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Is paypal crap?
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<< It is why, if you are accepting credit card payments, I would recommend reading the rules in the Seller Protection Program and using it. >>
Yes, but what did your "rules" state as of 4 months ago when the transaction was taken? So you're telling me your company didn't get the money from the credit card before you told me you did? That's what it looks like... Holes in the system? Yes. I can't belive after being a member sence the company started I would get screwed like this.
Complete trash. You can spit out all the new rules you want. But going back 4 months in time and just now telling someone that you're going to take back some acient money is just wrong. You will never see me use your service again.
GreenBeret
Golden Member
Ok. Help us then. HOw do we qualify for Seller Protection (or whatever it is). I'm very curious, since I was about to begin using my paypal account in conjunction with some fleabay auctions. A link would suffice.
Hi Greenberet,
Here are the details-
Be a Verified Premier or Verified Business Account (U.S.)
Verification is a positive signal to your buyer and to the PayPal community. By using the Verification System, PayPal reduces the risk that a Seller is not legitimate. Dishonest Sellers damage both the PayPal community and the online community in general.
Ship to the buyer's Verified Shipping Address
PayPal prompts buyers to provide sellers with a Verified Shipping Address when making a purchase. The Verified Shipping Address is checked against the buyer's credit card billing address maintained by their credit card company. Shipping to this address minimizes the risk of being paid by a fraudulent buyer.
Retain reasonable proof-of-shipment that can be tracked online
Always keep proof that you did indeed honor the payment and made the shipment to the Verified Shipping Address. Most U.S. carrier companies offer this service, including the U.S. Postal Service. You will be required to provide a copy of this shipment record in cases of disputes. The tracking documentation must show that you shipped to the Verified Shipping Address.
Ship tangible goods
Since comparable widely-accepted proof-of-shipment methods are not currently available for intangible goods and services, we are currently unable to offer Seller Protection for digital goods and other electronically-delivered items.
Only accept single payments from single PayPal accounts
Payments by a buyer from multiple accounts for a single item are a fraud indicator. Under no circumstances should you accept these payments. Acceptance of these payments will result in loss of protection under this Policy and possible termination of your account.
Ship to domestic (U.S.) buyers at U.S. addresses
We do not currently extend Seller Protection for international payments and shipments.
Hi Bowdown and Russ,
The Seller Protection Program has been in effect since August of 2000 with the same criteria that is currently on the site and that is displayed above.
TextText
Here are the details-
Be a Verified Premier or Verified Business Account (U.S.)
Verification is a positive signal to your buyer and to the PayPal community. By using the Verification System, PayPal reduces the risk that a Seller is not legitimate. Dishonest Sellers damage both the PayPal community and the online community in general.
Ship to the buyer's Verified Shipping Address
PayPal prompts buyers to provide sellers with a Verified Shipping Address when making a purchase. The Verified Shipping Address is checked against the buyer's credit card billing address maintained by their credit card company. Shipping to this address minimizes the risk of being paid by a fraudulent buyer.
Retain reasonable proof-of-shipment that can be tracked online
Always keep proof that you did indeed honor the payment and made the shipment to the Verified Shipping Address. Most U.S. carrier companies offer this service, including the U.S. Postal Service. You will be required to provide a copy of this shipment record in cases of disputes. The tracking documentation must show that you shipped to the Verified Shipping Address.
Ship tangible goods
Since comparable widely-accepted proof-of-shipment methods are not currently available for intangible goods and services, we are currently unable to offer Seller Protection for digital goods and other electronically-delivered items.
Only accept single payments from single PayPal accounts
Payments by a buyer from multiple accounts for a single item are a fraud indicator. Under no circumstances should you accept these payments. Acceptance of these payments will result in loss of protection under this Policy and possible termination of your account.
Ship to domestic (U.S.) buyers at U.S. addresses
We do not currently extend Seller Protection for international payments and shipments.
Hi Bowdown and Russ,
The Seller Protection Program has been in effect since August of 2000 with the same criteria that is currently on the site and that is displayed above.
TextText
GreenBeret
Golden Member
ok... so we have to be a paying (premier or business) account to keep from having to pay if we are the VICTIMS of credit card fraud? Even if I follow all the other steps I still am not protected, right?
You still don't seem to understand my point.
-PayPal provides the service which transfers money between people. (following me so far?)
-PayPal electronicly transfers the money from on user to another...
-PayPal validates the money to the seller by posting the money into the sellers account and tells him the transaction has been "completed."
-Seller sends out the package to the users address...
-Buyer contacts the seller and tells him the package has arrived as described
-Done.
If something goes wrong with some CC company after 4 months of other transactions involving that money and other money then it's not my problem. It's your service that told me the money was good. It's your service that confirmed the payment, and gave me the go ahead to ship the goods.
