Is the tide of rage against IAPs and microtransactions hitting critical mass?

[Nintendesert]

That's funny, because Forza 1, without microtransactions, still required actually playing the game to get the next car. And so did GT. Have you played Forza 5? Because I have. The microtransactions are neither forced nor required. But, I know you read some faux journalist who blogged about it while never had played the game, so you understand the issue.

I'm not just talking about this Forza necessarily, it can be the next one or the next one. It can be any game that no longer designs gameplay for the sake of gameplay.

Gameplay is now driven by the need to feed the microtransaction, gameplay has been retarded and manipulated to no longer be about gaming but about finances. It's a fundamental shift in the way game design is happening and it's much more prevalent in the tablet/smartphone arena of gaming.

It's only now starting to seep into PC gaming and now Console gaming. That's the danger here. Nobody wants to see the industry become the mobile gaming one with a bunch of crapware.

 

[futurefields]

I'm not just talking about this Forza necessarily, it can be the next one or the next one. It can be any game that no longer designs gameplay for the sake of gameplay.

Gameplay is now driven by the need to feed the microtransaction, gameplay has been retarded and manipulated to no longer be about gaming but about finances. It's a fundamental shift in the way game design is happening and it's much more prevalent in the tablet/smartphone arena of gaming.

It's only now starting to seep into PC gaming and now Console gaming. That's the danger here. Nobody wants to see the industry become the mobile gaming one with a bunch of crapware.

+1

 

[smackababy]

Yes, but the unlock of the next car was carefully timed to be a fun challenge, with the slow drip of satisfaction and reward keeping you playing. But that model has entirely changed in a modern microtransaction fuelled game. The new strategy is to slow the rate of progress to an irritating crawl, annoying the gamer enough to get them to fork out cash to progress.

If you completely ignore the microtransactions, Forza 5 is exactly that. I would know, I've done it. That doesn't mean the game doesn't have flaws; the lack of tracks is a good one to point out. But, that has little to do with microtransactions and more to do with them having to put out a game in a limited time period and having to rescan all the tracks.

A much better example would be a game like LoL. Sure, you COULD unlock every hero free, but you'd have to play a billion hours.

 

[smackababy]

It's only now starting to seep into PC gaming and now Console gaming. That's the danger here. Nobody wants to see the industry become the mobile gaming one with a bunch of crapware.

And what are we to do about it to stop it? Not buy the microtransactions, you say? That is exactly what ignoring them does.

This thread isn't about that, it is about us all having a circle jerk over how superior we are for not buying microtransactions and how those that ignore it (and still don't buy them) are the bad guys. And about whining it continues to happen because some people (none that have posted in this thread as far as I can tell) don't mind giving their money rather than their time; because, some people have more money than time.

It is also about getting upset when someone calls you a hypernerd.

 

[cmdrdredd]

The tide of rage? You mean the tide of hypernerd's crying because they'd rather spend their money on Warhammer figurines than in app purchases? Sure, I guess.

Or, do you mean the tide of people happy to spend their money on it? Because, that sure is surging forward at an astonishing pace.

Honestly, microtransactions effect me zero. I don't buy them. Simple as that. There are plenty of games that don't offer them, go play those.

Yep. Forza allows you to buy money. I don't buy them. NBA 2k14 allows you to buy VC (virtual currency) which is used to upgrade your created player and card packs for your fantasy team etc. I don't buy them. There is always the option of playing through the game and earning what you want.

The only games that force it are mobile games that suck anyway. "You ran out of energy. You need to wait 24hours to get more or you can pay $5 now to get another refill."

 

[Aikouka]

So, I saw that Sonic All-Star Racing Transformed was on sale for iOS yesterday ($1.99), and since it's a good game, I figured that I'd buy it. Excluding the fact that it refuses to run on my iPad 4, everything was looking good... until I saw a little cart button at the top of the screen. "What's this for?" I look through the options, and I see an in-app purchase for $10 that makes all future races free. "Wait... what?" I go and check out the races to see that it costs rings to enter, and you have to do challenges to help replenish your rings. What the fudgesicles!?

I know... I know... it's an iOS game. I shouldn't be surprised that they attempt to extort you in any way possible, but I expected better from SEGA. I guess I should've known something was afoot when I didn't hear the SAY-GUH at the beginning of the game. Thankfully, Sony gave away the game for free on the Vita as part of PlayStation Plus, so I at least have a decent mobile copy. :\

 

[cmdrdredd]

Yes they do affect you, when a game like Forza makes unlocking cars extremely time consuming compared to previous version of the game so they can sell time-dilation microtransactions when you get frustrated with needing 550000 races to get the next car it affects you.

