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Intel Skylake / Kaby Lake

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Sweepr

Diamond Member
May 12, 2006
5,151
1,128
131
Agree.

My results are probably worst-case. Ambient temp was rather high (23C), the NUC is mounted directly on the back of my monitor, close to the wall, and I ran the tests all in a row. I like stress testing, so I would rather know the lower scores vs. just the best case. Will try doing some individual runs later for best-case results.
Worst case scenario for 45W TDP Skylake-H, and already faster than 65W TDP Broadwell-C/K. At equal TDP it should perform better as well. Let's see if GameGPU's garbage with old/unspecified Intel drivers and crap memory reflects what reviews will show this week. :)
 
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VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
50,487
6,063
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Ebay item # 381538812816

Newegg store on ebay, Intel Skylake i3-6320 3.9Ghz dual-core with HyperThreading. $169.99 list, $8 off.

So they're released. Thinking about two of those, versus some i5-6500 CPUs, and BCLK OCing them.
 

crashtech

Diamond Member
Jan 4, 2013
9,656
1,521
126
Ebay item # 381538812816

Newegg store on ebay, Intel Skylake i3-6320 3.9Ghz dual-core with HyperThreading. $169.99 list, $8 off.

So they're released. Thinking about two of those, versus some i5-6500 CPUs, and BCLK OCing them.
BCLK OC is still a thing? I thought Intel had killed it for good by now.
 

Burpo

Diamond Member
Sep 10, 2013
4,165
399
126
Ebay item # 381538812816

Newegg store on ebay, Intel Skylake i3-6320 3.9Ghz dual-core with HyperThreading. $169.99 list, $8 off.

So they're released. Thinking about two of those, versus some i5-6500 CPUs, and BCLK OCing them.
That's a bit above retail, but I think you'd be pretty happy with performance. Not too shabby..

However this combo deal is the best I've seen..

i7-6700K + Gigabyte GA-Z170-HD3P for $ 389.99..

http://www.ebay.com/itm/121978560443
 
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AtenRa

Lifer
Feb 2, 2009
13,556
2,539
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At a third or less of the power consumption of the 7870k. Very impressive.

Does AMD put the 7870k in any nuc like former factors? Are there any reviews of them?

Core i7 6770HQ is 45W TDP, A10 is 95W TDP

It is made at 14nm FF, A10 is 28nm bulk

The iGPU is the HD580, more than double of the iGPU on A10-7870K

Price is $300+ , A10 is lower than $150 (currently at $140 on newegg)

And finally, this is a 2016 model when Kaveri iGPU was released two years ago in January 2014.

So if the 3D Mark performance above is what this HD580 can do, i find it extremely disappointing for 2016 $300+ 14nm FF product even if it is at 45W TDP.
 

mikk

Diamond Member
May 15, 2012
3,041
838
136
The iGPU is the HD580, more than double of the iGPU on A10-7870K
I don't think so. Intels 14nm density is roughly 2x better than Intels 22nm which wasn't really better in density than 28nm of the competition. One Gen9 GT2 core is 40 mm² big (33% of 120 mm²). Three of them are 120 mm², know you have to exclude the Uncore from two GT cores which aren't doubled. On a Broadwell GT3 the second was 90% big compared to one GT core with Uncore. 90% of 40mm are 36 mm², scaled up to a GT4 results in 112 mm².

A10-7870k GPU area is ~50% of 245 mm², result in 122,5 mm². If we say Intels 14nm is twice as good in density we end up with 224 mm vs 122,5 mm². This is clearly not a doubling.



So if the 3D Mark performance above is what this HD580 can do, i find it extremely disappointing for 2016 $300+ 14nm FF product even if it is at 45W TDP.

AMD looks better in 3dmark usually. I'm sure you are aware that Kaveri is struggling to beat a smaller GT2 in lots of games at the same TDP.

http://ht4u.net/reviews/2016/amd_low_budget_prozessoren_a10-7860k_und_amd_athlon_x4_880k_im_test/index6.php

And you may know that the CPU is much better from Intel, you don't pay only for its iGPU.
 

Phynaz

Lifer
Mar 13, 2006
10,143
816
126
Core i7 6770HQ is 45W TDP, A10 is 95W TDP

It is made at 14nm FF, A10 is 28nm bulk

The iGPU is the HD580, more than double of the iGPU on A10-7870K

Price is $300+ , A10 is lower than $150 (currently at $140 on newegg)

And finally, this is a 2016 model when Kaveri iGPU was released two years ago in January 2014.

So if the 3D Mark performance above is what this HD580 can do, i find it extremely disappointing for 2016 $300+ 14nm FF product even if it is at 45W TDP.
So is that no, there are not any AMD NUC-like devices?
 

exar333

Diamond Member
Feb 7, 2004
8,519
6
91
So is that no, there are not any AMD NUC-like devices?
I can attest to 45w already being on the upper limit of a NUC type device, with 30w or less being more ideal for the smaller, traditional NUCs. 95w would be abysmal and sort of defeat the purpose. :)
 

AtenRa

Lifer
Feb 2, 2009
13,556
2,539
126
I don't think so. Intels 14nm density is roughly 2x better than Intels 22nm which wasn't really better in density than 28nm of the competition. One Gen9 GT2 core is 40 mm² big (33% of 120 mm²). Three of them are 120 mm², know you have to exclude the Uncore from two GT cores which aren't doubled. On a Broadwell GT3 the second was 90% big compared to one GT core with Uncore. 90% of 40mm are 36 mm², scaled up to a GT4 results in 112 mm².