Why not go back and pull the money out of the users accounts that I may have sent it to? Why, you can do that to me right? Why not do it to them? You have records of all these transactions... As part of offering this service you are obligated to stand behind your service. If you tell a user that he has money is his account, he should have the fricking money in his account. I don't give two craps if he's verified or not. If theres money in my account, and the transaction is completed the deal is done.
Hey... allowing unverified users to use Credit Card funds is a flaw in your system. Not a flaw of the seller. It's your service that allowed it, and it's your service that completed the transaction giving the seller the go ahead to ship.
-PayPal provides the service which transfers money between people. (following me so far?)
-PayPal electronicly transfers the money from on user to another...
-PayPal validates the money to the seller by posting the money into the sellers account and tells him the transaction has been "completed."
-Seller sends out the package to the users address...
-Buyer contacts the seller and tells him the package has arrived as described
-Done.
If something goes wrong with some CC company after 4 months of other transactions involving that money and other money then it's not my problem. It's your service that told me the money was good. It's your service that confirmed the payment, and gave me the go ahead to ship the goods.
Why not go back and pull the money out of the users accounts that I may have sent it to? Why, you can do that to me right? Why not do it to them? You have records of all these transactions... As part of offering this service you are obligated to stand behind your service. If you tell a user that he has money is his account, he should have the fricking money in his account. I don't give two craps if he's verified or not. If theres money in my account, and the transaction is completed the deal is done.
Hey... allowing unverified users to use Credit Card funds is a flaw in your system. Not a flaw of the seller. It's your service that allowed it, and it's your service that completed the transaction giving the seller the go ahead to ship.
i also got one of those fraud letters
i have talked to other people on egay who have become victims to this fraudulent person. I learned that the fraud stole a credit card and was using it to pay for goods on egay.
now i am $55 in the hole, seems as though the person who has lossed their card has gotten their money back. How bout me? How long do these investigations last for?
Where do i end up paypalDamon?, whenever i call your buddies on the 1-800 line never give me a definite answer.
i have talked to other people on egay who have become victims to this fraudulent person. I learned that the fraud stole a credit card and was using it to pay for goods on egay.
now i am $55 in the hole, seems as though the person who has lossed their card has gotten their money back. How bout me? How long do these investigations last for?
Where do i end up paypalDamon?, whenever i call your buddies on the 1-800 line never give me a definite answer.
MrAnderson
Golden Member
Paypal does have its glitches but in general I have had pretty good luck with them. Moved probably about 2K worth of merch. without many problems!
ForeverSilky
Banned
I've never had problems with paypal. I've done 20+ transactions with people using paypal. Just make sure you're getting money from a verified account and only send money to a verified account.
Rooster286
Senior member
Paypal has been decent for me. However, getting hit with a 4 month old chargeback is crazy, espically if you followed all the correct steps. In the retail world, when a merchant uses a creditcard authentication service, certain steps are followed, which in turn, if followed correctly, bascially prevents them from issuing a charge-back. Paypal should take up this practice, or not use it at all. BTW, the retail "world" i am talking about, is Circuit City, the biggest electronics store in the nation.
Customers, or Circuit City when following policy, DO NOT get hit with bogus chargebacks, because we carry to much weight for that to happen, perhaps Paypal thinks that alienating a single customer is less "pain" than dealing with the problem???
my .02
Customers, or Circuit City when following policy, DO NOT get hit with bogus chargebacks, because we carry to much weight for that to happen, perhaps Paypal thinks that alienating a single customer is less "pain" than dealing with the problem???
my .02
Hi Bowdown,
I do understand your point. However, as I mentioned, regardless of what industry you are in, there is always the risk of a charge back related to a credit card transaction. To the best of my knowledge, we are the only payment service offering any measure of protection provided that the user follows the steps in the program. Our service is a payment service offering users the ability to move money and accept money through credit card transactions or bank account funding and we do take great measures to insure that the funds are the result of a legitimate credit card transaction (verification measures and internal mechanism to identify potential fraud).
With a traditional merchant account the money is often pulled even if the user can provide proof. We are offering a different kind of service (using credit card transactions) that offer some measure of protection to the recipient provided they follow very explicit rules.
You still don't seem to understand my point.
-PayPal provides the service which transfers money between people. (following me so far?)
-PayPal electronicly transfers the money from on user to another...
-PayPal validates the money to the seller by posting the money into the sellers account and tells him the transaction has been "completed."
-Seller sends out the package to the users address...
-Buyer contacts the seller and tells him the package has arrived as described
-Done.
If something goes wrong with some CC company after 4 months of other transactions involving that money and other money then it's not my problem. It's your service that told me the money was good. It's your service that confirmed the payment, and gave me the go ahead to ship the goods.
Why not go back and pull the money out of the users accounts that I may have sent it to? Why, you can do that to me right? Why not do it to them? You have records of all these transactions... As part of offering this service you are obligated to stand behind your service. If you tell a user that he has money is his account, he should have the fricking money in his account. I don't give two craps if he's verified or not. If theres money in my account, and the transaction is completed the deal is done.
