Is it legal to change engines in a car?

[boyRacer]

Originally posted by: NutBucket

Originally posted by: iamwiz82

Originally posted by: Quixfire
What kind of engine swap are you planning?

Quixfire, am i correct on the older engine-newer car law, or am i talking out of my ass?

That's the way it is in Cali. And in Cali you put anything you want into anything else, so long as its newer. There's a smog official that will then certify that the engine is installed properly in the car, ie all the smog equipment that it originally had is still present and hooked up correctly. So the engine has to pass the same smog test as if it were in the car it was originally in. That means all those guys with 302s under the hood of their Volvos can be perfectly legal. This is California, can't speak for other states. I have to start prepping my car to be certified actually.

bah... im sure you know people that'll certify your car without getting tested...

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: LAUST
yes, as long as it passes emissions for the chassis

Also has to be the same year or newer than the chassis. I.e. you can put a brand new engine into a '57 Chevy, but you cannot put a 1968 L-88 427 into a 2003 Silverado. (Of course, you could buy a new factory "crate" motor that was identical to the L-88 but that would technically be a new engine.)

ZV

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: coolred
OKay the state the cra is in is Ohio. I am not planning to swap any engine, but the thunderbird I recentlly purchased had a newer engine put in it before I bought it. I just recentlly found out that this is a mustang engine. The engine that is supposed to be in the cra is a 3.8L super charged model. I think that is what got put in there, but I have been told its a mustang engine. Or do they both use the same engine, but since the stang is more popular that is what the engine is consider?

Basically the car got me through when i needed it to, but I now want to get something a little newer and prolly with a couple more doors. But I was informed that i would have trouble selling it with a mustang engine in it. ANd I was also told that with that engine in there a dealer would not give me junk for trade in.

Mustang never had a supercharged 3.8. Never. The could have put a Mustang 4.6 V8 in there, and that should be OK since the T-Bird used the same 4.6 V8 as the 'Stang did in the late 1990's

ZV

 

[MacBaine]

Technically (at least in IL, I think there are similar laws in other states), it is illegal to modify a car AT ALL from its factory specifications. You have to use the same tires it came with, same oil filter, same lightbulbs, etc. Of course, these laws are never enacted except in extreme cases dealing with legal matters, and even then...

So short answer yes, long answer no with a but.....

 

[AvesPKS]

Originally posted by: boyRacer

Originally posted by: NutBucket

Originally posted by: iamwiz82

Originally posted by: Quixfire
What kind of engine swap are you planning?

Quixfire, am i correct on the older engine-newer car law, or am i talking out of my ass?

That's the way it is in Cali. And in Cali you put anything you want into anything else, so long as its newer. There's a smog official that will then certify that the engine is installed properly in the car, ie all the smog equipment that it originally had is still present and hooked up correctly. So the engine has to pass the same smog test as if it were in the car it was originally in. That means all those guys with 302s under the hood of their Volvos can be perfectly legal. This is California, can't speak for other states. I have to start prepping my car to be certified actually.

bah... im sure you know people that'll certify your car without getting tested...

Yep, that's how my cousin got his Jeep to pass inspection with no Cat, and holes in the floor, among other smaller problems...

 

[NutBucket]

Originally posted by: boyRacer

Originally posted by: NutBucket

Originally posted by: iamwiz82

Originally posted by: Quixfire
What kind of engine swap are you planning?

Quixfire, am i correct on the older engine-newer car law, or am i talking out of my ass?

That's the way it is in Cali. And in Cali you put anything you want into anything else, so long as its newer. There's a smog official that will then certify that the engine is installed properly in the car, ie all the smog equipment that it originally had is still present and hooked up correctly. So the engine has to pass the same smog test as if it were in the car it was originally in. That means all those guys with 302s under the hood of their Volvos can be perfectly legal. This is California, can't speak for other states. I have to start prepping my car to be certified actually.

bah... im sure you know people that'll certify your car without getting tested...

