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Is the U.S. Headed Toward Bankruptcy?

D

dmcowen674

No Lifer
8-19-2012

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/08/is-the-u-s-headed-toward-bankruptcy/

Is the U.S. Headed Toward Bankruptcy?



Grover Norquist – Founder and President, Americans for Tax Reform


I’m very optimistic, because for the first time one of the parties actually has a plan that will reform entitlements and give us a pro-growth economic policy. And that hasn’t been true before. We don’t have two parties with that, but we have one.


If Romney’s elected along with a Republican House and Senate, then you can do something like the Romney and Ryan proposals on tax reform and spending reform and we do a u-turn way from the road to serfdom.


If the Democrats have the Senate or the presidency, you end up with higher taxes


There’s a decision and people will decide in November, you want bigger government and higher taxes or smaller government and lower taxes? I’m confident the American people will choose wisely.
 
The defacto ruler of the conservative movement has spoken. I'm sure he called frank luntz and asked if he focus group agrees.
 
Look no further than Europe to see what happens when you implement austerity (i.e. cutting spending, or voting in Repubs) during a recession. Why do you people keep pushing this stupidity when we have walking proof across the pond?
 
Given that fact that government spending will not be cut. what percentage of taxpayers have to have their percentage increased in order have a measurable impact on the deficit?

Some here like to say, soak the rich.

Ok - what is the percentage that you want to set the tax rate to. What will be the resulting numbers; What will be the impact.

Now, after you see the impact; what do you go after next.
Unearned income rates. make those progressive also?

Not a big enough dent in the budget - take a look at the 10%s of wealth.
Not there yet; look at the 15% instead.

It is always the person above you that has to pick up the load - never you.
How many of you are volunteering to pay 40% of your income? Why not? Adjust your lifestyle - there are plenty of others that survive on less that you.
 
Pr0d1gy said:
Look no further than Europe to see what happens when you implement austerity (i.e. cutting spending, or voting in Repubs) during a recession. Why do you people keep pushing this stupidity when we have walking proof across the pond?
Click to expand...

No, look no further than probably your own state. If not than the state next to you. States HAVE to have austerity as they can't print or borrow their way out of trouble like the Fed can. A lot of states have cut 10% or more of their workforce. But keep on using completely different economies to compare to rather than your own back yard. It works good for your arguement.
 
Matt1970 said:
No, look no further than probably your own state. If not than the state next to you. States HAVE to have austerity as they can't print or borrow their way out of trouble like the Fed can. A lot of states have cut 10% or more of their workforce. But keep on using completely different economies to compare to rather than your own back yard. It works good for your arguement.
Click to expand...

Many states, like Tennessee, have balanced budget amendments. Tennessee will cut government services instead of running a budget deficit. It hurts sometimes... but it works.

Tennessee had 8 years of a democratic governor who increased the state's budget at twice the rate of inflation which inthe last couple of years has led to steeper than normally needed cuts. Tennessee though is on track to have a budget surplus and put money back into the state's rainy day fund which is used for budget shortfalls.
 
EagleKeeper said:
Ok - what is the percentage that you want to set the tax rate to. What will be the resulting numbers; What will be the impact. Now, after you see the impact; what do you go after next. Unearned income rates. make those progressive also?
Click to expand...
Good question, although higher income people will just not pay when the top marginal rate makes it more expensive for them to pay. Liberals would look smarter if they understood that. I don't care if the Democrats raise the top marginal personal income tax rate all they want, because it won't result in the govt getting more revenue.
 
The two party system has seem to have hit snag.
If bankruptcy is in our future, like with the bailout we won't know until
congress is crying in our soup.
We'd be lucky to get a 3 day notice.
 
Matt1970 said:
No, look no further than probably your own state. If not than the state next to you. States HAVE to have austerity as they can't print or borrow their way out of trouble like the Fed can. A lot of states have cut 10% or more of their workforce. But keep on using completely different economies to compare to rather than your own back yard. It works good for your arguement.
Click to expand...

Your problem is you still think this country is actually using some sort of economic model to run things, and that we could afford to have 10+% of our government workforce to lose their jobs right now. Do you know what kind of a hit that would put on the country's purchasing power as a whole? I don't have an argument, I just don't want my kids growing up in the same situation my grandparents did. Our best bet for that is for the government to stabilize the country since the private sector has proven it is an enemy to this country.
 
dmcowen674 said:
8-19-2012

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/08/is-the-u-s-headed-toward-bankruptcy/

Is the U.S. Headed Toward Bankruptcy?



Grover Norquist – Founder and President, Americans for Tax Reform


I’m very optimistic, because for the first time one of the parties actually has a plan that will reform entitlements and give us a pro-growth economic policy. And that hasn’t been true before. We don’t have two parties with that, but we have one.


If Romney’s elected along with a Republican House and Senate, then you can do something like the Romney and Ryan proposals on tax reform and spending reform and we do a u-turn way from the road to serfdom.


If the Democrats have the Senate or the presidency, you end up with higher taxes


There’s a decision and people will decide in November, you want bigger government and higher taxes or smaller government and lower taxes? I’m confident the American people will choose wisely.
Click to expand...


What if I want bigger and lower taxes? And a bigger yet more condense/smaller government?
 
Pr0d1gy said:
Your problem is you still think this country is actually using some sort of economic model to run things, and that we could afford to have 10+% of our government workforce to lose their jobs right now. Do you know what kind of a hit that would put on the country's purchasing power as a whole? I don't have an argument, I just don't want my kids growing up in the same situation my grandparents did. Our best bet for that is for the government to stabilize the country since the private sector has proven it is an enemy to this country.
Click to expand...

