny, I don't feel any different today.

 

[BoberFett]

Nonetheless, while I very seldom agree with Sportage I think he's got some good points here. The only reason we have employer-provided health insurance is because of government wage freezes. It's a burden on employers and in an age where workers seldom work for one company for decades, an anachronism. I dislike a lot about Obamacare and as a small business employee I'm destined to be collateral damage as the Dems break the private health insurance system as a necessary precursor to government health care, but making people responsible for their own health insurance is a good thing IMO.

No, the reason we have employer provided healthcare is because long, long ago it was provided as a benefit to attract workers. But that was when health insurance was actually insurance, and not a payment plan for Viagra.

 

[werepossum]

No, the reason we have employer provided healthcare is because long, long ago it was provided as a benefit to attract workers. But that was when health insurance was actually insurance, and not a payment plan for Viagra.

From the wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_insurance_in_the_United_States

The rise of employer-sponsored coverage[edit]
Employer-sponsored health insurance plans dramatically expanded as a direct result of wage controls imposed by the federal government during World War II. The labor market was tight because of the increased demand for goods and decreased supply of workers during the war. Federally imposed wage and price controls prohibited manufacturers and other employers from raising wages enough to attract workers. When the War Labor Board declared that fringe benefits, such as sick leave and health insurance, did not count as wages for the purpose of wage controls, employers responded with significantly increased offers of fringe benefits, especially health care coverage, to attract workers.

There were a few employer-provided plans prior to World War II - mostly government entities - but the reason this is the dominant plan is that during World War II the federal government froze wages. Desperate for quality employees in a very tight labor market - remember, most women before World War II did not work outside the home, much less in construction or manufacturing - employers began offering fringe benefits, which the National Labor Board ruled were not covered by the wage freeze. It was a way of paying more than the competition. By war's end, most people expected to have health insurance furnished "free" by their employer, and those expectations drove this model. As you say, at that time such plans were not terribly expensive to the employer and not an onerous burden, but were it not for the wage freezes, employers would have been able to simply offer more money to attract better employees, without taking on the overhead of health insurance.

 

[BoberFett]

Right. So government control of the market caused the clusterfuck we have now.

I know! Let's have government fix it!

 

[Matt1970]

There's nothing to compromise on when they're stated position is to get rid of Obamacare. Get it?

And yet they offered a compromise.

 

[First]

And yet they offered a compromise.

404 compromise not found.

 

[Matt1970]

They lost 5 seats in an off election mid-term typically heavily older and conservative leaning and with the 6-year itch working in their favor. It was a well known disaster for them. Read up: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_House_of_Representatives_elections,_1998

Excuse me, correction. One year after the shutdown of 1995 they lost 3 whole seats in the 1996 election still holding a 21 seat advantage one year after a gov shutdown.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_House_of_Representatives_elections,_1996

History shows a Gov shutdown is not the end of a party and will not bring an economy to it's knees like some here would like everyone to believe.

 

[Matt1970]

404 compromise not found.

Full funding for Obamacare allowed. Only the mandate and congress subsidy delayed.

404 Liberal's facts mixed up

 

[Ryan]

How much is your premium.

It will be $87.82 on a biweekly basis.

 

[First]

Excuse me, correction. One year after the shutdown of 1995 they lost 3 whole seats in the 1996 election still holding a 21 seat advantage one year after a gov shutdown.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_House_of_Representatives_elections,_1996

History shows a Gov shutdown is not the end of a party and will not bring an economy to it's knees like some here would like everyone to believe.

The debt ceiling is talked about as bringing the economy to its knees, a gov't shutdown of a few days wouldn't and no one claims a shutdown of that length would. It undoubtedly hurts the economy and no one particularly intelligent argues that point. How much is a matter of debate but, nonetheless, it is unquestionably bad all-around for economic activity.

Full funding for Obamacare allowed. Only the mandate and congress subsidy delayed.

404 Liberal's facts mixed up

Sorry, that's not a compromise, that's facing reality. The mandate is the entire crux of the law, "delaying" it makes no sense (btw, no evidence or guarantee Repubs wouldn't delay it yet again next year, further revealing what a face-saving joke this "compromise" is). The employer mandate is meaningless, it's not necessary for the law to function. Without the individual mandate you get ultra expensive NY-style healthcare, which was due to their complete lack of a mandate/penalty despite "requiring" insurance.

