Not the case at all. But several people here are saying AGP is dead, or will be very shortly which just isn't the case. I've been building my own systems for about 10 years now and one thing I have learned is things don't die easily, unless they are complete trash to begin with. Yes, pcie is the future and agp will be phased out eventually and that is a good thing, evolution is neccessary. But don't try to kill off something that is still the mainstream and completely viable and easily available, and for all intents and purposes just as good at the moment. agp will die yes, but it will be a slow death.
Not the case at all. But several people here are saying AGP is dead, or will be very shortly which just isn't the case. I've been building my own systems for about 10 years now and one thing I have learned is things don't die easily, unless they are complete trash to begin with. Yes, pcie is the future and agp will be phased out eventually and that is a good thing, evolution is neccessary. But don't try to kill off something that is still the mainstream and completely viable and easily available, and for all intents and purposes just as good at the moment. agp will die yes, but it will be a slow death.
Its simple economics really.
95% of all motherboards out there have and AGP slot. Only 5% have pci-e. And that 5% is probably a high estimate. Where is the money for the manufacturers?
Its still in AGP.. and it will be for few more years, until PCI-e out there out # the AGP.
Right now, when you want the best bang for your buck on and upgrade to your computer, what the 2 things they suggest most? Memory and video card. Whose doing upgrades? People with established systems. What kind of card do those people want? AGP.
Its simple economics. Why would manufacturer make a PCI-e card, when it only hits a very small percentage of the market. You are looking at 2-3 years before the AGP is "dead".
thats my 2 cents.
Chris
95% of all motherboards out there have and AGP slot. Only 5% have pci-e. And that 5% is probably a high estimate. Where is the money for the manufacturers?
Its still in AGP.. and it will be for few more years, until PCI-e out there out # the AGP.
Right now, when you want the best bang for your buck on and upgrade to your computer, what the 2 things they suggest most? Memory and video card. Whose doing upgrades? People with established systems. What kind of card do those people want? AGP.
Its simple economics. Why would manufacturer make a PCI-e card, when it only hits a very small percentage of the market. You are looking at 2-3 years before the AGP is "dead".
thats my 2 cents.
Chris
that's a good point, which is why i've been a bit stumped over ati pushing so hard for pci-e....
both ati and nvidia.. oh and intel
have all stated that this will be a fast turnover. unlike past transitions.i personally just do not want to chance it. others may do as they will.
but on teh 5% marketshare comment... i bet that number is growing exponentially as dell is shipping PCIE systems.
ATI is wanting to cater to Dell.. where the money is.. and even though we think we are "in the know", when big boys like ATI and Dell team up to push PCIE, we will either use it.. or not find a video card.
Once the OEMs are on board.. I generally follow suit.. you shouldnt be "behind" technology compared to OEMs! We are enthusiasts! It doesnt make sense for US to use older tech, we should be AHEAD of OEMs, not behind.
I for one, fear the almighty power that dell commands. They put 50% of the american marketplace with PCIE systems.. and watch AGP die fast, not slow.
Yeah housecat... it's a tough call... but... I think AGP has a lot of inertia... and people will be wanting AGP for a few years. Heck, you can still buy PCI cards too..hehe... altho they certainly are not as common as they used to be.
Jeff
Jeff
Originally posted by: housecat
both ati and nvidia.. oh and intel
i personally just do not want to chance it. others may do as they will. <snip>
well, at least they want it to be.. but it irritates me that they try to dictate the market. i have no problems upgrading or changing platforms - but not until we as consumers can realize the benefits of said platforms.
some of you old timers in here can certainly remember when VLB was being pushed as the "future", but early adopters took it in the shorts as most consumers held out - and VLB was dropped in favor of pci, and later agp. there's a reason migrations such as this should take time, especially when they offer no immediate benefits over the earlier standard.
Originally posted by: CaiNaM
Originally posted by: housecat
both ati and nvidia.. oh and intel
i personally just do not want to chance it. others may do as they will. <snip>
well, at least they want it to be.. but it irritates me that they try to dictate the market. i have no problems upgrading or changing platforms - but not until we as consumers can realize the benefits of said platforms.
some of you old timers in here can certainly remember when VLB was being pushed as the "future", but early adopters took it in the shorts as most consumers held out - and VLB was dropped in favor of pci, and later agp. there's a reason migrations such as this should take time, especially when they offer no immediate benefits over the earlier standard.
i had a VLB video card..
my only problem with the idea that consumers should change the platforms instead of the companys pushing it on us that if you examine a different market, the games market..
you'll notice that the most played game for the last five years has been CS 1.6 and prior versions.
which is playable on a GF2MX.
basically i dont think that huge portion of gamers would ever change or move ahead graphically, or otherwise unless HL2/CSS was released!
sad but true.
if people can get away with using a GF2MX they will. someones got to push this stuff on us.
but i will admit, currently i play CSS in DX7 mode.. for max FPS.. all i care about in that game is killing faces..
i see a face I KILL IT.. DIE DIE DIE!
dont get me wrong im not disagreeing with you guys.
i am just too scared to build a new system right now with AGP.. i'd really like to know whats going to happen here with PCIE.. i have a aching feeling it could explode overnight once the availability problem is fixed.
that should be alieviated with ATI pushing PCIE in these new cards. but of course they are, they are making akilling off their dell partnership. i'd do the same thing.
i don't forsee "avail problems" being fixed any time in the near future:
Availability and Pricing: Still Not Promising
Ever since the aforementioned companies launched their next generation of GPUs, they are having problems fulfilling customer orders. Whenever this question was raised, both companies promised better availability, but failed to deliver. NVIDIA is still better off than ATI, since they only have to take care of their GeForce 6 series, but ATI has been in more trouble ever since they announced their X850 product line with mid-range GPUs such as the X800 XL. This was the topic of concern at the show and we discussed their availability issues and prices in our meeting with both vendors.
