It is possible that Democrats will gain, not lose in November. Here's why/how.

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Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
19,060
3,965
136
My radical idea is allowing education debt be cleared with bankruptcy (also lend at prime rate plus a little). Schools sell shit degrees will need to understand they won’t get all their monies back.
Bankruptcy will only effect the lender, the schools will still be paid in full.
 

Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
19,060
3,965
136
Was your sentiment the same with the Trump tax cuts?

I agree with your point about getting useful degrees, but the cost of education in North America is out of hand. The gov't should be investing in education, which would ideally lower the costs for the average person. Unfortunately it is treated like a business which it shouldn't be, if you care about long term societal benefit.

And I'm sure you've heard this before but the people you vote for are the ones trying to push education into something only the wealthy can afford with charter schools and such.
Of course the cost of education is out of control, we've dumped trillions of dollars into the system, and somewhere along the line decided that an advanced degree was required to answer the phone or run a McDonalds. The poor help desk shmuck that tells you to "turn it off then back on" probably has a hundred thousand dollars of debt.
 
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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
77,912
36,091
136
Of course the cost of education is out of control, we've dumped trillions of dollars into the system, and somewhere along the line decided that an advanced degree was required to answer the phone or run a McDonalds. The poor help desk shmuck that tells you to "turn it off then back on" probably has a hundred thousand dollars of debt.
They...uhhhh... do not. People on both sides of the aisle have wildly wrong ideas about what people owe.

Median student loan debt for adults in America is $0.

Median student loan debt among only those Americans with outstanding student loan debt is about $20k.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
77,912
36,091
136
Bankruptcy will only effect the lender, the schools will still be paid in full.
Yes, student loans are a bad idea for this reason, among others. The person selling the product has no stake in the customer.

Student loans should be abolished and replaced with publicly funded schools in the way we used to do it before the boomers decided they weren't interested in funding higher education for their kids in the same way their parents funded it for them. They realized a great scam - they could take the free (or nearly free educations) their parents paid for and then make their kids pay their own way, thus being the one generation that got to skip paying for college.

We should make community college free or very low cost. We should also make public teaching universities (Cal state, etc.) free or nearly free, conditional on acceptance. Then let the rest of the universities do what they want. You can get someone to pay you $100k a year to attend? Good on you, but no publicly backed loans should pay for it.
 

MrSquished

Lifer
Jan 14, 2013
16,217
14,161
136
Yes, student loans are a bad idea for this reason, among others. The person selling the product has no stake in the customer.

Student loans should be abolished and replaced with publicly funded schools in the way we used to do it before the boomers decided they weren't interested in funding higher education for their kids in the same way their parents funded it for them. They realized a great scam - they could take the free (or nearly free educations) their parents paid for and then make their kids pay their own way, thus being the one generation that got to skip paying for college.

We should make community college free or very low cost. We should also make public teaching universities (Cal state, etc.) free or nearly free, conditional on acceptance. Then let the rest of the universities do what they want. You can get someone to pay you $100k a year to attend? Good on you, but no publicly backed loans should pay for it.
Conservative voting Boomers really fucked up this country
 

thilanliyan

Lifer
Jun 21, 2005
11,656
1,761
126
Conservative voting Boomers really fucked up this country
Maybe there should be a limit on voting passed 75 or something lol.
At that point, you've got everything out of the system you'll get and you're voting tendencies will generally screw over the younger people :p

The older people in their younger days should be voting for people who aren't FYGM dirt bags so that when they're older they might actually have some sort of social safety net (if they need it). :D
 
Feb 4, 2009
32,766
13,562
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Bankruptcy will only effect the lender, the schools will still be paid in full.
Fuck good point
I guess it still could work if a school is consistently churning out people who specialize in color theory and cheese paring then discover $100k in debt doesn’t work with what they are skilled in.
 

uclaLabrat

Diamond Member
Aug 2, 2007
5,319
2,357
136
Yes, student loans are a bad idea for this reason, among others. The person selling the product has no stake in the customer.

Student loans should be abolished and replaced with publicly funded schools in the way we used to do it before the boomers decided they weren't interested in funding higher education for their kids in the same way their parents funded it for them. They realized a great scam - they could take the free (or nearly free educations) their parents paid for and then make their kids pay their own way, thus being the one generation that got to skip paying for college.

