Is AMD 960K Athlon Excavator likely to beat intel 2500K sandy bridge?

[RaistlinZ]

Oh crap, not this again.

^ Sooo this.

 

[tential]

^ Sooo this.

What do you expect? He's new, the conversation is therefore new to him. Obviously you're going to be tired of it but there will always be new members who haven't talked about it before and will want to.

 

[Spawne32]

Will Carrizo even have a FM2+ variant? It seems like so far they've only talked mobile versions.

Speculation is yes, but I don't understand why they wont advertise it with the upcoming holiday buying season, unless its that far out that it wont matter if they push the roadmaps around christmas to get people hyped. Honestly I am considering ditching this brand new 860K system and building a mATX G3258 system just to cover me till broadwell hits. The 860K had some marked improvements over my 8320 @ 4ghz but it's not cutting it where I want it to, which is games.

 

[tential]

Speculation is yes, but I don't understand why they wont advertise it with the upcoming holiday buying season, unless its that far out that it wont matter if they push the roadmaps around christmas to get people hyped. Honestly I am considering ditching this brand new 860K system and building a mATX G3258 system just to cover me till broadwell hits. The 860K had some marked improvements over my 8320 @ 4ghz but it's not cutting it where I want it to, which is games.

Not sure why you get an 860k and a 8320e....

Not purchasing both of those, you could have actually gotten an i5 4690k. Reading some benchmark charts would have really helped.

 

[Abwx]

Honestly I am considering ditching this brand new 860K system and building a mATX G3258 system just to cover me till broadwell hits. The 860K had some marked improvements over my 8320 @ 4ghz but it's not cutting it where I want it to, which is games.

3258 review :

http://www.anandtech.com/show/8232/...y-edition-review-the-intel-pentium-g3258-ae/4

8370 review to check other CPUs in comparison, particularly the 4 cores FX wich is close to a 860K :

http://www.anandtech.com/show/8427/amd-fx-8370e-cpu-review-vishera-95w/3

 

[ShintaiDK]

Thanks IdontCare

I had no idea this is how things worked. I just taught because Qualcomm has half the money of intel and growing rapidly that being second richest after intel and vastly richer than AMD that they would be able to compete with intel.

Now that you explain it I can see why this isn't the case.

No wonder intel cannot compete with Qualcomm in smartphones and tablets.

However I fear dark days ahead if AMD ever goes bankrupt and decides to quit the X86 market like all the rest. Imagine what would happen if intel had a monopoly?

I also wonder how the world would have turned out if intel didn't use illegal mafia tactics and threats for companies not to buy AMD
Maybe the EU courts should have granted AMD a lot more than just a billion euros in damages?

what you guys think would be the outcome today if intel played fair instead of illegal and mafia?

After the whole Pentium D failure and getting beaten by Athlon X2 series I think intel saw AMD as a real threat and decided Mafia and threats was the only way to keep AMD down.

Nobody wants AMD because its a terrible bad deal. If anything they buy AMD for IP and close everything. You have to be lucky to even continue the dGPU production. And AMD is more or a less a one hit company. They had K8 and then it was it. Its AMDs owns fault for being in the position they are in. Delaying 65nm, buying ATI, living on the dreams they could just sell 300$ and up CPUs only etc.

You keep looping in the same crap and its still as wrong as ever. You really need to move on.

 

[john5220]

Here we go again with "Illegal Mafia tactics"..
It's business. nothing more..
AMD used to win a few.. not so much anymore..
Why whine about it?

People call an assassination "business" aswell

No need to sugar coat what it truly is, its illegal and criminal bottom line.

How much does intel pay you to troll forums btw?


Insulting other members is not allowed here
Markfw900

 

[john5220]

Nobody wants AMD because its a terrible bad deal. If anything they buy AMD for IP and close everything. You have to be lucky to even continue the dGPU production. And AMD is more or a less a one hit company. They had K8 and then it was it. Its AMDs owns fault for being in the position they are in. Delaying 65nm, buying ATI, living on the dreams they could just sell 300$ and up CPUs only etc.