NVIDIA and ATI both apologized for their poor chip yields and yet again, promised better delivery starting this month. ATI excessively stated that they will bring their X800 XL in mass quantities to the market sometime this month. Many consumers saw ATI and NVIDIA?s high-end graphics cards for retail at larger OEMs such as Voodoo PC, Alienware and Dell, which led us to wonder about the availability. For those of you who are not aware of this, ATI and NVIDIA?s main goal is to support larger OEMs first, since they purchase in volume or bulk quantities, therefore, generating higher revenue for both vendors. When there are limited quantities available and OEMs such as Dell demand more products, ATI must cater to their needs first, hence, leaving the end-consumer market and smaller OEMs waiting for better chip yields and availability in the future.
As far as prices are concerned, ATI and NVIDIA?s partners are having difficulty producing enough graphics cards to meet the demand, which obviously has led to higher prices. The graphics card makers we talked to on the show floor are also frustrated, since they are the ones having to answer consumer questions. The poor availability is also taking a toll on their sales revenue, which is expected, so their frustrations are completely legible.
When we discussed about their high-end offerings, they both slanted the question and informed that high-end graphics card market is very targeted, which means that availability will always be limited. This does not make too much sense considering that both companies were able to provide their previous generation of high-end graphics cards (5950 and 9800XT) in fair quantities and never posed this issue before. As far as we can tell, despite ATI and NVIDIA?s claims, the availability issue will somewhat improve in the future, but never to a surplus extent. All we can pronounce right now is to be on the lookout for the high-end cards of your desire and try to purchase them as soon as possible, assuming that the prices are reasonable.
Availability and prices are closely tied to each other and honestly the future doesn?t look too bright for ATI and NVIDIA?s better availability claims.
Availability and Pricing: Still Not Promising
Ever since the aforementioned companies launched their next generation of GPUs, they are having problems fulfilling customer orders. Whenever this question was raised, both companies promised better availability, but failed to deliver. NVIDIA is still better off than ATI, since they only have to take care of their GeForce 6 series, but ATI has been in more trouble ever since they announced their X850 product line with mid-range GPUs such as the X800 XL. This was the topic of concern at the show and we discussed their availability issues and prices in our meeting with both vendors.
NVIDIA and ATI both apologized for their poor chip yields and yet again, promised better delivery starting this month. ATI excessively stated that they will bring their X800 XL in mass quantities to the market sometime this month. Many consumers saw ATI and NVIDIA?s high-end graphics cards for retail at larger OEMs such as Voodoo PC, Alienware and Dell, which led us to wonder about the availability. For those of you who are not aware of this, ATI and NVIDIA?s main goal is to support larger OEMs first, since they purchase in volume or bulk quantities, therefore, generating higher revenue for both vendors. When there are limited quantities available and OEMs such as Dell demand more products, ATI must cater to their needs first, hence, leaving the end-consumer market and smaller OEMs waiting for better chip yields and availability in the future.
As far as prices are concerned, ATI and NVIDIA?s partners are having difficulty producing enough graphics cards to meet the demand, which obviously has led to higher prices. The graphics card makers we talked to on the show floor are also frustrated, since they are the ones having to answer consumer questions. The poor availability is also taking a toll on their sales revenue, which is expected, so their frustrations are completely legible.
When we discussed about their high-end offerings, they both slanted the question and informed that high-end graphics card market is very targeted, which means that availability will always be limited. This does not make too much sense considering that both companies were able to provide their previous generation of high-end graphics cards (5950 and 9800XT) in fair quantities and never posed this issue before. As far as we can tell, despite ATI and NVIDIA?s claims, the availability issue will somewhat improve in the future, but never to a surplus extent. All we can pronounce right now is to be on the lookout for the high-end cards of your desire and try to purchase them as soon as possible, assuming that the prices are reasonable.
Availability and prices are closely tied to each other and honestly the future doesn?t look too bright for ATI and NVIDIA?s better availability claims.
Sounds good to me... and when something is dead is such a gray area. Is the timex-sinclair dead? I think dead happens when A product is no longer being manufactured or covered under warranty or no support is available for it. I like to think AT slots are dead...lol. AGP will still be an option in 2 to 3 years since people will still be buying AGP cards for their 1-2 year old PC's and stuff... the cards will still be manufactured but less and less until one day... it'll just stop.
I think dead will be the day when all manufacturers are no longer making AGP stuffs and people are resorting to ebay for their agp cards ;-)
Jeffy
I think dead will be the day when all manufacturers are no longer making AGP stuffs and people are resorting to ebay for their agp cards ;-)
Jeffy
Just because ATI, Nvidia and Intel are behind PCI-E is not an immediate death sentence for AGP. Nvidia and ATI have both developed a PCI-E to AGP bridge chip to cater to the overwhelming number of people who have AGP slots.
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