iPhone 8, headphone jack?

[bradly1101]

I'm thinking of Samsung's decision to add the SD card back to their S series. I think that was a wise decision. It's cool to have my entire music collection with me (and everything else). They realized their mistake and corrected it.

Which brings me to Apple's decision to remove the headphone jack, severely limiting its sound quality potential and getting roundly criticized for it.

So what do you think, will it return?

 

[Eug]

Huh? I guess you haven't heard but the headphones and even that tiny headphone jack dongle have a DAC built into them. Also, there have been no complaints over sound quality compared to the previous. The issue is the absence of the 3.5 mm jack not the sound quality over Lightning. If anything, the headphone geeks are excited at the prospect of new high end Lightning DAC converter boxes being released.

There is exactly a 0% chance that the next iPhone will have a built-in headphone jack.

 

[Kazukian]

They'll put it right next to the parallel port they're bringing back

 

[dainthomas]

No way it's coming back. Iphone users love dong(les).

 

[Crono]

Apple may be going in the right direction by removing the headphone jack, however I think they were too early, much as they were with not supporting Flash. For a few years there were plenty of sites you couldn't view properly on an iPhone, but could with an Android phone (if you had Flash installed, which I usually did). Apple will stick with no headphone jack and eventually everyone will follow suit... but probably not with the physical connector being Lightning. That's Apple being Apple again. USB-C is the near-term standard, which Apple for some reason only chose to use on the MacBook.

The reason they gave for removing the jack isn't a good one, though. Did they really need more space internally? From pics, it looks like a lot of it is taken up by a mechanical component: the "taptic engine". That's not a particularly innovative or forward-looking feature, despite the marketing spin and name. It's still just a vibration motor, even if it's special from some engineering standpoint.

 

[bradly1101]

That's not what I've heard (about the sound quality):

http://bgr.com/2016/09/20/iphone-7-headphones-jack-sound-test/

Edit: I guess it's not a big difference anyway.

 

[bradly1101]

Huh? I guess you haven't heard but the headphones and even that tiny headphone jack dongle have a DAC built into them. Also, there have been no complaints over sound quality compared to the previous. The issue is the absence of the 3.5 mm jack not the sound quality over Lightning. If anything, the headphone geeks are excited at the prospect of new high end Lightning DAC converter boxes being released.

There is exactly a 0% chance that the next iPhone will have a built-in headphone jack.

Can you charge and listen through headphones at the same time?

 

[bradly1101]

It's always fun to buy new hardware to support your new hardware, especially if it only works in one sphere.

 

[Roland00Address]

It is not coming back.

Apple engineers like the extra space it brings and they think it is worth the transition to do the removal of the headphone jack now even if it causes "growing pains" for the user.

For example the iphone 7 has a 14% larger battery than the 6s which has the same external dimensions. The iphone 7 also has optical image stabilization.

Now personally I think that increase battery is a good thing and I think it would make more sense to make the phone a little bit thicker and increase the 1960 mah battery to something like a 3000 mah battery. That said apple does not like my plan, they want the current thickness and the only way to get more space was to remove things.

 

[bradly1101]

It is not coming back.

Apple engineers like the extra space it brings and they think it is worth the transition to do the removal of the headphone jack now even if it causes "growing pains" for the user.

For example the iphone 7 has a 14% larger battery than the 6s which has the same external dimensions. The iphone 7 also has optical image stabilization.

Now personally I think that increase battery is a good thing and I think it would make more sense to make the phone a little bit thicker and increase the 1960 mah battery to something like a 3000 mah battery. That said apple does not like my plan, they want the current thickness and the only way to get more space was to remove things.

That makes sense. A big battery is nice. I only have to charge every other day. Proprietary is good for $$$.

 

[Kazukian]

The best part is people that don't have an iPhone and never will are so vocal about it.

I've had a ton of iPhones, haven't used a headphone jack in over a year on one. And last I heard, no one was forcing anyone to buy anything.

My G1 didn't have a headphone jack.

One of the reasons I have iPhones is because Bluetooth just flat sucked on every Android phone I tried.

 

[Crono]

The best part is people that don't have an iPhone and never will are so vocal about it.

I've had a ton of iPhones, haven't used a headphone jack in over a year on one. And last I heard, no one was forcing anyone to buy anything.

