Is it really worth it?

[Semidevil]

it's just one of those things about life....when will you be completely happy? from birth to 4 or 5, that's when you get total freedom, but most of us dont remember that, and can't enjoy the memories. from 5 to 18, we go to school, and as we all know, no one likes school. as kids, school ruins our life. from 18 on to whatever. we make our own choices. more school, or work....either one you pick, stress is bound to be there....

I mean, when is the time to take a breath and really enjoy the moment? from 65 to up, that can be the time, but by then, you will be too old and lack of energy to enjoy it....and then you kick the can.

moral? the truth is that I think happiness is really hard to get if you dont enjoy what is given to you. You have to see what is in front of you, and manipulate it in a way where it works in your favor.

I mean, seriously, stress and problems will never ever go away. as soon as you accomplish something, another thing then comes up and will get you stressed.

life is the suck like that. but it's cool....just keep in control and realize, your life is not perfect....and dont make it be perfect

 

[StageLeft]

Most of us have to work to make money, and if we use that money intelligently it can lead to some level of happiness (nicer house, more vacations, etc.). I think a lot of people do chase it too hard, and then when they have it the cost they've paid has been too high. Worse yet is when people work themselves to the bone to make more money and instead of doing something truly meaningful with it, like saving for an earlier retirement or that trip to europe they've always wanted, they merely raise their budget such that they now need this new money just to pay for their car payments or mortgage or whatever, and in actuality they are no happier than when they worked 40 hours/week and made half as much.

At the heart of it you should be working to live, not living to work. If I'm ever long term at the point where my days are totally and utterly spent with work and my energy to live is sapped, then I know I've lost balance.

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: ohnnyj
This sounds eerily similar to a King Solomon, you really should read Ecclesiastes from the Bible.

It begins.."Meaningless, meaningless says the teacher. Everything is meaningless." But in the end he finds that although life may seem pointless it is simply the fact that this is earth and not heaven, so there is no way we can have heaven on earth. We can make the experience more pleasurable by trying to enjoy it by not doing the sorts of things that are eating you away, but it pales in comparison to what we can experience after this life.

"So I commend enjoyment, for there is nothing better for people under the sun than to eat, and drink, and enjoy themselves, for this will go with them in their toil through the days of life that God gives them under the sun." Ecc. 8:15

Always loved that book.

We are meant to enjoy this life as well though.

Pacfanweb, my pastor supports his family just fine on a HS teacher's salary. It's all in how one budgets and what one's priorities are. I don't need to kill myself inside to put food on the table.

ZV

 

[StageLeft]

Oh yes, as I've always held, there is little correlation that I've seen between money and happiness. Once you've reached a "reasonable" income level (say median for this country would definitely do it), and you're now able to buy groceries, have a house, etc. I suspect that the increase in happiness from your income to one 10x as much is negligible, if any. People chase money like it's going to make them happy. It's very hard not to, but it doesn't make us happy. Even most lottery winners' euphoria quickly subsides and they're no happier than they were before--often times in fact it "ruins" their lives. I can't imagine a guy working 65 hours/week and making 2 million year is any happier than I am. He's probably stressed to death, unhealthy, and has no family time.

 

[imported_Reck]

What's the point in raising kids if you are just going to be raising them into the same ****y society that you abhor? Chances are things will suck just as much for them as it does for you. That's not worth it for me...

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: Ameesh
honestly i work hard now so i wont have to when i am 40 years old, i'll be able to spend time with my family and friends and enjoy life, i figure i had a reak until i was 18, i'll work my ass of from 18-40 and coast the rest of my life. chasing the zeros in your bank account now will set you up later.

For you and Descartes that may make sense, as long as you save Most people don't have the discipline, as mentioned above, to save in such a manner, so the dream of the early retirement is just that.

hy should our job be a means to an end? Why do we see it that way and accept it, even like it?

For me personally I don't like that, but yes it's a means to an end because it's a small few who truly enjoy what they do. I don't hate it. If it was a grind I'd quit, but I won't pretend I would rather be doing it than something else. Maybe I'm stupid for still doing something I don't "love", but really that's why it's called work

My philosophy is born partly out of deliberacy and partly out of laziness, in that I simply _don't like_ to work that hard, and I have tailored a philosophy in part around that. Instead of chastising myself for not working harder I've told myself that I'm doing it right, but you know I really think I am because the more laid back approach leaves me quite contented indeed.

One thing is for sure though: anybody working consistently more than 40 hours/week needs to be getting OT or bonuses or whatever. Don't work those extra hours just to make some disloyal boss happier.

