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Intellectual capability of career welfare individuals

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MooseNSquirrel said:
There is no data that supports most of the misinformation in this thread.

And really, the Welfare Queen meme ....again?

Sad.
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Just like republicans skew/omit data for their rich overlords, the democrats skew/omit data for their bought and paid for voter base aka welfare recipients.
 
momeNt said:
the democrats skew/omit data for their bought and paid for voter base aka welfare recipients.
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What would be a good term for a demographic that refuses to integrate with the rest of society? But also, a demographic that consumes more then they contribute?

The Amish are segmented from modern society, but they do not consume resources provided by the tax payer. They are their own self-contained and self-supportive unit.
 
Texashiker said:
I bought the chick when it was a couple of days old. For the past 5 months I have fed, watered, protected, and even built the chickens (13 chickens in all) a nice coop with an enclosed run.

The way I treated my chickens is "about" the same way the government treats those on welfare. The government feeds, protects and gives welfare recipients a place to live.
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Well it sounds like you understand government. This is the function of government. To fatten the cattle. Placate with handouts so that the unemployed masses will not get unruly. Because we cant have an unruly population refusing to watch its nightly propaganda (dancing with the stars etc). God forbid we have people getting informed and organized. Nope. We will go from the tv to the gas chamber in one swift swoosh. But it wont be like Nazi Germany. People here will be so dumbed down they will literally not even care as it happens.
 
Texashiker said:
What would be a good term for a demographic that refuses to integrate with the rest of society? But also, a demographic that consumes more then they contribute?

The Amish are segmented from modern society, but they do not consume resources provided by the tax payer. They are their own self-contained and self-supportive unit.
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They drive on the roads - but if they were not there they could get along just fine. Happens to be that the state put a road in the same location they already were using, so they just kept using it. Only now it is more dangerous for them to use these roads.
 
SlitheryDee said:
Say you chose a person randomly and gave them $20 every morning for 10 years straight. Then after 10 years you suddenly stop. Do you think they'd be grateful to you for the 10 years of getting $20 every morning that they did nothing for, or pissed at you for stopping?
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and this pretty much sums it all up.
 
I hate to break it to you all that have never obviously met or talk to a real poor person, but generally the more socioeconomically disadvanted one is the more right wing reactionary they become.

Thus more susceptible to the right wings paranoid "everyone out to get a piece of my action* narrative

Go ask a homeless schizophrenic sometime about politics, its all conspiracy right wing BS.

This is the base of the right. Damaged people with no hope thanks to drugs/alcohol or paranoid schizophrenics.

People with low comprehension skills and fanaticism. For whatever reasons.

Being a caseworker, you wouldn't believe how often I hear the same disturbed babble coming out of the hopeless as the foxnews echo chamber cult crowd in here.

And they all KNOW they are on a moral crusade to stop some "evil".

It goes with the territory.

Anyone who has lived on skid row has observed this.

The economic phrase for this is phenomena is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lumpenproletariat

Marx's definition has influenced contemporary sociologists, who are concerned with many of the marginalized elements of society characterized by Marx under this label. Marxian and even some non-Marxist sociologists now use the term to refer to those they see as the "victims" of modern society, who exist outside the wage-labor system, such as beggars, or people who make their living through disreputable means: prostitutes and pimps, swindlers, carnies, drug dealers, bootleggers, and bookmakers, but depend on the formal economy for their day-to-day existence.

In modern social theory sometimes the word underclass is used as equivalent to Marx' lumpenproletariat.
 
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Steeplerot said:
I hate to break it to you all that have never obviously met or talk to a real poor person, but generally the more socioeconomically disadvanted one is the more right wing they become.

Go ask a homeless schizophrenic sometime about politics, its all conspiracy right wing BS.
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When I was in high school, a buddy of mine had a dad like that.

His entire way of life revolved around the government trying to get him. The paranoia went so far, that the dad busted holes in the walls of the house, then stuck a rifle or shotgun into the hole. When the government came to get him, he had a firearm in every room.

The dad did small engine repair, and made just enough money that he did not pay income taxes. A lot of the people paid in cash, so there was no record. The mom was not in the picture, she had left years ago. The family lived in severe poverty because of the dads obsession with the government. The kid I went to school with, he never had nice clothes, they were more like rags then clothes.

