is anyone watching this cnn presents: pain medication

[KAZANI]

A problem exists separating the fakers from the real thing.

Look at MJ as a perfect example

This is not an issue exclusive to under-the-counter drugs. All lot more harm is done by enforcing a strict separation of the psychoactive effects of cannabis from the physical ones, on patients who benefit from the synergies of both.

 

[hardhat]

Last year when I had a kidney stone I went to the doctor and she wanted me to wait until all the test results were back before giving me anything for the pain. It wasn't until I threw up from the pain while walking to have blood drawn that she relented. I know that there are problems with people seeking drugs just to get high, but it's rediculous when people who are legitimately suffering can't get pain killers.

 

[bfdd]

all drugs should be legal and available OTC. Anything less is stupid ignorant "moral" legislation.

 

[xj0hnx]

all drugs should be legal and available OTC. Anything less is stupid ignorant "moral" legislation.

There are a couple drugs that I would be wary of making OTC, such as Ketamine, and PCP, and especially those research chemicals coming out of China, and Russia.

The system I would like to see, and the only way I think it would work is to have a set up similar to how it is to get a "prescription", either a doctor, or trained specialist, counselors, that you go to get a script for your recreational drugs, either free, or extremely cheap, and at the same time it would introduce counseling for those that need it, and hopefully keep not yet addicts from getting too far in.

 

[waggy]

Last year when I had a kidney stone I went to the doctor and she wanted me to wait until all the test results were back before giving me anything for the pain. It wasn't until I threw up from the pain while walking to have blood drawn that she relented. I know that there are problems with people seeking drugs just to get high, but it's rediculous when people who are legitimately suffering can't get pain killers.

yeah tell me about it. its fucking insane.

as it is even with a documented chronic illness you are still under a microscope on pain meds.

My PCG and RA doctor are amazed that my pain med doctor won't prescribe anything higher then Vicodin. They CAN'T prescribe anything else because it has to go through him. He refuses to give anything more EVEN after both have written letters asking for it.

My RA doctor keeps bringing up MJ too. he won't come out and say it but he keeps hinting that IF i smoke it do it only twice a day lol

 

[xj0hnx]

yeah tell me about it. its fucking insane.

as it is even with a documented chronic illness you are still under a microscope on pain meds.

My PCG and RA doctor are amazed that my pain med doctor won't prescribe anything higher then Vicodin. They CAN'T prescribe anything else because it has to go through him. He refuses to give anything more EVEN after both have written letters asking for it.

My RA doctor keeps bringing up MJ too. he won't come out and say it but he keeps hinting that IF i smoke it do it only twice a day lol

You need to switch PMD then.

 

[waggy]

You need to switch PMD then.

can't. in most cases you sign a contract to not switch PMD. Also there are none in this area besides him.

swapping pain doctors is a sign of drug abuse. it shows you are looking for a doctor to give you that "high". so you sign a contract that says you have to stay with the one. and if you doctor shop you will be stuck without one.

 

[xj0hnx]

can't. in most cases you sign a contract to not switch PMD. Also there are none in this area besides him.

swapping pain doctors is a sign of drug abuse. it shows you are looking for a doctor to give you that "high". so you sign a contract that says you have to stay with the one. and if you doctor shop you will be stuck without one.

You can switch if they will give you a referral to another pain management clinic. Mine did this because he and I had a disagreement about treatment, he was like yours. However if there isn't another clinic in your area, if RA is arthritis then I would look for another specialist if there is one in your area, they can prescribe whatever is available, but you might need to leave you pain management doctor for him to be able to, since you are right, they have those bullshit contracts.

 

[Darwin333]

QFT. Spend a day in an ER you'll realize how big of a problem this is.

Just give them the damn drugs and you will see costs come WAY down....

 

[Darwin333]

no. there would still be junkies. but nothing is really going to fix that.

my issue is are those in chronic pain really the people the feds should be going after?

I think his point was, if you just give the junkies the damn drugs in the first place then doctors are free to treat people who actually need and are seeking proper and responsible treatment.

 

[waggy]

Just give them the damn drugs and you will see costs come WAY down....

wrong. cost will shoot up.

why? say the doctor gives John a script for some great pain pills. Even though john has NO history of chronic pain and has no real reason to be in pain.

John takes pills and gets a high. he decides he wants to go to denny's for breakfast. on the way he hits a buss full of 1st graders and kills them.

