Yeah well they still need us in order to get to crystalreports.com so sorry but they're still dependant.
It's a shame, this thread has become anything but an actual discusson regarding the OP.
I don't expect that it will get back on track but if anyone cares to grow up a little bit here's my .02kb for the intended discussion.
IT responsibility and controls (or the lack thereof) regarding information security vary between company; so whether or not the "idea" of external hosting for the purpose of sharing Crystal Reports is a good thing is a relative discussion to each company.
Business Objects is an 800lb gorilla in the data mining industry so it doesn't so much concern me from a security and distribution standpoint that they offer the service. Our information policies and data controls prohibit use of external hosting of reports (we host our own distribution model) but for those companies who do not have good internal reporting infrastructure I do see where they might benefit.
What does concern me however is how that service is presented (free and easy to use with disregard for IT). That marketing ploy is an eye catcher and is appealing to any crystal reports staffer who is either frustrated with their company?s distribution method or just plain doesn?t want to comply with data controls (if any exist). There should be strong wording throughout the page that the use of such service should comply with the company?s internal policies regarding distribution of company information. As an internal control this sort of service should require C-level, owner or data owner signoff.
The marketing aspect of hosted CR distribution not only offers a service model that can generate revenue (for Business Objects) but it gives them data from which they can make marketing decisions. It?s actually a good strategy. An aside to cold calls and soliciting customer feedback they can now mine the data from aggregate hosting and get a pulse from which to drive their marketing. It also presents an opportunity to serve up a hosted version of their distribution model to those companies that cannot afford to bring the capability in-house.
-Need more hosting capabilities; buy the paid service.
-Want more control on how that distribution is served up; buy the server product and bring it in-house.
It?s a good marketing strategy for Business Objects; just poor taste in how they?re offering it. They have to do something though to stay a leader in the data mining market because compelling alternatives are leveling the playing field.
I don't expect that it will get back on track but if anyone cares to grow up a little bit here's my .02kb for the intended discussion.
IT responsibility and controls (or the lack thereof) regarding information security vary between company; so whether or not the "idea" of external hosting for the purpose of sharing Crystal Reports is a good thing is a relative discussion to each company.
Business Objects is an 800lb gorilla in the data mining industry so it doesn't so much concern me from a security and distribution standpoint that they offer the service. Our information policies and data controls prohibit use of external hosting of reports (we host our own distribution model) but for those companies who do not have good internal reporting infrastructure I do see where they might benefit.
What does concern me however is how that service is presented (free and easy to use with disregard for IT). That marketing ploy is an eye catcher and is appealing to any crystal reports staffer who is either frustrated with their company?s distribution method or just plain doesn?t want to comply with data controls (if any exist). There should be strong wording throughout the page that the use of such service should comply with the company?s internal policies regarding distribution of company information. As an internal control this sort of service should require C-level, owner or data owner signoff.
The marketing aspect of hosted CR distribution not only offers a service model that can generate revenue (for Business Objects) but it gives them data from which they can make marketing decisions. It?s actually a good strategy. An aside to cold calls and soliciting customer feedback they can now mine the data from aggregate hosting and get a pulse from which to drive their marketing. It also presents an opportunity to serve up a hosted version of their distribution model to those companies that cannot afford to bring the capability in-house.
-Need more hosting capabilities; buy the paid service.
-Want more control on how that distribution is served up; buy the server product and bring it in-house.
It?s a good marketing strategy for Business Objects; just poor taste in how they?re offering it. They have to do something though to stay a leader in the data mining market because compelling alternatives are leveling the playing field.
Ktulu
Diamond Member
- Dec 16, 2000
- 4,354
- 0
- 0
Doesn't bother me in the least. I can't really generalize users but I can only think of one user out of the entire campus that even remotely knows what they're doing with the data. Give 'em any damn tool you want I'll still be the one they'll be calling to write their reports.
No.
The work does not get done through magic.