I doubt the family received any social assistance due to the dads hatred of the government.
 
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whilst it may be unPC to say, I think persons who perpetually are on welfare are mentally behind. it would take somebody of that ilk to not want to better themselves.

I think this doesn't enter public discourse, since it IS unPC to mention.
 
Texashiker said:
This morning I posted a thread in off topic about my chicken pecked my hand.

As I was making the post, I started thinking about the chicken that pecked my hand, and people who make a career out of welfare.

I bought the chick when it was a couple of days old. For the past 5 months I have fed, watered, protected, and even built the chickens (13 chickens in all) a nice coop with an enclosed run.

The way I treated my chickens is "about" the same way the government treats those on welfare. The government feeds, protects and gives welfare recipients a place to live.

Instead of appreciating what has been given to them, both the chickens and the welfare recipients pecks the hand that feeds it.

There is a reason why chickens are called bird brained. They can not comprehend anything outside of their natural instincts.

Where does this leave people who bring crime, drugs and violence into poverty ridden areas? Are those people unable to comprehend what would happen if the government stopped providing those benefits?

When I was closing the coop up, it was right at dark. The chickens were starting to get into the roost and settle down for the night. I took the chicken that pecked at my hand, set it outside the coop on the ground. The chicken did not know what to do. It was on the ground when it knew it was supposed to be in the roost, and it was away from its friends. The chicken just stood there. I picked the chicken up and placed it back into the coop.

What would happen if the government suddenly withdrew welfare benefits? How would the people react that know no other way of life?
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This is the fault of government.

Welfare should always a "hand-up" not a handout. When people are up on their feet, they don't need welfare.
 
We provide welfare benefits because we are afraid of crime and the uprising - other countries have riots -we have welfare and free cable TV.
 
Fmr12B said:
We provide welfare benefits because we are afraid of crime and the uprising - other countries have riots -we have welfare and free cable TV.
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So basically welfare is the same thing as when Romans gave tribute to barbarian tribes. How did that work out for them?
 
Texashiker said:
When I was in high school, a buddy of mine had a dad like that.

His entire way of life revolved around the government trying to get him. The paranoia went so far, that the dad busted holes in the walls of the house, then stuck a rifle or shotgun into the hole. When the government came to get him, he had a firearm in every room.

The dad did small engine repair, and made just enough money that he did not pay income taxes. A lot of the people paid in cash, so there was no record. The mom was not in the picture, she had left years ago. The family lived in severe poverty because of the dads obsession with the government. The kid I went to school with, he never had nice clothes, they were more like rags then clothes.

I doubt the family received any social assistance due to the dads hatred of the government.
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This is a tragic but not too uncommon story in the US.

Folks like this can be helped, another reason why ideas like "starve the beast" to destroy our safety net are so dangerous to a modern civil society.

We literally leave productive citizens to rot in dysfunction. This is wasteful. That homeless kid with a needle in his arm one day could save your life with a cancer cure.

But no, folks want to "get back" at anyone not living what they consider "the proper life"

-its a textbook case of moral hypocrisy. And rather callous and failed short term thinking for personal emotional gratification.

"I am better than you." Is the message damaged people want to feel when they themselves are insecure. This sums up the whole conservative victim trip to me in a nutshell, it's endless in places like this. That in itself says a lot about the state of our republics citizenry and how hollow and superficial our culture has become sadly.

Our two main evolutionary advantages that set us apart mainly from animals are hands to create, and highly developed social capacity in the upper folds of our brains.

We are literally, all in this together. This is our advantage. We have made it this far, why retreat now?

Our strength is in numbers, with our imaginations and talent put to use as a species, the stars themselves are no limit.

Big problem is since the industrial revolution we are literally still socially in the dark ages, while our technology races ahead of us.

Will we adapt before the old animal ways that are literally evolutionary baggage that divide us -like capitalism/religious fanaticism- kill us? Or will we take our place as something better, together?
 
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momeNt said:
Just like republicans skew/omit data for their rich overlords, the democrats skew/omit data for their bought and paid for voter base aka welfare recipients.
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As someone that sees the guilt that people go through, the last thing your average welfare recipient wants is the stigma for being a parasite hanging over their heads.

It literally is like admitting you have herpes.

This does not even make sense to assume people on welfare are on the take.