We should make community college free or very low cost. We should also make public teaching universities (Cal state, etc.) free or nearly free, conditional on acceptance. Then let the rest of the universities do what they want. You can get someone to pay you $100k a year to attend? Good on you, but no publicly backed loans should pay for it.
Fuck that. Go one further. All public schools are state funded and tuition free. Just like germany/finland. Make the rich kids earn it on merit. Im tempted to advocate private schools be forced into it too but i doubt that would fly.
 

Maxima1

Diamond Member
Jan 15, 2013
3,475
741
146
Was your sentiment the same with the Trump tax cuts?

I agree with your point about getting useful degrees, but the cost of education in North America is out of hand. The gov't should be investing in education, which would ideally lower the costs for the average person. Unfortunately it is treated like a business which it shouldn't be, if you care about long term societal benefit.

And I'm sure you've heard this before but the people you vote for are the ones trying to push education into something only the wealthy can afford with charter schools and such.
It's also the big opportunity costs for many people. The first two years btw for most degrees is virtually complete duplication of high school content if you didn't graduate with just the bare minimum requirements, and they somehow think it makes sense to add generally 9 units for upper division gen ed.

Even Robert Reich came around to seeing as a fail.


Here's a great example of the opportunity cost craziness.


New requirements 2023-2024: Effective Jan. 1, 2024, the Commission on Dietetic Registration (CDR) will require a minimum of a master’s degree in addition to supervised practice from an Accreditation Council for Education in Nutrition and Dietetics (ACEND)-accredited program to be eligible to take the registration examination to become a registered dietitian nutritionist (RDN).
Applicants participating in the spring 2023 dietetic internship match for UC San Diego Health will be required to have completed a minimum of a master’s degree before the start of the internship to be eligible for admission.

So BS + MS + 1-year internship just to be a registered dietitian. The military lets you do nutrition and better compensation trajectory with just about a month of technical training....
 

MrSquished

Lifer
Jan 14, 2013
16,217
14,161
136
It's also the big opportunity costs for many people. The first two years btw for most degrees is virtually complete duplication of high school content if you didn't graduate with just the bare minimum requirements, and they somehow think it makes sense to add generally 9 units for upper division gen ed.

Even Robert Reich came around to seeing as a fail.


Here's a great example of the opportunity cost craziness.


New requirements 2023-2024: Effective Jan. 1, 2024, the Commission on Dietetic Registration (CDR) will require a minimum of a master’s degree in addition to supervised practice from an Accreditation Council for Education in Nutrition and Dietetics (ACEND)-accredited program to be eligible to take the registration examination to become a registered dietitian nutritionist (RDN).
Applicants participating in the spring 2023 dietetic internship match for UC San Diego Health will be required to have completed a minimum of a master’s degree before the start of the internship to be eligible for admission.

So BS + MS + 1-year internship just to be a registered dietitian. The military lets you do nutrition and better compensation trajectory with just about a month of technical training....
Sure that is excessive, but about a month of technical training is also very excessive, in the other direction, as in not even close vs way too much.
 
Feb 4, 2009
32,766
13,562
136
It's also the big opportunity costs for many people. The first two years btw for most degrees is virtually complete duplication of high school content if you didn't graduate with just the bare minimum requirements, and they somehow think it makes sense to add generally 9 units for upper division gen ed.

Even Robert Reich came around to seeing as a fail.


Here's a great example of the opportunity cost craziness.


New requirements 2023-2024: Effective Jan. 1, 2024, the Commission on Dietetic Registration (CDR) will require a minimum of a master’s degree in addition to supervised practice from an Accreditation Council for Education in Nutrition and Dietetics (ACEND)-accredited program to be eligible to take the registration examination to become a registered dietitian nutritionist (RDN).
Applicants participating in the spring 2023 dietetic internship match for UC San Diego Health will be required to have completed a minimum of a master’s degree before the start of the internship to be eligible for admission.

So BS + MS + 1-year internship just to be a registered dietitian. The military lets you do nutrition and better compensation trajectory with just about a month of technical training....
This, when I was in telecom and admittedly this was during the employment meltdown. They wanted MBA’s to take store manager jobs. I kept thinking some dude who has a MASTERS in Business Admin is going to take a job paying $42-58-ish thousand and be happy with it? That suggested requirement is ridiculous. Takes two years to become good at it, they’ll leave the instant a better opportunity arrives.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
31,556
20,210
136
I see no evidence of this in issue polls. What's your basis for it?
One of the proposed Voting Rights bills ends partisan gerrymandering

A win win. Not only for the disenfranchised voter but puts real representation back on the table.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
31,556
20,210
136
I really think that Herschel Walker could be the worst senate candidate ever in a general election. Dude has scrambled eggs for brains. And that he's as close as he is in the polls says something really awful about where our country is.
Worse then Roy Moore?
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
31,556
20,210
136
You mean he actually pulled the trigger on a live round?