Do you take yourself seriously?
 
Matt1970 said:
Do you take yourself seriously?
Click to expand...

You don't take that seriously? Do you think the banks and wall street are not part of the private sector? Do you think that so few employers offering affordable health insurance isn't an attack on the working class of this country? Do you know how many people have not had a raise in years? After the 2008 crash I don't see how anyone could not see the private sector as an enemy of this country. Sure, the government is in bed with them but it is the government that has to clean up the mess after it happens, and they see that now. The private sector has had nothing to dissuade them from doing this all over again.

Why do you think we need Obamacare now? Do you think almost no non-white collar employers offered insurance a couple or few decades ago? Do you think they actually paid retail salespeople mimimum wage back in the 80's and 90's? Do you think every retail store was turning into Wal Mart back then? You may not be affected by this stuff up in your ivory tower but rest assured that for every one of you there is 5 of those people doing those types of jobs.
 
I think the fact that Dave is posting the way he is right now, is that the problem transcends party labels and we need to consider which team is going to do the hard but required things that have to be done and which team plans to keep on doing what they have been doing, over and over again for the same result.

Which team is sane and which is insane? It really is as simple as that.

This nonsense about coming full circle, is just that.

Obama, Biden, Pelosi, Reid had their chance to show us what they would do and they did just that. Has it cost the country? Indisputably. Do we need to keep banging our heads against a wall to know it hurts?

Hell, no!

That is what elections are for - Judgement Day.
 
Pr0d1gy said:
Your problem is you still think this country is actually using some sort of economic model to run things, and that we could afford to have 10+% of our government workforce to lose their jobs right now. Do you know what kind of a hit that would put on the country's purchasing power as a whole? I don't have an argument, I just don't want my kids growing up in the same situation my grandparents did. Our best bet for that is for the government to stabilize the country since the private sector has proven it is an enemy to this country.
Click to expand...

Wha?

Small businesses in American employ nearly half of everyone in the private sector. I know a lot of small business owners. I never met one that is an enemy to this country. Well maybe the one who pimps beer and lottery tickets out of his smelly store... but other that that... none.

Not all large corporations are evil either.

Would you rather we all be like Cuba and earn $20 a month working for the government?
 
Pr0d1gy said:
You don't take that seriously? Do you think the banks and wall street are not part of the private sector? Do you think that so few employers offering affordable health insurance isn't an attack on the working class of this country? Do you know how many people have not had a raise in years? After the 2008 crash I don't see how anyone could not see the private sector as an enemy of this country. Sure, the government is in bed with them but it is the government that has to clean up the mess after it happens, and they see that now. The private sector has had nothing to dissuade them from doing this all over again.

Why do you think we need Obamacare now? Do you think almost no non-white collar employers offered insurance a couple or few decades ago? Do you think they actually paid retail salespeople mimimum wage back in the 80's and 90's? Do you think every retail store was turning into Wal Mart back then? You may not be affected by this stuff up in your ivory tower but rest assured that for every one of you there is 5 of those people doing those types of jobs.
Click to expand...

When you see over 90% of our economy as the enemy, you have a problem and will never be taken seriously.
 
rudder said:
Not all large corporations are evil either.

Would you rather we all be like Cuba and earn $20 a month working for the government?
Click to expand...


Obviously the remarks were pointed at the large corporations which employ these methods as standard practice. Small business does not employ most of America, but they aren't exactly without their anti-America bullshit either (hiring of illegals for cheap labor & such).

Matt, I really don't care if you take me seriously because the truth is right in front of your face whether you choose to accept it or not.
 
Pr0d1gy said:
Obviously the remarks were pointed at the large corporations which employ these methods as standard practice. Small business does not employ most of America, but they aren't exactly without their anti-America bullshit either (hiring of illegals for cheap labor & such).

Matt, I really don't care if you take me seriously because the truth is right in front of your face whether you choose to accept it or not.
Click to expand...

You can't even get the truth right about who employs more people in America. Small business employs over 50% of the workforce. Seeing as how you are probably bad at math let me put that into terms you can understand. Small businesses employ more than large corporations, the government, and self-employment combined. The truth came a-knockin a long time ago and you refused to answer.
 
Matt1970 said:
You can't even get the truth right about who employs more people in America. Small business employs over 50% of the workforce. Seeing as how you are probably bad at math let me put that into terms you can understand. Small businesses employ more than large corporations, the government, and self-employment combined. The truth came a-knockin a long time ago and you refused to answer.
Click to expand...

Yes, but who does small business emulate and try to compete with? You keep trying to make this discussion about who hires what and what their employer's classification is, but refuse to accept the truth of my original point and instead choose to obfuscate with miniscule details that have little to do with the point. I said the private sector because the little guys are almost as guilty as the big guys. There would be less of a problem here if contractors hired American workers instead of illegals for a third of the wages. There would also be less of a problem if corporate jobs weren't such horrible trash. And on and on and on....
 
Pr0d1gy said:
Yes, but who does small business emulate and try to compete with? You keep trying to make this discussion about who hires what and what their employer's classification is, but refuse to accept the truth of my original point and instead choose to obfuscate with miniscule details that have little to do with the point. I said the private sector because the little guys are almost as guilty as the big guys. There would be less of a problem here if contractors hired American workers instead of illegals for a third of the wages. There would also be less of a problem if corporate jobs weren't such horrible trash. And on and on and on....
Click to expand...

I haven't tried top make this discussion about anything. I am just correcting your errors and pointiing out your hatred of everything that isn't government. And seeing as how you hate all Republicans and probably a good deal of Democrats too, thyere isn't much you don't hate.
 
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