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: Reck
What's the point in raising kids if you are just going to be raising them into the same ****y society that you abhor? Chances are things will suck just as much for them as it does for you. That's not worth it for me...

I have nothing but love for this society. If I did not love it, I would not be sad that those in it sometimes choose poorly (though admittedly no worse than I myself choose sometimes).

I can hardly wait to have children and a family. I will raise my children to follow their heart and to let God lead their heart. Hopefully, others like me will do the same and by not giving up on this world we may, in some small way, be able to change it for the better.

ZV

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: Reck
What's the point in raising kids if you are just going to be raising them into the same ****y society that you abhor? Chances are things will suck just as much for them as it does for you. That's not worth it for me...

yep that's why you don't want to be the dad who's always showing up 30 min before their bed time and too damn tired to even spend that half hour with them because "work was hell today".

 

[Squisher]

http://www.simpleabundance.com/


Life is too short.

 

[Pacfanweb]

ZV, my point wasn't really about money, it was that you'll REALLY know why you do whatever you do when you have a family to support. Doesn't matter if you're a ditch digger or a surgeon.
I used to question why do I work everyday and all just like you did. Then I had my daughter, and 22 months later, (6 months ago in fact) a son.
No questions about it now.

 

[rh71]

get the right kind of job (60 hours, no way)... earn enough for what you need.. spend on what you desire (don't be a miser)... and your life is in perfect balance.

When I have kids, it'll throw this balance off, but then I'll be on the mindset that I'm working to make them happy and to provide so it should be all good then too. You're right about one thing, live it up while you're still young. I hate how people are all about work and savings, only to finally spend it when they're 50 or 60.

 

[iwantanewcomputer]

would you rather work 40 hours a week at near minimum wage at some crappy fast food/retail/manufacturing job and hate what you are doing even more?

 

[ts3433]

I have nothing to add--I won't even be going through this for quite a few years--but it's an interesting read; thanks, those who've posted.

Nothing I'm able to really treasure at present... school is easy, almost to the point of boredom; not much of a social life to speak of (my natural, involuntary eloquence is a b!tch sometimes, but at the same time I would hate to purposefully lower my appearance in that manner), because I'm so goddamn self-conscious; nothing to do in a boring town already in a relatively uninteresting area... maybe I am going to end up living to work in the years to come. In some ways I hate to think about this miserable stuff just 14 years into life, when I have one of the only chances to take advantage of youth's freedoms.

</pseudo-philosophical rant>

Again, my apologies for killing another thread.

 

[ohnnyj]

Originally posted by: Pacfanweb
When you have children, you'll know that all you do to support them is worth it.

:thumbsup:

"There was a man all alone; he had neither son nor brother. There was no end to his toil, yet his eyes were not content with his wealth. "For whom am I toiling," he asked, "and why am I depriving myself of enjoyment?" This too is meaningless- a miserable business!"

- Ecclesiastes 4:8 -

 

[Kadarin]

There is no point to life, that's why we invented religion. So give thanks to your God and rejoice in the salvation He gives you, or whatever.

 

[ivol07]

Is it worth it.....let me think....

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: iwantanewcomputer
would you rather work 40 hours a week at near minimum wage at some crappy fast food/retail/manufacturing job and hate what you are doing even more?

You've missed it entirely, my friend.

I have nothing against these jobs themselves. If one finds rest and enjoyment in them, then so much the better for that one. What I do question however, is the choice that I see so many people make. The choice to give their lives over to work and burn themself out by so doing. Sacrificing their happiness for money well beyond what they need to provide a decent life.

And Pacfanweb, it's not that I question the wisdom of what you say about having someone to provide for. Rather, I am questioning why I have made the decision to provide for myself with a job I dislike instead of with a job that I am fullfilled in. It seems to me that a lot of people are choosing to take jobs that are life-sapping when there are jobs available that are almost infinitely fullfilling and still provide more than sufficient money for supporting one's self and one's family. Having money beyond what I need has never made me happier than having only enough to get by.

ZV

 

[Taejin]

You have a couple choices:

1) kill yourself, or contribute heavily in events leading to your immediate death.
2) think about life and waste your time
3) start living and achieving the goals you'd like to achieve

 

[troglodytis]

zm...i hear ya. luckily, i had this thought discussion with myself whilest on my way to getting into your spot.

i figured...screw that!

dropped out. took out loans and worked my ASS off for 2 years so that i could get the skills i needed make money doing something i LOVE! now i have fun, all day. everyday. sure, sometimes a job's a job, but even my worst days beat the hell out of what use to be my best days.

life is what you make it. might as well make it what you want.