Hey... allowing unverified users to use Credit Card funds is a flaw in your system. Not a flaw of the seller. It's your service that allowed it, and it's your service that completed the transaction giving the seller the go ahead to ship.
I do understand your point. However, as I mentioned, regardless of what industry you are in, there is always the risk of a charge back related to a credit card transaction. To the best of my knowledge, we are the only payment service offering any measure of protection provided that the user follows the steps in the program. Our service is a payment service offering users the ability to move money and accept money through credit card transactions or bank account funding and we do take great measures to insure that the funds are the result of a legitimate credit card transaction (verification measures and internal mechanism to identify potential fraud).
With a traditional merchant account the money is often pulled even if the user can provide proof. We are offering a different kind of service (using credit card transactions) that offer some measure of protection to the recipient provided they follow very explicit rules.
You still don't seem to understand my point.
-PayPal provides the service which transfers money between people. (following me so far?)
-PayPal electronicly transfers the money from on user to another...
-PayPal validates the money to the seller by posting the money into the sellers account and tells him the transaction has been "completed."
-Seller sends out the package to the users address...
-Buyer contacts the seller and tells him the package has arrived as described
-Done.
If something goes wrong with some CC company after 4 months of other transactions involving that money and other money then it's not my problem. It's your service that told me the money was good. It's your service that confirmed the payment, and gave me the go ahead to ship the goods.
Why not go back and pull the money out of the users accounts that I may have sent it to? Why, you can do that to me right? Why not do it to them? You have records of all these transactions... As part of offering this service you are obligated to stand behind your service. If you tell a user that he has money is his account, he should have the fricking money in his account. I don't give two craps if he's verified or not. If theres money in my account, and the transaction is completed the deal is done.
Hey... allowing unverified users to use Credit Card funds is a flaw in your system. Not a flaw of the seller. It's your service that allowed it, and it's your service that completed the transaction giving the seller the go ahead to ship.
Hi rooster286,
The advantage that a b and m store has is that they can ask for a signature and id (in many cases) for the transaction. Our verification measures include an avs screen to validate address on the card and our internal measures. In addition, users are capped at a specific spending limit unless they provide additional identification.
However, I could dispute a charge made to a store if I felt the need to. Charge backs are a consumer right under federal law.Any charge made on any charge card can be disputed.
We do have a policy to prevent charge backs from impacting our users and it is the Seller Protection Program. If the steps are followed the liability for charge backs is erased.
The advantage that a b and m store has is that they can ask for a signature and id (in many cases) for the transaction. Our verification measures include an avs screen to validate address on the card and our internal measures. In addition, users are capped at a specific spending limit unless they provide additional identification.
However, I could dispute a charge made to a store if I felt the need to. Charge backs are a consumer right under federal law.Any charge made on any charge card can be disputed.
We do have a policy to prevent charge backs from impacting our users and it is the Seller Protection Program. If the steps are followed the liability for charge backs is erased.
bigbootydaddy
Banned
you know, paypal worked fine for me, but that X account crap is what made me close the account, not even the mandatory 15 day notice was given, and i know there were a ton of people who used direct deposit with their x account, and just screwed over people.
Our fraud percentages are well below the industry standards because of how aggressively we pursue it.
the reason why your fraud percentages are so low is because your "company" doesn't take responsibility for the fraudulent charges - instead you kick them back to whoever ELSE you can blame.
i've done over 100 transactions on pay.pal, and had over $10,000.00 run through them. then i had one of these BULLSH!T fraud chargebacks on my account, so i pulled off pay.pal.
paypaldamon
instead of trying to preach how you can avoid chargebacks, why don't you actually put yourself to good use and HELP THE HONEST TRADERS NOT GET THESE CHARGEBACKS.
pay.pal is a friggin' joke. while it was a great idea, the way the "company" handles their customer service and customers IS SUCK.
I'm waiting for paypal.com to go out of business. i'm sure that everyone would be very happy because i can guarantee you that not one of these HONEST traders who have been charged w/a fraudulent charge is going to pay it.
i'm sticking back to good old money orders.
the reason why your fraud percentages are so low is because your "company" doesn't take responsibility for the fraudulent charges - instead you kick them back to whoever ELSE you can blame.
i've done over 100 transactions on pay.pal, and had over $10,000.00 run through them. then i had one of these BULLSH!T fraud chargebacks on my account, so i pulled off pay.pal.
paypaldamon
instead of trying to preach how you can avoid chargebacks, why don't you actually put yourself to good use and HELP THE HONEST TRADERS NOT GET THESE CHARGEBACKS.
pay.pal is a friggin' joke. while it was a great idea, the way the "company" handles their customer service and customers IS SUCK.
I'm waiting for paypal.com to go out of business. i'm sure that everyone would be very happy because i can guarantee you that not one of these HONEST traders who have been charged w/a fraudulent charge is going to pay it.
i'm sticking back to good old money orders.
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