My G1 didn't have a headphone jack.

One of the reasons I have iPhones is because Bluetooth just flat sucked on every Android phone I tried.

The G1 sucked.
Also the first iPhone didn't have a standard 3.5mm jack that worked with regular headphones, either (something they addressed with the 3G, which did have a normal jack). It also sucked.

We may have nostalgia about those early Android and iPhone models, but the truth is they had more promise than actual functionality. The iPhone shipped with a lot of basic features missing. The early Android phones were laggy as hell, buggy, and had terrible battery life.

Removing the standard headphone jack is a step backwards... or is - at best - a less than ideal intermediate step towards a new, widely adopted standard (and if that is the case, like always, waiting for the S version or next number may be the better option for the Apple faithful). The 7 is mostly Apple adding in camera features that many Android phones have had without removing the headphone jack in order to do it. Did the iPhone *really* need to stay the same thickness and add the taptic engine?

I'll give Apple credit for having the "courage" to remove the headphone jack, but it's really only the same kind of narrow design philosophy that resulted in too few ports on their MacBooks and Mac Pros in the past. Apple's core competency these days seems to be in making elegant designs that require inelegant solutions to do anything practical. You may not need to use the dongle, but I'm betting most users will at some point.

Apple is always getting praise from the tech press for making changes, adding features, and entering new markets at exactly the right time, but I think this is too early from a consumer standpoint. For Apple, though, they are happy to plow forward since they have their customers locked-in, and will benefit from all the premium accessories and cables they can push.

But perhaps one of these days the execs at Apple will wake up and realize they've gone too far down the Sony route before it's too late. Unfortunately, it's more likely their culture is so monolithic and rigid that they'll drive the iPhone and iOS in the same unchanging direction - even as Android phones close the effective performance and design gap at much lower price points, while continuing to eat away at Apple's marketshare.

 

[Fingolfin269]

The best part is people that don't have an iPhone and never will are so vocal about it.

I've had a ton of iPhones, haven't used a headphone jack in over a year on one. And last I heard, no one was forcing anyone to buy anything.

My G1 didn't have a headphone jack.

One of the reasons I have iPhones is because Bluetooth just flat sucked on every Android phone I tried.

Yes and no. The problem we have now is that there are really only two OS choices. And if you prefer iOS, and want the latest hardware it will run on, then the only choice you have is to not have a headphone jack.

I've come around. I do use wired headphones quite a bit and know with absolute certainty that wireless is not up to snuff yet. However, I'm starting to think the trade off may be worth it because frankly I just don't want to deal with Android again after having two bad experiences previously.

The perfect world for me would be one where you could choose your hardware and then also choose your OS. But unfortunately that's not at all where we are.

 

[Kazukian]

I find Marshmallow to be a very good OS, if I was upset by the removal of the headphone jack, I'd simply switch, life goes on. I was running MM on my nexus 6 for months, and I'm looking at getting a OnePlus 3 for my Android phone (I've always got at least one)

As it happens, I've been using BT for years, I helped generate the user stats Apple looked at when they were making the decision.

I find app quality to continue to be better, and I like the integration of Apple's stuff.

LOL, just flipped a 7 Plus 32GB for $1000

 

[ControlD]

^^
You had problems with Bluetooth and your Nexus 6? It has been pretty flawless on mine. Sort of off topic, just curious.

 

[Kazukian]

^^
You had problems with Bluetooth and your Nexus 6? It has been pretty flawless on mine. Sort of off topic, just curious.

The nexus 6 was pretty good, it was the first one, I imagine the current gen flagships are much better than the ones I used.

 

[antihelten]

Apple may be going in the right direction by removing the headphone jack, however I think they were too early, much as they were with not supporting Flash.

I absolutely agree with this. Wireless really is the way to go (with everything really), but timing is definetly key here. They should have waited until Bluetooth 5 was ready.

It is not coming back.

Apple engineers like the extra space it brings and they think it is worth the transition to do the removal of the headphone jack now even if it causes "growing pains" for the user.

For example the iphone 7 has a 14% larger battery than the 6s which has the same external dimensions. The iphone 7 also has optical image stabilization.

