Actually what you said was, if you deal with the Palestinian leadership you have to deal with terrorists.Originally posted by: Fencer128
Of course I don't think it's a game! I first tried to say that there is no doubt that there are those within the Palestinian leadership with some sort of blood on their hands - and furthermore that you wouldn't have to look very far to see many with links, however tenuous, to darker elements. IMHO you'd have to take a very narrow view to think my comments otherwise.You think it is all a game?
I almost didn't bother to grace that comment with a reply. You must have much more information on what exactly went on than me if you see only one side in the Shabra dealings and have no problem with the way Israel conducts it's business with the Palestinians. I didn't directly accuse the Israeli's of indiscriminantly killing civilians - your words not mine - if anything I'd say they were particularly good at inadvertantly killing civilians. I almost forgot, Mossad couldn't possibly have any shady dealings in the way I implied for other parties... part of their remit is assasination (and that goes wrong) and I guess given the impeccable record of the participants in this conflict nothing untoward could ever have been perpertrated by them. No evidence but I'll go with my gut instinct on that one.[/quote]Now can you explain how the Mossad and Israeli leadership is directly linked to indiscrimanate killing of civilians.
If you are going to bring up Shabra again please be advised that Sharon was found indirectly responsible for that action for failing to foresee what the Phalangists would do. I just didn't want you to waste your time.
Perhaps you shouldn't have graced it with a reply, at least not the one you made. Oh well, here goes.
Yes, it is obvious that I have more information on the subject than you. I like how you try to connect Shabra(Christian Phalangists) with Israel and imply that is the normal method of dealing with all Palestinians. You are clever in your innuendo, I'll give you that.
No, you didn't directly accuse the Israelis of indiscriminate killing, you are more subtle than that in your accusations. I see the only evidence you have on the Mossad is over 20 years old and dealt with retribution for the massacre at the Munich games. I watched that live on TV, it wasn't a pretty sight when the helicopter exploded and killed those people because of the Palestinian terrorists.
EDIT: Nearly forgot, from the BBC archives:
Ask yourself why he failed to act and why he had to resign?From 16 to 18 September, the Phalangists - who were allied to Israel - killed hundreds of Palestinians in the Sabra and Shatila refugee camps as they were encircled by Israeli troops in one of the worst atrocities of nearly a century of conflict in the Middle East. Mr Sharon resigned from his post as defence minister after a 1983 Israeli inquiry concluded that he had failed to act to prevent the massacre.
Why would he act if he did not know what was going on? You circled yourself into that one Andy. He had to resign because he was the overall military authority of the region. Like the captain of a ship it was his responsibility even if he was not aware of it. He didn't foresee how upset the Phalangists were at the Palestinians for when the Palestinians murdered the Phalangist presidential candidate.
You have yet to show any proof that the Israelis knew what was happening. I know the stories are out there. There are people with reasons to invent them. There has never been any reputiable proof that Sharon knew or condoned what happened at Shabra despite your little attempts in insinuate otherwise.Did he or his men kill them themselves - No, is he partially responsible for their deaths - Yes (read "encircled by Israeli troops"). I guess they just didn't know the massacre was occuring, it only lasted for 3 days.