It just goes to show the lack of character of the one making broad unrealistic assumptions about others motives. Or to assume someone would be that sociopath to have no caring for others or their own self-image.

A rather cowardly strategy at that, -kicking one when they are down. This is how the weak fight, someone with a position of strength can rise above.

This is why the elites USED to raise their children to be "gentleman" (just because you CAN exploit does not mean it is civilized or good for the long term)

Nowadays the name of the game is "I got mine F-you." How sad these people are in here day after day showing their true colors..

Degenerate Animals, but I just call em reactionaries, it's a lot less insulting to our furry comrades who want no part in our self-destructive dramas.

On the flipside, we have this planet rigged to explode multiple times over in our arrogance. Maybe our greed will win over everything.

That'll show them! Humanity was just out for free shit anyhow, and all those animals too wanting free food. Hell, proto-planetary disks are mooching hard earned nebula dust...uh oh! Nuke the whole socialist universe!!

Ok, I am getting Carl Sagan silly. Peace.
 
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Steeplerot said:
This is a tragic but not too uncommon story in the US.

Folks like this can be helped, another reason why ideas like "starve the beast" to destroy our safety net are so dangerous to a modern civil society.

We literally leave productive citizens to rot in dysfunction.
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We can only help those that want to be helped.

Here is another story, this one has a tragic ending.

When I was growing up, there were two brothers that lived 2 houses down from my house. The older brother was my age, the younger brother was 2 years younger, and the same age as my brother.

The younger brother got on drugs when he was around 16 years old. His mom and dad kicked him out. He went friend to friend living with people until he got caught with drugs, and kicked out again.

One day in 1992 or 1993, he just walked away. Nobody, including his family heard from him for a decade.

When he finally got in touch with his older brother in 2002, the younger brother had developed some kind of disease where the white blood cells attack the joints. He was unable to walk, was in a wheel chair, living in a homeless shelter, and still drinking and doing drugs.

In 2003 the younger brother killed himself. He was only 31 or 32 years old.

Maybe if Steven had gotten the help he needed, he still might be alive today.

How do you make someone stop doing drugs, or even get a job if they do not want to? Society can not force people to change their behavior.

We can offer help, but that does not mean the person is going to accept the help.

I think part of problem is people will take the easy route. Given a path of drugs, or a path of rehab, people will take the easy route.

Given the path between welfare and getting a job, they will take the easier of the two paths, and that is the path of welfare.
 
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Steeplerot said:
As someone that sees the guilt that people go through, the last thing your average welfare recipient wants is the stigma for being a parasite hanging over their heads.

It literally is like admitting you have herpes.

This does not even make sense to assume people on welfare are on the take.
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Which of course is why "welfare" keeps getting rebranded to things like EITC, WIC, and EBT.
 
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First said:
No actually, they really don't.
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Yes they do. I was once told by someone "Why work here 50+ hours a week, pay taxes and medical for my kids when I can get a job at an oil change place for $8 a hour 40 hour Weeks, not pay taxes, or healthcare and it ends up being the same money in the end." Said person ended up getting fired for never showing up to work. I promise you there are a whole society of people looking for any handouts or loopholes the govt provides.
 
OILFIELDTRASH said:
Yes they do. I was once told by someone "Why work here 50+ hours a week, pay taxes and medical for my kids when I can get a job at an oil change place for $8 a hour 40 hour Weeks, not pay taxes, or healthcare and it ends up being the same money in the end." Said person ended up getting fired for never showing up to work. I promise you there are a whole society of people looking for any handouts or loopholes the govt provides.
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When I was working in the welding field, the companies worked a lot of overtime. There were months when I got day off for 6 - 8 weeks at a time.

People would hire in, work a couple of weeks, say screw this I aint working on a weekend, get their stuff and walk out.

In 1989, 1990, 1991, I was 21 - 23 years old, and was bringing home $800 - $1,000 a week after taxes. But then again, I was working 70 - 80 hours a week.

One company I was working at, I was working the night shift. A guy came into the shop at around midnight - 1am asking for spare change. I told him I did not have any spare money, but we are hiring and pointed him towards the weld shop office.

The guy turned around and almost ran out of the shop.

People like that, I have no pity for. If he would filled out an application and made an effort, yea, I would have probably gave him some money.
 
I've known a number of people who think welfare is just fine and never intend to find a job.

Something needs to be done, but I don't know what.
 
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