 

[Ornery]

...there's a lot to be said for a simple house out in the country and a "good old boy" 40 hour/week job.

It's a hoot that most of those "good old boys" are saying the same thing. Wondering why they don't sell off everything and just live in a trailer in the mountains, desert, or something...

I just look at how people lived only 100-150 years ago, right in this country. Working from dawn till dusk, just to put food on the table. Washing clothes and cooking were hours long endeavors. No cars or electronics. Medical problems were frequently life threatening. Indoor plumbing didn't exist in many areas!

Now we have quite a range of choices in how we want to go about eking out a living. Only a relatively small portion of your week is actually spent "working" compared to our great, great grandparents!

I frequently feel like a drone, but I just think about how our founding fathers had to struggle through life, and I really don't feel so bad. Enjoying your career from day to day, would be like having your cake & eating it, too. Good luck with that!

 

[daveymark]

OP, I was in the same situation you were in. I was running the rat race. One day I looked at all the material things I had, and I realized I didn't even know who I was. I told myself "I don't know who's life this is, but I'm not going to hang around to see how it ends"...Now I'm doing rewarding and fun "work", I don't even call it work though. I'm self employed, and I'll never go back.

Don't worry about finding what you're looking for. As long as you're looking, that's all that counts. It WILL come to you eventually.

 

[daveymark]

Originally posted by: Ornery Enjoying your career from day to day, would be like having your cake & eating it, too. Good luck with that!

I have my cake and I eat it too. It's very possible. If I'm not enjoying it, I don't work. Simple as that. Amazing what self employment will do to a person.

 

[Ornery]

My wife won't go along with being "self employed". Actually, I was self employed when we first got married. I got tired of making quotes, with no work to show for it, and chasing after slow pays. My wife was working at a bank, and told me about all the small business owners coming in there, trying to make ends meet, finding trustworthy employees, and working longer hours than anyone, anywhere!

I'm content to let other people handle the details. I know they're getting the lion's share of the money I bring in, but that's only fair. Until my wife gets onboard with the idea of owning our own business, I'm not even going to think about it. It will be hard enough to deal with fickle customers, without having to listen to her bitching & moaning and saying I told you so!

 

[abracadabra1]

i think you really have to start enjoying the little things. there's so much beauty, wonder, and amazement out there (just in the natural world), but you're probably passing idly by ignorant to its magnificence. now that's not going to make you happy, but it's a start. you have to understand that at times there is a trade-off between how hard you work (time spent working) and the time you have left to enjoy things that gives you meaning and purpose (or at least pleasure and enjoyment).

if you haven't done so yet, read Tuesday's with Morrie by Mitch Albom - i think it should help.

i think you'll come to realize that all you really want is to spend time with the one's you love and make you laugh.

 

[Descartes]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: iwantanewcomputer
would you rather work 40 hours a week at near minimum wage at some crappy fast food/retail/manufacturing job and hate what you are doing even more?

You've missed it entirely, my friend.

I have nothing against these jobs themselves. If one finds rest and enjoyment in them, then so much the better for that one. What I do question however, is the choice that I see so many people make. The choice to give their lives over to work and burn themself out by so doing. Sacrificing their happiness for money well beyond what they need to provide a decent life.

And Pacfanweb, it's not that I question the wisdom of what you say about having someone to provide for. Rather, I am questioning why I have made the decision to provide for myself with a job I dislike instead of with a job that I am fullfilled in. It seems to me that a lot of people are choosing to take jobs that are life-sapping when there are jobs available that are almost infinitely fullfilling and still provide more than sufficient money for supporting one's self and one's family. Having money beyond what I need has never made me happier than having only enough to get by.

ZV

So says the person that likely has more money than you need. Have you ever lived in poverty? You're extolling the virtues of choice from atop a mountain of opportunity that almost everyone wishes they could climb; unfortunately, not everyone has these opportunities. Is that fair? Is it fair for you to forfeit your opportunities when so many others aren't given them? I think you should ask yourself this question when you consider how many people work their entire lives barely getting by. If you wish to enlist in a lifestyle of ascetism then you are free to do so.

I'm a little annoyed. I know that I have opportunities not available to all and I feel I would be remiss if I were not to seize them. The only thing I can do is insure that no one in my family has to suffer; this doesn't mean expensive cars, huge houses, etc.; no, this just means that I can enable them as much as possible.

On another note, have you ever heard of the scarcity principle discussed in psychology? Take away your ability to acquire excess and I think you'll realize rather quickly how fortunate you are.

I hope you find your place, and given that you're quite young (I'm 24, and I've fought over a lot of the same things that you have now, but I've found balance) you will.