Is RedHat deliberately CRIPPLING Linux?

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: JohnBernstein
Running an X-server on a production server is an extra unnecessary risk.
Where have you seen such enterprise servers? Your basement?

It's a small risk. It's a bigger risk to run apache, sendmail, bind, or allow users shell access to the server.

 

[JohnBernstein]

Originally posted by: Rangoric
If Redhat makes a Server distro of Linux then obviously they will include what is useful for someone running a server (like X for Oracle) and not something for an amateur that runs their server from their basement (like MP3 Support).

You, (along with the professional disinfo people here,... well,.... who knows maybe they are just ignorant of the facts,.... I guess that is possible,... as incredible as that may seem), conveniently ignore the facts that:

1) Redhat is not a server only product.
2) Redhat, was and still is, first and foremost, a desktop product.
3) This desktop product does NOT ship with MP3.

I was just trying to point out that running a server with a graphics environment is stupid. It is nearly as stupid as having MP3 on a server.

This was in done in reply to the stupid claim that Redhat does not include MP3 support because it has a server solution in its product lineup.

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
It's a small risk. It's a bigger risk to run apache, sendmail, bind, or allow users shell access to the server.

I totally agree.

 

[erikistired]

Originally posted by: JohnBernstein

Originally posted by: Rangoric
If Redhat makes a Server distro of Linux then obviously they will include what is useful for someone running a server (like X for Oracle) and not something for an amateur that runs their server from their basement (like MP3 Support).

You, (along with the professional disinfo people here,... well,.... who knows maybe they are just ignorant of the facts,.... I guess that is possible,... as incredible as that may seem), conveniently ignore the facts that:

1) Redhat is not a server only product.
2) Redhat, was and still is, first and foremost, a desktop product.
3) This desktop product does NOT ship with MP3.

I was just trying to point out that running a server with a graphics environment is stupid. It is nearly as stupid as having MP3 on a server.

This was in done in reply to the stupid claim that Redhat does not include MP3 support because it has a server solution in its product lineup.

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
It's a small risk. It's a bigger risk to run apache, sendmail, bind, or allow users shell access to the server.

I totally agree.

 

[TanisHalfElven]

your points a invalid. those are not the ways redhat maybe trying to cripple linux. BLOCKING PRPRITERY DRIVERS IS.

 

[TanisHalfElven]

your points a invalid. those are not the ways redhat maybe trying to cripple linux. BLOCKING PROPRITERY DRIVERS IS.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: JohnBernstein
You, (along with the professional disinfo people here,... well,.... who knows maybe they are just ignorant of the facts,.... I guess that is possible,... as incredible as that may seem), conveniently ignore the facts that:

1) Redhat is not a server only product.

After further investigation, this is correct. They offer both desktop and workstation variants. The desktop version is priced at corporate levels, but the workstation version is priced more reasonably.

2) Redhat, was and still is, first and foremost, a desktop product.

Their marketing and their software selection is more geared towards professional installations, which generally do not need mp3 support.

3) This desktop product does NOT ship with MP3.

Doing a search on the redhat network for "mp3" provides 7 packages: freeamp, grip, icecast, rio, smpeg, xmms, xmmsskins. freeamp, smpeg, and xmms appear to be mp3 audio players.

I was just trying to point out that running a server with a graphics environment is stupid. It is nearly as stupid as having MP3 on a server.

I see nothing wrong with it, if someone needs that. I don't do it (except in Solaris where I get lazy).

This was in done in reply to the stupid claim that Redhat does not include MP3 support because it has a server solution in its product lineup.

Well now we have a problem: Redhat does provide professional desktop and workstations versions, and they do provide mp3 support. :Q

Now where does this thread go?

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: tanishalfelven
your points a invalid. those are not the ways redhat maybe trying to cripple linux. BLOCKING PRPRITERY DRIVERS IS.

Blocking proprietary drivers would be an improvement.

 

[M00T]

Why is this thread not locked? John Bernstein is trying to gain publicity for his ad-latent website. He cares nothing about the open source community or Red Hat.

A quote from Patrick V on Bernstein's forum:

If you need more help, i am not going to post a tutorial on this guys site since he is obviously using ads to further his stupid agenda and spamming various sites with his adress.

 

[Brazen]

Originally posted by: JohnBernstein
So none of you guys have a clue what you are talking about,.... that's what I thought.

Your arguments are so stupid, it's amazing.

 

[Rangoric]

Originally posted by: JohnBernstein
1) Redhat is not a server only product.
2) Redhat, was and still is, first and foremost, a desktop product.
3) This desktop product does NOT ship with MP3.

Its taken you this long to post this information.

I care very little for Linux but the fact that until after I posted, you didn't mention this makes you look VERY bad.

So maybe next time instead of insulting people, maybe you should back up your arguements better. By you know, showing people how they are wrong instead of raving like a madman.

 

[Robor]

Okay... Must stop reading this thread at work. Seriously, I can't keep the smirk off my face.

 

[rasczak]

Originally posted by: M00T
Why is this thread not locked? John Bernstein is trying to gain publicity for his ad-latent website. He cares nothing about the open source community or Red Hat.

A quote from Patrick V on Bernstein's forum:

If you need more help, i am not going to post a tutorial on this guys site since he is obviously using ads to further his stupid agenda and spamming various sites with his adress.

If this is true, then I vote that this thread be locked and request censure of OP.

 

[Brazen]

I'd be happy with this thread being locked and John Bernstein being banned.

 

[TanisHalfElven]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey

Originally posted by: tanishalfelven
your points a invalid. those are not the ways redhat maybe trying to cripple linux. BLOCKING PRPRITERY DRIVERS IS.