You keep looping in the same crap and its still as wrong as ever. You really need to move on.

I understand that you are comfortable gaming without a discrete video card. And banking on intel iGPU. But AMD acquiring ATI was the best thing they ever did. This is mainly why they have been destroying intel in APU sector.

Have you ever seen how much of a joke the i3 HD 4000 is compared to a A10 6800k? Hell even a A8 APU is vastly better at a fraction of the price of a i7. intel's integrated GPU is rubbish and so are their drivers.

Since you are a iGPU gamer I would have expected you to be going AMD. Intel has nothing on AMD when it comes to GPU they are a joke.

I would imagine AMD does very well in 3rd world countries. Most people there prefer buy a cheap PC that can do everything, APU plays the best role here. i actually laugh at all those people I know who have those HP desktop PC with i5 and no video cards.

My 7850 radeon literally destroys any intel GPU. When my friends see my PC which cost less btw, and how I can run almost all games on max 1080p with 4X AA very smooth. They are in envy really... I have a haswell i3 because I play specific games but for the vast majority of casual gamers who play COD and FIFA.

An AMD APU is vastly better for them. If only desktop PCs came with AMD APU. They are still coming with these garbage intel iGPU and people are having a hard time gaming on them. to get AMD APU you have to build a system yourself, kinda sad. I bet intel is still bribing HP and DELL to ship out these garbage i5 systems with no video cards and clueless joes keep buying them to play games on.

Most people have 0 clue whatsoever what a video card or a CPU is.

 

[Burpo]

People call an assassination "business" aswell

No need to sugar coat what it truly is, its illegal and criminal bottom line.

How much does intel pay you to troll forums btw?

I do it for free.. To help the misguided

I don't recall any criminal proceedings against intel.. The government must not share your opinion

 

[Insomniator]

I understand that you are comfortable gaming without a discrete video card. And banking on intel iGPU. But AMD acquiring ATI was the best thing they ever did. This is mainly why they have been destroying intel in APU sector.

Have you ever seen how much of a joke the i3 HD 4000 is compared to a A10 6800k? Hell even a A8 APU is vastly better at a fraction of the price of a i7. intel's integrated GPU is rubbish and so are their drivers.

Since you are a iGPU gamer I would have expected you to be going AMD. Intel has nothing on AMD when it comes to GPU they are a joke.

I would imagine AMD does very well in 3rd world countries. Most people there prefer buy a cheap PC that can do everything, APU plays the best role here. i actually laugh at all those people I know who have those HP desktop PC with i5 and no video cards.

My 7850 radeon literally destroys any intel GPU. When my friends see my PC which cost less btw, and how I can run almost all games on max 1080p with 4X AA very smooth. They are in envy really... I have a haswell i3 because I play specific games but for the vast majority of casual gamers who play COD and FIFA.

An AMD APU is vastly better for them. If only desktop PCs came with AMD APU. They are still coming with these garbage intel iGPU and people are having a hard time gaming on them. to get AMD APU you have to build a system yourself, kinda sad. I bet intel is still bribing HP and DELL to ship out these garbage i5 systems with no video cards and clueless joes keep buying them to play games on.

Most people have 0 clue whatsoever what a video card or a CPU is.

I think this thread is nearing its end...

 

[Yuriman]

You make some valid points, but even your 7850, which is basically entry level these days, is still 3x faster than AMD's top APU. I'll grant you that AMD's iGPUs trash Intel's and often make the difference between not being able to play a game at all, and having a game play acceptably at very low settings, but a vast majority of people don't game on their PCs and would be better suited with a Celeron that offers the same desktop experience for $50 less. It would be nice to see some offerings from the major vendors that include APUs in their lowest end PCs, but the for something like $50 more you can get a PC that's capable of 3x the framerates. APUs are unfortunately getting into the realm of "so cheap you're starting to lose value" if you're comparing FPS per dollar.