Who do you think the Feds, lawyers adn parents are going to place the blame with?

 

[Darwin333]

A problem exists separating the fakers from the real thing.

Look at MJ as a perfect example

So the solution is to either A. fuck over the people in serious pain who desperately need help while the junkies continue being junkies or B. let the junkies continue being junkies anyway and treat people properly....... Yeah, A sounds like a much better way to do it and is in fact the way we are currently doing it.

 

[xj0hnx]

Just give them the damn drugs and you will see costs come WAY down....

Agreed.

It's a fact that no matter how long, or hard the WoD™ rages, there are always going to be people that do drugs, junkies, alcoholics, etc ..., if they were legalized not only would our prison population drop dramatically, the ER's wouldn't be a place people went seeking drugs to get high.

 

[xj0hnx]

wrong. cost will shoot up.

why? say the doctor gives John a script for some great pain pills. Even though john has NO history of chronic pain and has no real reason to be in pain.

John takes pills and gets a high. he decides he wants to go to denny's for breakfast. on the way he hits a buss full of 1st graders and kills them.

Who do you think the Feds, lawyers adn parents are going to place the blame with?

Say John goes to the store and buys a bottle of Jack, and chugs the whole thing, and decides he wants to go to Denny's for ...dead kids in a school bus.

The point is that there is no moral difference between drugs, and alcohol, and realistically, if John got all high on pain pills, he probably wouldn't want to go anywhere, especially to eat.

 

[Darwin333]

can't. in most cases you sign a contract to not switch PMD. Also there are none in this area besides him.

swapping pain doctors is a sign of drug abuse. it shows you are looking for a doctor to give you that "high". so you sign a contract that says you have to stay with the one. and if you doctor shop you will be stuck without one.

Wow.... So you don't even get some sort of "trial" period where you can evaluate the pain doctor before you sign the contract? I have seen a few doctors that I just wasn't comfortable with them and their diagnosis for some reason or another and went to a different one. I wasn't "shopping" around for a specific diagnoses but I was "shopping" for a doctor whom I trusted and was comfortable with whatever diagnosis they gave me. Not being able to do that with a doctor, regardless the type, is really screwed up.

 

[xj0hnx]

A problem exists separating the fakers from the real thing.

Look at MJ as a perfect example

No amount of prohibition has ever stopped people from getting drunk/high.

 

[xj0hnx]

Wow.... So you don't even get some sort of "trial" period where you can evaluate the pain doctor before you sign the contract? I have seen a few doctors that I just wasn't comfortable with them and their diagnosis for some reason or another and went to a different one. I wasn't "shopping" around for a specific diagnoses but I was "shopping" for a doctor whom I trusted and was comfortable with whatever diagnosis they gave me. Not being able to do that with a doctor, regardless the type, is really screwed up.

Yip, pain management clinics have contracts you have to sign before they will even see you. You pretty much sign away any recourse in treatment, it's ridiculous, and one of the reasons I stopped going to mine.

 

[Darwin333]

wrong. cost will shoot up.

why? say the doctor gives John a script for some great pain pills. Even though john has NO history of chronic pain and has no real reason to be in pain.

John takes pills and gets a high. he decides he wants to go to denny's for breakfast. on the way he hits a buss full of 1st graders and kills them.

Who do you think the Feds, lawyers adn parents are going to place the blame with?

What makes you think that John isn't already going to find someway to get high and kill the buss of 1st graders anyway? And I am not talking about the ER, send him to a freaking pharmacy in the parking lot or something so they aren't in the ER at all. The costs to the system for people like that are insane because NONE of them ever have insurance or money to pay for the visit yet they have to be treated just like everyone else. Even worse is there is always someone with an actual problem that must wait, and potentially get worse/more expensive to treat, while the staff wastes time with the junkie. If the junkie could just get the pills elsewhere the problem wouldn't exist.

 

[waggy]

Wow.... So you don't even get some sort of "trial" period where you can evaluate the pain doctor before you sign the contract? I have seen a few doctors that I just wasn't comfortable with them and their diagnosis for some reason or another and went to a different one. I wasn't "shopping" around for a specific diagnoses but I was "shopping" for a doctor whom I trusted and was comfortable with whatever diagnosis they gave me. Not being able to do that with a doctor, regardless the type, is really screwed up.

nope. to see a doctor the first thing you do is sign the contract. You have to select 1 pharmacy that ALL medicaction goes through. you agree to not doctor shop, you will call if you go to the ER so they can ok any pain meds. Any pain meds are done ONLY through the Pain clinic etc etc.

i have heard of stories of people trying to change pain doctors because of situations like mine. When they do they are now "doctor shopping" and are banned from ANY pain clinic. Since some areas have it the only way to get high levels of pain maids is through the pain clinic it can fuck you up.