Actually, I don't. Besides, my car is already setup with all the smog stuff anyway so it shouldn't be a big deal. Doesn't cost anything extra and its good to be legal in case the police try to pull something. The only issue I'm concerned about is that I hear some of the referees are bitches when it comes to JDM motors, even if they meet all of the criteria.

 

[coolred]

Mustang never had a supercharged 3.8. Never. The could have put a Mustang 4.6 V8 in there, and that should be OK since the T-Bird used the same 4.6 V8 as the 'Stang did in the late 1990's

Well thats interesting to know. I know for a fact that the engine in the car is super charged, I can tell you that much for sure. Did Ford make any supercharged engine at all for the mustang?

 

[coolred]

Actually if it helps to figure out what engine is in the car one thing I can tell you is that the guy I have working on it said that in order to get to the spark plugs he would ahve to drop the carriage. Not sure if thats common or if that will help narrow it down. LIke I said about the only things I know for sure is that the engine is super charged. And the engine that is supposed to be in the car is a 3.8L super charged engine. But when the guy working on the car called some other guy about a part he read the serial number or whatever off the engine and the guy told him it was a mustang engine.

 

[coolred]

SO is it true that the mustand never used a super charged engine? Would it have been possible for them to put the 3.8 fromt he mustang int he tbird and then use the exsisting supercharger on that engine?

 

[Lifer]

you'd have to report it to your insurance company so they can adjust appropriately.

the rates for a fast car and a slow car (which is determined by the engine) are vastly different.

 

[Evadman]

Originally posted by: MacBaine
Technically (at least in IL, I think there are similar laws in other states), it is illegal to modify a car AT ALL from its factory specifications. You have to use the same tires it came with, same oil filter, same lightbulbs, etc. Of course, these laws are never enacted except in extreme cases dealing with legal matters, and even then...

So short answer yes, long answer no with a but.....

Did I mentionj I love living here? My truck passed emmisions though. THey never poped the hood, and the test is an idle for 8000+ lb trucks. I was 8800, so it was cool.

If they had poped the hood I was toast.

 

[flxnimprtmscl]

Originally posted by: MacBaine
Technically (at least in IL, I think there are similar laws in other states), it is illegal to modify a car AT ALL from its factory specifications. You have to use the same tires it came with, same oil filter, same lightbulbs, etc. Of course, these laws are never enacted except in extreme cases dealing with legal matters, and even then...

So short answer yes, long answer no with a but.....

:Q Wow, that's the best law money can buy if your an OEM manufacturer. Who the hell actually passes these things

 

[Vortex22]

Is there a code or serial number anywhere on the engine block?

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: coolred

Mustang never had a supercharged 3.8. Never. The could have put a Mustang 4.6 V8 in there, and that should be OK since the T-Bird used the same 4.6 V8 as the 'Stang did in the late 1990's

Well thats interesting to know. I know for a fact that the engine in the car is super charged, I can tell you that much for sure. Did Ford make any supercharged engine at all for the mustang?

Last couple of years the Mustang Cobra has come with a supercharged V8. (Trust me, you'd know if it was the Cobra engine, well over 300 hp.) And in the mid 1980's there was the turbocharged 4-cylinder Mustang SVO. But never a supercharged V6. If it's a supercharged V6 from Ford in recent years, it's the Thunderbird SC engine. Whoever told you that it was a Mustang engine needs a quick infusion of clue.

ZV

EDIT: Regardless, the fact that the engine has been replaced at all is a huge hit to resale value since there is the assumption that in order to have blown that first engine up, someone was mistreating the car.

 

[Evadman]

Originally posted by: Vortex22
Is there a code or serial number anywhere on the engine block?

of course.

 

[coolred]

I don't currently have the car with me. I will be picking it up later today, so then maybe I can answer some of your questions. I am just trying to figure this stuff out. I know myself for a fact that the car is either supercharged or turbocharged. I am prettys ure its the first one. I also know when the guy working on it, called some parts place about a part, they asked for the serial number or whatever, he gave it to them and they said it was a mustang engine. Like someone else said I think I would know if it was a supercharged V8, and I feel that it most certainly is not. I am just kinda wondering if it wasn't just a little mix up in the guys computer or something. Like I said I know it did have the engine replaced, but I was under the impression that another engine from another TBird SC was put in. I understand that with the engine change that it hits the resale value. But I got a good deal on it and I put new tires on it as well as a couple other parts that needed replacing. In total I have put a few hundred into the car. I think i can get 2000.00 out of it, maybe more, but I would be happy at 2000.00 since that pretty much covers all the cash I put into it. I guess I will wait till I get that car back and then go from there.