EDIT: Might want to take a look at the thread Haswell i3-4150 vs FX 8320/e for budget gaming rig?

 

[tential]

I understand that you are comfortable gaming without a discrete video card. And banking on intel iGPU. But AMD acquiring ATI was the best thing they ever did. This is mainly why they have been destroying intel in APU sector.

Have you ever seen how much of a joke the i3 HD 4000 is compared to a A10 6800k? Hell even a A8 APU is vastly better at a fraction of the price of a i7. intel's integrated GPU is rubbish and so are their drivers.

Since you are a iGPU gamer I would have expected you to be going AMD. Intel has nothing on AMD when it comes to GPU they are a joke.

I would imagine AMD does very well in 3rd world countries. Most people there prefer buy a cheap PC that can do everything, APU plays the best role here. i actually laugh at all those people I know who have those HP desktop PC with i5 and no video cards.

My 7850 radeon literally destroys any intel GPU. When my friends see my PC which cost less btw, and how I can run almost all games on max 1080p with 4X AA very smooth. They are in envy really... I have a haswell i3 because I play specific games but for the vast majority of casual gamers who play COD and FIFA.

An AMD APU is vastly better for them. If only desktop PCs came with AMD APU. They are still coming with these garbage intel iGPU and people are having a hard time gaming on them. to get AMD APU you have to build a system yourself, kinda sad. I bet intel is still bribing HP and DELL to ship out these garbage i5 systems with no video cards and clueless joes keep buying them to play games on.

Most people have 0 clue whatsoever what a video card or a CPU is.

So you talk about how great the AMD APU is, yet you still purchase an intel CPU+AMD GPU....

And now we know exactly why the AMD APU is where it is....
-------------
Why you would think Dell/HP would put an AMD APU in their systems when the majority of people purchasing these systems are purchasing it for general day to day tasks and NOT for gaming is beyond me.

Most of your post really is not sound business practice. IF the AMD APU was that amazing, people would use it. Yet most people avoid it like the plague... Save for a FEW niche circumstances.

 

[john5220]

So you talk about how great the AMD APU is, yet you still purchase an intel CPU+AMD GPU....

And now we know exactly why the AMD APU is where it is....
-------------
Why you would think Dell/HP would put an AMD APU in their systems when the majority of people purchasing these systems are purchasing it for general day to day tasks and NOT for gaming is beyond me.

Most of your post really is not sound business practice. IF the AMD APU was that amazing, people would use it. Yet most people avoid it like the plague... Save for a FEW niche circumstances.

I purchased a i3 based on recommendations on this forum

The i3 still stinks in my usage of Unreal Engine 4 rendering development compared to a 8 CORE FX amd would is on the level of a i7

But I like to play DayZ also which performs better on intel, "case of poor optimization of a early access Alpha game and not because of AMD"

So i am not sure where you are going with your ignorance.

AMD APU is years ahead of what intel has to offer. Most people who go into a store buy a PC based on a brand name like DELL or HP and they go home expecting to game on it because their parents or whatever the case is isn't willing to spend much much more on a system with video card..

In reality for much lower price a AMD APU system could be built if you know how to builds computers.

This forum has a handful of PC gamers compared to the reality out there.
Majority of consumers who game do not even know what a CPU is and takes using the manual to locate the power button.

So yes when someone buys a i5 PC for big money and realize a crappy "AMD" APU system destroys it you can't help but feel these people's money would have been best spent on AMD

Also in the real world everyday usage you cannot even tell the difference between a desktop A10/A8/FX and a i3/i5/i7

my school has a haswell system with i7 that we use for Engineering purposes and there is no difference in a blind test with my older AMD system.

if you think the average consumer knows or cares about those fancy benchmark tests that intel wins then you are living in LA LA land. People just want a system that could play games and do everyday tasks for a good price. Intel integrated GPU does NOT give good value for money at all.
The people I know has never even heard of DayZ, I am just one of the few who plays these specific games like DayZ and Starcraft 2 and Diablo 3.