It's changing the way progression in games happens. It's extending it out in order to simply compel people to buy the next unlock. Even a hypertool should be able to see that.

I got all the cars I wanted in 3 days of play time. Within two weeks I had all the upgrades I wanted for those cars.

Yes, but the unlock of the next car was carefully timed to be a fun challenge, with the slow drip of satisfaction and reward keeping you playing. But that model has entirely changed in a modern microtransaction fuelled game. The new strategy is to slow the rate of progress to an irritating crawl, annoying the gamer enough to get them to fork out cash to progress.

No...it's the same exact concept. You race, you get money for each race, when you turn off some assists you get more money, when you learn to drive good and place better you get more money, when you change the difficulty to something harder when you are better at the game you earn more money. It's easier in Forza 5 to get lots of money because when you rank up you get money, when your drivatar races you get free moneyThe game throws money at you.

The idea that because you can now just buy the money to get cars turns it into forced purchases is ridiculous. The idea behind a racing game is to race and keep racing. It always has been. If you don't race, you don't get money to upgrade and buy what you want.

 

[master_shake_]

i've never paid money in a game, i will never pay money in a game.

if all games turn in to pay2win im tossing my computers in the street.

 

[cmdrdredd]

i've never paid money in a game, i will never pay money in a game.

if all games are pay2win im tossing my computers in the street.

Exactly. If you like the game play it normally and don't give them extra money. If you don't wanna play the game then just don't. It's really the only options available to people who don't want to pay real money for virtual stuff.


This all started way before you probably would think. Double Dragon 3 in the arcade had in game item shops that cost you real quarters. Power up moves were a dollar if 1 credit = $.25, weapons cost a quarter, lives a quarter each etc, weapons cost one quarter. This was back in 1990

 

[master_shake_]

Exactly. If you like the game play it normally and don't give them extra money. If you don't wanna play the game then just don't. It's really the only options available to people who don't want to pay real money for virtual stuff.


This all started way before you probably would think. Double Dragon 3 in the arcade had in game item shops that cost you real quarters. Power up moves were a dollar if 1 credit = $.25, weapons cost a quarter, lives a quarter each etc, weapons cost one quarter. This was back in 1990

double dragon 3 was shit anyway worst of the original 3

 

[artemicion]

One thing the gullible crowd never gets (and you can forget trying to make them understand) is that the little annoying things that you ignore as "doesn't affect you" turn into great big pains in the ass later.

No one seems to remember the Nazis apparently.



*patiently waits for the "software is nothing like Nazis" argument*

So you're saying that we should all vociferously protest against IAP's instead of silently ignoring them because it is a menace that needs to be wiped from the face of the earth irrespective of the fact that there exist an insular demographic of casual gamers who are OK with IAP's and who buy IAP's?

It sounds like you're the facist.

 

[ImpulsE69]

So you're saying that we should all vociferously protest against IAP's instead of silently ignoring them because it is a menace that needs to be wiped from the face of the earth irrespective of the fact that there exist an insular demographic of casual gamers who are OK with IAP's and who buy IAP's?

It sounds like you're the facist.

It's called history. Taking a blind "it doesn't affect me eye" to things is why the world is in the state it is today. Do you think companies (not devs...quit trying to intermingle them) give a rats hiney about you or your beloved games? They care about profits. That's all. It's very clear from some of the discussion (and others we've had) that there are many people here who never look beyond their own immediate satisfaction. There is nothing fascist about what I'm saying, it's simple common sense. It's looking to the future and seeing how bleak it looks unless someone stands up to it. If you(collectively) don't get it, you just won't and there's no point arguing on a forum about it because you are part of the problem. All that being said, ignoring may indeed be fine, but being vocal tends to have much more impact. Silence is generally considered consent.

Of course while I have no issues with capitalism itself, I absolutely hate endless greed, so maybe that does make me fascist by today's standards. Sorry, I have some morals.

 

[Skel]

Having gone through this subject a few times I still don't see the issue. While personally I can't see myself ever paying to proceed (outside of some DLC level) in a game, I also can't see myself feeling so self important that it should be denied to the person who would. Some people would rather burn through their video game and are more than willing to pay to bypass grinding that would normally have to happen. While I personally wouldn't do that, it's no more wrong than my OCD tendency of attempting to find every stupid chest in a level. In many ways it's akin to telling someone they're playing a game wrong just because they don't use the same class as you.