Blocking proprietary drivers would be an improvement.

how is that.
if i can't get my ati to have 3d accleration i'll sure as hell switch to windows/ anything else.
why do you think i use windows these days, cuz my ati does not perform in linux as well as windows and i wanna play games. if it does not perform at all than liux can rot in hell.

ps. this is coming from someone who LOVES linux. i mean really loves and markets/spreads linux everywhere i can.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: tanishalfelven

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey

Originally posted by: tanishalfelven
your points a invalid. those are not the ways redhat maybe trying to cripple linux. BLOCKING PRPRITERY DRIVERS IS.

Blocking proprietary drivers would be an improvement.

how is that.
if i can't get my ati to have 3d accleration i'll sure as hell switch to windows/ anything else.
why do you think i use windows these days, cuz my ati does not perform in linux as well as windows and i wanna play games. if it does not perform at all than liux can rot in hell.

ps. this is coming from someone who LOVES linux. i mean really loves and markets/spreads linux everywhere i can.

b cuz propritary drivers b da debil and people shud not hav 2 put up wit dat krazee shizzle ati shud releez driverz fo u yo i hav no probz wiff proprietary video driverz b cuz theez cumpaneez releez free driverz fo those uf us dat care about freedums

wurd

 

[nweaver]

Originally posted by: tanishalfelven

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey

Originally posted by: tanishalfelven
your points a invalid. those are not the ways redhat maybe trying to cripple linux. BLOCKING PRPRITERY DRIVERS IS.

Blocking proprietary drivers would be an improvement.

how is that.
if i can't get my ati to have 3d accleration i'll sure as hell switch to windows/ anything else.
why do you think i use windows these days, cuz my ati does not perform in linux as well as windows and i wanna play games. if it does not perform at all than liux can rot in hell.

ps. this is coming from someone who LOVES linux. i mean really loves and markets/spreads linux everywhere i can.

because if we get rid of binary blob drivers (blob, blob blob blob, blob...can't get that damn song out of my head!) then they can be included in the kernel source, meaning no install required, and better support (bugs can be found/fixed by the community). He isn't saying get rid of 3d drivers, only get rid of the binary blob drivers and open them up.

Although the current drivers included work great for me, but I'm not a gamer.

 

[TanisHalfElven]

i know the advantages of openinig drivers. infact fot those who don;t read this
http://www.kroah.com/log/linux/stable_api_nonsense.html

but in all honesty does ati care. or does nvidia care. if they block out proprietery drivers we as users and linux suffers.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: tanishalfelven
i know the advantages of openinig drivers. infact fot those who don;t read this
http://www.kroah.com/log/linux/stable_api_nonsense.html

but in all honesty does ati care. or does nvidia care. if they block out proprietery drivers we as users and linux suffers.

Only users suffer. It doesn't affect Linux.

 

[bsobel]

Only users suffer. It doesn't affect Linux.

You really think it won't affect desktop linux adoption rates? FSF is really barking up the wrong tree on this one...

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: bsobel

Only users suffer. It doesn't affect Linux.

You really think it won't affect desktop linux adoption rates? FSF is really barking up the wrong tree on this one...

I never said such a thing, but I don't think desktop linux adoption affects Linux as much as probably many others believe.

 

[TanisHalfElven]

it does. the more ppl that use linux the better support it'll get and the better it'll become. besides nobody, not even the biggest of geeks like to use something nobody else does.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: tanishalfelven
it does. the more ppl that use linux the better support it'll get and the better it'll become. besides nobody, not even the biggest of geeks like to use something nobody else does.

It's being adopted daily on the server front, and geeks love to be unique by using something that isn't hugely accepted by the mainstream world. Read Linus' original Linux announcement sometime.

 

[Nothinman]

it does. the more ppl that use linux the better support it'll get and the better it'll become. besides nobody, not even the biggest of geeks like to use something nobody else does.

The problem is that closed drivers are usually the worst supported. Whenver an internal API in the kernel changes all of the in-tree drivers are updated by the person changing the API but closed drivers have to be updated by the company that owns them. Just look at how long it took nVidia to finally put some work into ACPI support for their drivers. A bad experience with a closed driver is worse than a bad experience with an OSS driver because the latter can be fixed in a reasonable amount of time, using the former puts you at the whim of a corporation who may or may not care about your problems.

 

[TanisHalfElven]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey

Originally posted by: tanishalfelven
it does. the more ppl that use linux the better support it'll get and the better it'll become. besides nobody, not even the biggest of geeks like to use something nobody else does.

It's being adopted daily on the server front, and geeks love to be unique by using something that isn't hugely accepted by the mainstream world. Read Linus' original Linux announcement sometime.

you mean the one one usenet where he mentions something like
"are you tired of how easy minix is. do you miss tha days when to get a device to work you had to write the driver your self.. well here linux"

well linux has come a long way that post is no longer valid.
ps. geeks like to stand out. but they still like atleast some more ppl to use what they use.
its called fanboyism.

 

[erikistired]

Originally posted by: tanishalfelven

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey

Originally posted by: tanishalfelven
it does. the more ppl that use linux the better support it'll get and the better it'll become. besides nobody, not even the biggest of geeks like to use something nobody else does.

It's being adopted daily on the server front, and geeks love to be unique by using something that isn't hugely accepted by the mainstream world. Read Linus' original Linux announcement sometime.

you mean the one one usenet where he mentions something like
"are you tired of how easy minix is. do you miss tha days when to get a device to work you had to write the driver your self.. well here linux"

well linux has come a long way that post is no longer valid.
ps. geeks like to stand out. but they still like atleast some more ppl to use what they use.
its called fanboyism.

you don't stand out by falling in line.