In my case a intel chip was better for gaming due to single threaded performance. Most of what is coming out now supports 4 threads and more.
AMD CPU runs damn fine in Battlefield 4 especially with Mantle enabled. And in future the 8 core FX will be a better performer than the i3 when games start using 8 threads. And the 8 core AMD is same price or cheaper than i3

Insulting other members is not allowed here
Markfw900

 

[tential]

I purchased a i3 based on recommendations on this forum

The i3 still stinks in my usage of Unreal Engine 4 rendering development compared to a 8 CORE FX amd would is on the level of a i7

But I like to play DayZ also which performs better on intel, "case of poor optimization of a early access Alpha game and not because of AMD"

So i am not sure where you are going with your ignorance.

AMD APU is years ahead of what intel has to offer. Most people who go into a store buy a PC based on a brand name like DELL or HP and they go home expecting to game on it because their parents or whatever the case is isn't willing to spend much much more on a system with video card..

In reality for much lower price a AMD APU system could be built if you know how to builds computers.

This forum has a handful of PC gamers compared to the reality out there.
Majority of consumers who game do not even know what a CPU is and takes using the manual to locate the power button.

So yes when someone buys a i5 PC for big money and realize a crappy "AMD" APU system destroys it you can't help but feel these people's money would have been best spent on AMD

Also in the real world everyday usage you cannot even tell the difference between a desktop A10/A8/FX and a i3/i5/i7

my school has a haswell system with i7 that we use for Engineering purposes and there is no difference in a blind test with my older AMD system.

if you think the average consumer knows or cares about those fancy benchmark tests that intel wins then you are living in LA LA land. People just want a system that could play games and do everyday tasks for a good price. Intel integrated GPU does NOT give good value for money at all.
The people I know has never even heard of DayZ, I am just one of the few who plays these specific games like DayZ and Starcraft 2 and Diablo 3.

In my case a intel chip was better for gaming due to single threaded performance. Most of what is coming out now supports 4 threads and more.
AMD CPU runs damn fine in Battlefield 4 especially with Mantle enabled. And in future the 8 core FX will be a better performer than the i3 when games start using 8 threads. And the 8 core AMD is same price or cheaper than i3

So the average consumer is a gamer who goes into a store to purchaser a gaming rig with their parents?

Wow... I guess I really am ignorant.

I'm really happy though that the fx8xxx is starting to compete with i3s. Good for amd.

 

[Maximilian]

This forum has a handful of PC gamers compared to the reality out there.
Majority of consumers who game do not even know what a CPU is and takes using the manual to locate the power button.

They are known as "console gaming peasants" and do not matter in discussions here.

 

[ShintaiDK]

I understand that you are comfortable gaming without a discrete video card. And banking on intel iGPU. But AMD acquiring ATI was the best thing they ever did. This is mainly why they have been destroying intel in APU sector.

Have you ever seen how much of a joke the i3 HD 4000 is compared to a A10 6800k? Hell even a A8 APU is vastly better at a fraction of the price of a i7. intel's integrated GPU is rubbish and so are their drivers.

Since you are a iGPU gamer I would have expected you to be going AMD. Intel has nothing on AMD when it comes to GPU they are a joke.

I would imagine AMD does very well in 3rd world countries. Most people there prefer buy a cheap PC that can do everything, APU plays the best role here. i actually laugh at all those people I know who have those HP desktop PC with i5 and no video cards.

My 7850 radeon literally destroys any intel GPU. When my friends see my PC which cost less btw, and how I can run almost all games on max 1080p with 4X AA very smooth. They are in envy really... I have a haswell i3 because I play specific games but for the vast majority of casual gamers who play COD and FIFA.