If and when a game comes out that requires a fee to play it, I won't be among it's players. I don't do MMOs because I don't think subscription based games are for me. More power to the people that love them, and I'm glad they can find happiness with it. If games ever get to the point where ALL of them require a fee, I'll move on with my life. As much as I enjoy playing video games, and I do waste way too many hours with them, I don't twist my identity with them. I can and will find something else to do.

If a video games ever becomes a World power akin to the Nazis, I will truly weep for humanity because again.. it's just a fucking video game.

 

[Red Storm]

I think the point is if you don't voice your opinion... then years down the road when every game is riddled with pay to win walls you can't really complain because it didn't matter to you then, it shouldn't matter to you now. The people who voice their concerns are not always worried about the game in question, they're worried about this practice seeping into and changing the games they love to play.

 

[artemicion]

It's called history. Taking a blind "it doesn't affect me eye" to things is why the world is in the state it is today. Do you think companies (not devs...quit trying to intermingle them) give a rats hiney about you or your beloved games? They care about profits. That's all. It's very clear from some of the discussion (and others we've had) that there are many people here who never look beyond their own immediate satisfaction. There is nothing fascist about what I'm saying, it's simple common sense. It's looking to the future and seeing how bleak it looks unless someone stands up to it. If you(collectively) don't get it, you just won't and there's no point arguing on a forum about it because you are part of the problem. All that being said, ignoring may indeed be fine, but being vocal tends to have much more impact. Silence is generally considered consent.

Of course while I have no issues with capitalism itself, I absolutely hate endless greed, so maybe that does make me fascist by today's standards. Sorry, I have some morals.

Horseshit.

1) Stop worrying, the free market is not going to ignore you. There's always going to be a significant number of people who won't buy into IAP's and there's always going to be game devs who will to cater their games toward this demographic. We don't need to "kill off" IAP's to ensure that we are being catered to.

2) You are basically saying that the proper thing to do is to stand up devs who make IAP games and consumers who buy into IAP games and tell them what they are doing is not OK. Forcibly suppressing things that you happen to disagree with is kind of what facism is all about. Sorry, there's nothing inherently immoral about offering IAP games or buying into IAP games, so the non-facist thing to do would to just let those people be and keep your nose out of their business. You are not Winston Churchill. You are not fighting against some grave evil that needs to be eradicated. You are making a big issue over something that most rational people view as relatively inconsequential.

You don't like IAP's? Fine, I'm not a fan of them either. But to suggest that I'm some selfish, short sighted person unable to see the big picture and join forces and act to prevent some grave evil is just beyond stupid.

 

[smackababy]

I think the point is if you don't voice your opinion... then years down the road when every game is riddled with pay to win walls you can't really complain because it didn't matter to you then, it shouldn't matter to you now. The people who voice their concerns are not always worried about the game in question, they're worried about this practice seeping into and changing the games they love to play.

If this is such a "concern" then not participating in IAP is the best thing you can do, which ignoring it covers.

Making continuous threads to show how much you dislike it is not worth the time. Companies don't give a crap about what you posted on youtube and what you say on some forum. They care about whether or not you (and anyone else) buys the content. And currently, IAP is making a ton of money. More people are willing to buy it than those willing to not partake, thus developers are catering to that market.

When all games start requiring this, those that wish to not partake will stop playing games. Simple as that.

 

[BoberFett]

Ignore hypershills like smackababy.

 

[BoberFett]

I think the point is if you don't voice your opinion... then years down the road when every game is riddled with pay to win walls you can't really complain because it didn't matter to you then, it shouldn't matter to you now. The people who voice their concerns are not always worried about the game in question, they're worried about this practice seeping into and changing the games they love to play.

That's the problem. This thread degenerated into people being called "hypernerds" (just the term makes me want to bitchslap the idiot that used it) because others dared voice their opinion.

 

[Dumac]

Hypershills be shilling.

IAP, microtransactions, and DLC is mostly a plague on the industry that has caused video game quality to decline.

'Just ignore them' isn't a valid response, as they negatively impact the games they are.

 

[smackababy]

Ignore hypershills like smackababy.

What exactly am I shilling? I am advocating not buying DLC or games with IAP, if that is what you want. I am also advocating not being a whiny punk about it and pretending you're superior because you make threads about companies you hate.

Obviously, I'm a shill...

Hypershills be shilling.

IAP, microtransactions, and DLC is mostly a plague on the industry that has caused video game quality to decline.