A10-7870k GPU area is ~50% of 245 mm², result in 122,5 mm². If we say Intels 14nm is twice as good in density we end up with 224 mm vs 122,5 mm². This is clearly not a doubling.
Kaveri iGPU is ~112mm2

41mm2 on Intels 14nm FF is more than 80mm2 at 28nm bulk.

So even if GT4 is closer to 110mm2 at 14nm FF, it should be more than double (220mm2) at 28nm.

And if you also add the eDRAM, it makes the performance of the GT4 even more disappointing(according to the above 3D Mark result).
 

zentan

Member
Jan 23, 2015
177
5
36
I don't think so. Intels 14nm density is roughly 2x better than Intels 22nm which wasn't really better in density than 28nm of the competition. One Gen9 GT2 core is 40 mm² big (33% of 120 mm²). Three of them are 120 mm², know you have to exclude the Uncore from two GT cores which aren't doubled. On a Broadwell GT3 the second was 90% big compared to one GT core with Uncore. 90% of 40mm are 36 mm², scaled up to a GT4 results in 112 mm².

A10-7870k GPU area is ~50% of 245 mm², result in 122,5 mm². If we say Intels 14nm is twice as good in density we end up with 224 mm vs 122,5 mm². This is clearly not a doubling.





AMD looks better in 3dmark usually. I'm sure you are aware that Kaveri is struggling to beat a smaller GT2 in lots of games at the same TDP.

http://ht4u.net/reviews/2016/amd_low_budget_prozessoren_a10-7860k_und_amd_athlon_x4_880k_im_test/index6.php

And you may know that the CPU is much better from Intel, you don't pay only for its iGPU.
Good points there. Also a much better review piece compared to some of the unbalanced reviews we have seen from Gamegpu recently.
 

AtenRa

Lifer
Feb 2, 2009
13,556
2,539
126
So is that no, there are not any AMD NUC-like devices?
There are lots of SFF cases on the market, you can make a mini-ITX with any AMD APU (45W to 95W TDP) at more than half the price of the SKL GT3/GT4 NUCs.
 

AtenRa

Lifer
Feb 2, 2009
13,556
2,539
126
What is your source? Based on a die image it is bigger than that.
Kaveri die size = 245mm2

Calculated from the bellow die pic, the iGPU is ~112mm2







GT2 is 40 mm² as I said. What is your source that 40 mm² is more than 80 mm² at 28nm?
Intel 22nm FF is more dense than GloFos 28nm bulk.

Intel 14nm FF is at least double higher density than Intels 22nm FF (According to Intel themselves).

Thus, 40nm at Intels 14nm FF is more than double than GloFos 28nm bulk.

 

The Stilt

Golden Member
Dec 5, 2015
1,709
3,057
106
Kaveri die size = 245mm2

Calculated from the bellow die pic, the iGPU is ~112mm2









Intel 22nm FF is more dense than GloFos 28nm bulk.

Intel 14nm FF is at least double higher density than Intels 22nm FF (According to Intel themselves).

Thus, 40nm at Intels 14nm FF is more than double than GloFos 28nm bulk.

AMD doesn't definite the GPU itself on APUs, but they specify "GNB" as a single unit. GNB includes all of the related blocks, which are directly not GPU (such as video decoders / encoders, ACP processor etc). On Kaveri GNB populates ~47.75% of the total die area (~117mm²).

From this area parts that are not directly related to the GPU itself (UVD, VCE, ACP, IOMMU) populate around 19mm².
 

The Stilt

Golden Member
Dec 5, 2015
1,709
3,057
106
There are lots of SFF cases on the market, you can make a mini-ITX with any AMD APU (45W to 95W TDP) at more than half the price of the SKL GT3/GT4 NUCs.
Pretty useless to build at least a HTPC based on current APUs. They don't support 4K decoding of any format, HEVC or VP9. Carrizo / Bristol Ridge / Stoney Ridge do support 4K & HEVC, but they are currently not available for DIY.

For other purposes than HTPC, they have too high power consumption and too little CPU performance. Price is the only thing they can even remotely complete in.
 

The Stilt

Golden Member
Dec 5, 2015
1,709
3,057
106
Nucblog has done some reviews on NUC

Here is the firestrike result, (ignore the chart title, probably a typo)
http://nucblog.net/2016/05/skull-canyon-nuc-benchmark-results/



Not as bad as the previous result, but still not great. The Geforce 945M is about 2500 on firestrike.
Compared to Carrizo FX-8800P configured to 35W/42W TDP (42W limit is used for the first 200 seconds of continuous stress):

Intel NUC6i7KYK is:

73.25% faster in Cinebench R15 ST (86 vs. 149)
147.8% faster in Cinebench R15 MT (286 vs. 709)
56.13% faster in Geekbench ST (2398 vs. 3744)
91.45% faster in Geekbench MT (7327 vs. 14028)
12.1% faster in 3DMark Fire Strike (1708 vs. 1915)
34.8% faster in 3DMark Sky Diver (6040 vs. 8140)

:'(
 

The Stilt

Golden Member
Dec 5, 2015
1,709
3,057
106
^Ouch, that smarts.
Not at the slightest.
What hurts is knowing that AMD won't have anything competitive until Raven Ridge, which is 7 - 19 months away... And who knows what Intel has available at that time D:
 

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