Say John goes to the store and buys a bottle of Jack, and chugs the whole thing, and decides he wants to go to Denny's for ...dead kids in a school bus.

The point is that there is no moral difference between drugs, and alcohol, and realistically, if John got all high on pain pills, he probably wouldn't want to go anywhere, especially to eat.

i agree. just saying why they won't. Also the war on drugs makes to many to much money. They have to continue to demonize drugs (all drugs).

 

[Darwin333]

Yip, pain management clinics have contracts you have to sign before they will even see you. You pretty much sign away any recourse in treatment, it's ridiculous, and one of the reasons I stopped going to mine.

Good lord. I also don't see why you would even go to a pain management clinic just for vicodin.... When I was going through my back issues my GP was writing me a crap ton of them for basically the entire process even though I was seeing numerous other specialists. I always thought pain management was just for the really strong stuff that normal doctors aren't comfortable writing and/or managing.

 

[Darwin333]

nope. to see a doctor the first thing you do is sign the contract. You have to select 1 pharmacy that ALL medicaction goes through. you agree to not doctor shop, you will call if you go to the ER so they can ok any pain meds. Any pain meds are done ONLY through the Pain clinic etc etc.

So if you go to the ER for a broken leg at midnight you can't take any pain meds they give you until the pain management clinic answers the phone and oks it??? Really? Have we really gotten that bad?

 

[waggy]

Good lord. I also don't see why you would even go to a pain management clinic just for vicodin.... When I was going through my back issues my GP was writing me a crap ton of them for basically the entire process even though I was seeing numerous other specialists. I always thought pain management was just for the really strong stuff that normal doctors aren't comfortable writing and/or managing.

yeah its insane. My doctor refuses to give me anything higher then vicodin. he is afraid that i will get addicted to them.

i rarely take the vicodin as it is. but there are those days even that does nothing for the pain. wish he would give me something stronger for those days.

So if you go to the ER for a broken leg at midnight you can't take any pain meds they give you until the pain management clinic answers the phone and oks it??? Really? Have we really gotten that bad?

pretty much it.

They want to keep people from selling it (i hear vicodin goes for alot per pill) or just trying to get a high. So they need to cross check to make sure he didn't do anything and milking it.

 

[Darwin333]

No amount of prohibition has ever stopped people from getting drunk/high.

IMO, the very first step to ending prohibition should be to repeal any and all seizure/forfeit laws that benefit ANY enforcement agencies. Why do you think cops enforce drug laws the way they currently do? Its because it is absurdly profitable for them to do so.

 

[Darwin333]

yeah its insane. My doctor refuses to give me anything higher then vicodin. he is afraid that i will get addicted to them.

i rarely take the vicodin as it is. but there are those days even that does nothing for the pain. wish he would give me something stronger for those days.

That is such bullshit. Addicted to pain meds and being able to get through the day without wanting to blow your brains out and then treating the addiction should you ever not need the meds anymore is absurdly better than the alternative.

I am not sure how hydrocodone works at higher dosages but if a larger dose would help but you are concerned about the APAP you should look up "cold water extraction". Relatively quick and easy.

 

[waggy]

IMO, the very first step to ending prohibition should be to repeal any and all seizure/forfeit laws that benefit ANY enforcement agencies. Why do you think cops enforce drug laws the way they currently do? Its because it is absurdly profitable for them to do so.

This and so much this. The siezure/forfeiter laws have gone beyond what the are for. now its a way for them to get rich.

That is such bullshit. Addicted to pain meds and being able to get through the day without wanting to blow your brains out and then treating the addiction should you ever not need the meds anymore is absurdly better than the alternative.

I am not sure how hydrocodone works at higher dosages but if a larger dose would help but you are concerned about the APAP you should look up "cold water extraction". Relatively quick and easy.

oddly i had a visit with my RA doctor today. we had a long talk about APAP. he hates teh shit and says to avoid it any cost (and again brought up pot..i don't think im picking up his hints..lol).