Your request is apparently low priority compared to other work that the guy you would just go talk to for a few minutes should otherwise be doing.
- May 18, 2001
- 7,885
- 382
- 126
I don't think I could have said it better. It seems like they are advertising this service as a way to circumvent the IT department (and through extension, company policies and procedures).
They're just pushing an application service provider approach.
As far as IT, they're just as useless as every other department. Try to get finance, legal or HR to actually do anything.
As far as IT, they're just as useless as every other department. Try to get finance, legal or HR to actually do anything.
Specop 007
Diamond Member
- Jan 31, 2005
- 9,454
- 0
- 0
Nope, not at all.
Because i DID go talk to the guy, he looked at my requirements and said "Gimme some time".
I was expecting a day or 2, less then 3 hours I had everything I wanted and more.
Granted it was a pretty simple request to have a script pull data and compare multiple result files to look for differences, but it isnt the first time going straight to the watering hole has given exceptional results as opposed to calling the water company so to speak.
The guys who do the work are great, the process of budgets and PM's trying to manage just screws it all up.
I agree with you both. Some IT departments would be happy to not have the additional responsibility of dealing with new services.
Yeah, I'm thrilled to see the IT person when my boss has been on my ass for not doing work that could've been done if IT was actually prompt.
Fact of the matter is that I, as well as most people I work with, don't need IT. We are required to use IT. So when we're kept waiting for a task that would take us 5 minutes to do ourselves (were we given access to the proper resources), the IT person is an asshole for being so slow. But we're all nerds, I'm sure the business people aren't gonna be as capable as the engineers and the scientists.
IT consulting. You have to admit try getting finance or accounting to cut a purchase order or legal to approve a contract or statement of work. This is the core of what those departments exist for and yet it takes forever for simple tasks. IT is no different than any of the other support departments in this respect and people would gladly bypass these departments.
What's better? Waiting 3 weeks for a PO to be cut or using a credit card and having it delivered next day?
I don't like it either NN. I just finished seething in my office because one of the employees was ripping into our department because he can't learn a new system that was implemented at HIS supervisor's request. He had an audience as well, so now several people think that, and I wasn't even given the chance to reply.
Just remember that stupidity is everywhere, and marketing is always going to pander to the lowest common denominator.
Just remember that stupidity is everywhere, and marketing is always going to pander to the lowest common denominator.
I don't depend on me, either. I've got a stack of crap to do...and what am I doing?
Why are all IT people sarcastic assholes? I've noticed this through the years...
BoberFett
Lifer
- Oct 9, 1999
- 37,562
- 9
- 81
As someone in IT, I dream of that day. I wish IT was transparent. Too bad the rest of the company (any company, it happens at all of them) won't let it happen.
I could design a beautifully architected application that fulfilled every specification down the last detail, and without fail some nimrod from another department will come to me the day before release and tell me a requirement they forgot about. And of course it changes the scope of the project. But they can't wait to refactor, redevelop, and retest the whole system. It has to be done. In 5 minutes. Because they're meeting with a client. So ugly hacks and patches creep in to the system. And then since it was so easy to make that change, well the client wants this and we told them we can have it done tomorrow.
Half of the problems from IT are not IT problems at all, they're problems with other departments that get foisted onto and blamed on IT.
That's about the perfect example of a failed project caused by not setting expectations from the get go.
Deeko
Lifer
- Jun 16, 2000
- 30,213
- 12
- 81
Well, obviously. I don't think anyone at Crystal Reports is advocating bypassing company policy. The point they were getting across is that the company, along with management and IT's approval, can choose to use a solution that requires less in-house IT work, basically.
Scarpozzi
Lifer
- Jun 13, 2000
- 26,392
- 1,780
- 126
Probably written by a marketing guy and not an IT person. All companies have these idiots that don't think about who actually USES Crystal Reports. As a decision maker in my organization, I'll probably never go with them for anything because there are plenty of open source solutions that can save us money. CR has grown too much in the last 7-8 years if you ask me.
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