 

[BullyCanadian]

i think this has to be illegal somewhere, there is a garage here that just got a job to put in a VTEC engine (i dont know which one yet dont know the details didnt ask) into a '94 i beleive Cavalier, actually I think the Cavalier might be a little older

 

[coolred]

What about parts for this car, ar ethey hard to find/get?

 

[CraigRT]

not illegal, i believe you also have to tell your insurance company of such a change

 

[NeoPTLD]

Assuming there is no restrictions by law as far as installing a different engine on vehicles for public road use, what are the implications on insurance rate?

For example, given everything else are equal, V8 Mustang has a higher premium than its V6 counterpart. What about a V6 or 4cyl car retrofitted with a larger engine? If they get away with paying the same rate, I find it not fair for others who has to pay higher rate.

Secondly, can insurance company deny your collision coverage claims(in which they have nobody to deal with but you) when they discover the unreported modification after the accident?

 

[coolred]

OKay I fina;;y got a chance to talk to the guy that put the engine in the car, and he asured me it is the standard 3.8L super charged V6 that originally came with the 1990 Ford Tbird SC. So, no mustang engine, must have been some confusion there.

I also got a chance to talk to the guy working on the car(or at least relay some info through people to and from him). He said the part that broke was the harmonic balance. After searching some on the internet I haven't found much info on it. I think I may have misunderstood him and maybe he said harmonic balancer. What is that exactly, and are they hard to find.

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: coolred
OKay I fina;;y got a chance to talk to the guy that put the engine in the car, and he asured me it is the standard 3.8L super charged V6 that originally came with the 1990 Ford Tbird SC. So, no mustang engine, must have been some confusion there.

I also got a chance to talk to the guy working on the car(or at least relay some info through people to and from him). He said the part that broke was the harmonic balance. After searching some on the internet I haven't found much info on it. I think I may have misunderstood him and maybe he said harmonic balancer. What is that exactly, and are they hard to find.

Definitely "harmonic balancer" though it could also be referred to as a "harmonic balance". It's basically a weighted shaft that spins counter to the crankshaft and generates vibrations that cancel out the engine's natural vibrations. In a V6, that should be mainly for comfort and noise purposes but don't be too sure. Without the balance shafts, the engine in my 924S can literally shake itself apart, so some engines really need them.

ZV

 

[atom]

Originally posted by: NeoPTLD
Assuming there is no restrictions by law as far as installing a different engine on vehicles for public road use, what are the implications on insurance rate?

For example, given everything else are equal, V8 Mustang has a higher premium than its V6 counterpart. What about a V6 or 4cyl car retrofitted with a larger engine? If they get away with paying the same rate, I find it not fair for others who has to pay higher rate.

Secondly, can insurance company deny your collision coverage claims(in which they have nobody to deal with but you) when they discover the unreported modification after the accident?

I would assume they would adjust it like they would any other modification to your car. IE stereo, bling bling rims, etc.

 

[coolred]

Thanks for the help guys, but I currently have a couple more questions.
1. Does a 1990 Ford Tbird 3.8L SC have coil packs? My brother in law and father in law say no, but the guy fixing the car said he replaced 1.

2. Can anyone give me an estimate on what it would cost to put a new super charger unit on the same car? I don't think that is the problem, I would just like to know for future knowledge. Thanks

 

[coolred]

Alright guys, I am bringing this thread back because I now finally have the car down here with me, and with someone that knows more about the car. He says the reason it is still not running right is because the last guy put a harmonic balancer on it that was meant for the standard 3.8L, whent he car has the 3.8L super charged engine. I just want to confirm that that would cause the car not to run? Or is there possibly something else wrong? Thanks