Its the power engine taking on a life of its own and why you need to get big money out of politics... like yesterday. And Murdoch.
I smell the next Warnock ad

Crazy and not so pro life. I think his ex wife said he physically attacked her

Not so impossible since a real pedo almost got elected in Alabama
 
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MrSquished

Lifer
Jan 14, 2013
16,217
14,161
136
I smell the next Warnock ad

Crazy and not so pro life. I think his ex wife said he physically attacked her

Not so impossible since a real pedo almost got elected in Alabama
He recently said how can climate change be real, look at all the trees. Out of many things. Not to mention him staying how important it is for fathers to stay in kids lives, while he had two kids that he hid as a not very present father.

The fact that so many Republicans would and will vote for him just shows that half of those people are just goners, at best
 

thilanliyan

Lifer
Jun 21, 2005
11,656
1,761
126
He recently said how can climate change be real, look at all the trees. Out of many things. Not to mention him staying how important it is for fathers to stay in kids lives, while he had two kids that he hid as a not very present father.

The fact that so many Republicans would and will vote for him just shows that half of those people are just goners, at best
I don't think they really care who the candidate is. They've been programmed to vote R regardless of how much a moral cesspool he/she is. Anything's better than a Dem apparently.
 

JEDI

Lifer
Sep 25, 2001
28,645
2,041
126
McConnell says there's a "50-50" chance Republicans take control of the Senate

6 months ago, it was lean repubs taking the Senate.

So If read in-between the lines, the turtle is just trying to keep up Repub morale and actually means Dems will keep Senate in 2022 elections.

Because supreme Court in overturning roe v Wade?

If so, Wished that effect carried over to the House
 
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Pens1566

Diamond Member
Oct 11, 2005
9,203
3,613
136
Worse then Roy Moore?
Moderately tough call, but yes. Worse than Roy Moore. Difference being he was an "alleged" pedophile. He could at least construct semi-coherent sentences, and had some reasonable background as a politician/candidate. Walker can't even get over that low of a bar.
 

K1052

Lifer
Aug 21, 2003
41,951
23,344
136
Are we thinking the R should have won because the district was “only” 1.5pts pro D? Or am I misunderstanding?
[/QUOTE
Molinaro was a good candidate for the Rs here. Well known and well funded. The district only went to Biden by 1.5% and he couldn't seal the deal in what is conventionally thought to be a favorable electoral environment. Polling had him consistently ahead also. So basically everything supposedly running in his favor.

This is just another signpost on the road to the midterms but the destination really isn't looking like red wave.
 

Paratus

Lifer
Jun 4, 2004
15,825
11,317
146
Molinaro was a good candidate for the Rs here. Well known and well funded. The district only went to Biden by 1.5% and he couldn't seal the deal in what is conventionally thought to be a favorable electoral environment. Polling had him consistently ahead also. So basically everything supposedly running in his favor.

This is just another signpost on the road to the midterms but the destination really isn't looking like red wave.
That’s good because the Dems have 78 to 22% (according to 538) hill to climb to retain control of the house.

I so want to retain the house and pickup two in the senate.
 
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K1052

Lifer
Aug 21, 2003
41,951
23,344
136
That’s good because the Dems have 78 to 22% (according to 538) hill to climb to retain control of the house.

I so want to retain the house and pickup two in the senate.
My impression so far is that Dobbs (and all the resulting conservative insanity) is going to have a rather large political price tag attached to it. One the GOP assumed they'd never have to pay if they flipped SCOTUS enough to do their work instead.
 

Pens1566

Diamond Member
Oct 11, 2005
9,203
3,613
136
That’s good because the Dems have 78 to 22% (according to 538) hill to climb to retain control of the house.

I so want to retain the house and pickup two in the senate.
538 looks to be trailing the trend here, which is to be expected. There have been real election results that are a better indicator than polls and his modeling shit.
 

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