Now personally I think that increase battery is a good thing and I think it would make more sense to make the phone a little bit thicker and increase the 1960 mah battery to something like a 3000 mah battery. That said apple does not like my plan, they want the current thickness and the only way to get more space was to remove things.

As Crono mentioned above, the extra space taken up by the 3.5mm jack is now taken up by a bigger taptic engine (the 6s also had a taptic engine), so the increased battery size and OIS has nothing to do with the removal of the 3.5mm jack. In fact the new bigger taptic engine has forced the battery to be moved further up inside the phone, so there is actually less room for it in this area in the iPhone 7.

iPhone 6s Plus:

iPhone 7 Plus:

In other words, if the had stayed with the 6S design (normal tactile button, 3.5mm jack, small taptic engine), then they could probably have fitted in an even bigger battery.

 

[Commodus]

One of the theories behind Apple ditching the headphone jack with the iPhone 7: it was definitely going to go away with the 2017 iPhone, so Apple decided that it would be better to get the uproar out of the way now than have it overshadow what would otherwise be a dramatic upgrade.

There's no guarantee this is true, of course, but it wouldn't be a bad idea.

My question: will the Galaxy S8 have a headphone jack? Samsung had fun touting the headphone jack as an advantage at the Note 7 event. However, this is a company that's almost neurotic about shadowing Apple's broader mobile strategy, even when it means losing features (see: the Galaxy S6).

 

[Roland00Address]

My G1 didn't have a headphone jack.

I had a G1 and this was one of the things I hated the most about this early google phone.

 

[Oyeve]

Well, the fact that the removed it to begin with so their loyalist will spend $$$ on their new wireless headphones, maybe they will bring it back, so their loyalist will buy new improved apple WIRED headphones.

 

[Mopetar]

I'm surprised someone voted yes. They obviously don't know Apple well.

The real question is what percent of Android flagship devices in the next few years will ditch the headphone jack as well.

My guess is that in two years it will be gone from almost all high-end devices.

 

[Oyeve]

I'm surprised someone voted yes. They obviously don't know Apple well.

The real question is what percent of Android flagship devices in the next few years will ditch the headphone jack as well.

My guess is that in two years it will be gone from almost all high-end devices.

That will be a sad day indeed. BUT, i will say this, if some manufacturer can come up with a compelling reason and actually put something into the device that will greatly improve sound, and I mean substantially improve sound, then I may embrace it.

 

[darkswordsman17]

That will be a sad day indeed. BUT, i will say this, if some manufacturer can come up with a compelling reason and actually put something into the device that will greatly improve sound, and I mean substantially improve sound, then I may embrace it.

Audiophiles will have all manner of things to push sound quality in the short term. DSP/DAC/amp integrated will enable them to push sound quality while also offering a lot of customization of sound quality to fit what people want. Longer term they'll likely find a way to directly beam audio (and completely bypassing a major weak link in our ears and how they affect how we hear) into the brain.

InnerFidelity has had a bunch of stuff about how the industry is moving to basically demanding DSP control as its necessary for them to push fidelity further. Simply getting the "in your head" or extreme channel separation, but also stuff like HRTF where the sound will change based on you changing your head. But plenty of other things (stuff like the Smyth Realiser), and more effective live reproduction. But even things like how "forward" sounding could be adjusted. This would bring higher end sound to more people in that they can make very good cheap drivers that are more than capable of being high end sounding (stuff like the cheap Fostex planars where improving the housing offers very good fidelity; for portable use balanced armature offers similar capability).

A lot of that sounds like stuff that has been available (but often gets frowned upon as it often has negative impacts on sound fidelity), they're really pushing to better understand and improve the digital processing. Tyll seems to think that it will bring about major changes (and improvements) to fidelity in the next few years.

Basically they're going to make headphones an integral part to the "smart" world/technology.

http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/aes-headphone-technology-conference-summary

 

[Eug]

I'm surprised someone voted yes. They obviously don't know Apple well.

The real question is what percent of Android flagship devices in the next few years will ditch the headphone jack as well.

My guess is that in two years it will be gone from almost all high-end devices.

My guess is that in two years it will still be there on most high end smartphones, except Apple's.

 

[Kazukian]

Looks like the HTC Bolt may be next. https://www.cnet.com/news/the-rumored-htc-bolt-could-be-another-phone-with-no-headphone-jack/