'Just ignore them' isn't a valid response, as they negatively impact the games they are.

So, please do give us your grand advice at what the alternative to ignoring them is? Posting countless threads about them on a forum no one with any decision making ability in the gaming industry is in? Buying all the games and burning the copies? Crying about being called a hypernerd for followign youtube channels dedicated to crying about video games they don't like?

If not buying the product isn't enough, please do enlighten us as to what else we can do.

 

[ImpulsE69]

I think the point is if you don't voice your opinion... then years down the road when every game is riddled with pay to win walls you can't really complain because it didn't matter to you then, it shouldn't matter to you now. The people who voice their concerns are not always worried about the game in question, they're worried about this practice seeping into and changing the games they love to play.

^^ this.

 

[cmdrdredd]

Hypershills be shilling.

IAP, microtransactions, and DLC is mostly a plague on the industry that has caused video game quality to decline.

'Just ignore them' isn't a valid response, as they negatively impact the games they are.

BS...I have more fun with games now than ever and find the storytelling to be multiple times better than it ever has been. Quality has gone UP not down.

 

[Zorander]

While I don't myself buy IAPs (nor plan to do so in the foreseeable future), I hope they go away or at least become less prevalent than currently.

In many cases, they are simply 'pay-to-cheat' buttons but in some really bad cases (DK mobile comes to mind), they are a 'forced' necessity in order to make the game playable/progress. Using XCom EU/EW as an example, how would you like it if your soldiers can only inflict 1 damage on aliens and you have to pay in order to 'unlock their weapon potential'? Neither do I want to have to pay real-money for upper tier spells in TES (and which conveniently are needed in order to win latter battles). The day I see this happen is the day true gaming has died and replaced by commercialism.

 

[ImpulsE69]

So smack, are we to understand that you don't stand up for anything you believe in? That's essentially what you are saying. You don't have an opinion on gas prices? Abortion? Who the next president is? All these things are probably considered by most to be much more important than a game, I agree, but that really isn't the point. Saying nothing is accepting what is given to you also giving you no right to complain.

Sitting idly by does not change anything. Calling it "whining" is just an attempt to cheapen opinions that differ from yours (which if you look at the history around here, is 99% of the time). As someone stated, it's only a game, but it all revolves around the same mindset. What is interesting is you are all for it, yet make a point to repeatedly engage anyone who thinks otherwise. I have no issues with your opinion being different from mine, but it doesn't mean I'm just going to sit (in silence) and accept what you say....oh wait...just like you didn't! (get what I did there?) You simply not paying is your way of dealing with it, speaking out is others.

 

[cmdrdredd]

While I don't myself buy IAPs (nor plan to do so in the foreseeable future), I do hope they go away or at least become less prevalent than currently. In many cases, they are simply 'pay-to-cheat' buttons but in some really bad cases (DK mobile comes to mind), they are a 'forced' necessity in order to make the game playable/progress. Using XCom EU/EW as an example, how would you like it if your soldiers can only inflict 1 damage on aliens and you have to pay in order to 'unlock their weapon potential'? I certainly do not want games to go down this way.

You and others in this thread make it seem like every game is like you describe. That is far, far from the case.

So smack, are we to understand that you don't stand up for anything you believe in? That's essentially what you are saying. You don't have an opinion on gas prices? Abortion? Who the next president is? All these things are probably considered by most to be much more important than a game, I agree, but that really isn't the point. Saying nothing is accepting what is given to you also giving you no right to complain.

Sitting idly by does not change anything. Calling it "whining" is just an attempt to cheapen opinions that differ from yours (which if you look at the history around here, is 99% of the time).

The point is and he is right 100% about this, that posting on a forum doesn't get anything done. You need to go to the companies making these games and somehow convince them that it is the wrong way to go about it. Not giving them any money is one such way to get the idea across to them. Nobody here is in any position to do anything so posting your frustration here doesn't serve the purpose you think it does. It's venting, not making a stand.

It's similar to people protesting Origin or EA in general by not purchasing their games. As a consumer, that is the best thing you can do. You could voice complaints by email or send them a letter etc. but if their bottom line is impacted negatively then that's when they will really pay attention. Unfortunately, they make enough money from their DLC and such that they will continue to offer it. I'm choosy with my DLC purchases, but some people buy the season pass for everything and what can I really do to stop them? It's like people paying "mining tax" for a video card when I may just want to locate one for at or near MSRP. What can I do about it but to refuse to buy it?