An AMD APU is vastly better for them. If only desktop PCs came with AMD APU. They are still coming with these garbage intel iGPU and people are having a hard time gaming on them. to get AMD APU you have to build a system yourself, kinda sad. I bet intel is still bribing HP and DELL to ship out these garbage i5 systems with no video cards and clueless joes keep buying them to play games on.

Most people have 0 clue whatsoever what a video card or a CPU is.

Buying ATI was the worst thing ever. There is no excuse for that. ATI would most likely have been better of without AMD. And a lot of ATI fans would like to see ATI seperated from AMD again. Buying ATI was another highlight of the arrogance inside AMD. Same that delayed 65nm on purpose because they couldnt imagine Conroe. And the same company that wanted only to sell you 300$+ CPUs because the rest was beneath them. While the CEO got caught with insider trading and another CEO got sued by investors.

And you claim AMD is destroying Intel due to its APUs. Why isnt this shown in the sales. Maybe its because they tend to buy a dGPU for gaming. Specially since you get more performance/$ in most cases with a CPU+dGPU than an APU. The place where you buy an APU but not a dGPU and game is very tiny at best.

Also I play on a GTX980, not sure where you got the IGP notion from. But again, it may be from the same place as the rest of your fiction, tinfoiling and nonsense.

 

[BSim500]

"my school has a haswell system..."

"Most people who go into a store buy a PC based on a brand name like DELL or HP and they go home expecting to game on it because their parents or whatever the case is isn't willing to spend much much more..."

Ah, the penny drops...

I think this thread is nearing its end...

Agree 100%.

 

[tential]

Do you even consider what you post, or is there some other agenda attached?

Buying ATI was the worst thing ever. There is no excuse for that. ATI would most likely have been better of without AMD. And a lot of ATI fans would like to see ATI seperated from AMD again.

And you claim AMD is destroying Intel due to its APUs. Why isnt this shown in the sales. Maybe its because they tend to buy a dGPU for gaming. Specially since you get more performance/$ in most cases with a CPU+dGPU than an APU. The place where you buy an APU but not a dGPU and game is very tiny at best.

Also I play on a GTX980, not sure where you got the IGP notion from. But again, it may be from the same place as the rest of your fiction, tinfoiling and nonsense.

AMD's banking on Fusion was a massive mistake... They tried to innovate too fast and paid the ultimate price.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Its also a conflict of interest when you try to sell both APUs and dGPUs. Specially since the IGP is more or less considered value added and nothing more.

 

[NTMBK]

Given that APUs from Intel and AMD have completely taken over the laptop market, I would say that betting on APUs was not a bad idea. The problem was not the GPU, it was the poor CPU it was attached to.

 

[Arachnotronic]

Given that APUs from Intel and AMD have completely taken over the laptop market, I would say that betting on APUs was not a bad idea. The problem was not the GPU, it was the poor CPU it was attached to.

"APUs" are just a marketing term for system-on-chip.

More integration for thermally/battery constrained devices is always a good thing

 

[ShintaiDK]

Given that APUs from Intel and AMD have completely taken over the laptop market, I would say that betting on APUs was not a bad idea. The problem was not the GPU, it was the poor CPU it was attached to.

Paying 5.5B$ for it was the bad idea. Not the concept. And even worse, when you internally compete against your own products.

 

[NTMBK]

"APUs" are just a marketing term for system-on-chip.

More integration for thermally/battery constrained devices is always a good thing

I try to use "APU" for when it integrates the GPU and NB, but not SB/PCH/FCH... but yeah, it's all just marketing terms for the most part!

 

[NTMBK]

Paying 5.5B$ for it was the bad idea. Not the concept.

Hah, yeah. No idea how the heck ATi managed to convince AMD they were worth that much. Someone (or several someones) got a very nice payday from that.

 

[Arachnotronic]

Hah, yeah. No idea how the heck ATi managed to convince AMD they were worth that much. Someone (or several someones) got a very nice payday from that.

They should have bought Imagination. Hell, ARM now has best-in-class GPU IP from its acquistion of tiny Falanx Microsystems.