Try harder next time.

 

[ivwshane]

It was an awesome fix! Good job Team Obama! It really worked out swell! /s

Anyway, I can now plainly see that you flat out just don't get the reason why I'm calling Democrats hypocrites over Medicare Part D. Let me explain.

Two of the biggest objections Democrats had to Medicare Part D was that it didn't allow reimporting of drugs into the country (as other countries were getting better deals) and it didn't allow direct drug price negotiations with Big Pharmacy allowing us to use our buying leverage to help assure lower costs (rebates). Dems bitched and moaned for years and years about these issues among others.

Then we find out that Obama was trying to cut this ugly backroom deal with Big Pharma ---> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/13/internal-memo-confirms-bi_n_258285.html

This is the hypocrisy I'm alluding to. Democrats complained for years about Medicare Part D; however, when they got control of the Executive and Legislative branches they did NOTHING to address the very issues they incessantly whined about when Bush was in the White House. In fact, we come to find out that Obama was going around everyone's backs and was caught negotiating a deal with Big Pharma that would actually continue these previously 'highly objectional' practices. Read the above link and weep through your tears of disillusionment...if that were only possible.

I'll concede that the dems didn't add the ability to bargain with drug companies (although it appears that prices were lower after part D was passed).

 

[werepossum]

Right. So government control of the market caused the clusterfuck we have now.

I know! Let's have government fix it!

Exactly. In attempting to fix one problem, government caused an unintended consequence that down the road caused a lot of problems. Very little in this world is either all good or all bad, and with the power of government to shape and control society something(s) bad will accompany anything good government does. Best we can hope for is either the bad things are immediately recognizable or are much less of a problem than the things government fixed.

 

[Matt1970]

Sorry, that's not a compromise, that's facing reality. The mandate is the entire crux of the law, "delaying" it makes no sense (btw, no evidence or guarantee Repubs wouldn't delay it yet again next year, further revealing what a face-saving joke this "compromise" is). The employer mandate is meaningless, it's not necessary for the law to function. Without the individual mandate you get ultra expensive NY-style healthcare, which was due to their complete lack of a mandate/penalty despite "requiring" insurance.

Try harder next time.

If the whole crux of the bill is forcing people into purchasing insurance, than that says volumes about the bill and half of what has been said was the problem. It pokes holes in the idea of how many people not being able to get insurance due to pre-existing conditions. That removed people should be lining up in droves to get insurance and a mandate no longer needed.

 

[shadow9d9]

If the whole crux of the bill is forcing people into purchasing insurance, than that says volumes about the bill and half of what has been said was the problem. It pokes holes in the idea of how many people not being able to get insurance due to pre-existing conditions. That removed people should be lining up in droves to get insurance and a mandate no longer needed.

There is no compromise there no matter how much you or other lunatics don't like it. They are not giving anything.

There is NO reason to give in demand or even 'lesser' demands in order to have the government function as it is supposed to, by paying its bills. When one party doesn't get their way, the solution is not to shut down everything. That is insane.

 

[shadow9d9]

Out of curiosity I tried to create an account and get a quote...but after 3 times of getting "your answers to security questions are invalid", I gave up.

You tried on the first day to use a website hammered by millions and couldn't get through... oh no!!!! This is truly the end. They should have hired corporations like Blue Cross which can't even keep their websites functioning at night to allow customers to pay their bills!

 

[sactoking]

Interesting note to stir the pot: Did you know that by opening today the federal exchange was operating in violation of federal law?

Federal law requires that an exchange only advertise or make available for sale "certified" qualified health plans. A "certified" qualified health plan is defined, in part, as a qualified health plan issued by a qualified health plan issuer that has signed an agreement with the federal exchange. The federal exchange is not signing agreements with qualified health plan issuers, and thus not certifying qualified health plans, until October 11. Until that time it is operating in violation of the law.

 

[michal1980]

so Obama can unilateral delay obamacare. But congress cannot.

Got it libs. makes perfect sense. You worship your dictator.

 

[hans030390]

FWIW, I posted my health care cost increases in a different thread. Seems people are interested in hearing how the ACA is affected others.

For me, it's no biggie. Small increase. I'm happy to pay more to help others get better insurance or be able to better afford it (even if through subsidies, which I do not qualify for).